Help a newbie with lens, 3 choices?

[cl516]

I'm no camera expert, I know just basics coming from shooting video / film.

The 7D kit includes the 28-135mm in the U.S.
but in Canada the kit possibly includes the other two listed below:

canon EF 28-135mm f/3.5-5.6 IS USM
canon EF-S 15-85mm f/3.5-5.6 IS USM
canon EF-S 18-135mm f/3.5-5.6 IS

Realistically, "28-135mm" and "18-135mm" are the ones in my budget.

1. For those in the know, please share some info with me about the lens? (pros cons build quality?)
2. Is it bad to get EF-S lens instead of EF?
3. Perhaps there are other suggestions in this price?

I'd be shooting a lot indoors, close-up of equipment, probably insufficient lighting. I'd rely on a lot of editing for the video.

[Cassius]

Maybe instead of lens investments you should get something for your insufficient lighting. That's much more important.

USM means 'ultra-sonic motor', which is used for autofocus. If you don't use autofocus, that won't matter. A lot of people would say the 18-135 could have lesser optics due to being a wider range (closer to prime is, to many, better). But I don't think you'll notice a difference.

[cl516]

yeah, i'm just gonna stick with one lens. not sure if i should the one included in kit, or other one that's all.

[Cassius]

That makes sense. Since the 7D still has a slight field of view crop, I would personally go with the 18mm, unless autofocus is big for you.

[ydgmdlu]

Remember: You can't autofocus continually in video mode.

If low-light ability is a big deal to you, then you should consider a faster lens like the Tamron 17-50mm F2.8. There's nothing wrong with buying EF-S instead of EF lenses, but EF-S lenses will not work very well on a full-frame camera, should you ever decide to get one. But at the same time, EF lenses are designed for full fame, which means that they won't be as wide as you want them to be on the 7D.

Long story short: If you're sure that you're never going to buy a full-frame camera, or if you don't mind the trouble of selling all of your lenses for full-frame replacements, then you should definitely buy EF-S lenses.

[cl516]

thanks ydgmdlu, i get the second part. the first part, i'm confused though about the autofocus. could you explain about the video thing? thanks

[ydgmdlu]

thanks ydgmdlu, i get the second part. the first part, i'm confused though about the autofocus. could you explain about the video thing? thanks
You can only autofocus when you're taking still pictures. You can also autofocus before you begin a take. But autofocus will not otherwise work while you are recording video, no matter what lens you use.

[USLatin]

The 18mm to 135mm range will let you shoot much more than the other. Unless you plan to only shoot outdoors and big rooms. In fact, that one covers the average basic prime set for narrative work. An average set is likely to include something like 18mm, 24mm, 35mm, 50mm, 85mm, and maybe something like a 100mm or 135mm. Give or take of course, everyone is different and the project dictates the gear needed. People favor specifying lengths also, like a 28mm or a 40mm, it all depends and taste is included in there. Some may also need something like a 300mm to compress shots, but much more often you'll find people requesting something wider than the 18mm than a long telephoto. Unless they are building sets where you can remove a wall to shoot on a longer lens and decide that it is a better look for the material.

[cl516]

hey USlatin you added more to the post, thanks so much!

[Emanuel]

Budget is budget. I smell a L quality 15-85mm instead. The problem is wide angle is a poor choice on h.264 @ 1080p -- count on it.

[USLatin]

No problem. Hope it helps.

Also, you'd be very happy with the 15-85 as well. And if it is any better image, especially at wide open iris settings then I'd personally definitely go for that one instead.

And if you think you'd do lots of small places then maybe just go for that one anyway.


Budget is budget. I smell a L quality 15-85mm instead. The problem is wide angle is a poor choice on h.264 @ 1080p -- count on it.

Is there one? I know the 17-55 Canon f/2.8 is L quality, but it is also $1,000.

I think I see your point about the wide angle, wide field of view means there will tend to be lots of detail in the shot. Right? Thanks for pointing it out. Please let me know if that is what you meant.

Well, anyway, they upped the bit rate from the 5D, and 24fps means less frames with the same bit-rate. Either way, if you need a wider shot you need a wider shot. Quality will have to be compromised and you'll have to live with it. But the fact that the camera in question shoots h.264 is already a compromise, the variable aperture is an other, so compromises are in the cards either way.

