MINI 35 X redrock M2

[jabour]

Hi everybody,

I really need help to decide the best lens adapter to buy for the HVX... MINI35 and the redrock M2 seems to be both very nice, but the first one is much more expensive.

The question is: Could redrock M2 do the same job of MINI35 since the price difference is quite big?

Thanks for helping.

[Adam_Levins]

I am testing the Movietube vs the PS Technik this week. I will post results.

[Ursa]

M2 pros
1/10th of the price
can stop down the lens without visible grain on spinning matte plate
lose only abt 1 F-stop of light

MINI35 pros
image acquired comes in correctly (that is: NOT upside down)
easier setup

I haven't tried either, I just repeat what I've heard. Personally, I'd go for the M2 or the Brevis35.

[backward]

Guys, don't you know whether mini35 uses a zooming on the ground glass? I think that a great minus with the M2 is shaking because of zooming.

[AbstracTheory]

I'd love to see movietube footage...

[jabour]

Thank you for your comments!!

Regarding the redrock M2: What do you think that could be done about the up side down images? It should be hard to work in that conditions!!!

[jeremytuttle]

Thank you for your comments!!

Regarding the redrock M2: What do you think that could be done about the up side down images? It should be hard to work in that conditions!!!

People use an external monitor and flip it. Using an external monitor also helps being able to see focus better (assuming you are using a high quality monitor). Also, i've heard about people using magnets on the viewfinder to flip the image all though I hear you have to open the case to do this, which might void the warrantee.

[escozooz]

If you need to ask which to buy, you probably shouldn't be buying the mini-35.

Do you already own a Zeiss Superspeed Set or are you going to spend another $20k on lenses?

You can buy an M2 and make back that money within a year. You should rent the mini35 and the movietube if you get a budget.

:beer: Matt

[Adam_Levins]

I tested the Mini35 and Movietube on the HVX yesterday. Mostly charts and stuff. I can't share the footage at the moment as it is for a feature and the visual FX supervisor has it all. but I will try to get some samples up soon.

The PS technik seem to me to be slightly sharper and designed beter (the movietube is quite big and heavy)

In the past I have tested the Redrock and I feel it is too soft for HD work.

[escozooz]

Really you like the mini35 over the Movietube?

I'm dying to use the TUBE! Did you encounter any ground glass issues at 210 shutter angles on the Mini35?

The M2 is soft for HD work, but for SD downconverts its a god-send.

:beer: Matt

ADDED:

I believe that the use of Cinema lenses on the Mini35 and MovieTube adds a lot more resolving power to the system as a whole. The M2 uses SLR lenses for the most part, and they don't even begin to compare to cinema lenses.

Mini35 w/ Cookes is a completely different animal than the M2 w/ Nikons.

[Adam_Levins]

One note with the movietube, the focus should nnot be set to infinity as with the DXV100, it should be arround 92-95

On the PS Technik it is very important to thred the adapter ring all the way onto the HVX. the one I had was very tight and it was hard to tell when to stop but after a couple of attempts it becomes clear. A focus od 1.40 meters seemed to work best.

[Adam_Levins]

To be fair I need to do another day of testing with both units, we had about 8 hours but there was so much to consider.

I think I might had had the back focus a bit off on the movietube so I am reserving judgement on it.

But in terms of wieght I like the PS Technik. I think one of the reasons to go for a setup like this is size and weight so I don't get why they made the Movietube so bulky.

I will be doing one more day of testing and we will be printing the results to 35mm. i will keep you posted on how it goes.

[escozooz]

Take some pictures of the setups. They make me happy.

Thanks for posting, you the man. :thumbup:

:beer: Matt

[jabour]

I've got a friend that just bought the M2 and he can not have focus when using it with a set of zeiss high speed. He had succeed only with slr nikons. Can anybody help on it?

[Adam_Levins]

Hi Jabour. you need to use a spectrometer to reset the position of the spinnning plastic disk. Thats what we had to do anyway. That means that each time you change mounts you have to reset it, a really pain!

