looking for a field mixer

[XDeathOrGloryX]

hey, its about time there was an audio board. =P

i was just wondering if anyone had any suggestions for a 3 or 4 channel field mixer. the company i work for uses the Wendt X4's and i love them but i believe they are a bit pricey, around $2500.

the Wendt 2 channel mixers have really ridiculous LED light audio meters, and i HATE them. i prefer the VU meters with the little needles.

i know a lot of people use the Shure 3 channel mixers, but ive never touched one myself.

just wondering if anyone knew of any other good brands/products for field mixing. or if anyone knew of a good store/site with low prices on their mixers. thanks

daniel

[Barry_S]

I think the absolute nicest 3 channel field mixer is the Sound Devices 302 mixer. *It's compact, bombproof, and the guys who designed have thought of everything as far as features. *Runs about $1200.

http://www.sounddevices.com/products/302master.htm

They also sell a great 4 channel mixer-- the 442 for $2500.

They both have LED meters, but they work great--not sure why you wouldn't like them. *Needle type meters are not great for knocking around in the field--they're delicate and I'm not fond of when they get pinned and you have flick the things with your finger.

The Shure FP33 is justly popular as well for a 3 channel EFP/ENG mixer, but at the same price I'd take the 302 without a second thought. *

PSC make a 3 channel--the M3. *Haven't used it, but they're a good company. *The Wendts you mentioned--solid stuff.

Just go and try the Sound Devices 302 before you make a decision--I'll be surprised if you get anything else after you try it.

[XDeathOrGloryX]

thanks a ton Barry. ill definately be checking it out. =)

[oleg]

hey, its about time there was an audio board. =P

i was just wondering if anyone had any suggestions for a 3 or 4 channel field mixer. the company i work for uses the Wendt X4's and i love them but i believe they are a bit pricey, around $2500.

the new wendt is around 1650$ , very nice mixer if you taking one ask for one with pick meeters


the Wendt 2 channel mixers have really ridiculous LED light audio meters, and i HATE them. i prefer the VU meters with the little needles.
better then all other 2 channels , the leds are wonderful for day use and night ass well , they programmed as uv mitter
and that is the only bad thing since uv (ussless valius) are dont tell you what is going with your level , this is averege valiusand even it shou you your evereg level is ok they dont show any picks which destroy your sound , the uv is good for mastering when you check your loudness , not more



i know a lot of people use the Shure 3 channel mixers, but ive never touched one myself.

dont touch if you dont have to , the eary models very noicy (31,32) dont have 48 v phantom power and abillity to jump from mix to return
the 32a have alot of problems with potansiomerers
the 33 is good but not even close to sd-302

the 302 has adjasteble line level output so you can feed the camera with -10dbv level signal(thats what the dvx like) for better sn ad less distortion on your inputs
it has adjusteble limmiter on outs and input limmiter on each channel.
you can monitor each side , ms or mono and the returns of your camera
the 302 can display pick ,uv or both
the return socket can work as additional 2 line inputs so actually you can record from 5 sources ,
extrimly light
well desighned
exellent quality headphone amplifier
lo cut filters
run on 3 aa bats or ext power 6-18 v so actually you can power it from your dvx batterias
the petrol case is the best for this one (i desighned it so it works :-))






just wondering if anyone knew of any other good brands/products for field mixing. or if anyone knew of a good store/site with low prices on their mixers. thanks
for new and used equip check

www. coffeysound .com in la
orwww. trewaudio.com

oleg

daniel

[Student]

I was just wondering, why I could'nt use a standard mixer like a Mackie or Berhinger. They are not battery operated,
but is that really the main difference. This type of mixer can be had for under $100 (US) at Guitar Center or any music store that sells pro audio equipment. I use one for mixing a keyboard with vocals and it sounds great. It has a all the outputs needed to go stright into the DVX.

