First hands on impressions: AC160 vs HMC150

[Phil1076]

I played with the AC160 yesterday at my local store...overall:

-bigger than the HMC150...more "meaty" and bulky, but still well balanced.
-one pound or so heavier than the 150
-LCD is much improved
-XLR inputs are in a much better location
-there's a little latch on the top handle record button which, once locked, prevents you from accidentally hitting the record button again.
-similar menu layout to the 150
-iris ring is now on the lens and is quite large
-the shutter/frame rate selection is on the same little knob
-that knob doesn't always seem to work...there's a button beside it which selects shutter-->VFR-->locked....setting it to "shutter" works fine...setting it to "locked" works fine also...but setting it to VFR works sometimes...spinning the knob does nothing and I found I had to cycle through the choices a few times before it worked....not sure if I was doing something wrong but I'll let it as user error since there's no way that would have passed QA.
-no noticeable jello during panning...I noticed a little when panning REALLY fast, but no one would ever pan that fast under normal circumstances. For all intents and purposes, no jello.
-VFR seemed to work just fine (aside from knob issue)
-the zoom kicks some major ass...will be great for wildlife
-Overall image quality seemed good...I only shot a few minutes and the lighting was terrible, but it looks clean.
-Couldn't test any low light.
-Not alot of dof (as expected).

Assuming that the knob issue was just my user error (I only played with it for about 15 minutes), it seems like a solid cam for events/weddings/wildlife/ENG stuff.

[ransom]

Phil, I just received my AC160 today. I agree with most of what you said. I didn't have any problem with the shutter/frame rate knob though. It's operation is similar if not the same as the AF100.

Build quality is very good and what I have come to expect from Panasonic. I haven't had a chance to shoot any footage yet. Just played with the menus and buttons and so forth. So far I really like the overall layout of buttons and controls. Menu is similar to the AF100 and it's great to have the scene file dial back on this cam.
If the image it makes is as good as I think it will be it will be close to perfect event cam imho.

[Jim Simon]

Does this model finally have decently slow zoom for the "Presidential Push", like the long discontinued but properly designed DVC30?

What about a decent snap zoom, also like the long discontinued but properly designed DVC30?

Is the zoom motor still so loud it gets picked up by the camera's built-in mics?

[ransom]

It has a pretty good slow zoom. I had a DVC30 as well and it may not be quite as slow as it was but it's good. Or it may be I'm really not sure. Snap zoom is not extremely fast. Haven't run any quite audio zoom test yet so can't comment on the zoom noise but seems quite. But I'm still learning the camera and there may be settings I haven't run across yet. Looking forward to Barry's free AC160 book when it's out.

[ransom]

Some quick first shots from the 160.

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Edit: replaced original video with a color corrected version

[Josh Bass]

Can you tell me what the flip out LCD is like in terms of clarity/sharpness? Last pana cam I used was an HVX200, and I was not impressed with that LCD. Sure, it's big, but it's not super sharp and the peaking wasn't very effective to me.

Does this have better peaking? I like the EX1's, for instance, where the peaking is a different color.

[ransom]

It seems to me the LCD is the same one as on the AF100 or close to it. I have never used an HVX200. In the Af100 forum people have commented that one is better than the 200 if I'm not mistaken.

Focus peaking in red works as expected on the 160. Again like the AF100. I set the EVF to B/W and the red pops better.

[mcgeedigital]

Some quick first shots from the 160.

30251915

You had a 3200 wb on while shooting outside there.

[ransom]

haha, could very well be. I said it was a "quick" test. I had very little time and had to finish fast. I had a warm polarizer on it so that may have helped it look better.

[Barry_Green]

Can you tell me what the flip out LCD is like in terms of clarity/sharpness? Last pana cam I used was an HVX200, and I was not impressed with that LCD. Sure, it's big, but it's not super sharp and the peaking wasn't very effective to me.
As a conservative estimate, the LCD on the AC160/AC130/HPX250/AF100 is about 1,000,000,000,000,000,000 times better than the one on the HVX200. It's dramatically sharper (I think it's over 4x as sharp) and the angle of view is incredibly wider. With the HVX you pretty much had to be viewing absolutely spot-on angle in order to see anything; rotating the LCD as little as 20 degrees would cause a massive shift in contrast and viewability. On the new cameras you have a pretty wide range of viewing angle.

