Is the Firestore Worth It?

[MSpencer]

I've seen good and bad reviews about this. anyone want to share their own reviews on it?

Is it worth the buy?

[wgzn]

having owned two of them (with zero problems) i can confidently say there are some instances where it is by far the best thing to use. there are many others where its not.

the primary use for a firestore (imho) is when you need to roll very long, non-stop takes. where you wouldnt have time or opportunity to pop a card out to an assistant. like a meeting, business presentation or training situation. i used to throw live music and theater into this group. but with P2 sizes now 32, 64 and larger. there are very few performances you can not get on a pair of cards.

but with applications like adobe on-location, as long as you dont have to move around much. you can easily shoot direct to a laptop. so this has yet further narrowed the firestore advantage...

about the only places i would definitely NOT use a firestore:
- for field ENG or live rock shows. anywhere where there is a lot of close activity, as the firewire cable could easily be yanked out.
- any extreme conditions, like water, heat, cold, or extreme vibrations

i have a friend who shoots nearly exclusively to firestore and he loves it! - BUT about 99% of what he shoots is in reasonably controlled environments. interviews, commercials, light docu, etc... if he were shooting live sports or live rock shows, im sure he'd be singing a different tune.

i think a firestore is a handy thing to have. and at the current going price, i say YES, its very much "worth it"
but just keep in mind, its not well suited for EVERYTHING. and very poorly suited for somethings. so id keep at least 1 pair of P2 cards (16gig or bigger) on hand as well.

[MSpencer]

alright that's what i wanted to hear. i've got a 16gb card but i also don't even have a card reader so i'd have to put out more money for the reader. how's the workflow on it. is it kindof similar to the cards just like plug it in and capture onto your computer? or would i need a different program.

[David Saraceno]

google "using firestore FS 100"

http://www.videomaker.com/article/12912/

[Phenixone]

I have never used the fire store because I don't see the use for it. Interviews can fit in two 32g cards and if not go for two 64G. For the offloading annoyance I have found the solution : NextoDI video Pro NV2500. It's a autonomous offloading station for basicly anything that is tapeless video 5D MKII, SxS, and P2. Offloading is amazingly fast and easy. Turn it on, click copy and wait for the screen to say COPY SUCCESSFUL.

Also yhere is another solution coming from AJA that you can connext on the HD SDI in the back of the HPX170 (yeah no go for the HVX). It records the RAW footage straight to the drive.

[wgzn]

how's the workflow on it. is it kindof similar to the cards just like plug it in and capture onto your computer? or would i need a different program.

for the most part, its just like connecting your camera to the computer. go through a couple of switching and organizing steps - then just plug it in and it comes up like a volume.

[MSpencer]

alright thanks david. i'm gonna check into everything a bit more i just wanted someone's personal review thanks wgzn.

[Postmaster]

Shooting on a Firestore from day one I owned a HVX200.
It was a budget decision back then. A Firestore was so much cheaper than the P2 Cards (dollar per minute).

Actually it worked so great for me, that buying P2 cards never came to my mind.

Frank

[MSpencer]

the cards are alot more expensive if you do dollar per minute so i think i'm gonna go with the firestore. thanks everyone for your input.

[DM_rider]

the cards are alot more expensive if you do dollar per minute so i think i'm gonna go with the firestore. thanks everyone for your input.

I had a terrible experience with a firestore once. Lost a ton of footage, and even after talking to firestore tech guys, it was still gone. It was not operator fault either, it was the firestore.

Never had a problem with p2 cards, ever.

If you are going to be shooting any handheld, eng style shooting with the firestore, it's not fun, at all. Battery life is terrible, delicate system, bulky, and more. I shot with one for about a year, and I absolutely hated the thing with a passion. Be very sure that a firestore is the way you want to go. With P2 prices coming down, and card sizes going up, I really see no reason to own a firestore. For $1200, price of a firestore, you can get 2 32gb e series p2 cards.

[sonuxxx]

i havn't used one but i heard they make a lotta noise and not good filming interviews or when your close to a subject you can hgear the motor running inside

[wgzn]

the cards are alot more expensive if you do dollar per minute so i think i'm gonna go with the firestoremspencer, like i said earlier. a firestore is a certain tool for a certain job.
think of it like this. in your toolbox you have a hammer, a screwdriver and some pliers. each has its specific range us uses. if you try to use one where another is better suited, you will jeopardize both the job AND the tool.

i think if you choose EITHER firestore OR P2 as your tool of choice strictly based on price - youre setting yourself for heartache. i say if you cant afford BOTH, then buy another 16gig P2 card and find someone or some place to rent a firestore as needed.

there are (at least in my world) too many places where a firestore is NOT the right tool for the job to choose it OVER P2.

[MSpencer]

well that's why i'll stick to both. it did kind of seem odd that as long as they've been around why hasn't everyone been using them but like you said it's a certain tool for a certain job. i did some more research on it and thanks for the inputs everyone.

[Benjamin98]

I have been using a firestore with HVX for a year now and you should know that it is very hard on the 1394 firewire port on your camera. I have had the port fixed twice. I guess the firestore works the fusses of the dv connection pretty hard. Other than this, it is inexpensive and will allow for long recording. When doing handheald, you may need to rig it to the side of your camera using a manfrotto clamp or something.

[Chris Santucci]

i havn't used one but i heard they make a lotta noise and not good filming interviews or when your close to a subject you can hgear the motor running inside


I've been using the FS100 for almost 2 years now and the only major drawback I see is the noise of the cooling fan which varies depending upon ambient temperature and use.