[smelni]

you can use cinema lenses with the M2 - just need to buy the 450 dollar PL mount - I plan on getting one at some point so I will be able to test it

[Adam_Levins]

some pics of the test: http://s105.photobucket.com/albums/m215/adamlevins/35MM%20ADAPTER%20TEST/?action=view&slideshow=true

[jabour]

Nice pics Adam!! Thanks a lot to everybody!! I love this place!!

[Adam_Levins]

Smelni, I am selling a Redrock PL mount, PM me for pics and details.

[Bunch Casseday]

We have both the Red Rock and the Mini 35, and we definitely prefer the Mini 35. It's easier and faster to set up, it's incredibly durable, and you can adjust the speed/amount of "film grain."

(not to mention the Mini 35 automatically flips the image for you, whereas the RR image is upside down)

....but heck, they're both pretty darn good ;)

[Adam_Levins]

Hi Bunch,

Do you mean that the faster you set the motor on the Mini35 the less grain you see? thats interesting as I have never heard it put that quite that way.

[pureHVX]

Adam,

I'm not sure what issues you've experienced with the M2, but I've swapped in and out nikon and PL mounts without any focusing issues and have found no need to recalibrate. But I am careful to screw all parts back together in an even manner, like a tire on a car.

And in my experience the cinema lenses on the M2 look great and are the way to go. Rent the lenses to keep your costs low.

Jason

[Lenilenapi]

Bunch and Jason,
I am interested in your comparison of Mini35 w/Zeiss lenses and M2 w/Nikon.

Bunch, you mention differences that sound like mostly ones of convenience. What is the difference in image quality. i was under the impression that the M2 because of its simplicity might be cleaner ( less halation ) perhaps sharper and lose less light than the mini 35. Of course you would probably offset those issues with the faster sharper cleaner Zeiss lenses.
How much difference do you see?

Jason, how much difference do you see on the Nikon vs. Zeiss set-up on the M2.

I would expect the Nikon/M2 to not be as sharp as the Zeiss/PL/M2 combination and it should have breathing problems, but the Nikon because of its larger image target should have noticable less depth of field. Also I'm shooting mostly interviews so far on the M2 and we often shoot out at 200mm on a 2.8 zoom lens. Trying to get that long a lens in a Zeiss PL mount might be enormous. Certainly a zoom would be very big.

What kind of monitor are you guys comparing on?

Lenny Levy

[smelni]

pureHVX- your infinity focus cannot be correct on both mounts - the flange distance for PL is different then for Nikon - you should check your setpup - it certainly requires an adjustment

[pureHVX]

Lenny,

I definitely notice a marked improvement with the cinema lenses. Mainly because they are better lenses and made for motion pictures. And with the superspeeds, you can live more comfortably around a 2.8 without pushing the lens. You never really want to bottom out a lens. As for the 200mm, that's a personal choice. I tend to go for more of an 85mm of which there are plenty.

Jason

[pureHVX]

Seth,

I haven't paid close attention to the infinity setting, but I have not had issues with normal operation. Now I've found that normal for the PL mount is close but maybe an inch off of the lens markings. It's measurable enough to get you close enough to work. But - and a big but - the Nikons are almost a 1.5x factor off of the lens markings. This is something I find to be a huge pain and an obstacle to the process. But to answer Lenny's other question, I utilize the Panasonic BT-LH1700W 17" HD LCD on set for the camera team so focus doesn't become an issue.

Jason

[Nathan Drillot]

read this article

http://www.showreel.org/memberarea/article.php?172

I agree with Rodney Charters and Taylor Wigton.

[fede:lang]

Hi, do you happen to know where can I get the Redrock Revolution software (the laptop monitoring software) its beta is out and I really need a monitor for my DVX100AE, since its a Pal camcorder a normal TV doesnt work. Thanks

[Nathan Drillot]

I would have loved to get on that beta as well....

Now we wait.