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    #11
    Senior Member John Morrison's Avatar
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    Barry, I apologize in advance, but I have to disagree with you. I own three of them, and I can tell you that they do record 4:4:4 in HD (1280x720 and higher). The work-flow is difficult, but not much more than what I've heard of the REDs work-flow. Amazing green-screen capture systems. However, I don't think there are that many out there, and all of mine have gone through 2-3 owners.
    John Morrison - Little Picture Productions, LLC
    "Never anger a bard, for they are not subtle and people remember funny songs."


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    #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by muonwave View Post
    Barry, I apologize in advance, but I have to disagree with you. I own three of them, and I can tell you that they do record 4:4:4 in HD (1280x720 and higher). The work-flow is difficult, but not much more than what I've heard of the REDs work-flow. Amazing green-screen capture systems. However, I don't think there are that many out there, and all of mine have gone through 2-3 owners.
    It can't do 4:4:4 in 720p. It's starting with a 720x480 sensor. Each chip is 720x480. You can't get more than 720x480 out of a single chip. You can, however, get more than 720x480 out of a three-chip 720x480 system, using spatial offset, but doing so doesn't increase the chroma resolution of each individual chip, only the overall luminance res of all three chips combined.

    I asked Juan about this long ago, and he said you could get 4:4:4 from standard-def, or you could get HD but it wouldn't be 4:4:4 (obviously) as it used a spatial-offset pixel shift system to get the additional res.


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    #13
    Senior Member joemiked's Avatar
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    heres a small bit of info if you havnet found much about 4:4:4: aftermarket technology once adapted into the dvx , included is an interveiw with alex ferrari whom never heard f it either.
    signature here
    www.mikedvideo.com
    peace


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    solucion possible
    #14
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    hello friends dvx user look for my experience with cameras not professionals. I know it's hard andromeda acer one I found a somewhat unorthodox solution to make the colors look so 4:4:4 is the issue. andromeda Pimero system is based on the shooting events are recorded on the tape to be recorded when you might wonder as to whether it is the only image that comes directly from the true color and true RGB sensor cable is the s-remember that s-video is not super video video video if not separate. and separates the primary colors. leaving true colors in the catch, unfortunately that is not even an exit grabber that has a more than a usb s.video. what we could do is buy one of those mini laptop economic sofwwarer put a capture as DV and capture live windows and let the colors in RGB, good in terms of resolution you can use sony vegas and force the video so you can capture 720p. that would be a solution even more expensive than andromeda system. forgive my bad English if you do not understand my text also left him a greeting in Spanish.
    hola amigos de dvx user miren por mi experiencia con camaras no profecionales. yo se que acer una andromeda es dificil yo encontr una solucion un tanto ortodoxa para hacer los colores 4:4:4 miren asi esta el asunto. pimero el sistema andromeda se basa en que los disparos hechos se graben en la cinta al momento de ser grabados pues ustedes se preguntaran a si es , la unica imagen que llega con colores reales directamente del sensor y en verdadero RGB es el cable de s-video recordemos que s-video no es de super video si no de separado video. y separa los colores primarios. dejando colores verdaderos en las capturas, desgraciadamente que aun no se de un capturador que tenga una salida s.video mas que una usb. lo que se podria hacer es comprar una de esas economicas mini laptop poner un sofwwarer de captura como el windows dv y capturar directamente y dejar los colores en RGB, bueno en cuanto a resolucion puede usar el sony vegas y forzar el video para que pueda capturarlo en 720p. esa seria una solucion aun mas barata que el sistema andromeda. perdonen mi mal ingles si no se entiende mi texto lo dejo en espaņol tambien un saludo


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    #15
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    Hello John, do you still have one DVX andromeda system for sale...or maybe info/schematics to DIY..? I have some knowledge about electronics and like that DVX look


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    #16
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    I'd think that you could just pick up a used HMC150 & get better results, while still keeping the "DVX look."
    Where are all the S-VHS hipsters?


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    #17
    Senior Member MDKfilms's Avatar
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    Just thought I would chime in here,
    Juan was bought out and the Andromeda and subsequent projects were shelved, the tech was bought by who? Who was building a camera system that was coming to market around that time? Hmmmmm, maybe it was some guy who use to make high end sunglasses? Is/was Juan bought out by the then RED folks? I would like to know. I remember Juan said he could not say who due to an NDA. Interesting. I'm probably wrong.
    MDKfilms - Sound & Film production


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    #18
    Senior Member GaryinCalifornia's Avatar
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    I've heard the same story...


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    #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by MDKfilms View Post
    Just thought I would chime in here,
    Juan was bought out and the Andromeda and subsequent projects were shelved, the tech was bought by who? Who was building a camera system that was coming to market around that time? Hmmmmm, maybe it was some guy who use to make high end sunglasses?
    The whole rationale behind Andromeda was that in the DVX100 the weakest point in the chain was the recording system - Standard Definition DV tape. And remember NTSC DV was only 4:1:1 - not even 4:2:0 as in 50Hz countries. The chipset was capable of better than DV tape was capable of recording and that was what Andromeda took advantage of.

    The HVX200 was a different matter. To DVCPROHD file via card the built in recording was roughly capable of recording nearly all the chips could deliver, so the same approach was never going to be able to deliver in the way Andromeda did. It shouldn't be any surprise that Hydra never saw the light of day. And the same goes for pretty well all modern cameras nowadays. So the tech as in Andromeda - in entireity - ceased to be valid. Which is not to say that some features, some patents maybe, weren't of use.

    And Barry is quite right about 4:4:4 HD. What 4:4:4 fundamentally means is that the red, green and blue resolutions will all be equal to the luminance resoluion. With 3 720x480 chips, the best you'll get is 720x480 for red, green and blue. So 4:4:4 SD (instead of 4:1:1) and no DV compression. But a RECORDING system may have a higher resolution than ACTUAL resolution off the chip. Think of blowing 16mm up to 35mm. You'll have a 35mm print - but it won't be the same as filming on 35mm in the first place. Same here - you may record 1280x720 with 4:4:4 sampling - but it doesn't mean the front end of the camera will neccessarily do it justice.

    And (apologies to Barry, who's heard me go on about this before!) the figures such as 4:2:2 are simply ratios of colour information to luminance - they're not absolutes. So if you think of 4:2:0 1080p, it means potential luminance resolution of up to 1920x1080 and chrominance of 960x540 by definition. So an example of a 4:2:0 system with far better chrominance (let alone luminance!) than a 4:4:4 system based on 720x480.


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    #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by MDKfilms View Post
    Just thought I would chime in here,
    Juan was bought out and the Andromeda and subsequent projects were shelved, the tech was bought by who? Who was building a camera system that was coming to market around that time? Hmmmmm, maybe it was some guy who use to make high end sunglasses? Is/was Juan bought out by the then RED folks? I would like to know. I remember Juan said he could not say who due to an NDA. Interesting. I'm probably wrong.
    Sorry, but you're wrong. He went to work for Panasonic and part of the agreement to employment was the termination of the Andromeda project.
    Mitch Gross
    NYC


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