HVX200 version B

[Arnika]

Does any one heard any clue about when Panasonic will release a new version of the HVX200 just like they did with the DVX100, not even a year after the original version ?

Arnika

[ullanta]

I think you mean version A. B will probably come after that if it does come.

[Pascal_Parvex]

If there is an A version what will be "corrected"?

[SPZ]

It will be full black. Not the "neither blue or black" casing nonsense :)

[Illya Friedman]

Don't plan on anything before Q2 2007

I.

P.S. Just a guess...

[alpi69]

- better LCD for sure.

the most needed fix is software compatibility for their formats. Pana needs to assist the software companies (Avid, Canopus etc) to make sure we can actually edit the stuff. right now I can´t buy the camera because I cannot use the 720p-PAL stuff.

[xray]

I agree. There is no way to edit with the mac, if you invest in mac, editing software (FCP), audio software, professional infrastructure, trained people, there is no way you can use the HVX200 right now in the PAL territories.

Maybe they need to send some software engineers over to Apple or pay for the development.

[evinsky]

Not that you guys don't have a point, but don't you think we oughta ' actually use the camera for a while before we start redesigning it? If for no other reason than to really know what we like and dislike. Huh?

And no, three months is not enough time to know.

[The Sarlacc]

Not that you guys don't have a point, but don't you think we oughta ' actually use the camera for a while before we start redesigning it? If for no other reason than to really know what we like and dislike. Huh?

And no, three months is not enough time to know.

I've really used the camera...twice already...see my posts on what I think needs revising.

Its a first gen camera, nothing is perfect.

[Arnika]

That’s what I heard from many users… They really enjoy this camera but since it’s a first generation there is always place for improvement..

The question is how long will they wait before making the next gen… I was very impress back then when the DVX version A came out.. it didn’t took that long… but I guest the original DVX had more flaws then the original HVX…

It make me wonder what’s the best thing to do since I wanted to buy it but at this point, if it’s a matter of less then a year ,I might wait for version A to come out.

Hopefully the price of the P2 cards will go down by then… I can’t believe you can only put about 1 mins of footage by gigs of P2 is it true ??

[Rhydon]

What Illya Friedman said, even if Panasonic is working on one i dont think we're gonna see any revision until ATLEAST next January.

[FatBird19]

Some improvements I'd love to see in the 200A..... :)

1) Better lens
The lens is good, don't get me wrong, but I've seen Barry's measurements. It'd be nice if the lens went to f11 safely without losing resolution. I also heard that the lens loses resolution at lower focal lengths but I could be wrong.
Also, I'm wondering if the lower rez on the HVX isn't caused by the lens itself. With spatial offset, out of its 540x960 chips the HVX should be able to achieve 810x1440 luma rez, and it isn't getting that. So unless I'm missing something, either there's a problem with the spatial offset implementation or there's a problem with the lens.
While resolution isn't the most important thing in the world for me, it sure wouldn't hurt, and I would easily put another $500 down for my HVX if I knew it would go towards lens improvements.

2) More pixels on the chips
The only way I would want this is if it wouldn't sacrifice the color, lattitude, and noise ratio that the HVX currently has, and unless Panasonic can shrink the space between the sensors without decreasing the size of the sensors themselves, this is pretty much impossible. Enough of my pie in the sky hopes, the image coming out of the HVX now is almost perfect as it is, and even lens improvements alone would make me more than content. :)

3) Image flip for 35mm adapters
C'mon, it's like 10 lines of code I'm sure. The HVX is perfect for independent filmmaking(among other fields, of course), and it would be great if they could include this one little feature that would be effortless to implement and make it that much more attractive and convenient for people in the film field.

