Pro Studio Monitors?

[DVX100Shooter]

I posted this question in the NLE section of this site and NOBODY responded to me so I am hoping someone in here has some insight. *
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I want to get some good monitors for editing my videos and arranging music. I have heard good things about the MACKIE HR series but they are pretty expensive (HR824 $1,000 a pair or 659.95 each). What are some other speakers to consider? Again my main use is for monitoring the audio while editing Music Videos, Short Films, and arranging music to be used in various productions. *
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Thanks * * * * * * * * * * * * *

[Barry_S]

Good studio monitors are expensive--unfortunately :-(. I keep getting recommendations for the Genelec 1029a ($1K/pr) or 1030a ($2K/pr). Both are out of my budget range for the moment and I'd like to start doing some good 5.1 mixes, so I'm still looking. I have heard good things about the M-Audio LX4 5.1 system. It's only $450 or so. You can also get the LX4 in a 2.1 configuration and while it won't be in the Genelec class, it may be ok.

[ullanta]

Many factors affect your choice of monitors; that's why replies are slow, I suppose. One of the most important factors is your room and setup. Huge monitors in a small room, or close to your head, will be bad. Small monitors far away in a giant room will be bad. Where and how you place your monitors is often more important than monitor choice.

If you're in a small room, and close up, some of the smaller, cheaper nearfield monitors from Event, Alesis, M-Audio, Roland, JBL, etc., could be optimal. Definitely don't buy any sub-5" models, but in the 5-6" range you may do well. Again, placement is critical with close, small speakers... you want 'em angled in two corners of an equilateral triangle with your head as the third corner.

What's a small room, or close up? I'd say, if the monitors are within 5 or 6 feet of your head.

In a larger room/setup, you'll want to go larger; but I'll let someone else handle that... I don't have much room...

-Barry

[DVX100Shooter]

Yea my set up is in a small room and the speakers would be in a 3-4 foot range from my head.

[MIDIMan]

I just replaced an old pair of Alesis Monitor Ones last month. I really liked the Mackies, but the budget just wasn't there. After listening to nearly a dozen different monitors, I wound up purchasing a pair of Event TR-6s for $399. The low end is a bit week, but they have a very smooth frequency response over 100hz. They are powered, and have plenty of juice for my small room.

The best thing you can do is go to your local music store and listen to several sets of monitors. Bring a CD that you are familiar with so you can hear the tonal differences between the different monitors.

MIDIMan

[Possu]

Yamaha NS 10 is very good choice for close-field studio monitors when example Genelec active monitors are too expensive. They are suitable even quite small room
Almost every recording studio in the world has a pair of these two monitors: Yamaha NS 10 or Genelecs.
I think nowadays you can find Yamaha NS 10 monitors quite cheap as well. Also second hand monitors might be a good choice.

[joachim]

I am using JBL Control 1 for years now and find them quite analytical but still not tiring when listening for long periods.
You can add the Control SB1 Subwoofer to give the system
a bit more punch in bass.

And the SB1 under your desk makes for an excellent footrest (including massage functions when cranking up the volume).

[kai]

Yamaha NS 10 is very good choice for close-field studio monitors when example Genelec active monitors are too expensive. They are suitable even quite small room
Almost every recording studio in the world has a pair of these two monitors: Yamaha NS 10 or Genelecs.
I think nowadays you can find Yamaha NS 10 monitors quite cheap as well. Also second hand monitors might be a good choice.

NS10's are in most studios because back in the day Yamaha gave them out for free to many big studios. Very smart marketing move on their part, because now they're seen as "the standard"... even though they don't sound incredible.

That said, I currently use the Mackie 824's, and they're great! I've also used Genelec with great results, as well as Meyer in big rooms.

[Barry_S]

Interesting. I looked at the auctions for NS10's on eBay and the prices seemed way inflated for some beat-up speakers. I've also heard a lot about the Mackie 824's, but at $1400/pair they should be outstanding. It would be nice to hear about some more sub $500 solutions.

