1080pa

[Poi Boy]

Up to now I've been shooting 720pn. I finally received FCP5.1 and am trying to edit my first 1080pa24 footage. I get stuttering playback even though the footage looks smooth in camera. the clips in my bin say 29.97 instead of 24fps...what am I doing wrong ?
aloha
-A

[toddeastman]

I didn't think FCP supported the advanced pulldown at 1080. Version 5.0.4 does not. I believe the only thing Version 5.1 brought to the table was native support for IntelMacs.

[Poi Boy]

5.1 added support for 1080 pa but I can't seem to find any info. Help Barry !
-A

[soarprod]

Here is how to do it:

Import your clips using the P2 import. For the timeline, you can use the default 1080i60 setup. Close or hide FCP. You can apply this to 1 clip or do a batch to remove the extra frames for all the clips.

1. Open Cinema Tools.
2. Open Clip.
3. Pick clip-reverse telecine

Capture mode :
F1-F2

File:
New (smaller)

Conform to:
23.98 w/ standard upper/lower

Fields:
AA
Style 1

Click ok and save new file.

Go back into FCP and create or change the timeline settings to be this:
1080i60 easy setup and change to:
click the advanced tab under the compression settings for 1080i60, custom fps 23.976.
That should do it.

Load your clips and they should be blue in the timeline and playback fine. One weard thing that cinema tools does is make the clips appear to have a frame size of 360x??? for quicktime playback but if you just change the size to be normal, they stretch back out to full screen 1920x1080. When you send the clips to motion project, they also have this 360 thing going on and you will need to render out the clip to 1080 from FCP to properly bring it into motion.

[Poi Boy]

Thanks !
Aloha
-A

[jeffyjones]

No... you shouldn't need to use Cinema Tools in 5.1. That was kind of the point. It should natively suck in the P2 media and remove the extra frames:

http://manuals.info.apple.com/en/Final_Cut_Pro_5.0_lbn_z.pdf

[Poi Boy]

That is what I thought; it imports but in the bin it says 29.97fps and when I play it it stutters. I read that pdf but can't find any other info.
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[TheFirstCause]

Yeah that is what I thought too. And why do we have to use 1080i60 timelines? To anyone else with FCP 5.1, does it have 1080p timeline presets? And can you simply throw your imported P2 footage in without cinema tools and have it be 24p or 23.98p?

Thanks=)

[soarprod]

I dont see any presets in my FCP 5.1

[R Gale]

Me neither. Despite the aforementioned document by Apple.
Also, I asked an Apple rep about it at NAB, and was told 5.1 does not support 1080/24p. strange.

[Barry_Green]

Yeah, I heard that too. Apple clearly said "5.1 = remove 1080/24pa pulldown." But people at NAB told me that Apple was saying that 5.1 DOESN'T support it after all.

I don't have 5.1 and can't verify. Soarprod, or anyone else with 5.1, can you please dig into this and give us a definitive answer? It said that the pulldown would be stripped out upon import, so maybe there's not a preset, maybe there's some capture setting?

[Poi Boy]

Well I finally got it to play smoothly. 24p is not supported. I think what it does is take out the frame on import and adds a pull down, as if you had telecined your film. It looks pretty darn good !
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[soarprod]

Well, my method above works. Kinda a work around, but I've been using it for weeks now and no hiccups yet :) I've transfered the timeline out to 720p, 480p DVCpro50, & DVD. The results are great. But common apple? WTF, here we go FCP 6.

[HVXguy]

Yeah, I heard that too. Apple clearly said "5.1 = remove 1080/24pa pulldown." But people at NAB told me that Apple was saying that 5.1 DOESN'T support it after all.

I don't have 5.1 and can't verify. Soarprod, or anyone else with 5.1, can you please dig into this and give us a definitive answer? It said that the pulldown would be stripped out upon import, so maybe there's not a preset, maybe there's some capture setting?

It does not work. They did a check box for remove pulldown but it does nothing. SoarProd use of Cinema Tools does work, it's just a pain to do when you have many clips. In the sequence presets you do have a 1080 24p sequence.

[jeffyjones]

Well hold on a second... I've sucked the files in and played them back and they look as they should. I haven't tried to drop a clip in a sequence, but it does look right. The specs very clearly say... "HD at 1080i 50/60, 1080p 23.98/24, and 720p 23.98/30/60"
http://www.apple.com/finalcutstudio/specs.html?finalcutpro

[HVXguy]

You shot 1080 24pa??
I import as P2 and check the box to remove pulldown.
Maybe I should not check the box??
I will try again.
But in a 1080 24p sequence it clearly shows an interlaced frame??

[Mike@AF]

Could any of this have to do with the System Settings / Playback Control tab where this is an option for Pulldown Pattern? The options are 2:3:2:3, 2:3:3:2, 24@25 Pulldown, and 24@25 Repeat. Mine was set to 2:3:2:3, but isn't 2:3:3:2 correct for the pA mode?

[Mike@AF]

I got to say this whole process sucks big time. I just started experimenting with the camera a little bit and haven't tried 720p yet. Is it the same ordeal with 720p? I understand I have to go through a frame rate converter for undercranked or overcranked clips, but what about normal 24p or 24pN?

Is there any loss in quality using the Cinema Tools Reverse Telecine process? It spends so long creating the new files that I'm concerned it's altering the picture or sound in some way.

Is there a way to batch reverse telecine clips that are in multiple bins?

[evinsky]

I got to say this whole process sucks big time. I just started experimenting with the camera a little bit and haven't tried 720p yet. Is it the same ordeal with 720p? I understand I have to go through a frame rate converter for undercranked or overcranked clips, but what about normal 24p or 24pN?

Is there any loss in quality using the Cinema Tools Reverse Telecine process? It spends so long creating the new files that I'm concerned it's altering the picture or sound in some way.

Is there a way to batch reverse telecine clips that are in multiple bins?

If you shoot 720 "PN" this is not an issue at all.

I don't have 5.1 yet but all the 1080 24PA clips I've shot I've used the "Cinema tools reverse telecine option" under Tools and it just extracts and works great. I now it's not as easy as doing it onn import but it's not awful.

[jeffyjones]

Agreed. I experimented with this as well and I didn't find any particular issue. I did notice the checkbox on the P2 import dialog though that says to remove advanced pulldown, but when I noticed it I was getting stuff that didn't need it. I assume the results would be what you'd expect though.

[Mike@AF]

I know it works, but with this movie I'm going to end up with hundreds of clips. It will take forever to use Cinema Tools for the reverse telecine process one clip at a time.