MatteBoxes - yay or nay?

[Boz]

I think there's been a few discussion regarding Matteboxes before, but most seem to dwell on WHICH matte box to get. I'm interested in a different question, whether a mattebox is needed or not. The trouble I'm running into is dealling with filters - either I need a complete set of filters for each lense I own, or I need to deal with step down rings and the like. And while matte boxes may add bulk and make DSLRs less "run & gun" it seems like they do speed things up and reduce costs when dealing with multiple filters.

I'd love to hear your thoughts on this, as I'm confused as to whether the pros outweigh the cons.

[Barry_Green]

If you're using the stock lens, or any zoom lens, a mattebox on rails is a profound pain in the patootie. Consider that the stock lens on the GH1 moves the lens front over a range of about four inches, and the 18-135 on my 7D moves it about three inches! Every time you want to zoom in just a little, or zoom out a little, you'd have to unbolt and slide the mattebox.

No way.

If you had to get a mattebox for an SLR, I'd say that if you plan on using the stock lens you should consider a lens-mounted one (attaching to the lens threads), even if it's something like the Cokin system (not that I'm recommending Cokin filters, but the way the lens shade works on the lens thread is more appropriate for an SLR zoom lens than a mattebox on rails would be!)

If you're using prime lenses, it's more likely you could use a mattebox on rails, but if so, you are still going to have a profound amount of hassle. You'll be sliding the mattebox forward or backwards every time you change a lens. A swingaway mattebox can grealy minimize the pain.

Or, you can just get a common front for your lenses. Like, with the Zeiss ZFs, the largest ones have 82mm threads, so spend a few dollars for step-up rings for your other lenses so that you bring them all to having 82mm fronts, and then you can use the same-size screw-in filters on all of them.

[Kholi]

If you're using the stock lens, or any zoom lens, a mattebox on rails is a profound pain in the patootie. Consider that the stock lens on the GH1 moves the lens front over a range of about four inches, and the 18-135 on my 7D moves it about three inches! Every time you want to zoom in just a little, or zoom out a little, you'd have to unbolt and slide the mattebox

No way.

If you had to get a mattebox for an SLR, I'd say that if you plan on using the stock lens you should consider a lens-mounted one (attaching to the lens threads), even if it's something like the Cokin system (not that I'm recommending Cokin filters, but the way the lens shade works on the lens thread is more appropriate for an SLR zoom lens than a mattebox on rails would be!)

If you're using prime lenses, it's more likely you could use a mattebox on rails, but if so, you are still going to have a profound amount of hassle. You'll be sliding the mattebox forward or backwards every time you change a lens. A swingaway mattebox can grealy minimize the pain.

Or, you can just get a common front for your lenses. Like, with the Zeiss ZFs, the largest ones have 82mm threads, so spend a few dollars for step-up rings for your other lenses so that you bring them all to having 82mm fronts, and then you can use the same-size screw-in filters on all of them.


Uhm. Accurate.

Since the beginning I've been saying this same thing. Mattebox is not for this application. However the concept still applies, so like Barry suggests either find a clip on or you can get a large threaded Rubber Lens shade, works wonders. All of my lenses have jumped to 77mm thread sizes, although in hindsight I think I should have gone with 82mm conversions. I'll probably do that in the near future and re-purchase NDs and Polarizers for all three cameras.

The other thing you should carry around with you, no matter what the circumstance, is a roll of BlackWrap/Black Foil and some Gaffers tape/paper tape. That'll take care of a whole mess of issues you encounter for sure, on the camera or for controlling light elsewhere.

[bwwd]

ah

[Boz]

Thanks for the advice guys, I appreciate it.

I was thinking of something like this as a compromise:

http://dvcity.com/dve/product_info.php?cPath=70&products_id=228

Get the 82mm size ring, then just go for the whatever size step-down ring you need for a particular lens. It's not all that fancy, but it seems like it would get the job done. No rails needed and no worries about telescoping zooms. Thoughts?

[Tim Joy]

I like having a mattebox, especially to ease the pain of changing filters and open up the choices.. ie grad filters, diffusion.. etc. Mine doesn't swing away, but I only have to pull it out a few inches to take off the lens. It seems much easier than unscrewing and screwing on those damn filters.

I would say that it depends on what you're shooting. If it's run-n-gun with a zoom lens, no way. If it's narrative with prime lenses, I say yay.