[DVX100Shooter]

I agree on the Mackie's! Everyone I talk to that works in Music or Video recommends the Mackie's. They also told me to look at the Tanoy's and Event monitors as well. I noticed that Sam Ash is having a sale on monitors www.samash.com

$1200 for those Mackie 824's I think is a bit much for what I would need the monitor for which is Video Editing. I just have a small set up in my Den at home. For the time being, I use my $100 headphones to monitor audio.

[Bischofftep]

I use a pair of M-Audio powered reference speakers and love them. One slight drawback is that they have a very narrow "sweet spot" when close by (your 3-4 foot range) and if you move a little from that spot you get major variation in the sound. Beyond that, they're fantastic!

[DVX100Shooter]

Any thoughts on the Behringer Truth B2031 Powered Monitors? I have been reading good reviews on them.

[Barry_S]

Well I was decided to drop in and browse a bit at my local Guitar Center (what a trip that store is) and I spied a pair of used Event TR6's for $125 each. It looks like someone bought them and returned them without even using them or maybe lightly using them for a short time. I auditioned them and they sounded good, but if you've ever been in a GC you'll know there's a lot of ambient noise on a Saturday afternoon :). I have to wait 18 days to pick them up because Maryland law requires a 30-day hold on used equipment (to allow for theft recovery), so I've still got a little time to audition some more monitors. However, for the price, I haven't found anything comparable so far. I auditioned some less expensive Mackies and the had a very detailed midrange, but very little low of high end. Thanks to everyone for turning me on to the Events--I hadn't been aware of them until this post. I will let everyone know how they work out for me after I've used them for awhile. Even new, they're only $200 each so they might be a good sub $500 choice.

[Dan_Lahav]

Any thoughts on the Behringer Truth B2031 Powered Monitors? I have been reading good reviews on them.

good question...anyone care to comment?

[hemophilia]

For what it's worth... to preface my comments... I've worked as a professional recording engineer in a couple different studios for years. When it came time to buy my own cheap-o pair of monitors for my home set-up I went with the Alesis m1 mkII actives.

http://www.musiciansfriend.com/srs7/sid=040621101951200141107198703445/g=home/search/detail/base_pid/603203/

I got them for $360 new. They sound very very good. No they don't sound quite as good as the mackies... but they sound better than anything else in the price range. I originally was thinking about the Behringer Truths... or generally something with a bigger woofer than the Alesis (like one of the Events). I had heard some of the original Alesis M1s a long time ago... and they sounded like garbage as far as I'm concerned, so it actually took me a lot of convincing to even consider their new ones (and in general I haven't been impressed by Alesis products). But after listening to the Alesis against the Truths and the Events in a couple different rooms, I was pretty surprised by how good they sounded, and how nice their bottom-end was despite their small profile. I guess it's a case of a better-but-smaller speaker sounding better than a larger-but-crappier speaker. I felt like the Alesis sounded better than anything short of the Mackies, and given the price difference that's pretty impressive.

Granted-- picking a pair of monitors is a VERY subtle business. The whole point here is that studio monitors are designed to have a flat, uncolored response (so if they're doing their job right they SHOULD sound amazingly similar to each other). But the Alesis consistently sounded a notch above, even in the bottom-end where I was pretty amazed at what a clean low-frequencies these things could put out.

Oh and they sound WAY better than those damn ns10s. No subtle business about it... their are much much better monitors out these days than NS10s for way le$$.

Pick up a good pair of headphones too. The best audio monitoring set-up is to have a couple DIFFERENT set-ups and cross-reference. The Sennheiser HD 580s are the bomb-diggy:

http://www.sweetwater.com/store/detail/HD580/

For mixing they're great. Aside from having fantastic sound, they're open-air and just about the most comfortable things on the planet, so you can wear them all day and night (which sadly is often the case). Being open-air they're sorta crap worthless for field recording though. So I guess if you're just gonna have one pair of good headphones it makes more sense to buy something that is more all-around like the popular Sony MDR-7506, or a Sennheiser closed-back pair. But I just had to say a good thing or two about the HD-580 b/c for sitting around mixing for hours on end you couldn't ask for anything better.

