Dynamic Range...

[Jannard]

This is the shot of the 959. I pulled it down to almost black to show that there is tone in the flag in front of the 4k light and everywhere on the 959. Pretty incredible.

Jim

http://www.dvxuser6.com/uploaded/10724/1158637397.jpg

[Brook Willard]

Geez, that's remarkable. It's difficult to tell if the inconsistencies on the flag in the last shot are from compression artifacting or reaching beyond the consistent range of the sensor, but the detail in the highlights are impressive no matter how you cut it. It almost seems to retain significant data past 100%.

How many stops over were the highlighted section?

[Jarred Land]

its amazing to see there is still detail in that flag that is being directly hit by that open faced light blasting 12 inches away from it.. and that there is enough range still in the darks that you can see the stuff in the background shadows like the orange extension cords on the ground etc.

[Rocketeer]

Its enough to make a man reserve a 3rd camera...

[tonacidigital]

incredible pics. I'm still dying for some 4k still downloads..or better yet a 1080p quick clip of the 959.

[Jarred Land]

Its enough to make a man reserve a 3rd camera...

ha ha ha no kidding.

[Blaine]

Soooo. When was that L.A. screening? :)

[Jannard]

We hurried to get footage together for IBC. We would prefer to shoot better footage before we offer any up for download. Why post something less than our best when there is plenty of time before we ship? Every pic will come under extreme scrutiny so we want to characterize our sensor 1st, maybe even correct for dead pixels... small stuff like that. People are not very forgiving to see work in progress with excuses. We are shooting this week and should have footage to post next week.

Jim

[CVB]

incredible pics. I'm still dying for some 4k still downloads..or better yet a 1080p quick clip of the 959.
Ok, OK... I found a pic of the 959 in all its 4K glory...
Keep in mind that I got this from a less than reputable source so there are a few minor artifacts... lol.

http://www.partfoundry.com/images/959_4K.jpg


.

[Jannard]

CVB... if anyone actually falls for this you are going to fall out of favor over here! :-)

Jim

[Brook Willard]

Wow, the RED camera really was a lie! It's just a little Sony in a fancy case! Noooooooo!!!


Good to hear about the upcoming shoots, I'm really looking forward to the new footage.

Will you ever post high-res frames of the current [Porsche, watch] footage? Maybe after the better footage has been posted? I'd just love to see it at some point.

[CVB]

CVB... if anyone actually falls for this you are going to fall out of favor over here! :-)

Jim

lol... couldn't resist. At least it gives a good representation of the size of one frame :)

[mikkowilson]

Ok, OK... I found a pic of the 959 in all its 4K glory...
Keep in mind that I got this from a less than reputable source so there are a few minor artifacts... lol.

http://www.partfoundry.com/images/959_4K.jpg

Man that looks lousy, my DV camera could do better. :Drogar-Dum(DBG): :grin:


- Mikko ... was at the screening, saw the real thing, daaaamn....

[Poi Boy]

Man, the 959 still looks like a curent show car; even after all these years.
The first image has no black... the second image is beautiful.
Aloha
-A

[J.R. Hudson]

(Want's too shoot feature with it)

Whoa

[tonacidigital]

We hurried to get footage together for IBC. We would prefer to shoot better footage before we offer any up for download. Why post something less than our best when there is plenty of time before we ship? Every pic will come under extreme scrutiny so we want to characterize our sensor 1st, maybe even correct for dead pixels... small stuff like that. People are not very forgiving to see work in progress with excuses. We are shooting this week and should have footage to post next week.

Jim

next week? sweeeeeeeet. I completely understand. The IBC show footage I have seen uploaded into tiny movie files is already mind blowing, I can't imagine what else you have in store. good times.

[imgentertainment@mac]

Now all I can say is hello low light shooting situations. A Documentary camera mans dream come true. Where sometimes the on camera ligh just isn't enough. I love how you can see everything in the back of the set the stuff that is not ment to be seen.

And beautiful car Jim. I got to ride in one once and that is something I'll never forget.

[Akube]

i so feel like kicking cvb's ass right now. lol.

but seriously... seriously... with that dynamic range .. with hardly any noise..

maaan you'd need so little light to make anything look hot and sexy.

i mean.. in the non red-world.. you'd spend hours and hours lighting with huuuge and massive lights so that youd have enough information inorder to not get visible ugly noise while you colorcorrect and tone ure image later on... i feel like i'd hardly be needing light if my images look so sexy toned down and GRAINLESS. even with those way small pictures you could hardly see any grain...

look at cvb's picture.. do you see anything other than jpeg artifacts? NO FREKKIN NOISE. and the picture is multiplied in size by a bizillion times... the tones are STILL SMOOTH... even a digital camera wouldnt give you that neat grading when uprezzed.

[acehole111]

Ahh cvb.. Slander!

[Kjetil Haugen]

We are shooting this week and should have footage to post next week.

Jim

Is it too early for some outdoor footage?

[Emanuel]

We are shooting this week and should have footage to post next week.

JimIs it too early for some outdoor footage?Good question Kjetil. And :dankk2: for your announcement Jim. We hope for it as much as possible.

[filmmaker1977]

We hope for it as much as possible.
quicktime 1080p and 720p for both Mac and PC sides, please..

