View Full Version : Images on red.com look like CG Renders
Matthew Bennett
09-25-2006, 04:41 PM
First off, I'm very impressed by the images on the red.com site, looking forward to seeing more.
On to my topic- maybe it's just me, but the camera images have the look of renders from 3D Studio Pro, the way the out of focus areas look and of course the noisless-ness of the image. I'm not a 3D artist, but I've seen a lot of work that an old roommate of mine did in the before-mentioned program.
I've always hated this look when seeing 3D animations, but now that I'm seeing that same look from a live source, it's very intriguing.
I'm not saying in any way that i think the images on red.com are cgi renders.. I'm just saying that to my eye, they share a lot of qualities with hi-res cg work. It's like you get all the cleanliness and 'slickness of a digital look, but the source is life, which could never be replicated by a 3d program. It's a 'best of both worlds' situation...
Very interesting look, I hope that it holds through the process of tweaking the sensor or whatever the final process is.
tlorenzo
09-25-2006, 04:52 PM
Dude - I'm quite sure they are actually 3D renders. And why wouldn't they be? Makes sense since the camera body is still under continuous development.
John Allardice
09-25-2006, 04:55 PM
Its funny...because I've just spent the past couple of months trying to make cg renders look like they were shot on film!
http://swayftp.com/Hyundai_HNCS_0114.htm
Policar
09-25-2006, 05:01 PM
Whoa...that was sick.
Brook Willard
09-25-2006, 05:06 PM
Its funny...because I've just spent the past couple of months trying to make cg renders look like they were shot on film!
http://swayftp.com/Hyundai_HNCS_0114.htm
I actually remember seeing this aired and being quite impressed by it. The sole fact that it takes on anamorphic focal and flare traits helps immeasurably.
Matthew Bennett
09-25-2006, 05:10 PM
Dude - I'm quite sure they are actually 3D renders. And why wouldn't they be? Makes sense since the camera body is still under continuous development.
Sorry, I meant the gallery images from the camera.. girl blowing smoke, the watch and car especially..
Oh and good commercial!
acoreasc
09-25-2006, 05:11 PM
John - is that your work? Because if it is I might have to kill you....for being too talented
Jim Arthurs
09-25-2006, 05:37 PM
Its funny...because I've just spent the past couple of months trying to make cg renders look like they were shot on film!
http://swayftp.com/Hyundai_HNCS_0114.htm
Fantastic work! Love the feel of the wide angle lens... very good photoreal quality and lighting.
The irony is I spent my summer taking lens distortion OUT of live action plates so I could track them better... :)
Regards,
Poi Boy
09-25-2006, 05:45 PM
I'm quite sure the gallery images of car, smoke, women etc are NOT cg 3d.
Aloha
-A
Neil Rowe
09-25-2006, 05:50 PM
..come on.. of course they are CG. its all a governemt conspiracy man.. i mean , they still wont admit that the moon is made of cheese.
Jaime Valles
09-25-2006, 06:03 PM
Its funny...because I've just spent the past couple of months trying to make cg renders look like they were shot on film!
http://swayftp.com/Hyundai_HNCS_0114.htm
Holy crap, John! That was unbelievable... Absolutely some of the best animation I think I've ever seen.
And, yes, the RED frame grabs do look like they were rendered in 3D, in a good way. I can't wait until I actually need to buy this camera (hopefully sometime late 2007 - early 2008)
Poi Boy
09-25-2006, 06:59 PM
Jonh, great spot..Sway does amazing work. How many animators do they use at any given time ?
Aloha
-A
wabbit
09-25-2006, 07:10 PM
Perhaps it looks cg because the image is so sharp and noise free compared to the usual digital video images and lacks the graininess of film. Seems to me you add some film grain to the image and you will have the closest filmlooking video to date.
Cheers
laguun
09-25-2006, 08:09 PM
First off, I'm very impressed by the images on the red.com site, looking forward to seeing more.
On to my topic- maybe it's just me, but the camera images have the look of renders from 3D Studio Pro, the way the out of focus areas look and of course the noisless-ness of the image. I'm not a 3D artist, but I've seen a lot of work that an old roommate of mine did in the before-mentioned program.
I've always hated this look when seeing 3D animations, but now that I'm seeing that same look from a live source, it's very intriguing.
hate to burst into yor bubble there.... but where have you been the recent 10 years?
didnt you have the :money: or the :time: to attend IBC?
however, welcome to my list, young director. you did qualify yourself ...
John Allardice
09-25-2006, 08:38 PM
Thanks guys.
Just to cover everybodys' questions: We had a team consisting of 3 modelers (max), 4 character guys (Lightwave), 2 TD's (Lightwave to MAX pipeline), 3 color & lighting (V-RAY), and 4 compositors (NUKE).
Plus myself & one other guy on previs & layout (Lightwave).
I directed, edited and acted as VFX supervisor.
....and yeah, we spent a while working on the anamorphic look, everything from the obvious (flares and elliptical bokeh), to little stuff like chromatic abberration and softening on the fringes of the image and a one to one-and-a-half stop falloff as you get towards the edge of the lens.