As far as peaking goes, it's probably only about 700,000 times better. :thumbsup: They really learned their lesson on peaking with the HPX170; even though the 170 used the same physical LCD panel as the HVX200, it was infinitely easier to use for focus because of the much better peaking algorithm.


Does this have better peaking? I like the EX1's, for instance, where the peaking is a different color.
It has much better peaking, but it also has a colored focus assist too, so you can get peaking in red, or you can use the focus-in-red focus assist which is basically another type of peaking.

[Stephen Mick]

As a conservative estimate, the LCD on the AC160/AC130/HPX250/AF100 is about 1,000,000,000,000,000,000 times better than the one on the HVX200. It's dramatically sharper (I think it's over 4x as sharp) and the angle of view is incredibly wider. With the HVX you pretty much had to be viewing absolutely spot-on angle in order to see anything; rotating the LCD as little as 20 degrees would cause a massive shift in contrast and viewability. On the new cameras you have a pretty wide range of viewing angle.

As far as peaking goes, it's probably only about 700,000 times better. :thumbsup: They really learned their lesson on peaking with the HPX170; even though the 170 used the same physical LCD panel as the HVX200, it was infinitely easier to use for focus because of the much better peaking algorithm.


It has much better peaking, but it also has a colored focus assist too, so you can get peaking in red, or you can use the focus-in-red focus assist which is basically another type of peaking.

+1,000

The new LCD, combined with focus-in-red, makes nailing focus ridiculously easy.

[Jim Simon]

On the subject of focus, anyone test the auto-focus in 24p modes yet? Is it quick? Is it accurate? Does it wander?

[ransom]

Just did a quick low light, semi-tele 24p focus test. It's not fast but it is accurate and it doesn't wander. It's not slow either just in 24p it has less to work with.

[Josh Bass]

+1,000

The new LCD, combined with focus-in-red, makes nailing focus ridiculously easy.

You just gave my brain a chubby.

[David Saraceno]

It has much better peaking, but it also has a colored focus assist too, so you can get peaking in red, or you can use the focus-in-red focus assist which is basically another type of peaking.

Barry:

I've looked all over the manual for the HPX250, and cannot see where this is set.

Any suggestions?

[Barry_Green]

Barry:

I've looked all over the manual for the HPX250, and cannot see where this is set.

Any suggestions?
Yep. Look at the thread title... :evil:

Seriously, this feature is in the AC160. It's not in the HPX250. The HPX250 has overall better peaking, because you can set not only the intensity but also the threshold. You just can't set the color. The AC160 has the ability to use either normal white peaking, or the focus-in-red.

But the HPX250 has the magnified focus assist. Overall, for ultimate focus tools, the HXP250 wins.

But, as said, this thread wasn't talking about the 250, it was talking about the 160. They're not the same camera, they're surprisingly different...

[David Saraceno]

Thanks.

I thought so, but there have been several comments here that the 130/160/250/100 all have focus in red, but it appears that the 250 does not.

thank you for clarifying it.

[Barry_Green]

Thanks.

I thought so, but there have been several comments here that the 130/160/250/100 all have focus in red, but it appears that the 250 does not.

thank you for clarifying it.
Right -- the 250 doesn't have focus-in-red, and the 130/160 don't have magnified focus assist.

The 130/160 are using what looks like AF100 software and processing inside, whereas the 250 looks like it's using HPX370 processing and software.

[Phil vG]

As a conservative estimate, the LCD on the AC160/AC130/HPX250/AF100 is about 1,000,000,000,000,000,000 times better than the one on the HVX200.Your still 82 "0" short of a GOOGOL:laugh:

[ELN614]

Sorry but this video's color seems wayyyyy off. It reminds me of old photos I transfer.
I have, on order, a 130. Makes me think I need to cancel my order if the color is going to look like this.


Some quick first shots from the 160.

30251915

[ransom]

Yeah it's already been mentioned I accidentally had white balance on 3.2K. Learn the hard way if you set ATW with a user button and power cycle the unit it doesn't remember it. Thanks pointing out. I'll replace the vid with a color corrected version. Was definitely NOT a camera issue.

