HDV FX1E+G35: clips from VIDEOCLUB shortfilm

[macgregor]

Hello guys. I am still in the middle of the shooting of a shortfilm using a Sony HDV camera and G35.

You can have a glimpse of some footage in here:

http://personales.ya.com/autodrome/

This is not the final quality version, not final takes (some are moving, some outfocused). I just wanted to pick up some images and show them in here.

Bye!

[mmm]

That was an FX1!!!

That rocks!! Makes me want to run out and buy one now!

Once that is colour corrected it will look AWESOME!! Have you seen it on a big screen yet, that will be a real test. Internet downloads can't do your work justice! :thumbup:

Please tell us how you got it to look so good.... :laugh:

[bikefilms]

Looks like you found a good combo. Great color for the FX1. I have found that 35mm adapters have postive effects on color, can't say why. Just goes to show what can be sone with proper lighting.

[Andrew Brinkhaus]

incredible...thats all I can say. That is some of the best looking footage ive ever seen from an FX

[J.R. Hudson]

Wonderful looking.

[adamblakecarver]

what did you light with primarily? fluro's? were they just the ones we saw overhead. i think you showed some test footage before with a girl, same film? or just a light test? My favorite part is right after he walks into the room and we see the lights twinkling behind him. there seems to be some blue light hitting him? could you share your full lighting package list? thanks. very impressive work!!!

[kyledroid]

Wow Great footage! im kinda curious if this is straight up 50i or if you converted it to 25p ( I assume since its a PAL cam this would be the ideal conversion) ?

[Spiff_2]

That footage looks fantastic! Great lighting, and nice use of the DOF. I'm curious - did you shoot 50i or CF25? I'm starting to suspect more and more that for the best 25p footage from an FX1/Z1 the CF modes are better for colour sampling and compression reasons.

-Spiff

[macgregor]

Yes. i recorded almost the entire feature in cf25 except for the shots that i wanted to do a slow motion later.

[araujofh]

Man, great looking footage. I am surprised.

[ChuckS]

Even thought I didn't understand a word they were saying, that was great. What was the music?

And on a totally unrelated question, I noticed your in Madrid, do you know anything about - http://www.ciudaddelaluz.com/ ?

[Hayden_Rivers]

The song is "Swallowed in the Sea" by Coldplay on their new X&Y cd. Get it here:

http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/B0006L16N8/qid=1122626790/sr=8-1/ref=pd_bbs_sbs_1/102-1531057-5776950?v=glance&s=music&n=507846


It looks very nice. I liked how well lit the guy who was handling the clapper was lit. Probably wasn't the point, but ah well.

Also, the closeups on the eyes and the sweat looked amazing. And I loved the door opening and the nerdy guy just walking around while the music played. I kept asking myself, "Okay, if this was double-blind, would I say this is video or 35mm?" That's a good sign.

And the set is really, really nice. Is that a real video store?

[reflex]

Yes, that was quite nice. :thumbsup:

[ACStudios]

Outstanding! I have a Z1 and I'm totally jealous!

That was shot in the cineframe 25 mode, huh. Wow! While watching your footage I was thinking that you had converted it to 25p. I have never seen cf look like that. In fact, there are several threads over the last few months with comments about the near "unusability" of the CF modes.

The G35 looks great as well. Have any trouble with low light or grain?

Great job - thanks for sharing.

D.

[ecarr]

that was awesome. didn't know what the hell they were saying, but the lighting and dof were sweet, and the music really seemed to fit the mood.

[macgregor]

well i find the cf35 exactly the same as the old xl1 frame mode worked. And watched on standard tv, there is no difference at all with footage from dvx100e (well, there is, the dvx gives a lot more grain). So i do not understand the problems of deinterlacing fields on camera with the fx/z1.

The videostore was completely built from zero. It is a set in the middle of a huge warehouse.


