Film loading, film purcahsing....and other general questions.

[kyledroid]

I was wondering if we could place a "faq" sticky on this board. Reason being, I and most likey others may have questions that need answering on this board, and those questions may not warrant a new thread to be posted. For example, Im interested in film and have a few general questions.

First question, I notice that certain websites have list prices for their cans of film,
and then they list "short medium and long end prices" for the same film at a relatively cheaper price. Why are they cheaper? The same question goes for recans. Also, one other question. How does one load a camera magazine properly?

[Kevin_Zanit]

A short end is film that was originally part of a longer role (for example 1000'). Let’s say you shoot 800' of this role, you are now left with a 200' "short end". If it is early in the show you may just use it later, or on some shows you would just throw it away.

On some shows the producers will sell back the short ends to a short end dealer. They will in turn sell the film to you at a rate below factory.

When the company breaks their pricing system down it goes something like this:

Short end = Anything 100' or less
Medium end = Anything over 100' up to 200'
Long end = Anything over 200'
(This is for most companies, and refers to 35 only)

The shorter the film roll, the cheaper because it is less useful. Let’s say you have a take that is 60' long. If you only have 100' loads, that means you must reload every take, and essentially waste 40' (you usually trash anything 50' or shorter).

A re-can is film that has had it's factory seal broken, but is still its original length. For example, a 1000' mag was loaded to have as stand by, but never got used. Thus the film would get "re-caned".

The risk of short ends and re-cans is that you really don't know much about the film, such as how it was stored. Most dealers do a "snip test" of the film that essentially tests the density of 10' of film. This is to just make sure the film was not fogged.

I have shot music videos on short ends, but I don't like to shoot things that will be projected on them. Generally older film has flaws that can be corrected in telecine, but not in printing.

If you do by short ends, by them at the same time, and try to get them all from the same emulsion batch.

You can not learn how to load a mag from text you read online. You need to handle the actual film and magazine in the dark to learn.

That said, here are the basics:

The film mag is taken either into a changing bag/ tent or a darkroom on the camera truck. You then, in pitch black open the film can, take it out of it's black bag, and remove a small sticker that keeps the roll rolled (make sure this sticker does not end up in the mag!).

You then thread the film through the mag and onto a take up "core". Fold a few inches of film over on itself, and fit it into the grove on the core. Wind around a few feet to make sure the film won't slip out when the camera starts.

Place the lid onto the mag, and make sure it is on properly. You can now expose the mag to low levels of light. Take 1" camera tape and go around the edge of where the lid meats the mag. Also take a small piece or two (depending on the mag) and tape the latches to open the lid shut. The color of the tape you use is dependent on the type of film you are using. If you don’t know what color to use, ask the 1st AC. It really does not matter as long as you are consistent (for example all 500 speed tungsten film gets red tape, and 250 daylight gets blue).

Now take a piece of tape about 6" long and write the following:
- Show title
- Film stock/ emulsion number
- Length of the load in the mag
- Date
- Mag #
- And roll number (you actually don't write the roll number in until the mag is on the camera, but you write an R: in the meantime)

You now place this tape on the lid of the mag.

You also fill out a camera report that you tape to the mag, and keep it with the mag until it goes on the camera.

If you place the mag into the case, take another piece of tape and write the length of the load and place it on the case. This just indicates that the case has a loaded mag.

Here are some rough diagrams of the threading path to Arri & Panavision mags:
http://www.kevinzanit.com/arri.jpg
http://www.kevinzanit.com/panavision.jpg

Here is a picture of one of the nicer camera trucks I have had:
http://www.kevinzanit.com/film/truck.jpg
(the darkroom is in the very back)

Here is how a short end can looks:
http://www.kevinzanit.com/film/can.jpg

Here is a properly labled and taped mag:
http://www.kevinzanit.com/film/mag.jpg

And just because I am a Panavision guy, and all my pictures have been non-panavision :undecided , another taped mag:
http://www.kevinzanit.com/film/mag2.jpg

It is very important to be focused when dealing with film. I can tell you I don't miss my days as a loader one bit!


Kevin Zanit

[ropbo]

Hey Kevin, thanks for your explanation. I've been following your posts on the other forum about the production of your last film and gotta say I've learned a lot from them.
Cheers.

[Nate Weaver]

Kevin, looks like the Colorado St. bridge.

What was the job?

[Barry_Green]

Utterly superb response, Kevin! Thanks for taking the time to put that together, and put so much detail in it!

[Kevin_Zanit]

Not a problem.

Nate - Yes, that was the Colorado St. bridge. A great location. It was from a project I did about 2 years ago. Anamorphic at night is always fun.

It was the second project I have done on that bridge, the other one was a music video during there day.

I was talking to the police during lunch, and they were telling me the creepy history of that place. Really odd, but a really good location.


Kevin Zanit

[kyledroid]

wow! thank you very much for that.

[Bruce Morgan]

the posts above are excellent
i wish to add one issue
if you load "short ends" OR RECANS from cored film onto an eymo load 100ft daylight load , which goes into a small affordabe hand held camera called the bell and howell eyemo (obtainable for about 500dollars on e bay ) .....
you will have a few ., one minute loads and a good hand held 35mm camera with no refex viewing , just a side finder ...
Here is the reason for my post-
WITH ANY RECAN OR REWOUND FILM OR ANY SHORT END
INSTRUCT THE LAB TO "PRINT WITH DOUBLE KEY LIGHTS " so you dont lose bar code or key number information which is important during negative conformation later on in post production .
Before assuming that the lab understands this order , go to the "will call" section of the lab . Ask to speak with a technical advisor.
The the people who do film printing (assuming you are going to the print phase) will need to understand that "print double key lights " is a request for the printer operator to illuminate and expose all " latent edge " numbers and bar code which is on your developed film .
..Good Luck
Bruce :shocked: :engel017: