Listen up!! All HVX suppliers...

[Ajit AP]

This camera could be an incredible hit, the only drawback could be the pricey P2 cards (I would rent them but not buy them). So I know many of these companies have set off making firewire drives that will try to replace P2 cards.

Here is what I suggest they consider:

1) Something not too big, something that can fit underneath the camera like the way the old xlr input device fit under the Sony vx1000 (between the cam and the tripod).
2) A simple knob (preferrable) or a button to record.
3) Critical: There has to be a hold button, very similar to what you have in MP3 devices or an ipod. This has to be included, you cannot NOT feature this. Period.
4) A little display indicating status, LED is fine. One color to say it is recording, one to say stand-by and one to say it is attached to computer. The record LED starts to blink faster and faster as it approaches the end. If you would like to be fancy then:
4b) A little display of timecode and other information, like or better than the FireStore.
5) It would be great if it could derive its power from the same battery the Panasonic uses. (This would be way cool but) Atleast have the power come from a mobile source. We don't mind gadgets hanging off us, it makes us look good but do not get in the way of the shooting by having wires hanging to the ground and me possibly trip over them, break my face and sue you. You don't want that!!
6) If, if possible please pake the drive very similar to P2 device, no moving parts. LISTEN UP IOMEGA, here is your chance you already have the technology, please don't screw us like you have earlier. The Rev with its 35gig could be used here, I am not sure about the write speed (they promise 20-25mb), so if someone would like to comment on, it would be very helpful.
7) Tiimecode is really important, no drop frames please.

FireStore FS-4 is a wonderful device but it needs to be integrate into the camera like I have discribed above. It needs to be less buttonny and more knobby. 5400rpm is too slow and frankly I think a drive with no moving parts will win my cash, it is just so much more reliable. Firestore has promised better disk speed and they will deliver, most likely, before the Pana comes out.

There is a lot of money to be had. If you sell such a device say 60 gig for about $700, you will sell about 2 for every Panasonic sold and probably other camera's as well. That is a lot of money to be had. Please get cracking.

POV of an independent filmmaker

[Neil Rowe]

..i think theres some serious misunderstanding of how P2 works here.
..the P2 doesnt handle the recording functions , it simply gets written to by the camera.

in order to replace P2 you would only need a drive that runs of the pcmcia slot and has the data trasfer rate and any compatible hardcoding/firmware and compatable security setup that the P2 cards have.

you dont need the drive itself to give you all the readouts or displays , the camera does that. your currently asking the equivelent of a hard drive manufacturer to make a hard drive with readout to tell you what its doing... which is not needed becuase you find that out by looking at the computer that is running the drive.

[Ajit AP]

..i think theres some serious misunderstanding of how P2 works here.
..the P2 doesnt handle the recording functions , it simply gets written to by the camera.

in order to replace P2 you would only need a drive that runs of the pcmcia slot and has the data trasfer rate and any compatible hardcoding/firmware and compatable security setup that the P2 cards have.

you dont need the drive itself to give you all the readouts or displays , the camera does that. your currently asking the equivelent of a hard drive manufacturer to make a hard drive with readout to tell you what its doing... which is not needed becuase you find that out by looking at the computer that is running the drive.
Hi,
HUH? I know P2 is a recording device. When did I state that it controlled recording functions. What I listed was a substitution for P2 that worked out like a stream through firewire or something like Andromeda stream (without the fix).
What I am suggesting or like to see is that I need a hard drive without a computer. The camera cannot possibly display the information of the drive. Like how much time is left on the drive, the camera would not be able to display the status of that so a display on the drive would be needed. What is so confusing?

[Dmitry Kichenko]

I wouldn't say you're suggesting. More like demanding. Let's hope you're heard.

[scharky]

why do you not think the camera will not be able to display the time and other info of the drive? It seems like it could do that with the P2 card, so why not any other device driven though the P2 slot?