I'm rambling. Sorry I'll shut-up now. :P

[DVX100Shooter]

I went ahead and ordered some Behringer Truth B2301's last week. I hooked them up over the weekend and they sound really good.

[boo]

ok i know these aren't pro speakers but anyone have any experience w/ the bose companion 3? i'm limited in desk space...thanks...

[DVX100Shooter]

you can always mount your speakers on the wall or get speaker stands since you don't have much desk space.

[boo]

i don't have room space either... :-/

[DVX100Shooter]

You should okay with Bose...they make good products.

[Barry_Green]

Most audiophiles would tend to disagree. Bose spends an absolute fortune on advertising, but apparently not so much on actual r&d and quality, according to dozens of threads. When I was shopping for a home-theater system, I was surprised to read so much anti-Bose chatter... basically people are saying you'll pay two to three times as much, and get lower-quality/mediocre-performing stuff.

So, do some homework before going with Bose, and definitely listen with your own ears. If you like it, buy it, but don't buy it just because they spend a lot on advertising...

[David Jimerson]

I second and third that. You pay a premium for the Bose hype, and "inferior" speakers like JBL and Yamaha sound better. I was where Barry was, too, and Bose was taken off the list veeeeery early.

[hemophilia]

Bose is garbage. 90% of their products are just terrible in my opinion. Most of their bookshelf speakers and the like don't hold up to the competition not even by a long-shot.

Yes their 'wave-radio' things put out the best perceived sound from anything out of that small a profile. To Bose's credit that's exactly the product that a lot of people want-- an incredibly small profile system that sounds solid. But that has nothing to do with what you should be looking for out of a pair of reference monitors. GOD FORBID you try to mix anything on Bose stuff and have it hold up on other systems.

I have never once seen a pro studio or even a serious home/project set-up that ever had a bose speaker anywhere in it. There's a reason for that.

My rich friends that have a grand piano in their living room that no one knows how to play (just because a grand piano looks so nice in the room)... they have Bose speakers.

[boo]

so do you guys have any recommendations for decent sounding speakers for limied desk space? thanks...

[s-audio]

A pair of tannoy 6.5's would work well and there not expensive.
The biggest problem with smaller monitors is they do not represent the low end frequencies very well.

[booggerg]

I recommend Behringer Truths Actives.. they are inexpensive and should be more than adequate for our NLE needs.

[DVX100Shooter]

yea my Behringher Truth's sound nice except for the hum that I posted about in here.

[booggerg]

I had hum.. barely audible hum, when I stuck my ear to the bass driver. That was when I had RCAs going out of my M-Audio card directly into the speakers. Since then, I have a Yamaha MG10/2 mixer between the card and the speakers. I made sure to coil up excess wiring and placed them away from the wires behind the PC. the hum has since completely dissapeared. I don't know what factors contributed to this fix though...

[Josicleverson]

Do you wanna feel like George Lucas mixing in THX???
Then you must buy the B&W Nautilus 802!!!
Just US$8000... Really cheap, isn't it ;D

[skippyfetus]

How do headphones compare to a good set of studio monitors for those who are trying to save a few bucks or save up for a nice pair of monitors? I actually don't mind wearing headphones and it has the added avantage of getting rid of ambient noise. Are there any monitoring headphones that are comparable to a nice set of monitors?

[skippyfetus]

For example, what about these:
http://www.bhphotovideo.com/bnh/controller/home?O=productlist&A=details&Q=&sku=129992&is=REG

or these:
http://www.bhphotovideo.com/bnh/controller/home?O=productlist&A=details&Q=&sku=93021&is=REG

[Barry_S]

Headphones are not optimal for doing mixes because they bias the way you hear sounds in relation to loudspeakers. Something might sound detailed and up front in headphones, but could very well be buried in the mix and lost when you play back through speakers.

