capturing HD-SDI output

[johncordell]

If I get an H1, I would like to have the ability to record 4:2:2 from the HD-SDI for the occasional greenscreen work I might do. I would even lug my quad mac to the shoot for such an occasion, if that helped (note that disk subsystem can sustain maybe 80MB/second writes as it's a pair of raid 0 internal drives, so uncompressed is off the table).

What card/device exists that would capture something noticeably better than the 25mb/sec HDV that I could get on tape? Which codecs would be best for such greenscreen work? I wouldn't spend tons for this ability, but I am curious if low-cost solutions might allow me to take advantage of that sweet HD-SDI output.

thanks.

[Elton]

Get the Kona LH card. It can be had for around $1,600 and has a wealth of features.

It works great with the H1 and you can capture into a number of QT codecs like DVCPROHD, AIC, and PhotoJPEG, all taking up much less bit rate than your hard drive setup can dish out.

You don't need uncompressed for good keys. Just use a good codec like the aforementioned.

[Elton]

Forgot to mention, you can get by with as little as the $595 Decklink HD card to go SDI into other QT codecs.

[jamestmather]

is there some kind of firestore or portable system that would allow you to record compressed but 4.2.2 colour signal?

[Elton]

Not at this juncture. Maybe after NAB.

[macgregor]

The deck link is quite cheap.

But how can you capture into 1080 in quicktime photo jpeg at real time?
What kind of machine can hadle this?

Where can i find more information?

I love photo jpeg compression. Small file sizes, almost perfect quality.

[Elton]

I'll check the real-time PhotoJPEG today. As an aside, if you get a fast enough RAID, you can capture uncompressed clips, then transcode to PhotoJPEG in fairly short order, then delete the uncompressed material and work from there.

[macgregor]

Yes, but a fast enought raid to work in uncompressed would cost around $12,000 which is a lot for me.

I´d like a HD editing solution for around $3-4k including the CPU.

If i can capture to photo jpeg and it plays smoothly, that will save a lot of money in the RAID since for the same Gb i will have a lot more HD hours.

[Elton]

macgregor,

You can do uncompressed with a 5 disk SATA RAID. Get 5 250 GB 16MB cache 7200 RPM drives, Maxtor being the cheapest at about $100 U.S. each. Get a RAID box and a SATA 8 port card and you're good to go. Nowhere near $12K...more like $1-2K for all the speed you need.

[macgregor]

Is it possible to buy an allready well made system? I dont have time to start searching for components and searching for low prices and compatibilities.
Also, even with that RAID, and the decklink HD card, is that all we need to capture HD over HDsdi?

Is it possible to edit that footage in that workstation?

[Elton]

www.macgurus.com

check out the Burly SATA 4 or 8 Drive kits...it's under "Roll Your Own SATA". It can be pre-made for you and even installed for you, I think. You can hire mac tech to install it for you, I would think also.
In additon, you can get great results with an older G5 dual 2 Ghz, and maybe save $1K.

[macgregor]

Hey, i am a PC guy, i dont like macs. ;D

[Elton]

Well, that changes things a little. There are all kinds of companies that build good RAIDs, and will work with Premiere Pro, Avid, Vegas etc.

I think the bottom line is you can get uncompressed for a lot cheaper than you thought.

If you go PC, you should consider Cineform Aspect HD. Awesome lossless looking wavelet codec with 10 bit 4.2.2 and a manageable data rate. Technically much better than DVCPRO HD but not truly uncompressed. Probably the best compromise out there on the PC platform.

[#include]

what about recording to different CODECs. I don't want to record to uncompressed HD (file size, need to convert) Can FCP run photo JPEG, Jpeg 2000 off the timeline in realtime.

What i need is 1920x1080 30fps in a decent codec. Can the decklink, or kona 2 do it.

I'm very close to getting the XL-H1

[Elton]

include,

for now, I think DVCPRO Hd is the format for you. Strangley enough, yes, from the H1. The Decklink and Kona card can capture real time into this codec, and the quality holds up, plus it's easy to edit.

