"Vegas Lights" GH13 short.

[Ben_B]

Hi Guys, here is a little musical montage short I shot with my GH1(3) C settings in Vegas this week. Let me know what you think and post any questions!

12869675

[HHL]

VERY NICE Ben B. This shoot has MANY shots that illustrate one of the distinct advantages of these smaller cameras.

I DOUBLE DOG DARE ANYONE with a RED CAMERA to walk into a casio, without a permit, and shoot footage. :) (...and before you ask, NO I won't pay to have you bailed out).

It also featured at least one shot (I think several) of the GH1 advantages with the articulating screen, there was a SUPER LOW side walk shot...(2:28, 2:32) Very nice.

It also showcased the "low-light" abilities of the GH1. This has already been beat to death, so I won't shoot any bullets into an already dead horse, but, ....more light, properly used/re-directed...is better, available light is fine....NOT STELLAR...but just fine. (As Barry said earlier, EXTREME LOW LIGHT and it looks terrible....as Kholi has repeated over and over....why do that to yourself?....just light it properly and get the shot. For micro-budget indies like me....accept the fact that EXTREME LOW LIGHT is just NOT going to look STELLAR....good enough??...depends who you ask. T2i owners (I own one myself and love it dearly)....yours doesn't look that much better...so don't gloat. (lol))

FRONT AND CENTER: GH13 abilities. Too bad alot of it is de-graded by Vimeo...RRrrrrr....I'd like to see it on a big screen without the Vimeo compression.

Would you mind uploading some screen shots Ben? Sorry to bother. I know that it's alot to shoot/post a vid in the first place. If you wouldn't mind/get a chance. I'd like to see YOUR fav for GH13 WIDE SHOT with juicey details...AS WELL AS...the WORST shot...with not so juicey details.

Bottom-line: High quality vid, low-light acceptable, "under a trench coat" in a casio in Vegas....NOICE!!!! Thanks Ben B!

PS: (Question) What was it like shooting in the casio? Did anyone come up and bug you? (ie: security)??? This is one of the *MAIN* reasons I've given this category of camera due focus in my work. I actually bought a GF1 with a Pentax 110 lens *SPECIFICALLY* to shoot in public places where it might get a little touchy (even with a T2i or GH1)....enter hacked GF1! :)

[JoeJITSU]

Hi Guys, here is a little musical montage short I shot with my GH1(3) C settings in Vegas this week. Let me know what you think and post any questions!

12869675
NOt Bad.
What lens did you use?
Im not too crazy about some lowlight shots. I am thinking of also doing some vegas shots as well since Im from vegas. Ill try to shoot some this weekend. Ill be using the Canon 50mm 1.4 FD and 24mm 2.0 FD.

[Barry_Green]

Ben, that bride shot is absolutely ... genius. Nothing says "Vegas" like a bride, in her wedding dress, sitting alone, playing slots by herself in a casino, and smoking.

[Rocketfuel]

Ben, that bride shot is absolutely ... genius. Nothing says "Vegas" like a bride, in her wedding dress, sitting alone, playing slots by herself in a casino, and smoking.

I concur. The bride shot is fantastic. It makes you wonder as to the story. Did she leave the groom at the altar? Maybe she was modeling at a runway show...

[Nitsuj]

ben, that bride shot is absolutely ... Genius. Nothing says "vegas" like a bride, in her wedding dress, sitting alone, playing slots by herself in a casino, and smoking.

+1

[plasmasmp]

I've tried getting rouge shots of slots only one time in Nevada. Not something they look kindly on when you're caught. lol

[butler360]

What lens did you use?

He lists them all on the Vimeo page.

[Brian@202020]

Nice work Ben.

[Ben_B]

NOt Bad.
What lens did you use?
Im not too crazy about some lowlight shots. I am thinking of also doing some vegas shots as well since Im from vegas. Ill try to shoot some this weekend. Ill be using the Canon 50mm 1.4 FD and 24mm 2.0 FD.

Listed on Vimeo, the GH1 kit, the pancake, a Nikkor 50mm f/1.4, and a Vivitar 100-300mm f/5.5. I am also less than crazy about some of the low light shots in terms of image quality...but a lot of the were shot with the notoriously slow GH1 kit lens and that slow and crappy Vivitar telephoto...yes, I could shoot at night (albeit the bright night of the Vegas strip) with lenses that were above f/4 at their maximum aperture. Just about any shot that is clearly telephoto, or clearly wide (those are a little harder to spot then the telephoto ones) were done with the GH1 kit, and one of my favorite shots, the fire truck pulling in with the cars and people around it (relatively early in the film) was done with that vivitar telephoto.

