1/2" DVCAM vs HD

[ggrantly]

Similar to many on the board, I am deciding whether to go with hdv for my new camera purchase. My considerations include the new jvc hd camera, or 1/2" SD cams such as the JVC-5100 or possibly a Sony. At one level the question is, would a 1/2" camera like the 5100 give a real improvement over the 1/3" cameras such as the dvx or XL2? Given the limited opportunity for HDV distribution at present, would you buy 1/2" SD equipment; either JVC or Sony, or go with HDV?
I will post this on the dvx board also.
Thanks for your thoughts.

[bilgami]

I guess it all depends on what you shoot and how much money you have to spend on a cam?

[mezelf27]

I would guess it's for totally different purposes, indeed. With the JVC GY-HD100, you've got native 16/9 and the high resolution of HD(V) (if you want it). With the 1/2" DVCAM, you've got a lower resolution (SD) and native 4/3. If you want to crop that to 16/9, it's worth like nothing. On the other hand, with a 1/2" SD cam, you can achieve a lower depth of focus - but that's the only advantage I can see...

I tested an XL1s, a DVX100 and a JVC GY-DV500 (old model!) together, and be assured, the JVC gave by far a superior image. Recently I compared that footage to the footage shot on a (native 16/9) XL2, and the 16/9 image of the XL2 is already of a different class.

You need to know wether 16/9 is important to you (the you should go for the HD100). If you need the HD, it's obvious. Only thing I can see, is the shorther focal depth...

[thisiswells]

I love the DVX. I really do. But, the JVC DV500 is one heck of a camera. Outstanding!

Not to pimp three year old technology, but it's a 1/2" 3-ccd camera with a 6-point color matrix
and monochrome CRT viewfinder, and they sell for less, yes less, money than a used DVX100.

I'm not saying it's the best camera, period, but it is a pretty incredible tool for the money.
They generally go for around $2000ish on eBay.

[mezelf27]

indeed, the first time I saw the footage I really was stunnend. It was the PAL version, obviously, but 2nd hand costing 3000 euro's (+/- 4000 dollar) it was worth every cent!
NTSC versions are probably as amazing in their rerspective format and the do go around 2000 - 3000 dollars.
Of course, it's some extra weight to carry, but most of all: all the accesories are DAMN right expensive (professional, eh). 3 batteries + charger = 1000 euro, AC- adapter = 500 euro, another lens perhaps? the other viefinder? ...
So it's cheaper or the same as a used DVX, but all the necessary accesories are quite expensive of course... don't be fooled!

[thisiswells]

I guess I was thinking about this 0 Hours DV500 with accessories. Sold for $2,125.
Others aren't much more. Some have Anton's as well. Just depends.

Item Number #7513938587



Fujinon S14x7.3b12U 14:1 Power Zoom Lens
JVC VF-P115BU 1.5" Black and White Viewfinder
Standard JVC Omni-Directional XLR Microphone
Power Sonic PS1270 F1 12v 70amp Rechargeable Battery in Carrying Pack
Power Cord
Charging Cord
(2) Sanyo Cadnica 1700mAh Nickel-Cadmium Rechargeable Battery Packs
JVC FieldCharger KX-2 4-Set Battery Charging Station

[mezelf27]

Well, in Europe, everything is more expensive :-(

Anyhow, the deal you mention seems quite sweet. I personally would choose it over a DVX. No hesitation. But it all depends what you need it for, of course...

[Flintstone]

Do this test... I did it 3 weeks ago, and I was surprised. Compare the image quality of the JVC 5100 with the Sony PD170 in both normal and low-light conditions. The difference is not what you'd expect of a 1/2 vs a 1/3. I'd actually go as far as saying the PD170 came out ahead in most tests. Granted, you have much better manual control over the 5100.

The question you should ask yourself is if you need HDV now! But I have to admit, the form factor of the JVC HD is interresting. But before I can say anything about it, I have to say, show me the footage. I handled it on May 2nd at a show here in Montreal; the feel of it is great. Although not everything was working on the pre-prod model, the 24p mode seemed to be, at a very quick first glance, quite interreting.

[ggrantly]

I would like to dig a little deeper into the 5100 vs hd100 question. JVC claims to have improved the dsp in the 5100 over the 5000 and 500 series and made a few other improvements also. With all the hooha about hdv artifacts, dropped frames, poor color and or poor low light performance, I am curious what the future holds for sd cameras like the 5100. Given that the hd100 is native 16x9 and or 24p, why would jvc bring the 5100 camera to market at a price point even higher than the hd100 and expect it to sell if the hd100 image is sooo superior?

[Gibby]

I love the DVX. I really do. But, the JVC DV500 is one heck of a camera. Outstanding!

I'll second that! When I need higher-end cameras (F900, Varicam, etc.) I rent them. I own a Z1, and I'll be buying an HD100 in July, and an HVX200 in December. My in-house SD camera systems are: DV500, PD170, and DVX100a. To me, all of these camcorders are excellent, have distinct uses, and inherent pluses and minuses. I enjoy and respect each in different ways. The DV500 has given me great service over the past four years. I've used it for numerous national television programs and business media projects. I use it with a Fujinon 20x6.4 lens, Century .8 wide angle converter, and scores of accessories. My stock footage from the DV500 is marketed extensively online by Mammoth HD (www.mammothhd.com). Several of my DV500 wildlife and coastal footage collections are there.

I feel the 1/2" chips and upgraded lens give the DV500 some advantages over my 1/3" cameras. But the 1/3" cameras are much more mobile, thus lending themselves better to "run and gun" situations. In post I've had very little problems matching the footage from 1/2" and 1/3" cameras. if it was all lighted the same, and shot with the same techniques. In fact, since the mid-90's when the Sony XV1000 was introduced, I have routinely intercut well-shot 3-chip 1/3" footage with 2/3" footage from Beta SP, and more recently PD170 and DVX100a footage with DVCPro 50 footage.

Even though I now have a Z1, with an HD100 and an HVX200 on the way, I'll just keep the DV500 for certain SD uses. It has the larger camera profile some clients expect, the images are excellent, it's a dependable workhorse, and it still has a lot of use left in it.

Gibby
www.cut4.tv

[DC]

. . . Even though I now have a Z1, with an HD100 and an HVX200 on the way . . .


Hey, Gibby, did you ever get that HVX200?