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    Almost done brandfilm...
    #1
    Senior Member legrevedotcom's Avatar
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    Just need a few tweaks here and there. I wanna touch the grade up a bit with the Avery Peck way of doing it.

    But all in all Im pretty happy with the fs7 efforts.

    All ground shots are fs7. The first shot is as well...
    the second estblishing shot is a7s ii... as are a few of the most gliding tracking shots on the beach and the one shot where they leave the car. Airshots p4p.

    Pass: kjetil



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    Senior Member jasonbrooks's Avatar
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    Overall very nice little piece, thanks for sharing. Since I liked it overall, and you're posting it as an "almost there", rather than a totally finished product, I'll throw in my ten cents.

    - I think you could save the 'reversed shot' trick until the latter part of the edit, i.e. play the first shot of the fire in the conventional direction. Because it's such an abstract shot, and it comes when we're just 'getting into' the piece, it threw me and almost felt like a technical mistake or "fix". I found that once your VO has got up to it's poetic speed, then the effect feels more natural and intriguing, whereas that first instance just felt odd to me. Another note on the reverse playback instances, it feels to me like there's something slightly dodgy with the implementation, like some dropped or skipped frames in the first few frames of those specific shots (0m3s & 1m36s are good example of this 'judder'). Could be something to do with the way you've implemented the ramping.

    - Shot at 56 seconds is beautiful - really nice!

    - ECU at 1m30s is problematic for me, as it slightly breaks the cosy feel. Could possibly be helped in the grade, but the harsh simulated moonlight on the RHS of her face show how much makeup she's wearing, and spoils the otherwise nice and moody (firelit) side of her face and eye. I would consider cropping in if you can't control those harsh highlights.

    - Fades vs cuts. For me, the straight cuts are working much slicker than the several short crossfades that are thrown in seemingly at random. Apart from the fade through white to the drone shot which works to me as it could signify him going into a 'flashback' of the days events. Even the following drone-to-drone quick fades just blemish otherwise pretty shots for me. I was once told (by another preachy editor) that crossfades help overcome editor's anxiety at choosing the perfect moment for the cut, and I think that thought helps me resist using them for no particular reason other than to change things up. On third watching I think that the fade from the sparks to the embers at the end is perhaps the exception to the rule (IMO anyway! :-).

    - WHERE is that amazing pure white coastline BTW - what a surreal location - fantastic!

    - Lastly (and I'm really splitting hairs here), the beautiful bird's-eye drone shot of the car driving, I would roll back ever so slightly (or just cut slightly sooner if you don't have preroll). To my eye the slight panning motion in the last 4-6frames breaks the dreamlike quality of the rest of the shot. It's almost like the pilot saying "here I am!" with a cheeky grin. ;-)

    Hope you don't mind my critiquing. If it's already locked then obviously disregard my ramblings. It's only cos I like the thing overall (and it had "offline" in the title) that I even bothered writing down my thoughts!

    Keep 'em coming! Cheers,

    jason
    ----------------
    Freelance Site: www.Opticalism.com/jason
    Company Site: www.Opticalism.com
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    Sum Ergo Edo.


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    Senior Member legrevedotcom's Avatar
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    Wauw.. that's pretty thourough feedback Jason! Thanks...

    I'm implementing some of the ideas you offered... I can see what you mean with the first fire shot, it's revert that. The strange thing is, I've noticed that little hickup, but the shot is not ramped, it's a simple reverse segment in Davinci. So it must be some kind of encoding error going on there. The clip is taken from the middle of a larger clip, so it can't be because of ends / beginnings.

    56 secs... yeah, amazing what an "old" GoPro silver can achieve x)

    The ECU... that has been bugging me, but it was a shot I really loved. The problem is that even with my Fujinon on macro and set at 2k scan center I still had to crop the damn thing to get this close to her. She actually doesn't have that much make-up on. I think it could be a combo of a full days shooting outside with dirt and all, the crop and grade. The grade I'm working on at the moment, I already dialed down the fake moonlight and lowered the midtone contrast, as well as making the overall grade a bit more pleasing and even to the other shots.

    Yeah... fader cuts... I have mixed feelings about those. I'll give hard cuts a chance because I haven't tried it with those on those shots you mention. But sounds like a good approach to fades

    That coast line is a sneaky one... and troublesome as well. The thing is... you can take-off from the ground as a private person if you get a permit (something I only learned later :S), but if you want to take-off from ground as a business you have to pay a lot of money for that.
    It's a common sightseeing place... but rules are rules. But the thing is, if you take-off from a boat and stay clear of their border line off the coast, you can fly there without permit. But in general... this area is completely off limits for drones from feb. 1st till sept. 1st. I was there mid january.

    I initially had pitched the idea of shooting the entire film at this location, but had to drop it on account of location fees. In the end, I think what we ended up with with the other locations is better than what we would have been limited to with just this one location.

    The location with the almost white coast line is a limestone quarry But from the right angles you almost can't tell... the colors of those drone shots with the cyan water is from there, and this is almost what it looks like out of camera because of the limestone. I ended up having to boost the color of the real coastal line

    Fixed the drone car shot as I write, you are right, it makes the clip much more calm and pleasing. I had to speed it down slightly because I had a hard pan in the beginning of it, but it still works.