[Ben_B]

Ben, that bride shot is absolutely ... genius. Nothing says "Vegas" like a bride, in her wedding dress, sitting alone, playing slots by herself in a casino, and smoking.


I concur. The bride shot is fantastic. It makes you wonder as to the story. Did she leave the groom at the altar? Maybe she was modeling at a runway show...


+1

Thanks! My favorite as well. I cut it together with the shot of the older woman doing the same to try and construct a bit of narrative (that that'd be her in 40 years.)

[Ben_B]

Bottom-line: High quality vid, low-light acceptable, "under a trench coat" in a casio in Vegas....NOICE!!!! Thanks Ben B!

PS: (Question) What was it like shooting in the casio? Did anyone come up and bug you? (ie: security)??? This is one of the *MAIN* reasons I've given this category of camera due focus in my work. I actually bought a GF1 with a Pentax 110 lens *SPECIFICALLY* to shoot in public places where it might get a little touchy (even with a T2i or GH1)....enter hacked GF1! :)


I've tried getting rouge shots of slots only one time in Nevada. Not something they look kindly on when you're caught. lol

Yeah I didn't have any problems, the camera was "naked" the whole time, no rig or anything obvious. I tried to have the pancake lens on as much as possible in the Casino because it really makes the GH1 seem more like a consumer super-zoom, but ended up using the Nikkor a bit because it's longer. This is one situation where the crop factor of the GH1 is totally advantageous...I was able to use a 100mm equiv f/1.4 lens (that I could afford!) that was not totally massive and obvious, to pick up shots relatively stealthily. I was also trying to not be too obvious...for some shots, like the bride and other people playing slots, I would sit myself down at a slot machine, flip out the LCD, put the camera in my lap, frame the shot looking down, and then hit record and look intently at the slot machine, and then review the footage in the viewfinder with the camera pointed down and the lenscap on. I mean, in Vegas you're on at least 4 cameras at any point in time (statistic made up, it's probably more) so it's not like I was stealthy enough to avoid that, but I was stealthy enough to avoid the attention of my subject, nearby security people, etc. When I had to take an obvious shot I made sure that I used the viewfinder, used the camera like a normal still camera, and didn't take too long to get my shot. I also would find places where other people were taking pictures with their point and shoots, stand near them, and take my shots.

As for getting caught, I wasn't particularly worried, I know my rights. On private property you can shoot until asked to stop, even if there's signage saying not to I probably would just go for it anyway, and if someone asks you to stop you ask why, if that's a casino policy, or their personal preference, why others are being allowed to take pictures and you're not, etc (be diplomatic, don't provoke them...you're not a professional trying to break rules you're just a normal customer with a nicer camera who is confused) and always ALWAYS remember that they CANNOT legally take your film, memory cards, camera, or anything away, or compel you to go anywhere with them under any circumstances. If they take anything of yours it's theft, and if they detain you without police assistance it is kidnapping.

Lastly, and I bet this helped...most of the Casino shots I got relatively late at night, when things weren't too crowded (weeknight.)

[Ben_B]

FRONT AND CENTER: GH13 abilities. Too bad alot of it is de-graded by Vimeo...RRrrrrr....I'd like to see it on a big screen without the Vimeo compression.

Would you mind uploading some screen shots Ben? Sorry to bother. I know that it's alot to shoot/post a vid in the first place. If you wouldn't mind/get a chance. I'd like to see YOUR fav for GH13 WIDE SHOT with juicey details...AS WELL AS...the WORST shot...with not so juicey details.


Yeah I'd be happy to post some stills but I can't until Monday night or Tuesday because I am away from my computer, etc, on a job until then. All I have with me for the web is my netbook and my phone, so I haven't really even seen the Vimeo version clearly :D

[Ben_B]

Oh, and props to anyone who can guess what hotel I stayed at! It's not really featured in the video, in fact I think the building is only in like 1 shot and barely so, but its absence should be conspicuous (hint: skyline.)

[sammysammy]

Good Work Ben! vey nice!

