Oh 7d you tempt me.

[franck]

Anyone else in the same boat? I've had the d90 for about a year, but the noisy video, lack of controls and lack of different frame rates is getting to me. Still love the camera for what it is, but unless you shoot close ups all the time, it's frustrating to get a clean image out of its video.
7D video footage just looks soooo clean, with barely ANY noise in flat mode...

[Tim Joy]

Having also owned the D90, and now shooting on the 7D, it's a big step up. I think you would be very happy upgrading.
The good thing is that if you have any manual focus Nikon lenses, they will work on the 7D. :)

[Zim]

Yes it is tempting. I might just use the DVX100b alittle longer too. I really want to upgrade my still cameras and like Nikon. But I sure want to use a DSLR with video too!!

[xcm]

Yeah, ... also have D90 and love it but lots of headache..
stil waiting for D400... but now counting my pennys :) maybe a scarlet 2/3

[ethan cooper]

if you're counting pennies, I'm not sure Scarlet is the way to go.

[Vinyl Stax]

if you're counting pennies, I'm not sure Scarlet is the way to go.

hahaha

[Cassius]

I have a GH1 and I keep looking at the 7D so I could use my existing and much superior lenses, among other things... and it's close to what I want, but just not close enough. I think. That decision crosses my mind pretty often. The competitors are all really similar, and none of them are quite there yet.

[Peter Reynolds]

Yes it is tempting. I might just use the DVX100b alittle longer too. I really want to upgrade my still cameras and like Nikon. But I sure want to use a DSLR with video too!!

I'm in the same boat. My DVX100b has served be well, but I'm not quite ready to upgrade to a EX-1 or similar investment. The 7D is very tempting as my first introduction to HD.

In fact, I have the chance to buy a 7D kit, new in the box for $2,100. I've been hemming and hawing the whole day.

Arrgh!

[jeracravo]

I'm on the same boat.
If Nikon doesn't release a full frame fully capable camera in the next 3 to 4 months... I'll become a Canon user...

[mattsand]

the 7d is absolutely great in every respect except the aliasing, but that little thing is actually so bad that it's reason enough to pass. just like the d90 it limits you to shooting only closeups and blurred backgrounds if you want it to look good.

[damonb]

jeracravo, I'm sure you know the 7D is 1.6 not full frame. Your option at the moment is only the 5D.

Hey matt, that info you posted above is important to me. I was also looking sideways at the 7D. Thank you for posting it.

[Peter Reynolds]

the 7d is absolutely great in every respect except the aliasing, but that little thing is actually so bad that it's reason enough to pass. just like the d90 it limits you to shooting only closeups and blurred backgrounds if you want it to look good.

Thanks Matt. I have to look into this "aliasing" issue more myself. It may be a deal breaker. I'm not looking for the 7D to replace a proper HD video camera (like the EX1) but more as an interim tool that can use creatively while getting use to HD tapeless workflow. It's a tough call.

Side note: You mentioned that the aliasing limits you to closeups and blurred backgrounds. I didn't notice this limitation on the following video (though I know it's a 5D Mark II). Unless it doesn't have the problems of the 7D, can you point out any aliasing that you see? Thanks.

http://vimeo.com/7058755

[Richard J. Johnson]

I have been back and forth and forth and back on the 7D and just can't seem to pull the trigger. The 5D has a better image IMO but is a little out of my price range. And I just have not seen the 7D produce anything that the HVX/HPX/GH1 can not. Barring the low light performance. I think I will wait on the next generation or if the ever elusive scarlett drops and if that happens I will step out of my range if it's good.

[iHartVideo]

I'm very tempted by Canon, but its the 5Dm2 that has my attention. It's functionality is as close to perfect as we can get these days, IMO - Full Frame, 23 MP stills, killer video.

I just cannot stand the Canon UI, at least as it pertains to stils. I find it takes multiple steps to accomplish things I can do with one button press on a Nikon.

I will see what they offer with the D400/D800. If they don't catch up on the video end then I, too, will be switching brands.

[Zim]

I've almost order the D300s and the 7D twice now but backed down at the last minute. A better price drop or couple hundred dollar rebate on the D300s would get me to buy it for the photography side. I won't buy the 7D for photography and won't buy it for video only.

If Nikon and Canon can't fix some of these issues I'll just buy a traditional HD video camera.

[franck]

I've been looking everyday at the footage my friend/co-worker shoots with the 7D. Greenscreen, wide outdoors, slow motion indoors, shooting against the sun, at low light dusk, purposely shooting bad... and it just looks like a generation ahead of my beloved D90... Of course the 7D is not perfect yet, but a much nicer starting point to get clean and workable images than the Nikon... The dynamic range is fantastic, and I haven't noticed much of the aliasing issue.
Anyhow... I've got the finger on the trigger, but I'll probably be reasonable and wait a few months, see what pans out in the DSLR video world.

