DIY "mini35" using mediumformat lens [Archive] - DVXuser.com -- The online community for filmmaking

Ted Ramasola

06-05-2005, 10:20 AM

thisiswells

06-05-2005, 10:43 AM

Take the prism finder off and point the DVX camera vertically at the ground glass on your Mamiya.
You'll need some level of diopter lens for the video camera, but that's for you to figure out.

Ted Ramasola

06-05-2005, 10:59 AM

I'm testing it now. Actually I tested on an RB67. -much bigger than 645. If the concept works 'll use the rb67 GG on a smaller housing using the 645 lens.

Ted Ramasola

06-05-2005, 12:51 PM

GenJerDan

06-05-2005, 09:01 PM

The DVX will pick up the grain, dust and scratches on a static GG. I the rotating "GG" is much better. I have to add an extension to the lens "mount", made from the lens cap, because the rb645 lenses needs a farther focusing distance to the "GG" than a 35mm lens.

When I did mine, I mounted to the sunshade, rather than the lens itself. Just made a plate to attach the two cameras. (I used a 6x6 SLR and focused on the viewfinder.)

And, yeah, gotta clean EVERYthing. :)

Dan

Unix

06-06-2005, 12:00 AM

can u guys post some pix, clips anything????????????????????????????
is this based on the micro35 design ? or that DOF machine tutorial?

GenJerDan

06-06-2005, 08:02 AM

can u guys post some pix, clips anything????????????????????????????
is this based on the micro35 design ? or that DOF machine tutorial?

If you do a search in Hardware for "Marla66" and go to the last page of the thread, you'll find a pic of what mine looked like, plus links to sample vids.

Or wait until next week or the one after...I think I'll be rebuilding it and geting some better video samples.

But all it is is a 6x6 SLR attached to the DVX. :)

Dan

Ted Ramasola

06-06-2005, 04:54 PM

I've done it guys. Finally finished the main construction part of the adapter. The extension cylinders for connecting to the dvx is still temporary until I can fix its distance to the adapter box. I've tested and calibrated the MAMIYA SEKOR 80mm lens for focusing up to infinity and DOF. -and I must say the results are worth the effort! The lens I tested has a max opening of 1.9 giving me a shallow DOF. Racking focus gave results I could never achieve with the built in lens. I'm cleaning up the wires today and continue to test.
I would like to share my test and design with you guys, please tell me how to post pics or footage.

GenJerDan

06-07-2005, 12:19 AM

I would like to share my test and design with you guys, please tell me how to post pics or footage.

You need to put pics & footage on another website, then link to it here in your message.

Using the "advanced" editor is the easiest way to do that...just click on the little pic of mountains and fill in the address for pictures you want to appear her, and click on the globe-with-chainlink to make a link to video (or another webpage, etc.)

Dan

Ted Ramasola

06-07-2005, 04:09 PM

ummm. sounds complex. I'l have to ask our multimedia dept. to find a host site. Thanks for the info Dan. In the mean time I'm testing it outdoors today.

If any of you guys wish to see the set up and samples before I can post in this forum my pics, email me at ramasola@globelines.com.ph

Sanchez

06-09-2005, 08:59 AM

Hey teddybear --- RU on Bohol ?

wow -- I was there last November -- I wanted to put one of the Tarsiers monkeys in my backpack !

Erik Olson

06-09-2005, 09:40 AM

If you're still having trouble hosting the pics and video, you can email them to me and I'll host them as long as there is interest.

eaolson70@gmail.com
eolson@expeditionfilmpartners.com

Cheers,

e

Ted Ramasola

06-09-2005, 12:53 PM

Sanchez,
Yes I'm a bohol based production house.
I sent u a private message.

overlandfilms
Thanks for your offer to post, I'll email to you still pics first then it's up to you if its worth it.

Ted Ramasola

06-10-2005, 02:41 AM

If you're still having trouble hosting the pics and video, you can email them to me and I'll host them as long as there is interest.

eaolson70@gmail.com
eolson@expeditionfilmpartners.com

Cheers,

e

e

I just finished testing on static objects and a person by a window.
I can send you a short 3-4 second clip of each. which email address should I use for these bigger files?

T

Alceujr

06-10-2005, 05:11 AM

Hey guys i'm about to test tomorrow my DIY adapter based on rotating GG, but I'm attaching medium format lenses from Mamiya 645. it casts a bigger image on the ground glass compared with 35mm. I'll post results when I'm done tom. (will someone help me how? the posting instructions are "complicated" for poor ol'me).