4) Image Processing improvement
This one I'm not sure about. I've heard rumors that there is some loss of image fidelity when switched from 720 to 1080 modes. I've seen some examples of this for myself, but I'm not sure if the user just didn't use different settings. From what I saw, 1080 mode exhibits less color saturation, less contrast, and slightly lower lattitude. But then again, those are just what I've heard and what I've seen within a very limited sampling of images, so I'll leave comments on this to people that actually have used the camera extensively. :)

5) Still image mode
Another tiny request like the image flip. I do stop motion occasionally, and I know other people who do stop motion. This camera looks so much like film anyways, I figure rather than pay money for 8mm or 16mm, I'd rather just be able to use this one. It's not much, just a button and a few lines of code.
I've heard you can jimmy rig this sort of thing though in the time lapse mode. If anyone knows it would be appreciated. :o

6) Higher rez LCD
I don't know how much $150 does in the world of LCD improvement, but I would defenitely put it forward if it would be used to give my screen a little more clarity.

7) XL style gain and WB dials
This is probably the biggest one for me, aside from lens improvements maybe.
This is one of the only features on the Canon XL camera series that I like more than on the DVX and HVX; immediate access to all gain levels and easier access to white balance. Being able to switch from -3db to 18db and every setting inbetween including auto with just the turn of a dial is so convenient. Not really necessary on a film set(although it's preferable to menu navigation) but last december when I was shooting a documentary with a magician at night, it would have been nice to have that dial when necessary. Same goes for the white balance dial. Having one notch for daylight, one notch for tungsten, three for custom and one for auto would be so convenient. Having a dial for the WB is not as important as a gain dial for me, but it would be really nice nonetheless. To completely remove the necesities of menu navigation for white balance and gain adjustment would make things a lot more convenient and user friendly.
The HVX is a beast compared to the DVX. It's much larger and it has much more room on it. Whereas I thought dials might have been a little crammed on the DVX, I think there would be plenty of room now on the HVX.

If I had a sayso, those would be my choices. :)

[ksteiger]

In the month that I have had this camera I would change nothing! Well maybe I would have the price reduced to $2000...and change the chip size to 2/3"...but that is absolutely all I would do...

[dcraig]

if we waited for lincolns we never would have bought model T's

No version A or B anytime soon

The HVX200 in Canada is the HVX200 eh!

Get on with it.

[RichardVClark]

The HVX200 in Canada is the HVX200 eh!


HAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHHA

[DC]

Even though the HVX200 is a first-gen camera, it doesn't really have much new technology inside that is less than 2 years old. The VariCam has been around for awhile now and so has P2. Sure, there are some features that aren't found in other cameras but the technology itself is not completely new.

[DavidBeier]

You realize Fatbird that number #1 and #2 on your list would mean seriously redesigning the camera right? This is a minor upgrade, not a new camera we're waiting for.

[Arnika]

After seeing slow motions dogs running, slow motion money falling, slow motion walking in the rain, slow motion dancing and the probably upcoming slow motion taking a d…. don’t you think no one has been able to post anything showing how this camera could really stand up in the film industry…

[FatBird19]

You realize Fatbird that number #1 and #2 on your list would mean seriously redesigning the camera right? This is a minor upgrade, not a new camera we're waiting for.

#2 is less likely the issue. I think the lower rez is all in the lens, unless the pixel shift is badly implemented.

It's all a dream in my head, but I'd defenitely pay $500 extra for an improved lens. :/

[FatBird19]

WB and gain knobs would be awesome though, at the least. :)

[DVG Big Cheese]

Keep in mind one of the main reasons the 100 came out with a "b" version had to do with the lead issue and the EPA. The HVX200 like the bigger 800 and 700 can be upgraded on some features via software. We just set through a training class with Raj Lad one of Panasonics techs at one of our broadcast customers that purchased both 700's, 800's and 200's, in the class we did software upgrades on the bigger cam's by down loading to the SD card. If a "B" version does come out it will be a ways down the road as the 200 REALLY started shipping in JAN.

[Jeff Deveraux]

Keep in mind one of the main reasons the 100 came out with a "b" version had to do with the lead issue and the EPA. The HVX200 like the bigger 800 and 700 can be upgraded on some features via software. We just set through a training class with Raj Lad one of Panasonics techs at one of our broadcast customers that purchased both 700's, 800's and 200's, in the class we did software upgrades on the bigger cam's by down loading to the SD card. If a "B" version does come out it will be a ways down the road as the 200 REALLY started shipping in JAN.