[Ian-T]

the 7d is absolutely great in every respect except the aliasing, but that little thing is actually so bad that it's reason enough to pass. just like the d90 it limits you to shooting only closeups and blurred backgrounds if you want it to look good.It's really more of a problem in 720p. 1080p looks great most of the time. there is some promise with the external Caprock filter though.

[Kholi]

I would suggest, for anyone that can afford to do so, stop standing on the fence and just jump off: Get a 7D, shoot with it for a while and if you don't like it, go back to a D90 or GH-1.

If you have to sell blood (or primary gear that provides you income) then you should think twice.

Aliasing on all of these cameras suck to all hell. However, like Matt said, it's the only thing that really detracts from the 7D's image and it's at its worse in 720P or Wides with lots of distinct lines. It could be worse, I guess. Another trade-off that I suspect won't be fixed (if ever) for a few more generations OR if another manufacturer jumps in with a cure, someone unsuspected.

Just get a 7D.

P.S. I like the 5D, having put both cams side-by-side and done composition comparisons ( i.e. use 85/1.4 on the 7D and a 135/2.8 on the 5D, match compositions and compare) the 5D is SUCH a specific image. Love it for stills, looking forward to 24P, but man that sucker is just crazy specific. Wides, certain effects, etc, all good. Otherwise, 7D for me.

[Isaac_Brody]

the 7d is absolutely great in every respect except the aliasing, but that little thing is actually so bad that it's reason enough to pass. just like the d90 it limits you to shooting only closeups and blurred backgrounds if you want it to look good.

Of course that didn't stop you from shooting a feature on it. :beer:

[mattsand]

exactly. it was exactly what i needed at the time and we worked around most of the problems. i would get a 7d if i needed it now, but i don't so i'll wait for something better.

[Adam J McKay]

Canon is tempting me more and more and more. I have the D90, I love it. BUT... the fact you can have a full frame, 20+ MP camera with video with the 5dmk2 is amazing. I am thinking about getting into the high res full frame market for landscape photography and could never justify the 8g for a d3x. There is that sliver of hope that maybe there will be a D90 firmware, but I mean, there is no hope haha.

I hope 2010 brings good things here in the Nikon camp.

[RyanMc]

I'm a GH1 user and was tempted to go to a 7d but everything I have read on this forum (and all the tests, especially those from Barry) has me thinking the GH1 is the superior camera. It doesn't appear to have the same problems with Aliasing, Moire, etc as the 7d, appears to have more vertical resolution and more latitude to the image. I don't know why the 7d is regarded as the better camera, though I must say I have never shot with one.

[Barry_Green]

In 1080 mode, the GH1 has the same level of aliasing/moire as the 7D does, however, the 7D's is more noticeable because it includes chroma aliasing.

In 720 mode, yes the GH1 is a lot cleaner than the 7D, but they still both have tons of aliasing.

I wrote up a big article on what I think the strengths and weaknesses of these two are; I think there's some very clear areas where each stands well ahead of the other.

[jonE5]

Im in the same boat.

I only paid $650 for my D90, but the limitations are starting to hurt me. I need manual settings because i work during the day so many of my shoots have to be at night. While the d90 does do good in low light, it doesnt allow you to set your dam shutter speed and that is really kiling me. Im getting janky shutter speeds and it keeps making my footage look akward, im sure some of it is due to my lack of knowledge and skill, but i just htink the 7D would make my life easier.

Im just not sure how to justify almost 3x the cost of my d90 though. :(

This started as a hobby for me, and still is, i dont plan on making any money at this for a long time if ever, can i really justify that much on a hobby? argg!

[Zim]

Yes if you enjoy doing it why not!! You should get what you need for your hobby.

[PerroneFord]

Yep, the 7D has seduced me. But I'm patient. I am going to wait until next summer or fall. I am hoping a few things happen before then:

1. I have more money
2. There is a Magic Lantern release for the 7D
3. There is a firmware / hardware update that helps with the choma aliasing.

But regardless, it's a tool that will do what I need to do, even now.

[jeracravo]

Yes damonb, I know the 7D is APS-C (1.6).
I just tried a 7D yesterday and I must say.
Canon ergonomics just SUCKS for photos... my D90 is years ahead.
But the ability to set your manual settings for the video recording and just forget about it is awsome.
It sucks to have to do all those tricks everytime you turn the D90 off.
If the D700x/s/whatever doesn't come in a few months with full manual control for the video side... I'll get a 7D just for video, get a 50mm 1.4 and an adaptor for my nikon lenses.
i just wish I had the money to get a D3s.... what a piece of gear...

[Cory Braun]

In 1080 mode, the GH1 has the same level of aliasing/moire as the 7D does, however, the 7D's is more noticeable because it includes chroma aliasing.

