Let's pretend FCP X was released today, as is...

[David Saraceno]

And what's the percentage of that 1 million who do simple wedding videos or skateboard videos and could easily work within iMovie or Windows Movie Maker, but have FCP because they heard it was for "professionals". Not to dump on them, but their workflow isn't exactly complicated or demanding.

I agree. What I and others object to is the view that unless you need a collaborative workflow, you aren't a "professional editor."

My guess, and it's just that, is that the overwhelming number of FCP 7 users rarely, if ever, did an OMF or an XML and yet still edited professionally.

Matt Gottshalk and others need that, and that's completely understandable.

Others don't. But just because they don't doesn't make them amateurs.

[Gary Huff]

Others don't. But just because they don't doesn't make them amateurs.

Not at all, but the term "editor" is rather more all-encompassing than just stitching clips together.

But, really, it's just a word at the end of the day. No reason to spend time upset because someone used the term in a way that left someone excluded.

[David Saraceno]

It's not a question of feeling upset, which I don't.

A sense of stereotyping a whole group of very good professionals just because they don't have or need a particular workflow.

[Gary Huff]

It's not a question of feeling upset, which I don't.

Sorry, should have made that more clear. I wasn't referencing you, just anyway who might get mad when they hear FCPX labeled as not being "professional" when they use it and feel that they are "professional". Words mean different things to different people in contexts.

A sense of stereotyping a whole group of very good professionals just because they don't have or need a particular workflow.

Well, we don't have a definition for people who just stitch video clips together and throw a title and that's as complicated as it gets. Doesn't mean it's amateur, but FCPX will be fine for them. Other people who do more complicated editing might find that it doesn't have the features they want. I don't see what "stereotyping" as to do with the conversation other than to bog it down in semantics to keep someone's feelings from being hurt.

[David Saraceno]

On another topic, I did a test multiclip with 10.0.3.

We used a GoPro at 1080/30p, a HPX250 at AVCINTRA 720/60p, a Panasonic TM700 at 720/30p, and HPX170 at 720/30pN, and a Canon point and shot with 720/30p mp4.

Used a lavalier on the 250, and set that as the sole audio angle.

45 seconds. TM700 transcoded to pro res LT. See the frame rate and size to 720/29.97

It created the multiclip in about 45 seconds, and played really well on are MacBook Pro late 2011. Cut between angles was accomplish just using the number pad.

Pretty impressive.

[Gary Huff]

Well, I really hope Apple can make this version fly. If we can keep a strong competition between the three 'A's, I think we all win.

[simonpwood]

I have always been a Premiere user, but made the switch to Apple as I was sick of PC bugs. I still edit in CS3 occasionally for HDV jobs on a PC.

But I really love using FCPX right now. Motion too. The combined price of those two programs, with the power that they have under the hood, is amazing value for money.

[Fahnon]

According to wikipedia, "A professional is a person who is paid to undertake a specialised set of tasks and to complete them for a fee." However they go on to say: Less technically, it may also refer to a person having impressive competence in a particular activity. With that in mind, you can be a pro editor without having ever worked with anyone but the person who cuts your check (or simply be masterful at it).

[Jester2138]

You just regurgitated the same points labeled against apple about the original release since last June. You aren't saying anything that hadn't been said a million times before. Whats the point in that. Now if any one tries to bring perspective to the X situation you're labeled overly defensive.

I don't understand... They've been said a million times before because they're true. Are you just hoping people will forget the past? Your use of "bring perspective to" sounds more like "ignoring faults of."

As for the semantic issue of what exactly "pro editors" means, I was using it to refer to editors with demanding workflows more than paid editors. I realize that this was unclear. I've used Paint on paid jobs before but that doesn't make it a "pro" app.

As for my uses, as long as FCP X can't meet the demands of collaborative workflows and Apple continues to fail to guarantee trustworthiness I have no use for either.

[bruceallen]

Well said. However for me at this stage (one man band not working with RED files), the software as of 10.0.3 is very good

Thank you! Totally agree - FCP X sounds good for you and many other one man band / indie professionals.

Nice to turn this into a more pleasant discussion. I'm not sure why everyone can't get along. Some of the most creative stuff is the one man band stuff and for sure they are pros.

But at the same time I think that the one man band FCP X fans should just understand that Apple really broke stuff for folks working on a large editing teams, folks who do lots of boring stuff, folks who edit projects that don't fit Apple's timeline paradigm well, etc.. The people who rely on Apple for support are PISSED. They are not upset because they are prima-donnas or can't handle change. They're upset because basic stuff got messed up and FCP 7 was discontinued.

If the FCP X rabid fringe keeps telling dissenters that they are whiny idiots - without trying to understand the other side's workflow... then they are behaving like amateurs. Even if they are professionals. Simple as that.

It's kinda like DSLRs... if Sony stopped making all shoulder-mount cameras and instead made a frikkin' awesome DSLR with like 4K video and wi-fi transmitting of signals for $500... I'd be happy. But the guys shooting sports on their shoulder-mount cameras would be... upset.

Then the guys who love the DSLRs would start calling the shoulder-mount sports guys whiny idiot prima-donnas. And the guys with the shoulder-mount cams would complain that the DSLR camp doesn't understand "professional" needs. Then the DSLR guys would say "no we're professionals too"... This is a really stupid conversation. And the professional shoulder-mount camera guys didn't start the argument.

If they keep up this rate of development I imagine things will be up to speed for you by the end of the year.

I really hope they do. That would be awesome (though as a programmer I have my doubts - there is a lot to be done, and it's not easy stuff).

I own 2 copies of Media Composer. I own Adobe Production Suite. I own Logic. I own Pro Tools. I own FCP 7 and FCP X and Motion. I won about $7000 worth of plugins (audio and video) for them too. This (and paying for upgrades) adds up.

I would love nothing better than to sell EVERYTHING except FCP X, Motion, Logic and DaVinci... and put the money from selling all of that stuff into making a film.

It's just a bit irritating when folks said I'm a whiny change-hating idiot prima-donna just because I dare to point out that FCP X is seriously lacking stuff (not this thread though - it has been civil). I don't hate Apple. I want FCP X to be all I need. Desperately. I DON'T WANT TO SPEND $20K ON SOFTWARE. It does not feed my ego. In fact I feel like an idiot because I'm one of the few guys not pirating the hell out of everything.

Bruce Allen
www.boacinema.com