Chucks, Cuidad de la Luz (city of light) is still being built as far as i know. Maybe it is finished but not 100% functional yet. I have passed by a lot of times, but there is not much to see except for some concrete buildings. Definately it is not Hollywood! ;P

I will post more video clips as soon as i have time (some of them spectacular!). Right now, watching the footage on a TV i would say that 99% of people would believe it is 35 mm, and the rest wouldn´t know what it is.
Colors get a lot better, and DOF is great in achieving the cinematographic look. With 25p and proper lighting we can have a very high quality film with very low budget. It is not the best solution (of course i prefer shooting in film) but nothing can compete with the price/quality of this setting.
Of course grain is a problem and i have never enought light, but it is the price we have to pay.

[Mike_E]

Dear goodness, hasn't finished loading yet, but the footage looks amazing! Even without CC. Great work!

[mmm]

Can you try CCing a little scene, just to tease us...?

[Mike_E]

And could you please give us all some details about how you lit the movie?

Also, Did you have any problems with drop-outs with the FX1 (in the 3-way, hehe, camera comparision it was said to be a problem)? Did you record audio direct to camera? How was the whole FX1 experience? :)

Sorry for all the questions, but this clip has given me an interest in the FX1. Also, would you mind posting some full res stills for us to have a gander at?

[Mike_E]

Can you try CCing a little scene, just to tease us...?

I enjoy grading things for fun/practice, so I'll did a grab from the footage a couple of different ways in Vegas 4

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v248/zmike/V_original.jpg

^ That's the original

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v248/zmike/V_grade1.jpg

^ That's just using the Color Correction tool, I'm quite fond of that one.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v248/zmike/V_grade2.jpg

^ And this one I posted because I thought it has more of a 35mm look to it, that's the Color Correction from Grade 1 with a Color Curves preset I made. Although this one I probably wouldn't actually use in a movie, it just struck me as resembling Production Stills.

Hopefully you guys like them.

[Mathew]

I'll be the voice of dissent here. While it looked cool from a experimental technical standpoint I found the shallow DOF to be over used. It reminds me of morphing or the 'matrix' effects. It's cool the first or second time but then becomes too obvious.

Also it was probably mis-used in some shots. Example the guy walking into the store. It comes off very much as a POV shot like maybe he lost his glasses. Yet he's wearing his glasses. See my point? I'm just giving you a general idea of how audiences will feel when they're watching the film. Some of it looked so surreal almost 'blue screened'. Again cool looking stuff but in the future I would only use it for shots that really benefit from shallow DOF.

[mmm]

Good point Mathew! I think we all tend to get a bit excited when stuff looks cool... at the end of the day, the visual style should serve the story!

As far as the colour grading, I like the 1st one, but the 2nd one looks like the shot was overexposed or it is a REALLY hot sunny day. It is hard to judge without knowing the context. It should all grade nicely because the original looks so good and is well controlled.

[macgregor]

I had three lenses to shot this shortfilm:
- nikon 50mm f1.4
- sigma 17-35mm f 2.4-3.5
- sigma 28-200 f2.8-5.6

So, in order to see grain i have to open the iris as much as possible. With the 50mm there is no problem. The other lenses gave me some problems.

Personally i love DOF, and even when filming in 35mm or 16mm i try to open as much as possible (never open at full becase the lense performance is not the best at full open).

I love DOF when shooting medium format pictures. It lets me "focus" on what i want. Its annoying to have a close up of a character and have disturbing things perfectly focused on the background. I get better colors and a personal touch to images becasue it lets me to have control on Z axis. It gives depth to images, something we cannot do in DV.

So why not using it? This is not like using morphing. This is like using BW film in a whole movie for artistic reasons. Would you then say "man, it is BW the whole movie!" ?

;P

[Daniel Skubal]

That was amazing stuff!! Holy hell!!