[TubEfingers]

its really disappointing that the 130/160 don't have magnified focus like the hmc150/hpx170, thats the one feature i really miss on the af101 as well

[Jonathana]

Did my first shoot with the AC-160 of a moderately-lit religious ceremony. Most of the time, I was operating within (using the OSD numbers) 85-99. At that end of the range, the light loss is significant, requiring operation with 6dB of gain. While clearly not an apples-apples comparison (especially in the zoom ratio), my previous camera, the DVX-100B, never needed additional gain under the same lighting conditions. The good news is that 6 dB of gain is much cleaner on the AC-160 than on the DVX.

VERY, VERY, VERY happy that the jerky start of the DVX's servo zoom has not been carried forward...just wish that the max speed was a tad faster.

Controls are logically placed, and the waveform display is a a phenomenal addition...never completely trusted zebras.

The handle feels very substantial (compared to other cameras that cost much more), and the inclusion of threaded slots for accessories was very thoughtful.

Love the simultaneous recording to both memory cards...extra piece of mind for once-in-a-lifetime events.

One thing that took me by surprise was the VU display. Unlike the DVX, there is only a single red segment, right at 0 dB, so it's very easy to clip without warning. Maybe with practice this will be a non issue, but it would be nice to see the segments between -12 dB and 0dB be yellow or red. Perhaps in a future firmware update?????

Overall, I'm very pleased, and glad that I was able to wait for this camera to be released.

[Barry_Green]

On the volume display, there is only the one red dot, yes. Sounds like you haven't used any intermediate Panasonic between the DVX and the AC160. They moved to the one-red-dot-only-at-clipping way back on the HVX200. Audio guys know that red is bad, and so when the DVX showed red during still-good audio, that wasn't a good thing. So they added vertical bar markers at -12dB, and changed it so that it's only red when it's actually clipping. It's been that way on all their HD cameras.

Just take note of that vertical line on the audio meters, that's -12dB. You get six dots after that before it clips, so it's giving you the same information, just in a more standard way so that established audio guys won't grossly under-record the audio (like was happening with the DVX; they'd back the volume down to never see red, and that wasn't how the DVX was supposed to be used).

[Jonathana]

You're absolutely right, Barry...haven't needed to shoot with any intermediate Panasonic camera since the DVX. Like I said, I'm sure that with a few more shoots under my belt, it'll be a non issue...just need to get used to the "not so new" way.

Thanks!

[D.R. Gates]

it seems like a solid cam for wedding stuff.

I do mostly wedding work with my HMC150. With all the flashes that go off around me, I don't think I'd want to use a CMOS camera any time soon. That's probably the biggest positive of a CCD sensor in regards to weddings. Flashes look normal, and even beuatiful when seen in slo-mo. On a CMOS chip, they're downright ugly.

[LanceOregon]

I do mostly wedding work with my HMC150. With all the flashes that go off around me, I don't think I'd want to use a CMOS camera any time soon. That's probably the biggest positive of a CCD sensor in regards to weddings. Flashes look normal, and even beuatiful when seen in slo-mo. On a CMOS chip, they're downright ugly.


I believe that the new Panasonic HPX250 has solved that problem with CMOS. Checkout its feature set.
.

[Barry_Green]

The HPX250 does have flash-band compensation, yes.

[Jonathana]

But no such compensation in the 160? Thought the two cameras shared the same sensor...

[Mike Warren]

But no such compensation in the 160? Thought the two cameras shared the same sensor...

That's right. No FBC in the 160 or 130. The sensor is the same for all three cameras, but the signal processing is different. It appears to me that Panasonic started with the DSP code of the 370 for the 250, and they started with the DSP code of the AF100 for the 160 and 130.

[Barry_Green]

But no such compensation in the 160? Thought the two cameras shared the same sensor... They have the same sensor, yes. But everything else is different. Think of it like two computers that share the same keyboard. What's really important is what's in the computer, and in the 160 vs 250 they have different computers attached to those sensors.

[D.R. Gates]

I believe that the new Panasonic HPX250 has solved that problem with CMOS. Checkout its feature set.
.