There's also the Genus that slides in and out with the zooming. Phill Bloom seems to dig that one.

The other thing to consider is that it ruins the stealth-factor of the cam, and you'll get looks whereas a bare camera nobody will think much of.

[Ben_B]

Mattebox isn't really worth the money for what it does in my opinion. Get some screw on filters or even that Cokin thing, and use the $400+ you save on a fancy dinner or nice glass or something you'll get more enjoyment out of.

[powervideo]

I'm finding the matte box easier. I have a Vocas MB-450 attached to the Zacuto baseplate and a Chrosziel follow focus. The rails mean you can add the FF which aids focussing incredibly. Plus as Tim said, switching in ND's, grads and polas is easy. I could go the on-lens lightweight approach, but then I'm not shooting guerilla-style trying not to be noticed.

Peter

[PerroneFord]

After shooting with a 5D last weekend (and two more weekends coming up) I wish to heck we had a Mattebox! The AC could deal with changing lenses and the mattebox while we were doing clip review.

But not having NDs is a royal pain. We just got this thing for this production, and are getting lenses from a variety of sources. With no NDs available, I am having the crew running around with ND gels and organza on the windows and playing lighting hero to keep everything in check. The camera has no waveform monitor so we are playing best guess with the light meter. We are changing ISO to compensate, but that's not ideal either.

I wouldn't own one of these things without a mattebox. But I sure wouldn't be lensing it with anything that had a moving front element. I don't see the pain of that process as any different than shooting film.

[Boz]

Hmmm... it seems opinions are mixed. I can see both sides of the arguement, which is why I asked in the first place. I'm still leaning towards a small, light, inexpensive matte box, like the one I posted above, but I need to ponder this further. Decisions, decisions!

[damienthedevil]

Hmmm... it seems opinions are mixed. I can see both sides of the arguement, which is why I asked in the first place. I'm still leaning towards a small, light, inexpensive matte box, like the one I posted above, but I need to ponder this further. Decisions, decisions!

I bought the same mattebox for my DSLR but it is front heavy. I think you should get a mattebox that goes with a rod system ( Pro aim v11) I am changing to the Pro aim now. and remember to get the right adapter ring ( 95mm to 77mm).

[16x9 Inc]

If you're using the stock lens, or any zoom lens, a mattebox on rails is a profound pain in the patootie. Consider that the stock lens on the GH1 moves the lens front over a range of about four inches, and the 18-135 on my 7D moves it about three inches! Every time you want to zoom in just a little, or zoom out a little, you'd have to unbolt and slide the mattebox.

Matteboxes mounted on rods will encounter this problem, i.e., lens pumping. Chrosziel offers a myriad of step-down rings that will clamp onto the lens itself; this will mitigate the lens pump action.

This is an an example of a Clamp-on Sunshade:
http://16x9inc.com/store/cart.php?m=product_detail&p=700http://www.16x9inc.com/images/products/chrosziel/ac-r20-can-5d-medium.jpg

Link: http://16x9inc.com/store/cart.php?m=product_detail&p=700

Michael Ibanez
16x9 Inc.
michael@16x9inc.com
Reseller of Zeiss Compact Primes
Exclusive US Distributor for Chrosziel, Bebob, & EasyRig
Exclusive Worldwide Distributor for 16x9 Inc., Noga Cine Arms

[ydgmdlu]

Hmmm... it seems opinions are mixed. I can see both sides of the arguement, which is why I asked in the first place. I'm still leaning towards a small, light, inexpensive matte box, like the one I posted above, but I need to ponder this further. Decisions, decisions!
Cinetactics Matteblox, dude. It's cheesy and cheap, but it'll do what you want. Get the HD version.

http://www.cinetactics.com

Note: Specialized Communications (a DVXuser sponsor) has better prices than direct from the company.

[Pookie]

Mattebox + Follow Focus + Rails + External Monitor + Shoulder Mount = BLING

http://elitechoice.org/wp-content/uploads/2008/09/pentax1.jpg
http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_sA89be9xiuE/StyYWivyBmI/AAAAAAAAF2M/qxJu4YXHB7o/s400/IMGP1342.JPG


Bunch'a crap screwed onto a DSLR just to look "pro".

http://techthoughts.org/wp-content/uploads/2009/09/dslr.png

Somewhere in that mess is a camera.

Try lugging that monstrosity around.