[Jay A. Kelley]

They said that to ask a question is a sign of intelligence. If this is true I must be a friggin genius!

Jim, what does it mean to "characterize the chip"?

Jay

[filmmaker1977]

"they"?..

[Shaw]

They as in the amorphous 'they' which is required by the english language since we can't form setences without an overt subject (unlike many languages which would just use a form of the verb by itself).

:D

[Lowkus]

You could also have phrased it more like a proverb... "it is said that to ask a question is a sign of intelligence".

[filmmaker1977]

thx lowkus.. now it's better..

[Jay A. Kelley]

Jim,

I wrote to a nice lady at Red and asked about getting a T-shirt and she said you felt they were not up to your standards yet.

Why in the cornbread hell are you wasteing time with this stupid camera when you could be perfecting the ultimate RED T-shirt!?

I am being made fun of out here in St. Louis and I want to wear my RED T-shirt and openly show I am NOT ASHAMED!!!

I wanna shirt

Jay

[WarrenS]

What the potato chip hell is "cornbread hell"?

I want a "RED" polo shirt and a hat. Maybe a tie, although I can't remember that last time I wore one.

[andersh]

I am being made fun of out here in St. Louis and I want to wear my RED T-shirt and openly show I am NOT ASHAMED!!! Okay, here you go. :)

[Robert Sanders]

What the potato chip hell is "cornbread hell"?.

ROFLMAO!

[Jack_Felis]

You guys are too funny! :grin:

[Jay A. Kelley]

"Cornbread Hell"... Yeah I came apart when I first heard it.. Kind of stuck ever since then...

I wanna shirt

Jay

[Shaw]

You could also have phrased it more like a proverb... "it is said that to ask a question is a sign of intelligence".
True, this is an interesting linguistic case. Make the sentence passive and drop the subject.

"It is said [by them] that ..."

Wow that was really geeking out... I'll shut up now :D

[Jay A. Kelley]

This is why brainiacs make such good politicians. You all got so obsessed over the wording of my post, YOU FORGOT TO ANSWER THE QUESTION!!!

What does it mean to "Characterize the Chip"?

Sheesh...

Jay

[glenn chan]

Maybe it's the measure the transfer function of the sensor... this way you can correct for any non-linearities. If you look at some exposure latitude tests of the Dalsa Origin, film stocks, Viper, Andromeda-modded DVX100, etc. (basically any camera that shoots extended dynamic range) you see that the whites tend to shift colors. The Andromeda is especially apparent when it comes to this.
Theoretically, it might be possible to calibrate against any non-linearities so the whites don't shift colors. Or they re-design the sensor to improve its characteristics.
The test footage does show that there is very little color shifting in the highlights though??

2- The characterization might mean something else... measuring the MTF, measuring spectral response, etc.

3- Ok, you know what: I have no idea what characterization means... I am just guessing here.

[Jay A. Kelley]

Yeah but they are very impressive guesses.. You should try this stuff on women...

Jay

[acehole111]

I think characterising might mean giving the chip its distinctive colour pallette and the way it handles exposure and tempratures natively. Maybe.

[GabrielR]

Most importantly, getting the Gamma curves correct.


Here's a nice little scholarly article. I hope your Calculus isn't too rusty. . .

http://www.ph.tn.tudelft.nl/People/lucas/publications/1994/SPIE94JMLVea/SPIE94JMLVea.pdf (http://www.ph.tn.tudelft.nl/People/lucas/publications/1994/SPIE94JMLVea/SPIE94JMLVea.pdf)

The introduction: (Now, I just need a PHD to English translator.)


The methods given in this paper describe how to accurately measure the following properties: linearity of
photometric response, signal-to-noise ratio (SNR), sensitivity, dark current and spatial frequency response.
Linearity of photometric response, which comes with the use of semiconductor sensors, is in some cameras
mapped to a nonlinear scale in order to 'gamma-correct' the video signal to produce a linear response on a video
display device. This 'gamma-correction' feature needs to be switched off if one requires a linear response. Dark
current is defined as the production of electrons per pixel from thermal energy. The SNR per pixel (SNR = 20
log(a/s), with 'a' the signal's amplitude and 's' the standard deviation of the noise) is limited by several noise
sources, such as, photon shot noise, readout noise, dark current noise and quantization noise. Spatial frequency
response quantifies the sensitivity of the camera to a spectrum of spatial frequencies. Sensitivity relates a camera
system's ADC unit to the number incident photons per pixel.

[vincekeala]

I'll translate that in one quick sentence:

"Blah, blah, blah, blah, blah..."

[mike the beginner]

Yeah but they are very impressive guesses.. You should try this stuff on women...

Jay


I think that's called undressing after which you adjust the exposure settings accordingly :)

[mavrix]

Definitely impressive range - would fill a big void where my F900 falls short -- and looks like the range surpasses the demo footage of the new Cinealta I saw at NAB. I'm definitely looking forward to seeing some outdoor footage as well - preferably both filtered and unfiltered.

[valoo]

"Cornbread Hell" is that from Life with Eddie Murphy?

[luisbustamante]

Can we please have some more examples of dynamic range? Please?

txs