    I loved the critique... especially because it's not so much about "you should have used this and that angle" but instead remains constructive and approaches the clips from what they are and the options available Thank you!


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    Senior Member legrevedotcom's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jasonbrooks View Post

    Keep 'em coming! Cheers,

    jason
    Updated the file with the new grade and edit changes here and there.


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    Senior Member jasonbrooks's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by legrevedotcom View Post
    Updated the file with the new grade and edit changes here and there.
    Fantastic - really glad that you were open to the feedback and I feel that it's helped give it that tiny but significant 0.5% lift that makes the edit do real justice to all the planning, work and skill you've put into the shoot. It's really singing!

    Strange re: the glitching from using reverse speed in DVR. I've never run into that, but then again I usually apply reversal effects in Premiere before sending a flat master ProRes 4444 into DVR solely for colour (and 'conforming' via .EDL). I guess maybe you're going start to finish in DVR, but could be worth trying the reversal effect on that clip alone in Premiere if you have access to a copy.

    Nice one,

    jason
    ----------------
    Freelance Site: www.Opticalism.com/jason
    Company Site: www.Opticalism.com
    Vimeo: https://vimeo.com/jasonbrooks/videos
    Africa Blog: www.Opticalism.com/travels

    Sum Ergo Edo.


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    Senior Member legrevedotcom's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jasonbrooks View Post
    Fantastic - really glad that you were open to the feedback and I feel that it's helped give it that tiny but significant 0.5% lift that makes the edit do real justice to all the planning, work and skill you've put into the shoot. It's really singing!

    Strange re: the glitching from using reverse speed in DVR. I've never run into that, but then again I usually apply reversal effects in Premiere before sending a flat master ProRes 4444 into DVR solely for colour (and 'conforming' via .EDL). I guess maybe you're going start to finish in DVR, but could be worth trying the reversal effect on that clip alone in Premiere if you have access to a copy.

    Nice one,

    jason
    yeah, that would be interesting to try... I used to go between PP and DVR as well. But I tried to do it with clips on a timeline, and that wasn't always very functional. I might just try your method, since I still think PP is a bit stronger in editing that DVR. We're almost there, but maybe a version or two more before it's great.
    When you bring your flat prores into DVR, do you cut it up again to apply the individual grades?


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    Senior Member jasonbrooks's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by legrevedotcom View Post
    When you bring your flat prores into DVR, do you cut it up again to apply the individual grades?
    Yeah, that's what the folks at BlackMagic call "Conform via EDL". If you search the DVR manual for that term there are surprisingly (for DVR) clear instructions, but it basically comes down to importing your self-contained flat export, then right clicking > timelines > confirm via EDL. You export the .EDL from the same timeline/sequence in PP that you make your flat master from, so it gives T/Cs for all the edit points in the sequence. DVR then uses those to automatically cut up the sequence. If someone gives you a flat export with EDL, or if you don't have access to the project, you can either use "Scene Cut Detect" fuction in DVR to try to guess where the cuts are (works well with static shots, but throws up a lot of false positives with handheld or more dynamic imagery). With either method you sometimes have to manually "split" a clip in DVR where it doesn't find a cut, but that doesn't take too long. Also, depending on how variable your exposure is, you can save time by applying a LUT to the entire flat export, before then splitting and applying secondaries and tweaks to individual shots.

    DVR is a powerhouse, I only wish I could claim to understand even 50% of the node capabilities - I still find the chroma/alpha & combiner/splitter nodes make my head hurt pretty quick!

    Looking forward to the Final, final (final) cut!

    Cheers,

    jason
    ----------------
    Freelance Site: www.Opticalism.com/jason
    Company Site: www.Opticalism.com
    Vimeo: https://vimeo.com/jasonbrooks/videos
    Africa Blog: www.Opticalism.com/travels

    Sum Ergo Edo.


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    Quote Originally Posted by jasonbrooks View Post
    DVR is a powerhouse, I only wish I could claim to understand even 50% of the node capabilities - I still find the chroma/alpha & combiner/splitter nodes make my head hurt pretty quick!
    Just memorizing the 1364 pages manual and watch the 500+ hour tutorials didn't help me improve my node workflow either. :-)

    It was a pleasure to see the clip and read the feedback.


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    Did not see the previous cut before Jason's comments but some really nice shots in this piece! Good work.

    Take this comment with a grain of salt - but for what's it worth - after first watching I was left a tiny bit confused about what the piece was promoting (was "Rains" the actual physical place or a brand of clothing / bags?). Perhaps because I'm not already familiar with the "brand" - but I went to watch a 2nd time to make sure there wasn't a light house (similar to the logo) somewhere at that lovely beach location. So perhaps one more "product" shot near the end may be helpful to goofballs like me.


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    Senior Member legrevedotcom's Avatar
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    Hehe... yeah I guess you are right Mark... we have had some post talk with the brand and will be making a quite more product focused video as well. I can totally see what you mean


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