[HHL]

Hey Ben! Thank soooo much for answering my questions. Very good advice. I like the shooting when/where others are shooting. VERY SLY INDEED! Also cool to hear about "rights"....honestly I didn't even know. So...thanks again. I know how busy I am...so I respect how busy others are on this forum. So thanks for taking time to add to our community and for answering my questions. Your answers were very helpful, informative, and insightful. Thanks so much Ben!

Now I'm going to have to shoot some footy somewhere public...where I wouldn't normally be able to. Honestly...I think I need to work this angle more aggressively. That is one of our MOST PRONOUNCED advantages as DSLR users. ps....I did mean what I said about the GF1 +18mm Pentax 110 lens. It's so freakin small it's CRAZY. I only wish it had manual contrl...rrrrr....

Final note about shooting SUPER LOW KEY...(like a Casino so wickedly demonstrated by Ben B here.)...have you guys seen this??

http://www.dvxuser.com/V6/showthread.php?t=214487

OH SNAP! It would be freakin wicked to have one of these hacked! (right now it's only for language... :( Maybe bit rate later? Anywho...enough wishful thinking....Thanks a million Ben!

[Martti Ekstrand]

Good job Ben. You got some lovely shots in there and the bride is just perfect.

[Ben_B]

Good job Ben. You got some lovely shots in there and the bride is just perfect.

Thanks Martti! Was waiting to see what you thought of it.

[BitMaestro]

Oh, and props to anyone who can guess what hotel I stayed at! It's not really featured in the video, in fact I think the building is only in like 1 shot and barely so, but its absence should be conspicuous (hint: skyline.)

Mandalay Bay. You're obviously shooting/facing north, "up" The Strip, and the hotel immediately south of the Luxor (first/closest hotel to your vantage point) is the MB. Plus, the shot you're referring to is the one in which you panned left/west to The Palms and caught the end of another wing of the MB with its distinctive solid copper/bronze glass (as opposed to the Mirage, which has similar colored glass, but it's clearly broken up into floors). Plus, the MB is across from McCarran. (Hence, the shot of the plane landing.)

But to get this back on topic: how did you unobtrusively get the CU of the roulette wheel?

Mark

[Ben_B]

Mandalay Bay. You're obviously shooting/facing north, "up" The Strip, and the hotel immediately south of the Luxor (first/closest hotel to your vantage point) is the MB. Plus, the shot you're referring to is the one in which you panned left/west to The Palms and caught the end of another wing of the MB with its distinctive solid copper/bronze glass (as opposed to the Mirage, which has similar colored glass, but it's clearly broken up into floors). Plus, the MB is across from McCarran. (Hence, the shot of the plane landing.)

But to get this back on topic: how did you unobtrusively get the CU of the roulette wheel?

Mark

Yup! Specifically THEHotel @ Mandalay Bay...schmancier.

Ahh yes, the roulette wheel. Actually, that one was pretty obtrusive...in fact I think I got yelled at (not quite sure the guy was somewhat inarticulate, and was not a security guy but a dealer or a waiter or something, so I just kind of ignored him until I got my shot and then got the heck out of there.

[AdrianF]

Nice. The bride shot is genius.

[maranfilms]

impressive, I enjoyed the shot compositions. I though it looked great, With nice shots, the pixel peeping goes out the door, and it did. I never once payed attention to any of the camera flaws. Nice relaxing piece to watch. It's hard to believe several blocks in either dirrection, it's a completely different world.

[maranfilms]

As for getting caught, I wasn't particularly worried, I know my rights. On private property you can shoot until asked to stop, even if there's signage saying not to I probably would just go for it anyway, and if someone asks you to stop you ask why, if that's a casino policy, or their personal preference, why others are being allowed to take pictures and you're not, etc (be diplomatic, don't provoke them...you're not a professional trying to break rules you're just a normal customer with a nicer camera who is confused) and always ALWAYS remember that they CANNOT legally take your film, memory cards, camera, or anything away, or compel you to go anywhere with them under any circumstances. If they take anything of yours it's theft, and if they detain you without police assistance it is kidnapping.

Im not sure of all ststes, but in some, your not allowed to record both video and sound of someone unless you have their consent. Two party consent. Thats even in public places. Not sure how that would fall in to this, but just a thought. Obviously at this point you have no worries, but in future endeavors, something to think about.