DVG-
Can you tell us more about this class you took? Where? When? How?...

[Justyn]

I'd change the camera to make it out of either cotton candy, dental floss, or 4 leaf clovers...


Why does this bizness come up about a and b and waiting. Brothers, buy the camera and get some work out of it. As of right now, my P2 card (yes only 1, but I borrow 2 more), my p2store, my camera cases (3), my microphone, and maybe 1/4 of the camera is paid for from gigs over the past 2 weeks!

I'm sure that within another 4-6 weeks I will have made back all of my 8K investment. So within 2 months... the camera is now all profit. Sure, I still want to buy 2 more P2 cards, Matte box, etc... but that is to be done after credit cards are at zero....

The bleeding edge is kind of a nice place to be right now. Shooting HD is opening some big phat doors for my big phat camera...

[booth]

I'm still excited by the fact that I can dump two P2 cards to my external hard drive - then be editing it within minutes, rather than digitising. I hate digitising and now I don't need to do it any more :)

So yes the bleeding edge is the place to be :love4:

[dudadoubt]

well its way to expensive for us here in the philippines to purchase that at around more than $5,000 multiplied by 53 pesos thats roughly P300+++ wow! an independent filmmaker like me will have to wait a long time til i can afford it... whew!

[DVG Big Cheese]

DVG-
Can you tell us more about this class you took? Where? When? How?...


Hey Jeff, we sold one of our broadcast customers a bunch (30+) of the AJSPC700 P2 camcorders for news, AJ-SPX800 for production, and some of the HVX200's as well as P2 stores and card readers. Panasonic sent Raj Lad down (one of their engineers and all around nice guy) to do training at the customers site on the cameras and since we did the deal I was invited (this was week before last). It was very informative and we covered everything from firmware/software updates on the cameras to setting the 200 as a host to dump footage off directly to an "off the shelf" firewire drive. We also went over transfering the video off to both Grass Valley News edit systems as well as Avid's.

[Erik Olson]

Well, none of us have been digitizing for a long time - we've been capturing. Digitizing is the capture of analog tape to a digital system.

Furthermore, capturing HVX isn't much less time consuming than tape, about four or six minutes for each 4GB drag and drop. A yield of better than half against ten minutes of native tape capture / batching.

I agree with what others have said. Get the camera and get to work. There'll be plenty of time for the "A versus 200" questions and debate in 18 months, if and when the A is introduced.

e

e

[Barry_S]

The DVX100a did not fix any flaws in the DVX100, it was a firmware and *minor* hardware upgrade based on user requests for additional features. It was incredibly impressive because it was done to add user requested features and *not* because of any problems. I never found the need to upgrade to the DVX100a from the original DVX100 and had zero problems.

I wouldn't expect an upgrade to the HVX200 any time soon because they incorporated much of the feedback from DVX operators and solicited feature request lists *before* releasing the camera. Of course, we're living in a fast paced environment, so production cycles keep getting shorter, but I don't see the point of waiting for an upgrade unless it's already been announced.


… but I guest the original DVX had more flaws then the original HVX…

[Jack_Felis]

If there was anything to upgrade from what I've been reading, it would be the few features that have already been mentioned:

1. Stop motion capability.
2. Better LCD.
3. Image Flip capability.

That's about it. People are essentially getting an HD DVX100B already,with the HVX200. Honestly, what else could you feasibly want?

[FatBird19]

If there was anything to upgrade from what I've been reading, it would be the few features that have already been mentioned:

1. Stop motion capability.
2. Better LCD.
3. Image Flip capability.

That's about it. People are essentially getting an HD DVX100B already,with the HVX200. Honestly, what else could you feasibly want?

I still contest that I'd like Canon XL style WB and gain knobs.
Lack of menu navigation is awesome!:Drogar-BigGrin(DBG)

[Barry_Green]

I never found the need to upgrade to the DVX100a from the original DVX100 and had zero problems.
Same here. I never "upgraded" from the DVX100 to the DVX100A... I still used my 100 even though everyone around me had 100As. (although I did find the upgraded features in the 100B compelling enough to sell my original 100... that DVX100B is a nice little camara!)