Wish me luck.

Hi Teddybear, have you had success on your trials?
I am very curious to see some results since I am also considering some investments in this area.

How do you manage the fact that the image appears upside down? Fisicaly switch the monitor?
Do you know if it only appears upside down or if it is actualy recorded upside down on the tape?

GenJerDan

06-10-2005, 06:26 AM

It will be upside down on the tape, too. Not big deal...NLEs let you flip vertically with no great trouble.

note: the first adapter I made flipped vertically AND horizontally. THAT, you don't want...takes forEVER to render.

Dan

Ted Ramasola

06-10-2005, 06:33 AM

Alceujr

I have already emailed e at overlandfilms the pics of my adapter and waiting his response to post them so I can send him test result video to assess also.

If you wish to assess them also please email me at ramasola@globelines.com.ph
so I can send you my test video in DV format and pics of adapter with medium format lens attached since I don't have a host site for posting pics.

Yes, the pics are upside down in the adapter but turning the LCD around but not all the way will give you a right side up image.(pics provided)
The recorded image will have to be flipped in post. But this is a minor issue since most NLE's have this feature.

For all other forum readers who are interested, please feel free to email me for further correspondence. I can provide the design of the adapter also for you guys to further improve.

Ted Ramasola

06-12-2005, 07:24 AM

Here are pictures of the adapter for medium format lens and sample frame grabs.

80 mm lens on the adapter
http://tedramasola.9k.com/images/adapter_w_dvx1.jpg

a grab
http://tedramasola.9k.com/images/stairbalusters.jpg

kyledroid

06-12-2005, 04:46 PM

i have a question for teddybear or for anyone in that matter: What would be the advantage of using a medium format adapter versus a 35mm adapter?

Ted Ramasola

06-12-2005, 07:23 PM

i have a question for teddybear or for anyone in that matter: What would be the advantage of using a medium format adapter versus a 35mm adapter?

In my experiments, the medium format lens casts a bigger image onto the rotating ground glass as compared with a 35mm lens. I think this is better for the dvx to record from as it doesn't have to zoom in to a small area thus getting a clearer image.

I also think you have more illumination in your image from the much larger "hole" of the medium format giving you more flexibility.

GenJerDan

06-13-2005, 01:57 AM

Yep. Also: one problem the 35mm adapters have is darkening/vignetting of the edges. With a larger "projected" image, you can zoom in more, cutting off those edges if you want.

Dan

Mike Smith

06-16-2005, 12:28 AM

I have a question for you guys. Why aren't you using 4x5 view camera parts for your adapters. You would get a very large ground glass, no vignetting and tilts, shifts, swings. OH YA! the mind boggles.

Mike Smith

GenJerDan

06-16-2005, 02:29 AM

Like you said..."very large". :grin:

Dan

Ted Ramasola

06-16-2005, 03:35 AM

Mike,

I also have several lenses for a much larger mamiya RB67 and even an ancient Bauch and lomb view camera lens.
It's apparent that the larger the lens you use the farther the distance would be from it's last element to the film plate plane or in our case we replaced that with spinning "ground glass".

This would mean a "Very Large" case for the whole contraption.

I replied to your 12v battery question too. posted a link in that thread.

Ted Ramasola

06-16-2005, 03:39 AM

The distance of the last element or the rim of the medium format lens to the "GG" is already 6.35cm give or take a fraction depending on where you started counting.

This gave me a sharp image up to infinity.

35mm lenses can be placed closer.

Hope this helps.

Mike Smith

06-17-2005, 01:16 AM

Thanks For the Response Teddy. I agree the 4x5 would look like a real bogosity but it would allow you to do things you could do with no other camera. It might be 3 feet long but if the tripod mount is centered weight wise who cares. Now if you mounted the DVX upside down wouldn't that solve your reverse image problem? For those of you who have not used a view camera it allows you to use more that depth of field to control focus. You use the tilts and swings to control the plane of focus. thus if you had two groups of solders standing face to face and you are filming from in the exact center where both groups are 20 feet from you could put one group in focus and the other out. You can do the same on the horizontal plane. I can't think of many examples where you would use that in film making but I don't see why not. It could be really fun.

On the medium format lenses. You can probably pick up Bronica lenses cheap, not the SQ series but previous to that. In general the medium format lenses will be faster than 35mm lenses if you need to project a 2 1/4" image.