[Barry_S]

Sure, you can use any sort of mixer you like. However, a unit like the Sound Devices 302 is designed specifically as a portable compact field production mixer. It has some very versatile features for mixing sound on location. An inexpensive mixer may be ok, but it will definitely have less features, build quality, and shoddy meters. Also, a cheap mixer may have noisy mic pre-amps. You can always test it and see if it suits you.

[oleg]

a) no battery power so it doesnt work on shoulder doesnt work outside ( invertor +car battry broken back - 350$
b) no phantom power (48v)( another box 130 $
c) no limmiters 200$
d) no normal headphone monitoring 100$

did you ever heare good mike with 100$ mixer full open preamp , not pa with screaming artist ?
there is no such a thing 100$ mixer for film work ( maybe if you buy it hot)
the clos you can get is 500-600 mackie with some modification amd some extra gran around
good mixer strip cost about 300-1000 for chanel ,depends on what you are looking for quality and friendlinnes of the gear

[Barry_S]

Amazingly, there are some cheap mixers that include 48V pantom power and can be run off batteries.

http://www.bhphotovideo.com/bnh/controller/home?O=productlist&A=details&Q=&sku=245582&is=REG

Like you Oleg, I'd be mighty suspicious of the quality of the mic pre's. The pots will also probably be noisy and as you mention, the headpone monitoring options are not very good and there's no limiter. Still, it's worth testing if student has one laying around.

[oleg]

o.k you catch me :-)
but the phantom power is only 18 v in battery mod (its looks that comes directly from 2 x9v ) so no good for nummans , zens , sankens and all others which not run 12-48v
the mike pres are better then nothing :-)

i tried this one year ago , worked as additional line and headphones disterbutor only ,
the actual life with ph on on batteries is 3 hours
the mitter is offol
the abillity to work with faders is problematic becouse the pots


very good for students which ruine equp its only 100$ you dont fix it just buy another one :-)
i have sugestion and dont louf :-)
check if you can find old umatic 150 sp even with no video head
for 200or less you have pres with some character and dc power and 48 ph
student or no student desent gear is nesseory to jage the true

[Student]

Thanks for your response guys.
The mixer I'm testing is a
Behringer - Eurorack MX802a
It has 4 mic ins with 48v preamps
2 stereo inputs
it does have aux sends and return for a limiter/compressor if needed. The meter is a LED type not that great but will let me know when a clip is near.
It has a 1/4" balance output, with pots and a metal case
The headphone output is ok but lacks some detail.
Its not portable and the preamp is nothing to brag about - but I'm amazed by the low noise and quality of sound for a 99 dollar mixer.
I think it could be handy to have around if you find yourself with a lot of audio sources and just one dvx to go to.

[Terry_Lasater]

I don't know anything about that mixer, but I've certainly spent $99 on production gear that did less. ;)

[Unclemort]

If you guys are going to shoot live bands and need a portable pro rig w/ EQ and XLR's the Marantz CDR 300 Recorder looks great! I'm sure it would work really well in most situations [non-music as well] sells for $699 [street] + $169 for Solid battery rig and charger! Has anyone tried it!

[Tom_Borg]

Hi!!
I wonder if the 302 is the best option regarding the high pass filter feature to reduce wind?
I use an at835b wiht a rycote 24cm Softie windshield (as the budget wasnt enough for the Rycote Modular windshield kit :( if i were to get also a mixer) . But to read about the high pass filter of the sound device mixer makes me wonder if this feature may be of help to my shooting conditions. Of how much wind am i talking? Well, if i leave a plastic on the ground, it will fly away.
So, i have heard the wind noise althoug i have the softie windshield.... :(..but:

is the high pass filter of the Sound DEviece Mixer 302 enough to try to patch my windshield limitations?
What about the 2 channel option of the same model?
Any other model which could be better for my specific problem and at the same time as good quality as the Sound Device (and neither more expensive) ?
Maybe ther is one kind of accesory or extra filter which one can buy for such situations if the high pass filter isnt enough good.......Any ideas or comments will be much apreciated :)

