capture card for Premiere Pro

[lhart]

I'm about to start editing a documentary shot in 24P with the dvx100A and need to upgrade my editing system. I have Adobe Premiere 6.0 with the Pinnacle DV500plus capture card. I want to upgrade to Adobe Premiere Pro 1.5 version and add Adobe Encore DVD and I'll need a new capture card. The certified capture cards listed on Adobe's site are the Matrox and Bluefish 444 brands. I need help figuring out which capture card will work best and what other hardware I'll need to upgrade my system. I'm confused as to whether the Matrox RT.X100 will work ok with my footage shot in 24P. My computer is a Dell Precision 330 P4, 1.5 Ghz (400Mhz Bus) with RIMM 256MB, PC800, 400Mhz, ECC 2 x 128 Rambus Memory. I can list additional specs if necessary. I am not a computer person, so it's difficult to understand what all I will need. Any help in this regard is greatly appreciated!
Thanks!

[Sumfun]

You probably don't need a capture card for most applications. I don't know about Pinnacle, but the Matrox card doesn't really give you any additional features (vs. no capture card). The main thing that you get is fast previews without rendering. The Matrox codec treats 24p as 60i, which is good if you want to use a 60fps timeline. If you want a 24p timeline, then you'll need to bypass the card for capture.

[PDX_DVX]

Honestly, I just use a standard firewire card. If you're going to be running external storage via firewire, you might want to get 2 cards so you arent running all your data through just 1 port. I have heard that if you stick with shooting 24pa, you dont really need a matrox card. As for the system, I would start by upgrading the processors. AMD makes some really good, fast, reliable processors that are actually less expensive than Intel and work just as good, if not better. My friend just got a system in which he's using an AMD 3500+, 2gigs of DDR ram, new case, etc etc and he put it together for under 1200 bucks. And the best part is, it's blazing fast. Of course nothing's going to compare to a Xeon or Opteron processor machine, but you gotta get what you can afford. Check out some of the HP workstations if you're looking for a ready made system.

The things I find most important in an edit system are as follows:

1. Seperate storage for programs/operating system and your captured footage- right now I run an 80 gig system drive where I have my OS and various programs, and for storage I run 1 120 gig drive for render files/rendered footage, 1 120 SATA drive for captured, and a 250 SATA for more captured footage. Keeping your files seperate will keep things from bogging down too much.

2. Dual monitor support- Right now, I have some crappy ATI card, but it supports dual monitor, in this case, 1 VGA and 1 DVI output. This allows you to stretch your desktop across 2 monitors giving you a WAY bigger workspace to keep things from getting cluttered/cramped.

3. A good DVD burner- essential for burning test DVD's and in some cases storing files. I use a LiteOn 16x Dual layer buurner. I have had alot of friends use these, and never once has one crapped out. They burn very few error disks (I havent burned any errors so far) and they are relatively cheap, mine cost 62 bucks

4. Plenty of case cooling- make sure if you're buying a new case that it has good fans and lots of air intake/exhaust. This will help keep the system running smooth when you're doing render intense projects. Keep in mind cooler=faster

5. Good audio card- You might want to run a 5.1 system on your machine (surround sound). But whatever you do make sure and get a decent audio card.

I hope this helps.....

[BLUESPIDER]

Yeah, believe it or not but I'm still using my $15 firewire card to edit all my stuff. Well, that's till I upgrade to maybe a SD/HD Kona card or something along that line.


Word!

[lhart]

Thanks for your quick response. When I asked Adobe why I needed a capture card they said that capturing my footage would be much faster and without one it would be very slow. What are your thoughts on this? Thanks very much!

[lhart]

Thanks so much for the information. Yes, it seems like upgrading my processors is a must and also my OS hard drive which is only 18 gigs. Then I have two additional hard drives (36 gig and 72gig) and they are all SCSI drives. I will ask my computer person what you suggested regarding hard drive space. When I bought this system 4 years ago, SCSI drives were recommended, but now it seems they are not as necessary, so I'm wondering if they should be replaced or can I add non SCSI drives to the system which are less money for more storage? I have 15 hours of footage that I will be working with, but not all of it will need to be captured initially. As for your other suggestions:

2. I will consider the dual monitor support.
3. I also have a LiteOn DVD burner. It's the DVDRW LDW851S model
4 & 5. I will consider the case cooling and good audio card

Thanks a lot! I think I'm getting closer to figuring this out.