GenJerDan

06-17-2005, 07:55 AM

On the medium format lenses. You can probably pick up Bronica lenses cheap, not the SQ series but previous to that. In general the medium format lenses will be faster than 35mm lenses if you need to project a 2 1/4" image.

:grin: My 300mm Zeiss lens is f4, the 'normal' 80mm is f2.8 on the Pentacon six TL I'm using. Let's see....back when the exchange rate was 15:1, I bought the camera, 80mm, 120mm, 300mm, and 500mm Zeiss lenses for...um...about $200.

I'm editing now and will put some stuff up later on. My "Marla66" again...goofy-looking.

Dan

GenJerDan

06-17-2005, 12:24 PM

Okie-doke. Re-did my Marla66 adapter (uses a 6x6 Pentacon SLR) and took some more footage.

Here's a grab:
http://www.changedcrocodile.com/Films/Marla/Book.png

And a webpage with what the adapter looks like, and the video.

Warning: the video contains puppets.

And ducks for Steven.

Dan

Shaw

06-17-2005, 12:53 PM

GenJerDan, Did you crop the image to that size or did you use some sort of anamorphic element? It seems quite a bit wider than 2.35:1 (though that may have been intentional).

GenJerDan

06-17-2005, 02:21 PM

I shot Squeezed, then cropped to 720x306 in Vegas.

Of course, that could have been totally incorrect...but I think someone here said 306 was right.

Saving a frame out as a PNG, with the square pixel thingie for computers, puts it to 872x480 (including the letterboxing).

So the real image shows up on the screen as 2.85:1 Which is just bizarre... But maybe it'll start a trend. :-)

Dan

Ted Ramasola

06-24-2005, 03:28 PM

I finalized some figures in using mamiya rb645 medium format lenses on this adapter.

when using 80mm the settings on dvx zoom is from Z81 to Z87 manual focus at MF33 macro.
for a wide 45mm, zoom is only at Z87 also at MF33 macro.

While the motor for the rotating "GG" is at 12 volts I powered it only with 2 AA 1.5v batteries to slow down rotation and eliminating vibration which can cause loss of sharpness.

I'll post construction schematic or photos of parts next time.

I will be using this adapter in a paying project next month. I'll post my "battlefield test" results soon after.

Ted Ramasola

06-25-2005, 05:13 PM

Heres the adapter parts.

Hope this helps those who are interested in resurrecting their old medium format lenses for their dvxes.

Heres a new link
lens adapter and samples (http://tedramasola.9k.com/photo.html)

bikefilms

06-26-2005, 12:28 PM

That's an awesome contraption Dan. Nice info too. I tried and failed with the rotating GG. The static GG has rocked my world though. No more grain.

bikefilms

06-26-2005, 12:32 PM

have you recycled a motor from a household appliance? Or found a motor especially for the DOF unit? I tried using a CD player motor, but when attached to the battery box, it shorted and sputtered. It never spun the CD fast enough.

Hmmm, I'd like to try again.

Ted Ramasola

06-28-2005, 09:49 AM

[QUOTE=bikefilms]have you recycled a motor from a household appliance? Or found a motor especially for the DOF unit?QUOTE]

bikefilms

The motor is from a kit for replacing an entire cd assembly. It comes with the lens for the laser thingy, I just romoved the motor and placed it on a wooden platform and fastened it with a thin metal strip to keek it from popping out. and finally I glue gunned around it to keep it from vibrating. its rated at 12 volts but powered it with only 3v coming from two 1.5 batteries to slow it down.

Mandy Leo

07-28-2005, 06:54 AM

Message for Teddybear

I love the look of your new dof rig and the shots in provides, good job!
A couple of questions :
1) how are you getting rid of hotspots?
2) How are you making the FL work if you can't adjust the position of the GG?

Any chance of seeing what it looks like on the inside?

Thanks in advance.

icicle22

07-28-2005, 10:30 AM

Can someone explain how the magnet inverts the image? Is this a way of fooling the LCD to think you actually flipped it? That would suggest some type of magnetic switch in the DVX itself.

Thanks.

Shaw

07-28-2005, 10:53 AM

That's exactly it :)

ulisses

07-28-2005, 04:33 PM

I saw DVXDOF120 in the adapter, are you planning to sell it ?

Nice job ! Wonderful DOF.

Ulisses

Ted Ramasola

08-03-2005, 10:31 PM

ulisses,
I plan to post soon detailed scematics and photos and diagram of the inside.
I hope it will encourage people to make this on their own. As you can see from my location, its rreally gonna be hard marketing and shipping it. :-)

I also will post the new modification on the brace that bolts between motor housing and aluminum mount for camera.

