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    Senior Member Mike Harvey's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Otis Grapsas View Post
    If video style production with a long zoom is important, I would go for a 2/3" camera instead, like the HPX500 or the new Sony. The sensor size advantage in DOF will be lost if the zoom lens has an aperture smaller than f2.8, and that aperture will never appear in a 10x or 16x zoom at 4/3. A 3x f2.8 zoom at $2,000 is easy, those probably already exist, but things get extremely expensive and hard to design after that point.
    Except that the cheapest 2/3" camera (HPX500) is going to cost 3-4 times as much once set up, plus P2 media. I totally get what you're saying, but if you're shooting a wedding a full size P2 camera is going to be a bit large and obtrusive, and nice primes will not always be workable. And honestly, looking at GH1+kit lens footage on Vimeo, I'm more than happy to "settle" for the longer depth of field, because it still looks a lot nicer than what I get now. If I do end up buying this thing, the first thing I'm getting to go along with it is a nice set of primes. But for the market that this will most likely attract and be used for, primes simply aren't always feasible to use.


     

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    Quote Originally Posted by Mike Harvey View Post
    Except that the cheapest 2/3" camera (HPX500) is going to cost 3-4 times as much once set up, plus P2 media. I totally get what you're saying, but if you're shooting a wedding a full size P2 camera is going to be a bit large and obtrusive, and nice primes will not always be workable. And honestly, looking at GH1+kit lens footage on Vimeo, I'm more than happy to "settle" for the longer depth of field, because it still looks a lot nicer than what I get now. If I do end up buying this thing, the first thing I'm getting to go along with it is a nice set of primes. But for the market that this will most likely attract and be used for, primes simply aren't always feasible to use.
    I agree. 4/3 is a happy medium between 2/3" and super35/full frame for DOF vs ISO. In any case, lens availability will affect shallow dof and ISO requirements, so it should be considered.


     

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    Quote Originally Posted by naavt View Post
    I was also under the impression that the AF100 would have the ability to record RAW footage So it's only the AVCCAM codec?
    No camera on the market records raw (that anyone could afford!) Nothing that uses redcode, or cineform, or any other codec, records raw. As far as reasonably affordable (under $50,000) cameras goes, raw is fictional. It doesn't exist.

    The closest you'll get is the Red One's RedCode Raw, which is still a highly compressed codec; it just encodes raw sensor data instead of converting it to a video format first.

    There is nothing wrong with the AF100 or anything else not recording raw, because nothing records raw!


     

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    Quote Originally Posted by Otis Grapsas View Post
    4/3 is a happy medium between 2/3" and super35/full frame for DOF vs ISO.
    4/3 is a happy medium between 2/3" and "full frame" 35mm still film, yes. But 4/3 is very close to the frame size of super35. Super35 is half the size of "full frame" 35mm still film.


     

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    Quote Originally Posted by Bassman2003 View Post
    I think the lens option will make or break this camera's acceptance to the video crowd. If it does not come with a motor driven servo based video lens, many will be challenged to make it a main camera (including myself).

    SLR only lenses basically make it a "cinema style" production workflow. Prime lenses have great image quality, but are not always convenient for "video" type shooting.

    I think Panasonic knows this and will offer a kit video lens that can be removed to use other types of lenses. If they do not then they are losing potential customers because a body only AF-100 is just a $6,000 vDSLR with audio inputs imho.
    X100

    I am looking at buying this camera, but I am NOT the typical 'indie' film type guy
    that seems to be prevalent these days. I need a good 'run and gun' type camera
    that I can use for a ton of different things (TV spots, events, sports, news)
    and I do NOT have a 'cinema style' production workflow usually (my clients
    don't usually give me the time for one....)
    I am NOT going to be using prime lenses most of the time and I need a good, broadcast style lens....
    you know, like the HDCam or Varicam has. I know this is a different style of camera, and it may be
    aimed more at the 'indie film' crowd, so it may just not be for me if it doesn't have a good, video
    zoom lens. I hope it does, because I like everything else about it and I will
    almost certainly be buying one if it DOES have a good video zoom lens,
    but if does not, I will not be buying one, and will instead be looking at other
    options (like the EX series or whatever new cam has come out).
    I agree totally with Bassman, and I hope that Panasonic will want the
    business of us 'video' guys too. But hey, I understand that they can't
    satisfy everyone, and if it doesn't have what I want, no biggie, I can
    spend my money other places, and I'm sure they will make plenty
    of sales without me.


     

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    And for those purposes, there's the HPX370, HPX170, HMC150, HMC40, HMC80, HPX500, HPX2000, HPX2700, HPX3000, and HPX3700. The broadcast/ENG segment is pretty well covered.
    Last edited by Barry_Green; 06-09-2010 at 10:43 PM.


     

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    Quote Originally Posted by Barry_Green View Post
    And for those purposes, there's the HPX370, HPX170, HMC150, HMC40, HMC80, HPX2000, HPX2700, HPX3000, and HPX3700. The broadcast/ENG segment is pretty well covered.
    You forgot my much loved 500.
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    Senior Member Mike Harvey's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by alaskacameradude View Post
    I need a good 'run and gun' type camera
    that I can use for a ton of different things (TV spots, events, sports, news)...
    I don't know that I would be using this for sports... the nice thing about the smaller chip cameras is it's easier to shoot sports with the deeper DoF. But if you can pull it off, more power to you...

    I know this is a different style of camera, and it may be
    aimed more at the 'indie film' crowd, so it may just not be for me if it doesn't have a good, video zoom lens.
    I don't think it's aimed at one "crowd" over the other, per se. This camera really is going to be in a class unto itself until the Sony equivalent is released. I think a lot of "crowds" are looking at this and seeing everything they can get for the incredible cost. Us smaller budget guys can get a much higher end look for our smaller budget clients and much more of a cinema look for our weddings without having to deal with oddball vDSLR or 35mm adapter rigs; the higher end guys are looking at this as a cheaper alternative for situations where RED or a Varicam might be overkill (or just a lot more expensive), and the indie film guys doing... ummm... whatever indie film guys do Most of the heated discussions in this thread have revolved around one crowd not taking another's needs into account, which I honestly think says a lot about the potential this camera has.


     

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    Quote Originally Posted by Barry_Green View Post
    And for those purposes, there's the HPX370, HPX170, HMC150, HMC40, HMC80, HPX2000, HPX2700, HPX3000, and HPX3700. The broadcast/ENG segment is pretty well covered.
    Exactly. ENG is designed for that sort of thing.

    Think of a 16x f1.4 zoom for 4/3. That could easily cost a large multiple of the 2/3" equivalents, at least $200,000. Lower than $50,000 is improbable regardless of the production quantity. Even an f2.8 16x should cost about 2x the cost of an f1.6 zoom for 2/3". The absolute aperture would be about the same and the area of coverage far greater, that's a lot of glass and a design nightmare. $50,000 at least.


     

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    Quote Originally Posted by Noel Evans View Post
    You forgot my much loved 500.
    DOH! You're right, I did. Hey, that was off the top of my head, so I think I did pretty well, but ... yeah, forgot the venerable 500. I added it and edited the post.


     

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