[Barry_Green]

1. Stop motion capability.
What's missing about stop motion capability? The HVX is completely stop-motion and intervalometer-capable already...

[asparagui]

Barry:

What exactly was the difference between the DVX and the DVXa models? A firmware upgrade and what hardware change?

:dankk2:

[Jack_Felis]

What's missing about stop motion capability? The HVX is completely stop-motion and intervalometer-capable already...

Oh, sorry, I could have sworn I read something about that. Maybe it was the DVX100B? I don't know but I know that there was something about stop motion mentioned somewhere.

[troypod]

the DVX100 had too major things missing that the A had:

1) no auto-focus in 24p mode

2) no gain in 24p mode...

as for the HVX, CHANGE NOTHING! i just got mine and it kicks arse. my biggest thing that rules with the P2 is that i'm not using heads to record on tape. i dont have to worry about chewed tapes or cleaning heads ever again! YAAAA:dankk2:

[Spartacus]

After seeing slow motions dogs running, slow motion money falling, slow motion walking in the rain, slow motion dancing and the probably upcoming slow motion taking a d…. don’t you think no one has been able to post anything showing how this camera could really stand up in the film industry…

Well, I would also wait a little before running of with a rarely tested spanking-new camera and maybe waisting my production´s budget...
That said, this is what amazed me most when reading about that new Marc Singer documentary...
And that said, since HE is doing well with the HVX, I expect the pana to perfom satisfyingly in almost every situation...

[DavidBeier]

What specifically sold you on the DVX100B Barry?

[FatBird19]

as for the HVX, CHANGE NOTHING! i just got mine and it kicks arse. my biggest thing that rules with the P2 is that i'm not using heads to record on tape. i dont have to worry about chewed tapes or cleaning heads ever again! YAAAA:dankk2:

give me Canon XL style gain and white balance knobs. That's what I'd change. Anyone agree?

[SPZ]

Slower shutter and frame rate- maybe 8 or 4 fps for those incredible fast motion shots! (I believe this can be achieved by firmware).

[Barry_Green]

What specifically sold you on the DVX100B Barry?
Well, remember I had an original 100, so I didn't have niceties like gain in 24p, or slow shutter speeds, nicer zoom feel, etc. With the "A" came an irritation I really couldn't stand: the echo in the headphones. Drove me batty. I even bought a $250 set of Etymotic in-ear headphones to get around that echo.

But with the "B" they got rid of the headphone echo -- that was fantastic. And they made the LCD and viewfinder full-frame instead of overscan. And they made it lower-noise. And squeeze mode displays properly unsqueezed in the viewfinder. And you can use remote focus and exposure when on a jib arm -- I work with Pat Kerby frequently and we put the DVX on the end of an 18' to 30' Jimmy Jib all the time; having remote focus is a nice bonus. And I totally love the display off button! So you combine all that with the improvements from the 100A (like squeeze mode, and slow shutter speeds, etc) and then multiply that by the fact that my 100 was getting a bit long in the tooth, and it made it an easy choice to get a 100B.

[Jarred Land]

It will be full black. Not the "neither blue or black" casing nonsense :)

hey dont be dissssssing the color. I paid Panasonic alot of money to make that baby have a shade of DVXuser blue.

[SPZ]

hey dont be dissssssing the color. I paid Panasonic alot of money to make that baby have a shade of DVXuser blue.

LOL! :)

It should've come with the DVXUSER t-shirt! I want that upgrade! :)

[Jarred Land]

LOL! :)

It should've come with the DVXUSER t-shirt! I want that upgrade! :)

yeah it was a tough call.. Barry's book or the Shirt.. and we all know they made the right decision.

[SPZ]

yeah it was a tough call.. Barry's book or the Shirt.. and we all know they made the right decision.

Maybe the HVX200C will come with both? And How about a DVXUSER(A) t-shirt? Can we upgrade from the original?

[Jarred Land]

ha ha hah yeah.. I think we are at 100F shirts at this point.. and the first 100 people at the DVXUser party at NAB get tthe 100G shirt.