Baluardo

08-04-2005, 04:26 AM

You're a good photographer, teddybear:)
i like your DIY project, looks clean and professional. Will like to see the construction details..

i look forward to the possibility of using my MF zeiss lenses for video :)

Andrea

gritsngumbo

08-04-2005, 02:17 PM

Has anyone seen this on ebay? Looks a lot like the design Dan (GenJerDan) posted a while back spiffed up a little?

http://cgi.ebay.com/Mini35-Kit-dvx100-dvx100a-gl2-gl1-pd150-pd170-xl2-xl1_W0QQitemZ7535987903QQcategoryZ20332QQtcZphotoQ QssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

GenJerDan

08-04-2005, 04:45 PM

:)

Design stolen from the same folks I stole it from.

Dan

Baluardo

08-05-2005, 03:57 AM

> http://cgi.ebay.com/Mini35-Kit-dvx1...1QQcmdZViewItem

terrible sample photos, dont you think? :)
they didnt even use Dan's technique to flip the cam over in order to get image right in at least one dimension :)

Andrea

gkumar

08-05-2005, 09:42 PM

My adapter is almost complete. Can anyone point out what the magnifying lense does and what can be used to make one or where to buy one? This is my last obstacle :evil: :angry:
http://tedramasola.9k.com/images/adapter_parts.jpg

Ted Ramasola

08-08-2005, 11:34 AM

the magnifying lens is like any you'll find in a book store. The one "sherlock holmes" has. remove the lens from the frame and handle. I think this is the only visual ref I can think of! It it there so that you'll have an enlarged image on the rotating GG. the DVX can't zoom in that close. My setting is zoom at Z81 and manual focus MF33. with the magnifying lens there is no vignetting.

Ted Ramasola

11-08-2005, 08:46 AM

all,

heres the broken apart images of the adapter I built. I rememberd sm1 asking for details.

These images show a modified aluminum angular brace to attach the adapter to the camera baseplate. The first version only had 1 which had no rigidity, this model now has 2 angular brace bolted to the GG motor housing.

click on this link, if you dont see an image below, (my sitehost limits linked photos)

Parts of the adapter photos (http://www.tedramasola.9k.com/photo.html)

Scroll to the bottom of the page.

http://tedramasola.9k.com/images/structure_details.jpg

Ted Ramasola

11-29-2005, 05:27 AM

I posted more sample shots, this time of people.

people shots link (http://www.tedramasola.9k.com/photo.html)

http://www.tedramasola.9k.com/images/dof120-2b.jpg

there more pics at the link above

http://www.tedramasola.9k.com/images/dof120-3.jpg

engr

11-29-2005, 06:02 PM

Great instructions Ted!Wat GG did u use??

RMI Studios

11-29-2005, 07:45 PM

how do you focus with these units? manually? on the attached lens? or on the dvx ring?

Ted Ramasola

11-29-2005, 09:15 PM

engr
I used the "frosted" blank cds that come on both ends of a maxell cdr spindle. Otherwise I also have sandpapered clear cds as back up just in case.

RMI Studios
You set the optimum croping and focus on the gg by adjusting the zoom and focus on the dvx. This is one time only. Mark it. then use the attached lens' focus ring from then on.

hope this helps.

Ted Ramasola

01-01-2006, 04:34 AM

pastywhiteboy

01-01-2006, 09:02 PM

All

I've posted in stickypod gallery, sample footage from version 2 of DVXDOF120 adapter.
The major mod is that I've replaced the magnifying lens with 3 stacks of +3 close up lens that I mounted on a step down ring in front of the DVX.

Many thanks to www.stickypod.com (http://www.stickypod.com) for letting dvx users post footage.

Here are the links
rack-1 (http://www.stickypod.com/stickypod_upload/uploads/rackdvxdof120-3.mov)

rack-2 (http://www.stickypod.com/stickypod_upload/uploads/rackdvxdof120-1.mov)

The replacement of the magnifying glass removed ghosting and provided a much sharper image.
Looks really, really good. Soooo...... why aren't you selling these things? I don't think paying extra for shipping from Bohol would be a big deal for people, considering the quality of this product. Just my thoughts.
Anyway, the footage looks great!

-pasty

James Gerber

01-01-2006, 10:48 PM

Very cool adapter, and great footage!!

Other than giving you a larger visual on the focus screen, does using the 80mm lens also provide better light?