[macgregor]

Well, for the final scene we used every camera that i could find. I uploaded 2 more videos (not the final montage):

http://personales.ya.com/autodrome/

[monte]

That car scene will be really really nice when all is said and done in terms of editing and color correction. I assume the camera with the actor was the one with the g35, all other
FX-1s were stock?

[macgregor]

Camera list:
- fx1 for the side shot
- xl2 for the front and upper shot
- panasonic 3ccds (dont know the name but around €1800) in the ceiling
- fx1 with G35 with the actor
- very bad sony handycam inside the car
- old Sony Hi8 camera in the first dvd rack (not yet captured but you can see it hidden from the ceiling shot!)

[monte]

Handycam inside the car? It held up pretty well for a handicam IMO, but I guess compression and a small viewing space help.

[Mike_E]

As far as the colour grading, I like the 1st one, but the 2nd one looks like the shot was overexposed or it is a REALLY hot sunny day. It is hard to judge without knowing the context. It should all grade nicely because the original looks so good and is well controlled.

I totally agree, the only reason I included that was because it resembled a Production Still and thought it looked pretty cool. I wouldn't actually use it on moving footage, it's not at all subtle. Glad you like the 1st one, and thanks for commenting :)

[macgregor]

Thanks Mike, I like your CC. They give me ideas...

[Mike_E]

Thanks, and no worries. If you want me to take a screenshot of the settings, so you can easily recreate either of the looks, just send me a PM.

[macgregor]

How about this:

http://personales.ya.com/autodrome/Image4.jpg


http://personales.ya.com/autodrome/Image0.jpg

[Mike_E]

I'm not exactly sure what you meant by 'how about this:' (unless you were replying to someone who asked for full res stills.

Well I graded the two grabs and also did screenshots of the Color Correction settings in Vegas. They aren't at full res now though (they're now 800 x 395), I'm not setup to edit that high res.

Anyway,

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v248/zmike/CC_1.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v248/zmike/CC_1.gif

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v248/zmike/CC_2.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v248/zmike/CC_2.gif


Hope that can help someone.

[EyeBite]

I had to get in on the color correcting:

http://www.vstech.net/2ccb.jpg

[monte]

http://img274.imageshack.us/img274/6659/ccmontecc1bf.png

if theres anything i love its CC

used vegas

[flipsidekrew]

tried it myself

http://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y94/p0gipn0i2/cc.jpg

[Ill Eagle]

Which camera's had the G35 on them during that car scene??

[mmm]

http://img274.imageshack.us/img274/6659/ccmontecc1bf.png

if theres anything i love its CC

used vegas

Monte, are you actually Tony Scott? :)

[Hectorxd]

this footage makes me want to get a sony next go round. Thanks for posting. I seem to remember you posting some shots of cars a while back that looked really phenomenal. was that the sony as well?
Brian

[macgregor]

Nope, that was done with a dvx100.

Here it is:

www.neotokio.org/645dvx.avi

(70mb divx5)

Bye!

[monte]

Monte, are you actually Tony Scott? :)

No - just his colorist

[mmm]

No - just his colorist

lol... thought it looked good... for a particular type of story.

[Darren_Wharton]

Hi,

The footage looks fantastic. Can you tell me, in your opinion which camera gives the best, sharp, cinematic look...? I know the Sony image is sharp and detailed, using the G35, does it give you a filmic look that outshines the DVX...

Thanks

Darren

[macgregor]

Using CF25 at SD resolution both look very much the same. The filmic look is the same.

But:
- the sony needs more light
- the dvx100e gives a lot more grain
- i think colors are better with the sony (need to make sure of this) but what it is sure is that even with the mpeg compression the extra image size allows for a lot more color correction and compositing.

So i am using the sony at all times. Since i have the FX1, i just used the dvx100e once and it was to test the G35 which was ok but i prefer the sony for what i said.

I bought the sony 2 months ago because i needed it for a job, i did not really like it. But now i am very very happy with it. The new JVC does not seem even closer (i was expecting a great camera from JVC so i could change this but it seems it is not the case).