[skippyfetus]

Ok, that makes sense, but those AKG headphones are supposed to not color the sound:

"This standard specifies for a "diffuse field" equalization curve that provides headphone listeners with the sound pattern and characteristic of a room with reflective non-anechoic surfaces"

"Acoustic ventilation for uncolored sound"

Does that make any significant difference?

[Barry_S]

Nope, no difference--I wouldn't mix on the best headphones in the world. Headphones provide a very different listening experience.

[skippyfetus]

Ok, that's good to know and since there's no objections I'll take your word for it ;D

[smithy]

I heard the KRK V4's monitors the other day at GC Center. Awesome little speakers for clarity in the mids and highes and it kicks out some pretty good lows. If you want lower freq. you will need a sub by KRK's. Mackies 824's though is excellent for double the price.

Edit: Just saw an ad from Guitar Center today... these babies are going at $499.99 a pair. Saving $498.00. What a deal. I'm going to pick up a pair next week after pay day. They are also 90w Bi-amped so you don't need a amp to power them.

[Slapdragon]

Nope, no difference--I wouldn't mix on the best headphones in the world. *Headphones provide a very different listening experience.

The ideal sound environment is two speakers in a small room, placed above the eye level and mounted to the wall. Build from their if you are mixing 5+1 or 7+1.

For me, any consumer or professional speakers have worked well. I even like consumer Infiniti speakers attached to a Yamaha receiver since they often give me a better understand of what the home consumer, with access to a nice stereo, will be hearing, which is your grog audience anyway, and thus the people you should target.

[Michael_Nice]

I bought a pair of tapco S-5 nearfield moniters and I Love them!, they sound solid and only set me back like 350 or so if you order from B&H you get a free set of auralex speaker pads

[Slapdragon]

I bought a pair of tapco S-5 nearfield moniters and I Love them!, they sound solid and only set me back like 350 or so if you order from B&H you get a free set of auralex speaker pads

350 each, or for the pair?

[s-audio]

Tapco? Thats odd. That is Greg Mackies old company. Are they made by Mackie?

[Barry_S]

It's a separate low cost line produced by Mackie. The S-5's are $350/pair (5.25 inch woofer) and the S-8's ( 8 inch) are $500/pair.

[smithy]

Nope, no difference--I wouldn't mix on the best headphones in the world. *Headphones provide a very different listening experience.

The industry standard alot of sound people use is the Sony 7506's that are clear and cheap $100USD. But for final mixing I would use studio monitor speakers for depth and clarity. I use my headphones only on shooting thru my mixer via the boom for level adjustment and into the camera only. Also to listen for muddy sounds, feedback or wind noise before it goes to camera.

[booggerg]

Ideally, the tweeters of the monitor should be placed at ear level.

[Barry_S]

I picked up my Event TR-6s this weekend and I'm initially very pleased with them. They have a very natural, neutral sound which I think will be good for mixing. Even though my pair were marked as used, it seems like the speakers weren't even touched. So, I stole them at $250 for the pair. However, even at their normal price of $400/pair, I think they're worth auditioning.

It's worth noting that taking a favorite music CD and looking for the "best sounding" speakers may not be the best way to look for monitors with flat, accurate response. Males under the age of 30 seem to biased toward a big "thump factor" and some speaker manufacturers cater to this. I think it would be preferable to take a well-mixed film soundtrack.

[DVX100Shooter]

My Behringer Truth B2031's came the same way! I ordered a used pair last month and when I opened the box they looked very much brand new! No scratches or signs of wear. They sound nice too!

[Barry_S]

I think the take home message is that music is a volatile business and musicians are always selling stuff--so look for good used gear. Chuck, after I saw you'd picked up the Behringers, I tried to find some to audition, but no luck. Any comments beyond that you obviously like them?

[DVX100Shooter]

I still have to play around with the adjustments on the back. You can set them to a level based on the kind of room/studio you have them in. I have been pretty busy to even deal with that. All in all, they do sound really well. Although it has a nice sized woofer, the bass is not "boomy" which is a good thing. I have been very impressed with them so far.