I don't know much about photography, but just didn't know if a 1.8f 35mm lens, would be just as bright as a 1.8f 80mm lens? Or would the 80mm lens, because of the larger image, have less of a noticable "hotspot" on the focus screen?

jg

**EDIT**

Also... can you still manually focus an "automatic" lens? Or when you get a lens for an adapter, do you need to make sure it's a Manual Lens?

Ted Ramasola

01-02-2006, 06:59 AM

James Gerber

Since the 80 mm that I use is an f1.9, yeah, it is brighter.
When I use medium format lens, the projected image on the spinning CD is bigger and thus the captured image is more detailed than smaller 35.

Now take note that this statement apllies only to my own instrument and comparison, meaning. I am only doing a DIY device with tools lying around our studio. When I say "more detailed than smaller 35" this is when i'm comparing it with MY own 35 lenses and not with the commercial grade solutions found in this forum, such as G35, M2, MPIC, Letus, etc.

In my opinion, those solutions that I have mentioned have access to quality optics found in US and Europe. I don't have that benefit. Their 35 mm adapter are better than my DIY 120 adapter.

The lens that I use are manual, after setting the zoom setting and macro focus on the DVX to focus on the GG, you must mark it, lock it, tape it. All racking and focusing and f stop setting are done on the attached 120 lens. Among the parameters you can adjust on the DVX are, speed( but not too high, or the spinning gets obvious)and Iris(to control exposure).

Ted Ramasola

01-02-2006, 10:27 AM

Heres a pic of version 2 of the DVX DOF 120

If you can't see a pic please click this LINK (http://tedramasola.9k.com/photo.html) Scroll down.

I will post soon, footage from the adapter mounted on the PLYWOOD SKATER.

http://tedramasola.9k.com/images/comparisonpic.jpg

James Gerber

01-02-2006, 10:51 AM

Teddybear,

I was currious about the auto vs manual, cause there was a cheap 'auto lens' for sale on ebay... but I didn't know if you can still manually focus an auto lens.

Nice updated pics! That's a pretty sharp looking rig.

So you use the plastic lens cap for a mount?

Ted Ramasola

01-02-2006, 02:03 PM

As far as I know James there are auto lenses that you can still manually focus, some nikon dx lens has a A and M switch, D types you can also focus manually, some auto lens stays full open if there is no electronic means on your device to trigger its iris.

Yeah, I used 2 lens caps because the medium format lenses for the rb645 needs a longer distance to its 'film plane' (GG).

I have a video posted for another thread, the DIY plywood skater, it shows at the end, the DVX DOF120 adapter mounted on the plywood skater.

heres a Link to adapter mounted on PLYWOOD SKATER (http://www.stickypod.com/stickypod_upload/uploads/skater%20video.mpg)

its mpg format so youll have no problem playing it on media player, 6.87 mb only.

Thanks to www.stickypod.com for allowing dvxusers to post videos.

James Gerber

01-02-2006, 02:42 PM

Full open wouldn't be too bad.. 'cause, well, from the cheapo adapter I made for myself, I seemed to get a pretty bad hot spot when using the irus to control exposure, verses my cameras exposure control.

gonna have to check out that link you just posted.

thanx,

jg

Ted Ramasola

01-03-2006, 05:59 AM

I replaced the video attached to the link above, i noticed in the last sequence a slight wobble. I didnt tighten enough the dvxdof 120 adapter onto the plywood skater. Same link above to get video.

235 Studios

01-03-2006, 12:32 PM

Thanks for all those tips, and sample pic's. I'll take a look at the footage later today, right now I'm on a dial up connection.

Question for you- Do you notice any achromatic banding (?) on your footage (The blue / green banding that shows up on edges in a lot of these kinds of adapters.)? I'm not seeing any in the still pics, but then again you said you CC'd them with MB.

Ted Ramasola

01-03-2006, 01:18 PM

The sample pics on this thread,"guys against an open window and a child." -those labeled as cc'd with magic bullet were all taken with version-1. Download the links labeled rack#, these were done with +3(x3)close up. better images interms of color, and sharpness.

Some tradeoffs,

A little soft on the rims of the frame. sharpest in the center area.(must be my close up filter)

CA still exists in areas of extreme contrast and blown highlights. The amount though is subjective.

Ted Ramasola

01-05-2006, 11:25 PM

All,

I started a new thread with new "version" of Midformat adapter.
It contains tests and sample videos. Might help those interested to DIY.

Link to New thread (http://www.dvxuser.com/V3/showthread.php?t=42847)

Best Regards

Ted