But this is a thread about the 160, not the 250. So my original concern still holds based on the follow-up replies.

I wasn't even aware of FBC until it was brought up here. Looking at some online clips, it's rather impressive. Not perfect, but better than as-is.

But considering this technology was released by Panasonic nearly TWO YEARS ago, there really is no excuse for it not to be in these new line of cameras.

[LanceOregon]

But this is a thread about the 160, not the 250. So my original concern still holds based on the follow-up replies.

I wasn't even aware of FBC until it was brought up here. Looking at some online clips, it's rather impressive. Not perfect, but better than as-is.

But considering this technology was released by Panasonic nearly TWO YEARS ago, there really is no excuse for it not to be in these new line of cameras.


Are you sure of that? I thought that the Flash Band compensation is a brand new feature introduced this year. What camcorder had the feature almost two years ago?
.

[Barry_Green]

Hpx370
Has flash band compensation. It's the only other camera that has it.

[D.R. Gates]

Are you sure of that? I thought that the Flash Band compensation is a brand new feature introduced this year. What camcorder had the feature almost two years ago?
.

Make that 2 and a half years ago. (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=whyzpwqXixU)

[Vaughan Wood]

Hpx370
Has flash band compensation. It's the only other camera that has it.

The EX1/EX3 range do it in software, but with all the footage we've taken with them, no-one ever complained about it, and if we were slo-moing a wedding section, you could easily fix it with a white frame or two.

I received my AC130 today, and 1st impressions are.

1. Bigger than expected. Longer than EX 1, wider than EX 1, and even the lens cover is larger than EX 1., but isn't quite as heavy, and much better balanced in the hand (Thank God).

2. EVF is great, especially for an old fella like me who needs to put his glasses on to see the LCD properly.

3. The EVF Detail combined with the Focus Assist effectively means you have two settings for the peaking if you need it, as it's much more pronounced with EVF DTL on.

4. One thing that hasn't really been mentioned before, is a big improvement over the HMC 150, is the mic. input level now has 3 settings, -40 added to -50 -60.

Now if you are in a noisey room (with a band or stageshow) with a shotgun mic like a Senheiser, you have more headroom before you start distorting the mic pre-amps!


-1. The only negative so far is I also have the "Can simul record using Low Capac Slot 1" message, even though I have two new Panasonic 32 GB cards in it. I did use one of the cards in my AF100 last week, but reformated both cards in the 130 to no avail. Very annoying really!

-2. Oh yes, if only the camera could remember that you had the Focus Assist turned on when you power off and on again, it would be a much better option for us run and gun types!

-3. In simu. record mode, it won't play back any footage using the rec. check button. This is pretty poor implementation on Panasonics behalf I reckon, and sort of defeats the purpose of having Simultaneous record if you can't quickly check anything! Especially when you switch modes back from "play" to "record", you now get the "can simul rec using low Capac Slot 1" message as well!



I'm using it for a wedding tomorrow, so it will get it's first real run, but if things go to plan, there will be two EX 1's on ebay very soon, but my -3 above, really needs fixing!


Cheers,

Vaughan

[LanceOregon]

Make that 2 and a half years ago. (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=whyzpwqXixU)

But if Barry is correct that the HPX370 was the only earlier camcorder that had it, then it has only been out for a year and a half now. The HPX370 was announced in April of 2010, and I believe it started shipping that May. That is exactly a year and a half ago.

[Josh Bass]

If you can, can you tell me if this is noticeably heavier/lighter than a Canon XL2? That's what I have now. . .one thing I was looking forward to if/when I upgraded was the fact that most HD cameras (at least in the class/price range I'm considering) now are smaller/lighter than the giant XL form factor. I am definitely getting tired of handholding the XL2.

[Mike Warren]

If you can, can you tell me if this is noticeably heavier/lighter than a Canon XL2?

The XL2 is 3.5kg (7.8 lbs) including battery and lens, and the AC160 weighs about 2.4kg (5.4lbs) excluding battery, probably about 3kg with battery. People are reporting that it feels nicely balanced and not too heavy.

[Barry_Green]

The hpx300 had it too, but that's a discontinued model so I didn't think of it. Hpx300 didn't have it when it shipped; it was added a few months later but was always planned to be in it.