I was not very happy when sony did not include real progressive scan in their HDV cameras, but using CF25 you really see progressive scan at PAL res, and here in Europe won´t have HD TV for a while.

By the way i find the LCD screen great and the SHOT transition a big help.

[Darren_Wharton]

Thanks my friend,

Thanks for the advice. Very Helpful, just one more question.... what is a Guerilla35 exactly.....and is magic bullit sofware an option.. to get a more detailed film look with the Sony....?

Daz

[macgregor]

Ummm, Guerilla35 gives you the opportunity of using 35mm lenses in your inexpensive "cosumer" camera.

www.guerilla35.com

[Darren_Wharton]

Cheers for that

Darren

[Anhar Miah]

Ok so I downloaded the compressed Web clip (the trailer? 21MB one) and allthough its been compressed and not even full rez I converted it to mpeg2 DVD and watched on a TV and computer monitor (ok, i did some slight tweaking in vegas, colour correction and sharpness filter) and you know what???


ITs the first time that I said out loud THATS 35mm film!!, no Joke, this looked something I would see from a Hollywood DVD release. Ok I know it had some compression issues (due to web compression) but for it still to look that good, I just know that if I had access to the original file than the final DVD would look as good as a Hollywood DVD pixel for pixel.

My final conclusion:

FX1 or Z1U + G35 (or micro35, or mini35) + CC +(talent :) = DVD indistinguisable from Hollywood DVD release.

[Taylor Moore]

Just wanted to say, I am very impressed, yes the G35 is a stylistic device, but I think it adds some definite character to the story and image.

I have purchased the other rig the Micro35 and will be doing tests when it arrives with the Z1.

I think we are at a very interesting time where by these cameras and devices kick some serious ass...just imagine the HVX.

I finally think the tools will soon become secondary and we can all finally focus on story.

[mmm]

I finally think the tools will soon become secondary and we can all finally focus on story.

Good way of putting it! :thumbsup:

No more worrying about blown highlights! One day...one day... I can't wait!

[MrSleep]

i was only able to view the movie with the white guy shooting the black guy but i cant view the other movie!!! why??? do i need a codec?

[Tibby]

So just so I'm getting this correctly, that footage was shot using a Sony HDV PAL Camera, a G35, Nikon 35mm SLR lenses, using Cineframe mode? Am I missing something here? Every example of Cineframe mode I've seen looks like crap. Put as many lenses on a video camera that you want, video still looks like video. So how exactly did you accomplish that look? I'm awestruck. Details man...DETAILS!!! Thats a recipe I need!!!

[Yas Kassana]

Macgregor, I've been following your work for about 2 months now, right from guerilla35 forums to this. I must say it's very impressive and it's a great leap for us indy film makers. Well done. All of that came from an FX1??? Bloody amazing.

[Tibby]

Okay, I take back what I said about Cineframe, I went to the video store today and played around with the settings on the camera, it took me awhile(That menu is not user friendly) But I got a cool look (decent I should say) from the camera, in Cineframe mode. It does look alot better displayed on a TV as opposed to the actual viewfinder.

[Donnie Wagner]

Macgregor,
Is this footage from miniDV tape? or are you using the component outputs (Pb/Pr, Cb/Cr) of the sony and going "pseudo-uncompressed" staight to a harddrive with at A/D converter (like AJA)? The footage looks so good I have a hard time believing it was compressed onto miniDV tape.

Congrats on the quality! best I've seen.

[macgregor]

Of course, it was recorded in HDV format. I don´t find it too bad, and if you to DVD much better than miniDV.

[Donnie Wagner]

Macgregor,
I'm still not clear...
You did use the HDV format, but was it recorded to tape or to hard drive via component output?

[macgregor]

YES. It was recorded in the HDV tape.

