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    #11
    Senior Member KINOKS's Avatar
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    This is great news! Slog is what was missing from fs700. It's was the only thing that was holding me back from getting one.
    But I don't understand, is the slog going to need a hardware upgrade or only software?
    Sanjin Švajger


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    #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by Grug View Post
    Wow, very nice. I wonder how much additional dynamic range SLOG2 will open up on the FS700?
    It won't give any physical additional dynamic range, but it will make the range the camera is capable of usable. So you can argue that you increase usable dynamic range, yes.

    The distance between shadow and highlight will remain the same. The 8 bit output is constricting it so much as to render the extremes useless.

    I must sound like a broken record here (for those reading the 700 forum), for which i apologise, but i think it's important the people understand the distinction. You're not changing the sensor here.

    cheers
    paul


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    #13
    Senior Member Samuel H's Avatar
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    It could be any of both:
    * if SLOG is killing (not muting: killing) part of the DR of the sensor, the SLOG2 could bring it back to life and give you extra DR
    * if SLOG and SLOG2 are both using all the available DR of the sensor, just assigning different final values to each input value, then, well, by definition it's the same DR
    No idea which is the case in the FS700. I do know that in the Nikon D800 and D5200 a different way of transforming sensor values into codec values could give you 2+ extra stops of DR.


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    #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by Samuel H View Post
    It could be any of both:
    * if SLOG is killing (not muting: killing) part of the DR of the sensor, the SLOG2 could bring it back to life and give you extra DR
    * if SLOG and SLOG2 are both using all the available DR of the sensor, just assigning different final values to each input value, then, well, by definition it's the same DR
    No idea which is the case in the FS700. I do know that in the Nikon D800 and D5200 a different way of transforming sensor values into codec values could give you 2+ extra stops of DR.
    You can see 12+ stops from the paltry 8 bit range from the 700. But the upper and lower stops are next to useless for any manipulation. I don't believe there's anything beyond that. 12-13stops is more than adequate in real terms.

    Slog will just distribute the values in a much better way

    cheers
    paul


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    #15
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    Sony's HXR-IFR5/AXS-R5 combo enables the recording of raw from the FS700 at 16 bits, but what's the point? Isn't the FS700 12-bit internally? That just seems like a whole lot of extra but empty data.


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    #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tzedekh View Post
    Sony's HXR-IFR5/AXS-R5 combo enables the recording of raw from the FS700 at 16 bits, but what's the point? Isn't the FS700 12-bit internally? That just seems like a whole lot of extra but empty data.
    No one knows if it's 12-bit internally. There is no evidence/proof for that claim. The AVCHD was 8-bit and the uncompressed signal was also 8-bit. but it's unknown what the sensor is capable of after the firmware/hardware upgrade.


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    #17
    Senior Member starcentral's Avatar
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    I agree with Tzedekh, the FS700 is a 12-bit internal camera and Juan keeps saying recodring at 16 bits with is true but its 12-bit at source.

    If that "hardware/software" upgrade makes it 16-bit out, it will still be 12-bit on the sensor itself. Sony is certainly not replacing the entire guts of it for free or near free....
    Last edited by starcentral; 04-12-2013 at 07:59 AM.
    Dennis Hingsberg


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    #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by evilthought View Post
    No one knows if it's 12-bit internally. There is no evidence/proof for that claim. The AVCHD was 8-bit and the uncompressed signal was also 8-bit. but it's unknown what the sensor is capable of after the firmware/hardware upgrade.
    Admittedly the blog post is a year old, but AbelCine's Andy Shipsides says the ADC is 12-bit here (I specifically asked him):

    First tetonsonthefly:

    tetonsonthefly:
    Is it really 8bit HD-SDI out? 4:2:? What is the point of having 3G then?

    Andy Shipsides: It's 8-bit for sure, which is due to the Digital Signal Processor. The camera takes the 12 bit signal to 8 bit for the recording, doesn't have the ability to do 10-bit at the same time. 3G gives you 1080p output though.

    And then me:

    tzedekh:
    Wait, I'm confused. If the 3G-SDI output is only 8-bit, will the 4K raw upgrade also be only 8-bit? Isn't that kinda pointless? What is the bit-depth of the sensor's ADC?

    Andy Shipsides: The 4K Raw will be 12-bit, which is the same as the camera's A to D. Regular video will be 8 bit.


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    #19
    Senior Member starcentral's Avatar
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    Yes, the FS700 camera is 8-bit AVC internal, 12-bit RAW via 3G-SDI. Someone in the forums have been saying the FS700 will be 10-bit... but the only 10-bit internal cameras start at the F5/F55 range. Even the F3 is 8-bit internal but has 10-bit SDI but it is NOT RAW it is only YCbCr or RGB capable.

    Its seriously a shame Juan is going around saying the "FS700 is 16-bit" "the FS700 is 16-bit" - what a complete farse.
    Dennis Hingsberg


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    #20
    Senior Member Sumfun's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by KINOKS View Post
    This is great news! Slog is what was missing from fs700. It's was the only thing that was holding me back from getting one.
    But I don't understand, is the slog going to need a hardware upgrade or only software?
    According to this interview with Juan Martinez, the FS700 will get Slog2 as well as the 4k output upgrade by summer. It will be a hardware and software upgrade, but he says Sony is trying to minimize the price. It's unclear if you can just get the Slog2 upgrade without the 4k upgrade. My guess is that after the summer, new FS700s will ship with these upgrades built in. Or maybe they'll just introduce a new model altogether.

    http://www.dvxuser.com/V6/showthread...post1986305163


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