[Firefox39]

Vaughan,

Good luck on the wedding, please report back what your thoughts are about the 130, I would love to hear the picture quality between the 130 and Sony EX1!

[firehawk]

I would love to hear how it does at the wedding as well. I have been looking at the 130/160 for a while now and wondering if they would do well for weddings (in addition to other things).

[LanceOregon]

The XL2 is 3.5kg (7.8 lbs) including battery and lens, and the AC160 weighs about 2.4kg (5.4lbs) excluding battery, probably about 3kg with battery. People are reporting that it feels nicely balanced and not too heavy.

It works out to 5.9 lbs including the battery. It does not feel too bad at all to me. Although I just got it today, and thus have not yet had any opportunity to do any long shooting with it handheld.

I would have to think that its almost 2 lb improvement over the Canon XL2 would indeed be a noticeable improvement.

[Josh Bass]

Mine might might even weight more 'cause I'm talking about the 16x manual lens. Sorry I left that out before.

[LanceOregon]

I've got to say that the Automatic White Balance on the AC130 is superb indoors. Far, far superior to any consumer camcorders that I have ever used, including the Panasonic HDC-TM900K that I used for awhile earlier this year and way better than my current Canon Vixia GF 10. Autofocus appears to be fast and accurate, even indoors in mediocre lighting. So I give the camcorder an A+ on both AWB and Autofocus.

I think that I have got a pretty good handle on using the camcorder. I do have a volunteer event tomorrow, and I think I've got the camcorder down enough to use it on a non-paying shoot like this.

I guess that I may be old-fashioned, but I really wish that companies would always provide a full printed manual with their products. I don't know what Panasonic was thinking, to print just the short setup manual, but then only provide the rest of the docs in the second manual as an Acrobat file. The second manual is only just over 100 pages long, so that is only 50 more pieces of paper. Makes you literally have to take the camcorder to your PC to go over things.

In box opening videos for the Canon XF100, I've noticed that Canon provides a large fully printed manual for that camcorder. And it only costs $3,000, compared to $3,800 for my AC130. Heck, even my $1,400 Canon Vixia HF G10 came with a fully printed manual. So I have to give Panasonic an F on documentation, as I really prefer printed docs.

Is it only us old dudes that feel this way about having printed manuals? Or do any of the younger guys here feel that way too?

In any event, so far I am feeling very encouraged and positive about using this camcorder. I've got an audio-technica BP4029 Stereo Shotgun Microphone installed on it, and it is working very well.

A lot of what I shoot does involve covering political events. Some are partisan, and others, like this civil rights town hall, are not.

Does the ban on discussing politics in the forum also apply to posting footage that might contain any political content? If so, I may have to wait awhile to post any work. As my next two planned shoots are both political in nature.

I do shoot other types of events, so I'll eventually have some other stuff to post. In fact, I'm sure I could think of some ideas.

Is there any problem with sharing videos of pastries and candy? There is a sweets and pastry shop that I've offered to shoot some video of.

[Josh Bass]

I may be considered old at 32, but I think it is very lame not to have a printed manual. If for no other reason than having an emergency on set and needing to look something up, what if you never printed the PDF out? On the other hand, at a certain point, when you've used a camcorder, you've used a camcorder. At the professional level (or prosumer if that's your view), you pretty much find that every camera has the same controls and functions, just in slightly different places. They usually even have the same names. So chances are unless you're brand new to cameras you'll be able to find your around just fine without a manual, even having never used a given cam before. Most of the time. Until you come across the Black Smoke Muskrat Fetus item in a menu and have no idea what it does.

[firehawk]

I'm in agreement with you concerning printed manuals. I have lots of devices and cameras and some aren't used frequently , so I find myself forgetting certain things and its much easier to use a paper manual, especially in the field.
I'm 30 also so it's not just the old guys that feel this way. Maybe the old fashioned guys, lol.
That's good news to hear about the white balance and focus of the 130. I've been looking at that camera for a few months, trying to decide.