[Ben_B]

Im not sure of all ststes, but in some, your not allowed to record both video and sound of someone unless you have their consent. Two party consent. Thats even in public places. Not sure how that would fall in to this, but just a thought. Obviously at this point you have no worries, but in future endeavors, something to think about.

Actually I am pretty sure you can shoot whatever you want, consent or no, it's what you do with it after that can get you in trouble.

[tylerrad]

Any of this shot at ISO 1600? There must have been some 1250 ISO stuff, at least. I downloaded the .mov file from Vimeo to avoid the extra compression, but -- just out of curiosity -- how good a representation is that 600MB .mov file of the original footage? Are any of the artefacts/noise present in that video the result of overcompression, or is that simply the nature of the footage?

Nice video, by the way. The footage gels well with the music

[maranfilms]

good point. Did you see the recent story about the motorcyclist that got pulled over by an undercover cop, he recorded it with a helmet cam, then posted it on youtube. He's looking at a possible 15 yr sentence for it. seems nutts but as you said, "it's what you do with it that gets you in trouble" makes perfect sense to me.

[Ben_B]

good point. Did you see the recent story about the motorcyclist that got pulled over by an undercover cop, he recorded it with a helmet cam, then posted it on youtube. He's looking at a possible 15 yr sentence for it. seems nutts but as you said, "it's what you do with it that gets you in trouble" makes perfect sense to me.

In the United States of America (regardless of state) it is not illegal to photograph (including videotape) a person on a public street without their consent, nor is it illegal to post it online. The legal problems come from when you start making money off of it, and those are mostly civil situations, not criminal. With that specific case I believe the problem was a state law regarding audio recording, not photography, the video part was actually not the problem, and the recording law I believe dealt specifically with wiretapping, not recording in a public place, so I bet with any decent lawyer he'll be acquitted. In most situations in a public place you can be recorded so long as such a recording does not violate a reasonable expectation of privacy (for example upskirt videos, or videos taken of you through the window of your house from a public street, etc are not protected.) There's some great videos on YouTube of cops trying to bust people for photography and basically just getting shut down by people who know their rights ("I don't give my consent to be filmed or photographed" "I don't need your consent officer, this is a public street.") There are also videos of professional ENG camera people getting basically attacked by cops..."turn the camera off" "no officer, my camera is my protection." Remember that your camera is your protection and if you're not in the wrong and get into a bad spot, keep rolling.

[Ben_B]

Any of this shot at ISO 1600? There must have been some 1250 ISO stuff, at least. I downloaded the .mov file from Vimeo to avoid the extra compression, but -- just out of curiosity -- how good a representation is that 600MB .mov file of the original footage? Are any of the artefacts/noise present in that video the result of overcompression, or is that simply the nature of the footage?

Nice video, by the way. The footage gels well with the music

It's relatively compressed, I will post some full res screen grabs soon. Very little of it was shot at ISO 1600 (if any) and I don't believe any of it was shot at 1250 because I usually don't use incremental ISO values. I do a lot of photography so I am used to doing equivalent exposures, and they sort of make things more complex. I like to be able to say: hey I'm at ISO 400 at f/2, I'd like to shoot at f/2.8, I need to go to 800. In fact, some of the night stuff with faster glass was shot at ISO 100. I think certain bits of image artificating are the result of a still flawed codec (even post hack) and the sensor itself (FPN, etc) as well as the glass. Soft stuff looks bad, and lenses are soft wide open.

Also I doubt this actually effected any of the image quality, but I accidentally erased one of my SDHC cards in the field and recorded over some of it, and recovered about 3/4 of the footage with data recovery software....digital corruption is usually a very pronounced all or nothing type issue, so I doubt any residual corruption of the mts files had an effect on image quality...but maybe. I had to use Adobe Media Encoder to get those files out and I usually use compressor, but I ran several tests to find the optimum settings, because at first it wasn't getting me the best possible image.

I also spent a lot of time shooting at a 1/30 shutter which can result in very motion blurry soft footage, especially handheld with a naked camera like I was doing, but I used it because I liked being able to use my slower glass. I think I mentioned this already but one of my favorite shots (the telephoto of the firetruck pulling into the Casino, with people walking, stopped cars, and bright signs as a backdrop) was achieved (if my memory is correct) with a slow and optically junky Vivitar telephoto lens.