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    #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by DDirector View Post
    How so?
    Wow what a world, where we are expected to explain to supposed adults why stealing is bad.


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    #12
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    After expiration of patents the IP is in the public domain.

    https://patents.google.com/?q=fluid&...ler+fluid+head
    https://www.stopfakes.gov/article?id...rotection-Last

    Also remember that one may patent an improvement on an existing product, so it may be the case that the Ozen heads implement technology not in current Sachtler heads, if they are indeed copies.

    https://www.upcounsel.com/how-to-pat...isting-product


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    #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by nothing View Post
    Wow what a world, where we are expected to explain to supposed adults why stealing is bad.
    I think the question should be answered. Two views have been expressed on the forum at various times. In the case of Zaxcom, people have complained about their patents preventing companies from being able to sell similar products in the US. Now in this thread we have the opposite complaint of an alleged ripoff of a design and that it is a scummy move.

    Is this instance scummy because it is a clone? If it were patented by Sachtler and they prevented Ozen from selling in the US, would Sachtler be the bad guy? If some made a wireless transmitter with a recorder and offered it in the States, would they be a scum or a competitor to Zaxcom? Is Ozen the offender here because it is a clone, with perhaps technology taken directly from Sachtler? Sachtler has a lot of patents, so why are they not protecting their property? What about all the Chinese companies that copied Steadicam and Arri and everyone else? Do we want companies to be able to protect their inventions or do we want cheaper prices?
    Last edited by Paul F; 05-04-2019 at 10:42 AM. Reason: added 'alleged'


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    #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by Paul F View Post
    ...
    I've never argued that Zaxcom nor anybody else is wrong for defending a patent.

    Chinese corporations by and large do not abide by patent law. If you see a clone product coming out of mainland China, you can pretty much assume it's a patent infringement in 9 out of 10 cases. Until this instance is proven otherwise, it's safe to assume it is and I will operate on that assumption.

    If it's not a blatant ripoff intended to fool people into thinking it's the more expensive brand, then it would be simple and cheap to hire a designer to make it look different. Even if it isn't a patent infringement, the fact that it looks EXACTLY like another brand is an indication that they hope to ride some on the reputation of the other company.

    Scummy however you slice it.

    All that, plus it's likely to be poor quality that won't last under heavy use - so there's that.
    Last edited by nothing; 05-04-2019 at 06:47 PM.


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    #15
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    This will likely take this thread waayyy off topic... but for me - I need to know a little more of the back story / context before I can make a decision on whether or not this is indeed a scummy business practice, as has been mentioned, or perhaps entrepenurial fair play by a former employee / engineer / designer who perhaps was not treated fairly and then struck out on his own.

    I certainly can't say what's going in this particular instance - because I don't know. But I certainly can imagine a scenario where a contractor, employee or even owner/inventor of a product gets the shaft through sneaky, underhanded, corrupt or deceitful business practices - or even snake oil attorneys who get involved essentially stealing their idea. And rather than lay down & die, that same person takes a new path to creating / forging / producing their own version of that similar product / service. And I would say "good for them".
    On the other hand, I would certainly not want to support a knock-off company started by someone essentially stealing patents or ripping off others ideas. But I think we all should hesitate on forming an opinion without a little context first.


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    #16
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    Thanks Simon (nothing). I just wanted to hear an answer to the question. You made it clear.


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    #17
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    These donít seem that much cheaper than the equivalent Sachtler... am I missing something?
    JERBCO, LLC
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    #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by jbregar View Post
    These don’t seem that much cheaper than the equivalent Sachtler... am I missing something?
    Give or take $1000 depending on the model you get.
    I'm looking at the 100mm bowl
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