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    #21
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    I'm surprised that nobody has really nailed down a next-gen FS7 yet (or F5/55). As others have said, the competitors (EVA1 & C200) barely match the FS7 specs wise, and don't offer anything special in terms of handling. Smaller and lighter perhaps, but, again as has been stated, those advantages disappear once you add the peripherals needed to make it equal to a FS7.

    I think Kinifinity have come closest to what the market really wants, at least on paper - something that offers IQ & formats to (almost) match Red, but the convenience of "video" features - as well as a more flexible modular design (Red's awfully tall design makes it difficult to make a decent shoulder setup, or to use 15mm LW rods with the proper 85mm vertical spacing. So their "modular" design actually rules out a lot of options).

    It seems the big camera companies are stuck between worlds right now - they've accepted that users are going add their own extras, monitors, rigs, etc (C200B, and EVA1's horrible LCD are perfect examples where they taken an attitude of "they won't use this anyway"), but haven't fully committed to the things that make that easier - minimalist design, V-lock power (for D-tap/accessories), lots of I/O options etc. They're trying to build modular camcorders, without accepting that to be truly modular you need to ditch the camcorder idea and just have a brain (pun intended).
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    #22
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    deltoidjohn makes a good point... I think it would be interesting if Panasonic sold the EVA1 like Apple sells iPads or Macbooks:

    For example:

    Base EVA1 Model: $6500
    EVF: $0 None / $500 Basic / $1500 Advanced
    Upgrade CPU to 4k60p 10-bit Internal: $1000
    2nd SDI Port: $500
    Upgrade VND: $500 (+2 stops) $1500 (electronic VND)

    Etc.


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    #23
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    If we're talking cameras, that's really the ARRI, RED, and Kinefinity* way. (*Not as much with their new systems, but was with licenses and hardware 4-5 years ago.)

    Pay more to upgrade software/hardware and/or purchase accessories for a better camera.

    ---

    I really think everyone should do this with at least 1-2 cinema cameras in that middle range.

    Maybe you like the FS5, but want to purchase the FS7's codecs. Done.

    Maybe you like the C200, but want the C300's 10-bit. Done.

    ETC.

    ---

    A no-brainer in today's world (I know I say that a lot but it's true) because people are simply not spending the kind of money they used to, but some just want to upgrade for better features in maybe a different model.


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    #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by morgan_moore View Post
    The cameras problem is that is an FS7 three years late to market. Or an overpriced GH5. Depending what hat you are wearing.

    As it happens neither of those things make it a bad camera (I think it is probably excellent) probably just not one that will be popular.

    This.


    The Panasonic EVA1 is fighting against the stranglehold dominance the FS7 has on the market. The C300mk2 has the same problem!

    But the EVA1 has a few benefits over the FS7: doesn't need an XDCA back for raw, is much lighter (more like FS5 size, but much much better), better colors, has timecode on the body itself.


    Quote Originally Posted by morgan_moore View Post
    My personal beleif is that MFT mount (and mode) would have made it considerably more appealing as canon mount excludes GH4 upgraders who are invested in MFT glass.

    Stragtegically it is poorly conceived by panasonic. Is its only metier as a small Bcam to the Vari (a great thing for the four people who own varicams)
    This.

    Panasonic has years of history of building up a keen fanbase with their GH series, many of whom who are looking around for an option to upgrade to, the EVA1 EF was a kick in the teeth to Panasonic GH fans in not offering it in a MFT mount.

    EVA1's biggest competition the FS7 is a mirrorless mount, and Panasonic should have done the same with its own mirrorless mount MFT
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    #25
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    But the EVA1 has a few benefits over the FS7: doesn't need an XDCA back for raw, is much lighter (more like FS5 size, but much much better), better colors, has timecode on the body itself.



    We know the benefits but. Tcode? Ive never been asked for it, apart from a big multicam TV show I did (FS7 x 3) - my biggest editor/director shoots a DSLR for his personal work and is entirely happy synching audio in software.

    Raw - the kind of people who want raw - well me at least - also would not shoot through a cable to a recorder - its not safe enough - I only want raw to protect my self from mis-exposure - why add a bit of operator safety at the cost of data integrety risk.

    Also raw - does it work? 240fps, or are there a bunch of gotchas.. where is the promo video showing me this some raw wonderment?

    I tell you I pretty much dislike my FS7.. its too heavy for solo opping and too thin codec for 'serious' shooting, and the EVF is crap.. hell it doesnt even bolt to my sticks well.

    But all the other cameras are worse..
    Arri - too heavy
    All DSLR - wrong shape no ND
    Red - too rediculous
    EVA - maybe 10% better than FS7 but too costly to flip - lens mount error
    Blackmagic.. great I think but doesnt cure the mass problem.

    The FS7 is the least terrible camera. Its not a good camera.

    FS7 - handle doesnt work, VF doesnt work, cache record doesnt work, 2 chans of audio I cant access, no HD punch in, no TC, degraded SDi when HDMI is running, doesnt bolt down properly, no RGB wfm, the list is long.
    Last edited by morgan_moore; 11-20-2018 at 09:22 PM.


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    #26
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    No cameras are elegant tools right now (maybe 2/3 eng)

    Id buy an elegant camera (one were everything works and is operator centric)

    Also no cameras noticed the internet/wifi/3-4-5g. Tcode? My iphone doesnt need timecode - it just knows the time!

    Aslo to TC even really just 'pop' into line in an NLE? not to my knowledge.


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    #27
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    Sounds like you need an F55(or maybe F5), Sam. Yeah, you'll still be in the same ballpark size and weight wise to your Fs7, but at least you'll get so much more camera and better image. RAW recorder bolts straight on to the body and is then integrated, plus you can still record internally simultaneously(R5's are showing up on eBay ridiculously cheap, now). Multiple real native VF options. 2x/s16 HD/2K Center Punch. TC, 4x SDI outs plus an HDMI(why?). CODECS galore(but XAVC from the 55 is great). Etc, etc.


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    #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by morgan_moore View Post
    No cameras are elegant tools right now (maybe 2/3 eng)

    Id buy an elegant camera (one were everything works and is operator centric)

    Also no cameras noticed the internet/wifi/3-4-5g. Tcode? My iphone doesnt need timecode - it just knows the time!

    Aslo to TC even really just 'pop' into line in an NLE? not to my knowledge.
    That's why I still LOVE my VariCam.


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    #29
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    Yep - the 5/55 are kinda cool - I kept my FZ adapter when I flogged my F3. I do watch the used market.

    I alsmost respect them as cameras (HF jack, XLR angle I do not respect)

    The raw implementation is the best physically. (apart from the venice)


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    #30
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    HDMI why?

    SDI is not bendy enough and doesnt work with my Animon transmitter, since floppy HDMI leads hdmi has dropped off my most hated list.


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