[oleg]

the hi pass filter *on the mixer dont have any thing with your wind problem ,
better mike protection will slow the hits *and low friqvency overover your mike , if your mike have lo cut filter that sits befor the mike preamp *, open it and the lows will not overload your camera preamp, if not *40 $ barrel with lo cut would do the same job .( if i remember corectly yje lc on the mike is 150hz 12 db per octav so it alittle bit hard for my tast )
good zeppelin or even the less good :-) ( cavision ) with furry over it and 80=100 hp filter befor the camera or mixer preamp will do *it .the 302 has 80 and 160 if *Barry_S *remember correctly :-) ,( sorry i dont own that one *i have the *442 ) and it sits befor the preamp stage to prevent overloading

[Barry_S]

Tom--you're much better off taking care of the problem before you get to the point of needing to filter and EQ your audio. I returned a Rycote Softie because I wasn't happy with the performance in a moderate wind. I bought a Lightwave Equalizer and it does a significantly better job than the Softie. If you sold the Softie, you could buy the Equalizer for a minimum outlay of cash.

The 302 does have a high-pass filter, but there are definite limits to it's usefulness if you're dealing with serious wind noise. The 302's filter cutoff can be set at 80Hz or 160Hz, which is fine for some rumbly stuff, but wind noise can easily go above those cutoffs. You can also experiment with building your own zeppelin, if money is an issue. Bottom line--you need better wind protection for your mic. The mixer is a separate issue.

[Axel_M]

What's the difference between a Lightwave Equalizer and a Softie? They llooks the same on B&H's product descriptions.

How is a Zeppelin with Windjammer compared with a Lightwave Equalizer ?

Is the main difference between Sound Devices 302 and Mix Pre only the number of inputs?

I am grateful for answers of these questions :)

Axel_M

[oleg]

the lightwave have space between the mike and the shild thas what doing the wind bamps less problematic , the rycote is furry that sits over the foam so the wind problem is much nottible
for your second question -much better

the biggest difference detween the mix pre and 302 it have another input :-)

but really the 302 is much better product - better mittering (uv+pick mitters or combination between them), better separation on meeter mike and line inputs (mike only)
mike and line outs (line only)
ajasteble level out on 302 , and that is very critical when you work with consumer eqweip , the dvx will live much better with -12 dbv level out then with +4dbu
input and output limmiters (ajastble from 0-20db)-- output only on mix pre 10-18 db
ms matrix for stereo mikes that not exist on mix pre
beter monitoring (l,r,m,st ,ms )
can work as 5 input mixer threw return bus (only line -10 but it good then nothing)
bus input and output for another mixer extantion(2 302 is 6 inputs )
better powering option, with 302 you can work withli-ion 14.4 v battes

302 cost twice then the mix pre but it worth every dollar
the mix pre is anice extention for 302 or 442 or cooper or every other field
mixer, but very limmiting in normal work
between the 2 channels its not my first choice ,the wendt x2 is better (imo)
but then there is only 300$ more for the 302 :-)

[Terry_Lasater]

Damn! I just bought a Softie for my ME-66 from EVS. I live in Oklahoma... where the wind comes sweepin' down the plain.

Should I expect less than stellar results with it outdoors in winds that regularly gust to 35MPH on any given day?

If the Lightwave is that much better, then perhaps a call to Rush may be in order... to exchange my order. ;D

[oleg]

for 50 km in hour wind the full rycote is probably the best solution. if its on camera mike so it might be the best ,even i didnt compere it with lightwave mini screan ad fury over it

[Rush]

Hey Terry, let me know if you need an RMA for the softie. We are expecting 10 of the miniscreens soon.

[Sumfun]

Any body tried the DV Promix3 from Professional Sound? It got a good review in DV Magazine (June 2004), and only costs $500.