[dhardjono]

Hmc 150 versu Ac 160 -

So far i have shot 5 jobs with the 160 low lite, variable kelvin setting, 22 zoom, uncompress audio, spot focusing.double slot sd card all what i like about the ac 160
what i notice is the auto focus on the 160 it get out of focus easily compare to hmc 150 i can shoot with it on auto in a run and gun situation. Another problem it seem to be back focus problem with ac 160 in manual focus and the iris wide open i focus on the cake and zoom wide it look like it out of focus. So now i shoot manual iris and keep the iris setting to 2.0.
I do not see and problems like this in this forum so it might be my camera.
Here is the video of the out of focus.


http://vimeo.com/31741162



http://vimeo.com/31741447


Is any body getting result?

[Dstar]

My Ac160 is doing the same thing. I was shooting closeups of a face almost in full frame and I could see the AC160 was going in and out of focus???? Nothing else in the shot that the camera could try to focus on. I will try to post some video, but if this is the case that is not good..... This is the whole reason I purchased the AC160, my Sony FX1 seems to do a much better job with no problems what so ever.

[Deer Film]

I would like to hear more from others on this focus issue. This should be a different thread.

[LanceOregon]

I would like to hear more from others on this focus issue. This should be a different thread.


Yes, I would agree. This would be a good topic for a new thread.

[dhardjono]

Have you had problems in wide shot where the auto focus is hunting ?

[Dstar]

Here is the close up shot and as you can see at time :10-:11 and around :13-:14 the focus snaps in and out. I did notice on other shots that where definitely wider. I sure hope this is an easy fix. If this was not a practice shot, I would be in big trouble!!!!


http://vimeo.com/31764363

[dhardjono]

yes ic that my camera same problem, is this because the first bacth of new model camera always have some sort of glicth?

[Dstar]

I don't know? But, we have to get this sorted out. This is definitely an issue for sure. I would hate to be doing a wedding like you and have this happen to the bride and grooms face. Hopefully Jan or Barry can shed some light on this issue.

[Deer Film]

So my question, is it better to wait for the second batch? When will that be, after the first of the year? And what are you guys going to do about this? Let us know if us know if you find results.
This really "bites". Tried to use a nice PG word.
I hope panasonic talks about this, or they will loose customers.

[Dstar]

Yes, I have not contacting them yet on what they will do to resolve this. I just started to work with my Ac160 and it was obvious that it was not correct. When I saw this post I jumped on it, because now I know it is not just me or my camera. I will be contacting them tomorrow to see what is up. I am wondering if the Hpx250 has the same issue with the auto focus - meaning a lens issue- or if it is the different hardware in the camera. I will keep everyone posted. If anyone has an explanation, please let me know:cry:

[dhardjono]

i could try to bring it back but i might be getting a new same problem camera B&H policy is eather send camera to panasonic or give me a new one if there is some thing wrong with the camera it hard to prove the focusing problem cause they will check it under good evan lighting in there store so focus will work fine .

dstar on that job i use manualy focus and iris for vows and reading so only out of focus was un important stuff.

[Dstar]

Yeah, I will also contact B&H photo tomorrow. If more people expose this, they can't say it is just with your camera. Yes, I would hate to exchange for another with the same issue. There is definitely an issue with it. Keep me informed of the resolution and I will do the same. This sucks!!!

[ullanta]

Just to keep in mind... the variation in maximum Iris opening across the zoom range is a bit more drastic than in most cams (because of the long zoom!)... so I wonder if the DOF of the wider iris as one zooms out is enough to produce these effects? (The ones related to manual focus, not the ones related to autofocus!)

[Dstar]

I don't know, but I had my camera set to auto, middle zoom range, a little on the lower light side and the focus just jumps a lot. I did not move the zoom and had the camera fairly stable. My Sony did not have this issue at all. If they are advertising this as a run and gun type of event camera, it has to be a lot more stable. Otherwise, I would have just purchase an AF100 and set up all my shots.

[Deer Film]

Does it show you on the view finder the edges of the middle zoom range? Did you try other zoom options? And I viewed your video, it jumps big time out of focus, even when the card is not in the way. I am trying to figure out why it does that. There is no drastic change in colors, and you were able to repeat the mistake. I hope someone can try to match your test video to see if they get the same results. I hope hope hope you have a bad camera and not the whole batch are bad. And I hope you get a different good one.