I've seen these things record right up to full capacity, get dropped on the ground, and used for days on end with no loss or issues with files. I've shot 2 feature length films with Firestores and they never missed a beat.

I prefer the Firestore because I can't stand the P2 format and the lack of ease in reviewing files in general.

Regarding the 4 pin Firewire jack on the camera, if people don't properly relieve the strain on the connection, then yes, you will have problems as you would with even the s-video connection on this camera.

.

[Postmaster]

Put a modern hard disk in it and you here the fan only when you shoot in death valley at high noon.

Frank

[wgzn]

I can't stand the P2 format and the lack of ease in reviewing files in general

how exactly is it easier to review files on a firestore than from a P2 card?

[Chris Santucci]

Because a Quicktime file (which is what I meant) can transferred (like any other file) and can be viewed and trimmed (or flipped) with the Quicktime player.

And then there's the whole issue of P2 drivers...

Uhhggg.

.

[Berk]

We have the Firestore over 3 years. i dropped to the ground couple times. We haven't had any single problem.
Now we're loving it more cuz it has been hacked up to 320G.

[Chris Santucci]

I just ordered the Western Digital WD3200BEVE 320GB drive to put in the Firestore.

.

[Noel Evans]

Ive used a firestore for quite some time and never had an issue. Though since the introduction of 64gb cards I havent used it once. Thus (is this allowed?) I am happy to part with it for a reasonable price - pm if interested. - check my profile 6000 something posts been on here for sometime and know met many face to face even though Im in aus).

[MSpencer]

haha well thanks for the offer i actually got one off someone and it's on it's way here.

i also don't want to fork out extra money right now for a p2 reader.

[metrospace]

One thing i would recommend is gaffer tape the firewire connection to the camera. I have been shooting with a couple of fs100 for 2.5 years with no problems except that firewire port (and nosiy fan!). When doing handheld it helps to have rails, handle and shoulder pad because it gets top heavy.

[DPIX24]

With the new P2 E-series out, the cost factor should no longer be an issue. The 64gb is $900, which can record up to 180min in 720pn. Not too shabby....

I would NOT recommend using the firestore (based on my experience with the FS-100) for the following reasons:

*Heavy (not practical for steadicam shots or hand held even)
*Unreliable
*Moving parts
*Firewire cable inputs are not solid. My DV input got loose from constantly plugging and removing that the contact became loose in the middle of an important shoot. Luckily, an extra p2 was on hand.
*Not good with loud noises. - I shot a music video and noticed on the post end that every time the drummer hit the cymbal, the resonance or high frequency affected the moving disk putting pixelation on the footage.
*No immediate playback for slo-mo.
*Low battery life

P2 is the way to go. Hands down. Especially since they have come down in price so much.

[Chris Santucci]

With the new P2 E-series out, the cost factor should no longer be an issue. The 64gb is $900, which can record up to 180min in 720pn. Not too shabby....

The FS100 offers certain advantages over P2 cards like a really easy option for shooting timelapse. I'll admit, the E series cards are tempting even considering the 5-10 year lifespan and the annoyance of the P2 file format.


I would NOT recommend using the firestore (based on my experience with the FS-100) for the following reasons:

*Heavy (not practical for steadicam shots or hand held even)
*Unreliable
*Moving parts
*Firewire cable inputs are not solid. My DV input got loose from constantly plugging and removing that the contact became loose in the middle of an important shoot. Luckily, an extra p2 was on hand.
*Not good with loud noises. - I shot a music video and noticed on the post end that every time the drummer hit the cymbal, the resonance or high frequency affected the moving disk putting pixelation on the footage.
*No immediate playback for slo-mo.
*Low battery life

I use the FS100 on a camera stabilizer and it works fine.

I've shot 2 feature length films and a slew of commercial projects with the FS100 and it has yet to be "unreliable" in any way.

Moving parts? Yeah, my G3 has moving parts too.

I've shot with the FS100 close to firearms being discharged, and in clubs with live bands and I've never experienced anything like pixelation.

The battery life is fine, but I'd recommend using a dedicated battery charger which charges at a fairly fast rate.

.

[Editorialz]

I'll second that. I've never had so much trouble with a piece of kit as I had with this overcomplicated piece of rubbish. Any movement whatsoever and it froze up on us. We lost 2 major scenes on a feature that would have been hugely expensive to reproduce. Over 30 minutes was corrupt and zero chance of recovery. I cannot think of one solid reason why anyone should buy one of these Firestores. They are paper weights, pure and simple. Following this let down we went out and purchased 4 P2's and haven't had one single issue since. Run and gunning is not a problem. P2 transfer is not a problem. No complicated setups, no fiddling about with that ridiculous firewire connection and no living in hope that we actually got what we recorded this time. The stress, time and money that that piece of crap caused us is impossible to calculate but if I ever see another one I'll drop kick the darn thing back to where it came from.

[maranfilms]

umm, you do know this thread is two yrs old.

[kgimedia]

umm, you do know this thread is two yrs old.

It took me almost a full page of Firestore talk before I thought "Wait a minute?".

I do some freelance work with a major university. Some of the longer and less "important" lectures or speaker series we still use SD. We use 4 XL2's connected to switcher. Then out to an old Sony DV-Man recorder with a Firestore connected. Most of the time we stream and archive for web at the same time. The thought of capturing all those tapes and cutting makes me want to stab myself in the face with a pencil. Maybe it just because of all the times in years past that it was the only option. In these modern days of 64Gb P2 and USB card readers the Firestore is only really good for what it has been the best at since it was introduced. Very, very long static shoots. Especially DV.

[chuckygee]

I still use mine for weddings. Works greats for the tripod shots.