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Boon
05-25-2011, 09:57 AM
I was about to order a Ninja but realize there isn't a HDMI out from the Ninja. I was thinking of looping the Ninja to a 7 inch monitor. So with only one HDMI output from the FS100, I supposed I either have to buy a monitor with a HDMI loop-thru or a external recorder with one. My present monitor doesn't have a HDMI loop-thru.

Another concern is whether the loop-thru HDMI connector in monitor and recorder are all of good quality. I would think it's safer to pass the signal from the camera to the recorder and then to the monitor.

The other solution is to use a HDMI splitter instead, but I would rather not add another box and power supply to the rig.

Any suggestions?

Rick Burnett
05-25-2011, 10:10 AM
I was about to order a Ninja but realize there isn't a HDMI out from the Ninja. I was thinking of looping the Ninja to a 7 inch monitor. So with only one HDMI output from the FS100, I supposed I either have to buy a monitor with a HDMI loop-thru or a external recorder with one. My present monitor doesn't have a HDMI loop-thru.

Another concern is whether the loop-thru HDMI connector in monitor and recorder are all of good quality. I would think it's safer to pass the signal from the camera to the recorder and then to the monitor.

The other solution is to use a HDMI splitter instead, but I would rather not add another box and power supply to the rig.

Any suggestions?

Given that HDMI is digital, I myself wouldn't be worried. The only real issue I have with HDMI is the connector. I've had wires pop out before. They make some locking HDMI cables, which what *locking* means I am not sure, but I plan on investing in some. I will be in the same boat as you as my LCD only has 1 port as well. I've also contemplated an HDMI to SDI converter box since I do have pass through SDI on my LCD and I could get the samurai when it comes out.

olindacat
05-25-2011, 11:10 AM
I've also contemplated an HDMI to SDI converter box since I do have pass through SDI on my LCD and I could get the samurai when it comes out.
Only prob is Samurai doesn't record 1080p60, at least according to specs, Rick. (I was looking at that too.)

Rick Burnett
05-25-2011, 11:16 AM
Ahh, didn't know that. Well I guess that throws that out.

cheezweezl
05-25-2011, 11:54 AM
Nothing records 1080p/60 in the price range of the ninja, samurai, ki pro, pix, etc. Only the really high end recorders do it, and you need dual link or 3G SDI from the camera for it to work. So it looks like no 1080p/60 external recording is possible from the FS100. I am getting an external recorder for mine. I just bought the ki pro mini but I may return it and get the pix240. My solution for slow motion is just to go 720p/60 on the camera and have the recorder do an uprez in realtime to 1080p. I know it's not the ideal solution but I think it's the best possible one for recording externally.

imag
05-25-2011, 12:09 PM
I can't believe external 60p recording is a deal killer for most people.

Bloom's ice footage with this camera was shot at *60i* and it certainly looks far from horrible: http://vimeo.com/22911903

Shooting at 60p, even with the internal data rate and compression, can't be THAT bad. I can't imagine letting the quality difference govern which recorder I buy unless I was doing entire projects in slo mo. I certainly can't imagine it driving me to purchase a recorder that costs as much as the camera.

imag
05-25-2011, 12:15 PM
Nothing records 1080p/60 in the price range of the ninja, samurai, ki pro, pix, etc. Only the really high end recorders do it, and you need dual link or 3G SDI from the camera for it to work. So it looks like no 1080p/60 external recording is possible from the FS100. I am getting an external recorder for mine. I just bought the ki pro mini but I may return it and get the pix240. My solution for slow motion is just to go 720p/60 on the camera and have the recorder do an uprez in realtime to 1080p. I know it's not the ideal solution but I think it's the best possible one for recording externally.

So you would shoot in 720p and capture externally instead of capturing internally at 1060p? I can't imagine that the resulting footage would be better that way. Isn't higher quality footage the whole point of external recording? What am I missing?

cheezweezl
05-25-2011, 01:43 PM
So you would shoot in 720p and capture externally instead of capturing internally at 1060p? I can't imagine that the resulting footage would be better that way. Isn't higher quality footage the whole point of external recording? What am I missing?

actually i should have been clearer about this. i was only referring to my solution when external recording is a MUST. i'm mainly referring to greenscreen work. in this case, i think uprezzed 720 prores would key much nicer than any flavor of avc. i imagine that for most situations, i would record 1080p/60 slow motion to the SD card and transcode to prores. of course this theory will only be proven once i get the camera and do some tests. it will be a tradeoff of resolution vs. quality. we shall see which one prevails...

Rick Burnett
05-25-2011, 02:04 PM
actually i should have been clearer about this. i was only referring to my solution when external recording is a MUST. i'm mainly referring to greenscreen work. in this case, i think uprezzed 720 prores would key much nicer than any flavor of avc. i imagine that for most situations, i would record 1080p/60 slow motion to the SD card and transcode to prores. of course this theory will only be proven once i get the camera and do some tests. it will be a tradeoff of resolution vs. quality. we shall see which one prevails...

I used to be in this though process, till I got an AF100 and did green screen work on it. Surprisingly, 4:2:0 isn't as big an issue as I had feared. Having mixed 720p and 1080p on the last project I worked on, I want to keep everything 1080p. I could see the quality difference very easily.

imag
05-25-2011, 02:20 PM
Ah - okay. There is at least a method to the madness. I understand.

As for the OP's conundrum - I am wondering the same thing. I was thinking about getting a Samurai for the larger monitor and loop-through capacity, but now I see it *only* has an SDI input. That's a bummer.

cheezweezl
05-25-2011, 02:43 PM
I used to be in this though process, till I got an AF100 and did green screen work on it. Surprisingly, 4:2:0 isn't as big an issue as I had feared. Having mixed 720p and 1080p on the last project I worked on, I want to keep everything 1080p. I could see the quality difference very easily.

this sounds promising. although there are a lot of people shooting greenscreen with dslr's claiming that they key just fine. i know this to be not true, at least to what my standards of "fine" are. i do a lot of post in addition to shooting so i am a bit of a snob when it comes to keying. although, the ex1, which is a 4:2:0 cam, actually keys pretty well. so if the avc compression doesn't screw up whatever magic sony has going, then it could be ok...

still, for shooting normal 1080/24p stuff, i will still go external if nothing more for the convenience of editing right away with no transcode needed. plus, the external recorder can generate files that are post friendly, complete with timecode, reel #, etc.

Rick Burnett
05-25-2011, 02:50 PM
I've shot with the 7D enough to know that sometimes yes, most times no. The Chroma aliasing is the biggest problem I have with 4:2:0 from the 7D. The GH2/GH1 I have not keyed so I cannot say. But given what I have seen of FS100 footage I have downloaded, I feel confident that it should key well from the pixel peeping I have done :)