[mmm]

I agree with scharky... whether the hard drive is connected via the P2 slot or Firewire. These are both 2-way interfaces and so the capability is definitely there to make the camera display all the info about the drive, right on the LCD. Remaining time, battery etc.. The camera could also control the drive, ie record using the camera's normal button. This way the drive would need no buttons at all.

BUT... I don't know if Panasonic has designed the HVX200 to have this function , lets hope so!! It should only be a software issue and possibly could be upgraded.

What I would like to see is a hard-wearing (unlike an ipod), black box that I can stick in my pocket and connect via firewire or P2 that acts exactly like a P2 card. I would hope that the attachment to the camera was also secure as it would be a pain if it pulled out during shooting! Capacity could easily be 100Gb for $1000... but I doubt it will be yet. An 60Gb ipod photo is only $450 and that is far more complex than this needs to be.

[pkendall]

just get the cards and the p2 store. it's not worth all the headache. the cables and extra batteries, etc... it's HD. it's supposed to cost us money now.. it will get cheaper..

[BigMike]

This camera could be an incredible hit, the only drawback could be the pricey P2 cards (I would rent them but not buy them). So I know many of these companies have set off making firewire drives that will try to replace P2 cards.
Go to this thread:

http://www.dvxuser.com/V6/showthread.php?t=40521

[xray]

This camera could be an incredible hit, the only drawback could be the pricey P2 cards

I just think the flash memorycards are to pricey and they are going down!
This is about what I read today.

Hynix Semiconductor and Samsung Electronics both the biggest maker of memory chips (with Toshiba) projected a more than 25 percent and 20 percent fall in the price of flash memory during the 1st 3 months of this year.

As demand for popular digital cameras and MP3 players is going down, prices of NAND flash memory have fallen. Now the steep drop in price stops, but Hynix thinks the NAND chip prices would drop about 50 percent in 2006.

read it yourself at http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/business/4824628.stm

[MarcusX]

just get the cards and the p2 store. it's not worth all the headache. the cables and extra batteries, etc... it's HD. it's supposed to cost us money now.. it will get cheaper..

And that took you 11 months to write? :shocked:

[P2metoo]

P2 is costly absolutly but it is better reliable and quite. You get what you pay for. I dont understand why people always trying to redsign what manufacture spends million dollars on to design. Nobody ever appreciate the camera and its value they always go for unreliable nosiy and so cheap hard drive. Why would some one jepordise the time and money put in to the project by saving less then $3000 dollars. THis to me sound like penny saver and doller looser.
Sorry to get pissed of but every other day some wants dum HardDisk so he can shoot for a whole day without any hassel and for $200. He is the only one who figure this out. At the end of the day he droped his Hard disk and oops all gone.
FInally panny cameout with the solution which is reliable and asking price for it nobody wants to pay. everyone wants to make money but nobody wants to share it with Panny.
Get over with the 50 hour of continous recording I think it is a stupid way of doing it. There are more and more people shooting smart then just roll beacuse it is cheap. Forget the tape and forget the hard disk. NAND memory is also becoming fast popular learn on Panny and it will be usefull in the future instead of using dumb disk for recording 50 hours.
I have seen people shooting 50 Hours smart shoot with P2 reliable and fast. Its a new way of doing thing learn it instead of going back to HARD DISK.
MY head stopped SPINNING may be I hit the Floor.:Drogar-BigGrin(DBG)

[xray]

"I have seen people shooting 50 Hours smart shoot with P2 reliable and fast. Its a new way of doing thing learn it instead of going back to HARD DISK."

Thanks to Apple and the ipod, flash memory is getting cheaper, P2 4 gig cards today are still 3.8 x the memoryprice. And you always go to harddisk at the end. So spinning heads there you go..

[Doc Holliday]

I think the argument is valid for a large capacity hard drive. I don't think many people have dropped their cameras. (hd would be on camera.) Most of the work I do is run and gun, not set up, and not ENG. More for magazine style or documentary. If I am covering an unfolding event/ whatever, it is MUCH more convenient to have a drive that lasts more than 4-10 min. I often shoot 5+ hour in a day and I cannot always afford a pa to swap/ dump, etc. I think hd is a valid option.