[Dstar]

Thanks Deer Film, I hope it is just a bad camera also, I have been waiting so long to purchase this camera for my needs. I will try to do some more testing, but yeah it jumps big time.

[Vaughan Wood]

Hi Dstar,

That is a heavy hard test for an auto focus, as you have stated, the subject has poor lighting and the only two things the camera has a chance of focussing on are the sparkle in his eye, and a white card that is being held in front of him.

Notice the camera does the right thing and starts on his eyes, but the combination of several things happen that changes the auto focus:

1. He Blinks right near the start, and also moves the white card closer to the centre of the screen where it calibrates the auto focus, so the camera jumps to the white card and back several times.

2. Later he again tends to close his eyes and jump around through the shallow focus plane a bit , while again moving the white card towards the centre of screen, and again the camera changes focus to the card.

Boy, in my humble opinion it is doing a great job in really difficult circumstances here. Honestly, anyone can defeat an auto focus if you try hard enough, and this is one of those situations. Even in manual focus, I bet he's moving enough to test your focus plane, and he would be moving in and out of focus.

In your earlier shot in the church, I notice the start of the clip has a white altar in the centre of the screen, and that appears to be what the camera has focussed on.

As you pan up, the white outside light and then the overhead lights come into play, so the camera changes focus back further, and the metallic statue against the back wall comes more into focus.

This is probably much more noticeable on your new camera because it is much sharper than your HMC 150, and stands out more.

You want to try a AF100? let me tell you what happens when you pan across a dance floor with a 20mm lens on it. It looks great in the camera, bring it home and 90% of the people dancing will be out of focus, because they are not in the same (very) shallow plane of the next couple dancing. A great camera for interviews and set shots, but not much else in the live event scene.

I own Ex 1s, Af100, Hmc 150 and a AG-AC130, (yes I know, my wife's told me that all ready LOL), but I really think you should be playing around a bit more with your new camera before calling it a dud.

Just an extra thought, the AG-AC130 is the FIRST HD event camera I've ever owned with a PROPER HD image EVF. Over a million pixels, compared to 220,000 on my EX 1's.

With EVF detail and Focus Assist (peaking) you have EVERY chance of nailing focus on EVERY shot during the course of a wedding.

I know, because I used it last weekend, and it was a breeze to get focus with, both in manual and face detect modes.


Good luck,

Vaughan

[Dstar]

Hi Vaughan,
I think what is bothering me is that I have an older Sony Fx1 and it would have been stable in this situation. I have not had one issue with that camera and noticed it, but right away I noticed that the AC160 reacts to fast causing the focus to jump like this. You can buy a $300 handycam and would not notice this. If I was taking time to light perfect and set up my shots I would use my Dslr, but I purchased this as a run and gun event camera and it is making me nervous.

[dhardjono]

I agree with dstar 100 percent it should not hunt at wide angle. dtsar did you get my personal message? that i send you

[mellodeque]

Hello, i testes AC130 and AC160, so its looks ok (till now i'm using the EX1R/EX3 and HMC150 and SDT750) now time for change gear. I decided to buy 2xAC160 and 1xAF101 (160 is for rallies/adventure, AF will be for Promospots).

In my opinion AC130 have little different body material ( i mean the surface is more "matte" and the silver ring on body is also "looking" cheaper than 160/250) - anyone noticed this too ?

Sometimes i'm using SDT 750 as a timelapse camera (it have "very similiar" colours like HMC150 (when you set DigitalCinema Colour in menu) - so SDT have 1/4inch 3MOS sensor - and sharpnes of picture from this handy cam is even more detailed than EX1R (when shooting 1080 50P 28Mbit AVCHD, so if AC160 have the same type of sensor the quality must be avesome)

I decided to buy 160 becouse of prices P2Cards, and SDI-HD output (when you need you can use for ex. Samurai Recorder for 4:2:2)

For now i only tested this new cams in shop, so now is the time for field-test - i'm waiting for demo cam from dealer.

I also heard from our dealer, that the panasonic will relase soon firmware upgrage for Ac160 - upgrade for record audio/video in full 1080 50P - if that's true - the quality will be better than now.

(sorry for my english)
/regards
/Mell