[Raytracer]

When I asked Adobe why I needed a capture card they said that capturing my footage would be much faster and without one it would be very slow.

Sounds like the janitor is answering the phone again. If you're capturing DV footage it doesn't matter if you have a stock firewire card or an Edius NX: you capture the footage in realtime. Doesn't matter if you're batchcapturing just the clips you need, or the whole tape. The process is identical for both.

Now, working with your footage will be much faster with hardware acceleration. The advantage to cards like the Matrox or Canopus hardware is realtime output of many of the effects, transitions, graphics etc. These can really speed up your workflow, and considering they can be had used, or without the bundled software for as little as four or five hundred bucks they can pay for themselves pretty quickly.

Joe

[PDX_DVX]

I have found that 7200 RPM drives do just fine, supposedly SATA is faster, but not much. I think DV video as captured from a DVX100A runs about 12 gigs per hour, so keep that in mind as well. Just make sure not to get any hard drives that are less than 7200 RPM. Some people even use 10,000 and 15,000 RPM drives as their OS and program drives, because they improve bootup time. They are really expensive though, and if you have a dedicated OS drive the difference isnt that much. The average price of a SATA 250 gig drive is about 120-140 without rebates, the only thing you have to pay attention to is to make sure your motherboard supports SATA.

The speed of your capture doesn't have a whole lot to do with the card, since your capturing real time anyway. And like Bluespider says, hes been using a $15 card for some time and apparently hasn't had any problems. The only time you're going to run into lag/dropped frames is if you're running multiple devices off of the same card. Firewire 800 just came out, which is effectively twice as fast as standard firewire, but isn't really needed unless you're running a 10k or 15k rpm external drive.

A good online resource with good prices and service is www.newegg.com

BTW, a good case is the Antec P160

[lhart]

Yes, I had the same impression from Adobe that the guy did not know what he was talking about when he told me the capturing would be slower without a capture card. But it does sound like I should have one as far as seeing the effects, transiitions and titles in real time. The matrox RT.X100 comes with Adobe Premiere Pro 1.5 (upgrade from 6.0), Adobe Encore DVD and Adobe Audition for $750 which is considerably less than the cards from Bluefish 444 that don't include any of the Adobe software. The SD/Envy is $3996 and the Wildblue/AV is $3,495 for the cards alone.

So now in response to this comment:
The Matrox codec treats 24p as 60i, which is good if you want to use a 60fps timeline. If you want a 24p timeline, then you'll need to bypass the card for capture.

I'm back to the question of the Matrox not supporting 24P. What will happen if I use a 24P time line instead of the 60i? Will I not be able to see the transitions, etc. with the Matrox card? Or what will the 24P footage look like if I use a 6ofps timeline? Sorry I don't understand this better.

And regarding my hard drives. They are 10,000 RPM SCSI drives, but I will definately need more so this will be another thing to figure out. Another thing Adobe has been telling me is that external hard drives will not work with their software. They are not fast enough.

Can anyone recommend a good company that can advise me on what hardware to get to do this upgrade? I've found some companies on the internet that I've e-mailed and will contact tomorrow.

Thanks to everyone for your help!

[PDX_DVX]

If they're 10k rpm scsi drives, you shouldn't need to buy any more drives for system and OS stuff. Those will be fine, just make sure they are compatible with your mother board. External hard drives *are* fast enough in my experience, however, it would probably be better to work off of internal drives, and save external drives (if you have any) for archival purposes. In my experience, Western Digital and Seagate are the best drive manafacturers. Some motherboards support onboard Raid 5, which is a pretty good way to set up an internal storage solution. Basically what happens is it recognizes a group of hard drives as one giant one. I'm not sure on the specifics, but I believe you can also set it up to "mirror" your drives, so if one drive goes out, you have an exact copy of that drive will all your media intact.

Some professional video places can advise you on edit systems, I know of a place in Oregon called "professional video and tape" that does consulting about NLE type stuff, they won't tell you how to piece together a maching though, instead they will tell you a workflow and will recommend ready made systems. If you're looking to put a PC together yourself, these boards are actually a wonderful resource, since most of the people here will not blow smoke and try to get you to spend all your $$$.

I have heard good things about the Matrox cards, I think you can even get some that support dual computer monitor, as well as full screen preview, a total of 3 monitors. Plus with the Adobe software bundled, you are killing 2 birds with 1 stone and getting a good deal on both items....

[lhart]

Thanks, again. I will discuss these options with a computer consultant and go from there.