You can run PhotoJPEG in realtime from the timeline...but there are other considerations. I think it all depends on where you think you're project might end up.

If you acquire your H1 footage in DVCPRO HD via SDI, you can edit in that format and deliver in it too for broadcast. If you go to another intermediate codec you may still have to transcode to DVCPRO HD just to get the project finished on HD tape...i.e. rent a 1200a Panny deck to master on.

Just a thought

[#include]

Thanks for the reply elton.

I would like to use the XL-H1 at the highest quality possible without going uncompressed.

If i'm not mistaken doesn't DVCPRO HD resize the image to something like 1280 x 1080.

I need my final resolution to be 1920 x 1080. I know if I go with the XL-H1 I will be up rezing to get to my target, but I don't wont to throw any picture information out.

Have you ever heard of the Aurora Pipe HD.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------

... the Aurora A/V 5.0 drivers deliver ...

"The Interceptor™ feature functions completely independent of the running QuickTime application, and has no direct impact on, nor interaction with the running application.... All popular compression formats are supported, including, DV25, DV50, MotionJPEG-A, PhotoJPEG, Sorenson3, MPEG-2, MPEG-4, H.264, various uncompressed CODECs, and more. "


http://www.auroravideosys.com/products/avFam_pipehd.php


Aurora's family of Pipe cards (Pipe, PipePro, PipeSDI, PipeHD) is a true QuickTime solution for the Mac OS. No third-party software is necessary for previewing video in applications other than Final Cut Pro.


-----------------------------------------------------------------


I wonder if the PipeHD could capture photo JPG or JPG 2000 @ 1920.

btw my final output will be a digital file...

I can't wait till NAB

[Elton]

Thanks for the reply elton.

I would like to use the XL-H1 at the highest quality possible without going uncompressed.

If i'm not mistaken doesn't DVCPRO HD resize the image to something like 1280 x 1080.

I need my final resolution to be 1920 x 1080. I know if I go with the XL-H1 I will be up rezing to get to my target, but I don't wont to throw any picture information out.

Have you ever heard of the Aurora Pipe HD.

If you want the absolute highest quality with light compression and full raster (the H1 does indeed spit out true 1920x1080i) you might want to consider the PC platform w/ Cineform codec. If the Mac and FCP are required, I would think PhotoJPEG at 75% (4.2.2) 1920x1080 might be your best bet, and it sounds like that Aurora card might do the trick. I will test some other codecs w/Kona LH soon and report my findings.

btw, are we talking HDV tape playback to SDI out and then full raster capture, or live signal recording via SDI? If it's HDV playback...it's already horizontally subsampled, so it depends on how much you want to work in full raster in post. What you record via SDI into full raster PhotoJPEG was already horizontally compressed to some degree. It might simplify some things in post, but you may find a codec like DVCPRO HD to be very practical too.

I have a friend who shot a horror movie in HDCAM 24p, cut the film in DVCPRO HD, and then integrated FX shots and color corrections, and output back out to HDCAM for a screening this wed. in Hollywood...and said the results were great overall. He didn't complain about 1280x1080 subsampling, and his stuff looks really nice.

Check it out: www.lastritesthemovie.com

[starway2001@mac.com]

The Blackmagic modified DVCProHD codecs have been tweaked to sub-sample at 1440x1080.

I recently shot a project with the F900 and captured via my Decklink card using their modified codec, cut, color corrected and rendered all within DVCProHD. The results are phenomenal.

You can download the HD versions of the trailer off my sebsite.

http://www.starwaypictures.com/shadowfalls/trailers.html

[Elton]

Starway,

If you're free tomorrow evening, you need to go see Duanes' (my friend) screening of "Last Rites" at Raleigh Studios. He's done basically the exact same thing and is lovin' the results!

The screening will be from HDCAM 24p, onto a 30ft. screen in 1080p, I think.

I'm still debating whether to get on a Jet Blue flight and go to it tomorrow.

PM if interested.