[Christo]

This is very well made. I like the look of your footage, and more importantly your shot selection.
The video thing that always is apparent and something that noone seems to mention is the purple fringe that always appears in high contrast areas - next to white areas of his shirt for example. The biggest problem isn't depth of field (although it contributes to the problem) - it's exposure latitude. White and highlights are the killer.

[Cody_Jordan]

Well here's a question nobody's asked:

How did you get the Guerilla35? I've been monitoring johnathan's status for the past couple months or so and I just wish I could get my hands on it.... I had no clue you could use it for the Sony HD... I'm guessing its interchangable? How and when can we get one of those for ourselves?? Share the wealth friend!

Also, I'm interested in your comment about the grain of the DVX100... You say that the SONY HD is alot better in this area... (i guess so for HD) I have noticed myself the amount of grain with my DVX over a period of time... I'd like to have something to compare it to. Mabye i should be reading more of the DVX vs FX1 vs XL2. I think the HVX is gonna rock all of them though...

Tell me this if you can, what Nikon lenses were you actually using? MM and fstop rating would be great. My favorite shot is the closup of his eye/glasses... I love the DOF/light in that shot. I think you did go a little overboard with the DOF for the rest of the scenes... couldn't you just bump up the fstop on the Nikon lenses to deepen the DOF slightly?

[jittwoi]

That looks amazing, I have to agree with mathew about the overused shallow DOF when he walks into the room though, but either way i really wanna see this when its done! are you gonna put it up on a website or somethin? or send it to a festival?

[macgregor]

I just renewed my website.


http://personales.ya.com/autodrome/

[TimurCivan]

Handycam inside the car? It held up pretty well for a handicam IMO, but I guess compression and a small viewing space help.


if you light evenly and zoom in a bit, a handy cam will do surprisingly well, you`d be amazed. even on a fairly large TV.

There was a kıd running aournd with a TRV-70 shooting stuff in 30P. his name was questionman35 or soemthing did some amazing looking stuff with a handy cam.

[TimurCivan]

And Macgregor

your work is excellent.

too bad i dont have a fast enough modem to watch all of your stuff.

i can onlywatch the shorter pieces.

[callan]

Macgregor! Awesome stuff. You compose, edit, shoot wonderfully, and I'm afraid that our respect for that sometimes gets lost when we ask "what settings, what lens etc."

That being said...time for some tech questions.

First, that's the best looking stuff I have ever seen on video. I shoot DSLR stuff with my 50mm 1.4 all the time, I love the ability to guide the viewers focus. I've been dying to get that on my video footage (i'm a dvx but soon to be an hd owner...wainting to see how the HVX holds up).

That is a guerilla 35 unit? Their site says that unit is still in production...where can I get one?

In the black and white one, how did you control the whites so well, it's beautifully lit, any info on that one would be appreciated.

Lastly, in the secret garden, near the end your actress's face is super light, almost blown out, but it manages full gradients and no clipping, was this shot well within the exposure range and then upped with gamma to get there, or does the camera you shot with have that nice a curve before clipping?


AWESOME! Post more! POST MORE!

[macgregor]

Lastly, in the secret garden, near the end your actress's face is super light, almost blown out, but it manages full gradients and no clipping, was this shot well within the exposure range and then upped with gamma to get there, or does the camera you shot with have that nice a curve before clipping?


She is a little overexposed in the final image. Gamma has been touched so the black level.
But not everything is good. For example, in the B&W clip, you can see some dark edges around the girl when she has the light of the window in the back. I don´t know how to resolve that.
...

[Zac Henke]

SexXxy!

[pxl37]

could u tell me wat r g35 looks like?

thx

[Darren_Wharton]

Hey Macgregor....

Your footage looks fantastic.!

I need to get your system.......so what do I need

1 Sony FX1or Z1.....?
2 Which editing software..?
3 G35 adapter........?
4 extra lenses....?

5 Best software to get maximum quality to DVD...?
or digibeta tape for broadcast...!

Cheers

Darren Wharton
www.darrenwharton.demon.co.uk