The intention was to make it look as if it'd been shot on some old late 60's - early 70's, square front, LOMO anamorphics.
Nice work John. I saw that on the Tube last night.
insanityfw
09-25-2006, 09:53 PM
Nice John. Saw it on TV and loved it. Great work and energy.
Jarred Land
09-25-2006, 10:40 PM
John has been tremendosly generous inside and out in many ways through the last couple ways.. and its good to see his talents being shown.
good work!
Emanuel
09-25-2006, 11:10 PM
First off, I'm very impressed by the images on the red.com site, looking forward to seeing more.
On to my topic- maybe it's just me, but the camera images have the look of renders from 3D Studio Pro, the way the out of focus areas look and of course the noisless-ness of the image. I'm not a 3D artist, but I've seen a lot of work that an old roommate of mine did in the before-mentioned program.
I've always hated this look when seeing 3D animations, but now that I'm seeing that same look from a live source, it's very intriguing.
I'm not saying in any way that i think the images on red.com are cgi renders.. I'm just saying that to my eye, they share a lot of qualities with hi-res cg work. It's like you get all the cleanliness and 'slickness of a digital look, but the source is life, which could never be replicated by a 3d program. It's a 'best of both worlds' situation...
Very interesting look, I hope that it holds through the process of tweaking the sensor or whatever the final process is.Good news indeed and really new as well! And not just, new! Even if after all, new!
EDIT -- Sorry my play with the words but I can't find any other form to express what I feel on the subject.
Poi Boy
09-26-2006, 12:05 AM
Yes Kudos to John... But I wish I could do what the cg artist are doing ! You can tell the car is cg when it drives out but otherwise, fantastic,
Aloha
-A
mavrix
09-26-2006, 01:14 AM
my compliments - great work.
samuel33
09-26-2006, 05:48 AM
can someone put the youtube link, the original link is over bandwitch
guru_meditation
09-26-2006, 06:31 AM
im a cg artist using softimage xsi and its inbuilt mental ray renderer. i would love to see that commercial but the server says its bandwith is exceedet.
however, all pictures showing the camera are rendered. looks like maya to me, or 3ds max, and i dont really like both apps. the first time you try xsi you stick with it. best 3d app at this time. modeling-/rendering- and animation-wise.
the gallery pics, well, its just that we've never seen such a clear picture at that resolution. the dynamic range is so wide and the grades so soft, it looks allmost painted. i think this is what made matthew think it's cg.
that 4k shot looks brilliant. there are guys in the industry that can render a face like that but in the end it would take alot of time to render an animation at 4k with that amount of detail like sss and displacement maps.
red footage (full or downrezed) will be great for post work. can't wait to pull a key from that footage or track the camera, should work like a charm..
John Allardice
09-26-2006, 10:18 AM
can someone put the youtube link, the original link is over bandwitch
We'll have it back up again soon...the last few day we've had over TWO HUNDRED THOUSAND HITS....Jeez, we ought to get some advertising on there
AuditoryVisuals
09-26-2006, 03:01 PM
Just because it has people smoking and cars with rear view mirrors (smoke and mirrors) it doesn't mean it's fake!
samuel33
09-26-2006, 05:40 PM
the link works again.
The lights...the lights.... wunderbar!
im.thatoneguy
09-27-2006, 03:53 AM
Sorry this is a bit off topic but I'm just curious about your background John. Did you start out directing live action commercials or did you come from a CG background? This is the area of the industry I'm most interested in with the melding of cg and traditional film theory. I'm always interested to hear the stories of those who have succeeded and which direction they came from whether it be more of a VFX supervisor position or a live action commercial director.
Matthew Bennett
09-27-2006, 10:20 AM
My cgi-look thread got jacked by cgi guys!
Smoke and mirrors, very funny.. The user who said the out of focus areas looked 'painted' was bang-on.. a better way to describe how I was feeling about the aesthetics of the images from the mysterium. It seems like a mysterium image would go very well with cg.
Somebody shoot some dirt or a pile of litter!!
andersh
09-27-2006, 10:59 AM
Re: cgi-look: I wonder what they called it when it became possible to create movies in color. I'm sure somebody complained that the color films lacked some aesthetics. And just as some complained when we went from LPs to CDs, I'm sure somebody will complain when it now becomes possible to create movies with sufficient resolution and without noise (or no film grain at least). But if you like noise or lack or color it will still be an option, you will just have to consciously choose to add it. The red one will eliminate or lessen some problems, giving good directors time to think about more interesting problems. Bad directors that can't cope with the new possibilities or that feel threatened by the lowered barrier of entry of cause won't like this.
(This is not at all meant as an attack on you.)
laboprod
09-27-2006, 11:14 AM
Hi John,
Bravo, very good work!
I've noted that you had used vray to render. I've only started to create some 3D models, and I'm interested by vray, as it seems to be more friendly than mental ray.
Just to have an idea...how many times did the render took? On how many of computers?
ciao,
antoine
What was the Approx budget on that TV spot? I would take a guess at $600,000...close?