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    #11
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    The D850 actually produces some incredibly nice images (with good glass) considering the 8-bit 4:2:0 limitations. I've shot a short run-n-gun handheld project and a couple of long interviews, one with green screen.

    For hand-held without any stabilization, it's obviously not so great. I did have a folded monopod attached to help, and was using a couple of the rare Nikon lenses with image stabilization, but due to size/weight/form factor it was very shaky--mostly for this I was shooting 1080p120 so that of course made the shots stable. The sensor has some strong rolling shutter fx.

    For the first interview I shot out ProRes HQ to an Inferno. The subject had fairly weak lighting with the background being a window on a sunny day. I was impressed with how much I was able to retrieve from the highlights in the background--again, given the 8-bit 4:2:0 limitations. Shot 1080p24.

    The second interview was cut to 25 minutes, all green screen. Also shot 1080p24 out to an Inferno, running 2 mics through a zoom, into the camera and then into the Inferno (I didn't want to deal with offsetting the sync lag by going straight from the zoom to the Inferno's xlrs). Got a really nice key with 5 chroma and 1 ultra key. Footage also held up well to color grading to match different scenes.

    Did some test 4K test shots but that's it so can't comment on 4K performance. It's a good camera for stix and probably gimbal, not good for hand-held or whip pans.

    I've just ordered an FS5m2 to be my A Cam, with kit lens and an active adapter to utilize the image stabilization of the Nikon ES lenses. This will be used for all run-n-gun, as well as studio shots, going out up to 4Kp60 ProRes Raw. The D850 will be my B Cam.

    EDIT: I should mention that the still images from this sensor are absolutely incredible.
    Last edited by Saddler; 05-30-2018 at 02:55 PM.


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    #12
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    Thanks for the info Saddler.

    Have you done much shooting with the D850/Inferno combo?

    One thing I just can't get confirmation on from anywhere is whether the D850 can output the 120p over HDMI - any chance you've tested this with the Inferno?
    VIDEO PRODUCER ON THE NSW NORTH COAST, AUSTRALIA
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    #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by deltoidjohn View Post
    I'm not expecting the Nikon's to be proper video or cinema cameras, but I've shot on the 5DmkII & mkIII in the past and am hoping things have improved a little since then. !
    The good news is Nikon is way way ahead of Canon's old 5Dmk2/mk3 cameras! In fact Nikon had been ahead of Canon DSLRs in many areas for years and years now.

    The bad news: still not going to be as great as shooting with say a Panasonic or Sony, or a dedicated video/cinema camera.

    However if you at least pair it with a good camera op monitor such as a SmallHD Focus or SmallHD 502 then you'll be pretty sorted for some of your needs at least.

    Oh and get a Sound Devices MixPre3 as well if you'd like a very portable/compact rig paired with an audio recorder which will be automatically triggered over HDMI.

    Quote Originally Posted by deltoidjohn View Post
    - Is the 1080p slow-mo usable? Or is it pretty much the same 5DmkII-level 1080p we've had for nearly 10-years?
    Haha! No, it is better than that for sure. Don't worry, if you're coming from Canon DSLR shooting I think you'll have the potential to be perfectly happy shooting with Nikons! (aside from the lack of DPAF & ML)
    Am a Sound Recordist in New Zealand: http://ironfilm.co.nz/sound/
    Follow my vlog and adventures in sound: https://www.youtube.com/c/SoundSpeeding


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    #14
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    I've used cameras from both companies consistently, and see no difference in quality with 60p from the D850 and the newer Canons like the 6D Mark II, 5D Mark IV, and 1DX Mark II (4K/60p doesn't count in this case).

    IMO, the perception of the quality will most definitely be determined by lenses, lighting, depth-of-field (shallow DOF makes everything look nicer), and whether you're shooting close-ups or wide-shots (since of course wide-shots will look worse in 1080p).

    I don't remember the 5D Mark II/III anymore, but IMO both companies produce nice results, but the Nikons are not really ahead of the Canons in almost anything.

    The D850 has full-frame 4K recording, a 4K output, and zebras...that's about all I can think of on the video side that may be considered advantageous.

    But everything else...4K Motion JPEG is by far superior to any 4K Nikon camera format, the Nikon video auto-focus is terrible all the way to the D850, and the in-body image stabilization is worse with lots of 'warpy' artifacts.

    Neither company has any other video features/specs compared to the loaded Panasonic and Sony cameras. Even the focus peaking in the D850 only works in 1080p and not in 4K (at least as of last month...not sure about any firmware updates).