In 720 mode, yes the GH1 is a lot cleaner than the 7D, but they still both have tons of aliasing.

I wrote up a big article on what I think the strengths and weaknesses of these two are; I think there's some very clear areas where each stands well ahead of the other.

Is the article published yet?

[Barry_Green]

http://www.dvxuser.com/V6/showthread.php?t=192963

[Cory Braun]

http://www.dvxuser.com/V6/showthread.php?t=192963

Thanks.

[Duke M.]

2. There is a Magic Lantern release for the 7D


While not a release yet, its reported that progress has finally been made on the 7D firmware hack and they've enabled a couple of new features. Nothing major, but they were having problems accessing the firmware as its different than the 5D.

Now that they are getting some access I don't think it will be too long before we see some usable results.

[PerroneFord]

The last update I read (this week) stated that the only progress that had been made was that they could access the screen. I'll check the official thread on cinema5D later and see if they've accomplished more than that.

[damonb]

This is fantastic news and it's great for the D90 user and Nikon video...how?

Seriously, this forum will lose its way completely as a resource for the D90 if everyone simply enumerates the advantages and soon to be released features of other (especially non-Nikon) cameras over several posts in a thread, as has been happening increasingly over the last month. This is the best web resource the D90 video user has. Don't kill it.

[bobafet1]

Get the 7D . You won't be disappointed...I love mine!

[bobafet1]

Yeah, ... also have D90 and love it but lots of headache..
stil waiting for D400... but now counting my pennys :) maybe a scarlet 2/3

Sure buddy. While you're saving money for the Scarlet why don't you save a bit more for an invisible car, or a time machine, or a light saber....I'm sure by the time the Scarlet is out the other items will also be available.

[Starshine Video]

I will be able to get a light saber next summer? Awesome!

[bobafet1]

I will be able to get a light saber next summer? Awesome!

Given the track record for the release of the Scarlet it should have been out a long time ago...so if you feel like having a carrot dangled in front of our face then yes....Scarlet will be out by next summer...unless of course they find a way to make it even better then anything you've ever seen and so they won't sacrifice quality for the sake of releasing it on schedule and rather postpone it even more...

Scarlet=Pipe Dream

[PerroneFord]

How RED is to blame for the lack of patience of *potential* customers escapes me. The Scarlet is not a carrot. It is a camera under development. If you need a tool immediately, buy one. If you are interested in the Scarlet, monitor it's development. If you can afford to wait for it, then do so.

I really don't understand why that troubles some people so much.

[Jim Klatt]

Because people are manipulated into advertising for a company without even knowing it.

I remember years ago(yes, years ago) when people were talking about Scarlets "specs" and "prices".

People talked furiously and incessantly about them. Well, guess what? They have mostly changed all of these specs and prices and are no longer tangible things that will ever exist. Then they debated the new specs and prices and those changed. In the meantime, Scarlet's acolytes are trumpeting the product name and creating a sense of myth and hype around a product.

They change and change and change, and all of that time spent debating over an imaginary product really don't serve anybody but the company that is making them.

All I am asking is if you want to talk about these things, then fine. Go over to their website and do it to your heart's content and help them develop their camera. But stop coming to other tools' threads and invoking this name as if it is a real thing until it is a real thing, because most likely you are wasting everyone's time debating with specs and prices that are not real.

Call me when it's for sale or when somebody has it in their hands to review it.

[Jester2138]

Boy, if Red doesn't manage to live up to the ridiculously high expectations for the Scarlet, it's gonna be one helluva (insert terrible thing that might happen to Red).

[PerroneFord]

Boy, if Red doesn't manage to live up to the ridiculously high expectations for the Scarlet, it's gonna be one helluva (insert terrible thing that might happen to Red).

I highly doubt that. I've said it from the beginning. RED's market is digital film. REAL digital film. The 2/3 scarlet will likely end up as a loss leader for them. The Epic should have some real legs. The RED one will likely morph into the kind of camera to attract new filmmakers and a B-Cam.

The Scarlet will be fine for the people truly in a position to shoot it. Those truly thrilled with the 7D are going to love it to death. Those who expect it to replace their HPX170s, EX3s, etc. are likely going to be disappointed.

I'd love to have one of the S35 Scarlet units if it turns out like I think it will. But it's too expensive for me personally. Maybe I can get one on the job in a couple years. In the meantime, the 7D is going to do just fine.

But bringing the thread back to to Nikon, I truly hope Nikon step up and do something useful. They've certainly got the ability, but I know this has to be a huge leap for them.

[bobafet1]

Well given the current demand for these type of products I'm sure things will only get better for us consumers as the bigger companies like Canon, Nikon, Sony, etc...release products to meet our demand.