Editing And Color Calibration ?

[HMSanchez87]

I've been trying to figure this out for the past few days and this is the first time I've encounter this problem. I use a Mac-Book Pro to edit my films, and I use Adobe Premiere Pro CS5 as my editing program of choice. Now my problem has to do with color calibration. I know you can't honestly trust the default color calibration on a mac or on any HD TV. What I've done for the past year is, I would calibrate my LG HD TV to color bars to the best of my abilities. My TV has a expert mode that allows me to calibrate its pretty decent, nothing professional but decent.

Now on this recent project, I finished color grading and I decided to watch it on different TV's to make sure it looks over all good on other screens and this is where the problem starts. Some screens look good and some look average, and others look terrible. My question is, is this a common issue that even professionals can't get away from? Even if you edit by industry standards, will there always been a up to date screen that makes you project look terrible.

My other question is, when editing on a computer or laptop, do you change your color profile to get the best possible idea of what your color grading is, or do you just edit on the default color profile? This question is aimed more at the people who offend edit and color grade on laptops with out a calibrated monitor to use.

[Razz16mm]

You can't trust what you see on any TV that isn't known to be properly calibrated. Your LG is actually a pretty good reference monitor for HDTV. I use my LG as final grading reference. LG's with expert mode are ISF certified true 10 bit displays, better than most computer monitors for judging video if calibrated. If you know how to adjust to color bars in blue screen only mode you can get a pretty accurate reference point for most purposes by eye. LG's built in calibration wizard is quite good too.
Just because you have a decent grade on a reasonably well calibrated monitor doesn't mean it won't get mangled badly by poorly adjusted TV's.
I use a calibrated Expert mode for grading, but as a final test run through all the unaltered factory picture presets to see how it fairs on settings like vivid, sports, game, cinema, etc. Most people are just going to pull the set out of the box and pick one of these.

[HMSanchez87]

This is exactly what I do, everything you just mentioned. Nice to know I'm not to far off from what others do. This is just a small issue I've been having and I want to know if this is a common issue and if what I'm doing is even worth it.

[David Jimerson]

All you can do is make it look good on a properly-calibrated monitor. How others have their TVs set isn't in your control, and it's not your problem.

[Bruce Watson]

...is this a common issue that even professionals can't get away from? Even if you edit by industry standards, will there always been a up to date screen that makes you project look terrible?

Yes, and yes.


...when editing on a computer or laptop, do you change your color profile to get the best possible idea of what your color grading is, or do you just edit on the default color profile? This question is aimed more at the people who offend edit and color grade on laptops with out a calibrated monitor to use.

I can't color grade on my laptop. Just can't. Can't even get very close. Not for lack of tryin' either.

For any level of color grading I have to use either a local HDTV (similarly to your method) or a broadcast monitor. I'm leaning very heavily in favor of a nice portable broadcast monitor like the FSI LM2140W (http://www.shopfsi.com/FSI-21-5-Inch-HD-Broadcast-Monitor-p/lm-2140w.htm) just to put these problems behind me. Given a good monitor, I'm actually not so bad a colorist. But with just the laptop? Forget it.

[HMSanchez87]

Yes, and yes.



I can't color grade on my laptop. Just can't. Can't even get very close. Not for lack of tryin' either.

For any level of color grading I have to use either a local HDTV (similarly to your method) or a broadcast monitor. I'm leaning very heavily in favor of a nice portable broadcast monitor like the FSI LM2140W (http://www.shopfsi.com/FSI-21-5-Inch-HD-Broadcast-Monitor-p/lm-2140w.htm) just to put these problems behind me. Given a good monitor, I'm actually not so bad a colorist. But with just the laptop? Forget it.

I got another question then, towards more of my particular problem. The color-grading for this film is fairly simple, I'm lowering the brightness of the film, cause the tone should be dark and the scene takes place at night. Now when I get the brightness to where I want to, and it looks great on my monitor, it looks super dark on my computer. So the question is this the same problem with the color correction. The film will be dark on somethings and others bright.

My next question is, when lowering how bright the scene is, should I use Levels, Fast Color Correction Levels, or should I use the Brightness/ Contrast to control the brightness of the scene? I notice each one gives a slightly different result.

[David Jimerson]

I would use the color curves.

If your HDTV is properly-calibrated, go by that.

[HMSanchez87]

Any other possible tips on this matter, and thank everyone for the feedback on this situation.

[Bruce Watson]

Now when I get the brightness to where I want to, and it looks great on my monitor, it looks super dark on my computer.

This is most likely the difference in color spaces between your computer monitor and Rec.709 (HDTV) (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rec._709). Different gammas, so different luminance balance. If your computer monitor could show you Rec.709 this problem would likely go away for you. This is one of the reasons to work with an HDTV or broadcast monitor for color grading.


My next question is, when lowering how bright the scene is, should I use Levels, Fast Color Correction Levels, or should I use the Brightness/ Contrast to control the brightness of the scene? I notice each one gives a slightly different result.

I like Luma Curves for this duty. But any of the ones mentioned will get the job done. It might help if you are using PPro's waveform monitor to make sure you don't crush the blacks too much, or push the average luminance below where you want it to go. If you've got dark complected faces you want to be careful you don't push them so far into the shadows that you literally can't see them. Just sayin'.

[HMSanchez87]

This is most likely the difference in color spaces between your computer monitor and Rec.709 (HDTV) (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rec._709). Different gammas, so different luminance balance. If your computer monitor could show you Rec.709 this problem would likely go away for you. This is one of the reasons to work with an HDTV or broadcast monitor for color grading.



I like Luma Curves for this duty. But any of the ones mentioned will get the job done. It might help if you are using PPro's waveform monitor to make sure you don't crush the blacks too much, or push the average luminance below where you want it to go. If you've got dark complected faces you want to be careful you don't push them so far into the shadows that you literally can't see them. Just sayin'.

Thanks for the input, and I have another question then, when I upload the video on Vimeo, and people whos monitors are not set to Rec. 709. Will be extremely dark and if thats the case, should I do 2 exports, one that has the black levels adjusted for laptops such as my own and another set for television. I would also like to know what to edit in when working towards a theater screen.

Also, I'm curious about this. Say there is a GRIP FLAG in the shot. There were trying to block out the window on set but the detail shows in the shot. How would you make it disappear, is this something that is usually digitally removed or do you crush the blacks to the point that there is no detail to be seen?