    If slow-motion is important, the 1DX Mark II is light years ahead of anything from Nikon.

    ---

    Edit - P.S. Some links...

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GlLkigjAnmI

    https://vimeo.com/158004101

    https://vimeo.com/192756025
    Last edited by NorBro; 06-24-2018 at 05:30 PM.


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    #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by IronFilm View Post
    However if you at least pair it with a good camera op monitor such as a SmallHD Focus or SmallHD 502 then you'll be pretty sorted for some of your needs at least.

    Oh and get a Sound Devices MixPre3 as well if you'd like a very portable/compact rig paired with an audio recorder which will be automatically triggered over HDMI.
    I'll be pairing it with a Shogun Inferno which also has a an XLR input/adapter, so that should take care of both the monitoring and sound recording problems with one device.


    Quote Originally Posted by IronFilm View Post
    Don't worry, if you're coming from Canon DSLR shooting I think you'll have the potential to be perfectly happy shooting with Nikons! (aside from the lack of DPAF & ML)
    I'm coming from Sony FS7/700 using external recorders, but I'm plagued by bad memories of my Canon days pre-2013! It was great when they first came along in 2009 - when things were mostly going to the web in 720p or to DVD - but by the time I stopped using them as my main cameras they had been left in the dust and were a pain to use for most types of work!
    VIDEO PRODUCER ON THE NSW NORTH COAST, AUSTRALIA
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    #16
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    Thanks for your input and the links, NorBro.

    I'm sure they've both got their pros and cons, but for this project, I'm locked into Nikon only. If I had freedom to choose my system, I'd be going nowhere near any of the DSLR's!
    VIDEO PRODUCER ON THE NSW NORTH COAST, AUSTRALIA
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    #17
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    haha, true...by the way, this is the Atomos specs link for the D850. It looks like the HDMI maxes out at 1080/720/60p.

    https://www.atomos.com/cameras/nikon-d850

    [I actually can't think of any camera that outputs 120p over HDMI (everything seems to be via SDI/RAW).]


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    #18
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    Thanks... exactly what I was looking for!

    I also don't know of any cameras that actually do output 120p over HDMI. It does seem as though the ability to record 120p on the Atomos HDMI-only models is a bit superfluous. They update their product line fairly frequently so you wouldn't even consider it 'future proofing' on their part.

    The annoying thing is this means I've got to dump & sort two lots of cards each day - the SDD from the Atomos with the ProRes files (and XLR audio), plus the cameras SD card, with all the slow-motion stuff. And then I'll probably transcode all those internal recordings to ProRes as for editing as well.
    VIDEO PRODUCER ON THE NSW NORTH COAST, AUSTRALIA
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    #19
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    I haven't done much more shooting on the D850 since I last posted. The Inferno shooting was a green screen shoot--I both shot and delivered at 1080p, so it did take some extra care in keying as to be expected since the output of the D850 is only 8-bit and either 4:2:0 or 4:2:2. Something I found is that if I recorded directly from the Inferno, the D850 would eventually shut down, so I had to enable record control in the camera and use the camera to start and stop recording to the SD card as well as the Inferno to prevent this. There might be a workaround to this in the menu, I don't know.

    I had some fun shooting slo-mo with this--what I really liked is that the menu makes it really easy to quickly swap frame rates and resolution on the fly. That being said, I just received my Sony FS5m2 which will be my A Cam for slo-mo, recording out to ProRes Raw once it's supported in Premiere. The D850 will be a B Cam always on stix, and recording out to my second Inferno if it's warranted.

    The D850 unfortunately doesn't have sensor stabilization like the Sony mirrorless cams. So the internal stabilization is just doing a real-time software stabilization--turn that offf and stabilize in post or use lenses with IS/VR.

    EDIT: For the D850 with Inferno shoot I recorded a wireless lav and shotgun on a Zoom, fed that into the d850 for sync which then went out to the Inferno through the HDMI.


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    #20
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    Thanks again Saddler.

    Interesting point about the D850 shutting off - what makes this really a nuisance for me is it sort of locks me in to recording everything to the SD card. I was hoping I could record just the slow-mo stuff on the internal card for easy logging.

    I always avoid IS anyway (even with lenses that have it) and prefer to have a nice heavy rig which tends to smooth things out nicely. Usually I prefer a shoulder mount setup with VCT plate but for this rig I might use an easyrig, because getting a DSLR properly balanced on a shoulder mount is a joke.
    VIDEO PRODUCER ON THE NSW NORTH COAST, AUSTRALIA
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