[Emanuel]

Is there one? I know the 17-55 Canon f/2.8 is L quality, but it is also $1,000.

I think I see your point about the wide angle, wide field of view means there will tend to be lots of detail in the shot. Right? Thanks for pointing it out. Please let me know if that is what you meant.
Yes.

BTW, take a look on this post of mine just a few minutes ago:

http://www.dvxuser.com/V6/showthread.php?p=1759395#post1759395


Well, anyway, they upped the bit rate from the 5D, and 24fps means less frames with the same bit-rate. Either way, if you need a wider shot you need a wider shot. Quality will have to be compromised and you'll have to live with it. But the fact that the camera in question shoots h.264 is already a compromise, the variable aperture is an otherRichard Darge aka rgdfilms has shown the superiority of a higher resolution such as RED @ 4K -> 1080p, not necessarily related to shallow DOF but where the lack of detail doesn't come up easily. On the contrary. See Nyquist Theorem.

[cl516]

whoa you guys are way over my head, i'm still at the basics:

i can't figure out between the 18-135mm or the 28-135mm.

why do i ask:

if i buy it in Canada, the kit comes with the 18-135mm. It is not USM.
if i buy it in US, the kit comes with 28-135mm. this one is USM.

i know that 'cassius' already wrote that USM is ultrasonicmotor, but as a newbie i'm really not sure which to get.

as for the 15-85, i feel like maybe it's too nice for a beginner?

[USLatin]

Richard Darge aka rgdfilms has shown the superiority of a higher resolution such as RED @ 4K -> 1080p, not necessarily related to shallow DOF but where the lack of detail doesn't come up easily. On the contrary. See Nyquist Theorem.

Yes, I am completely aware of this. But of course we are talking about a $1,700 body here. We plan to shoot my first feature with two Reds, build 21, 4.5k 2.33:1 using RC36 and RC42 for high detail wides and slow motion. I am all over Red. However this camera will be a heck of a lot of fun, and for 480 it should deliver some real nice stuff. Probably very decent most of the time for 720p.


whoa you guys are way over my head, i'm still at the basics:

i can't figure out between the 18-135mm or the 28-135mm.

why do i ask:

if i buy it in Canada, the kit comes with the 18-135mm. It is not USM.
if i buy it in US, the kit comes with 28-135mm. this one is USM.

i know that 'cassius' already wrote that USM is ultrasonicmotor, but as a newbie i'm really not sure which to get.

as for the 15-85, i feel like maybe it's too nice for a beginner?

The best thing to do is to read reviews however I tried looking for you and didn't find any good reviews, just short descriptions.

Still, based on field of view I wouldn't even consider the 28-135. 28mm will be limiting indoors.

It is really more between the 18-135mm or the even wider 15-85mm one, which would be what I would pick our of the three.

Chances are the 15-85mm will be a better lens. In general, whenever you get a longer range quality goes down, unless you pay a lot more.

Also, the 15-85mm has a USM. Which sounds like "better motors". They are probably faster and more silent. Perhaps more accurate too.

Just get the 15-85mm. I am sure you will love it. And later you can get a 70-200mm.

[Emanuel]

Yes, I am completely aware of this. But of course we are talking about a $1,700 body here. We plan to shoot my first feature with two Reds, build 21, 4.5k 2.33:1 using RC36 and RC42 for high detail wides and slow motion. I am all over Red. However this camera will be a heck of a lot of fun, and for 480 it should deliver some real nice stuff. Probably very decent most of the time for 720p.
I am all over 5D Mark II/7D too. :)

As matter of fact, they can't be compared to RED 'cause RED ONE can't compete with their convenience, form factor, weight, price range at all. And the IQ differences are negligeable or almost for general use. But regarding wide shots, it's another whole distinct story (@ movie mode, of course).

[Emanuel]

But regarding wide shots, it's another whole distinct story (@ movie mode, of course).However, I'm still waiting for just checking this out:

http://www.dvxuser.com/V6/showthread.php?p=1762831#post1762831

Maybe, it may come up as a total game-changer. It's wait and see!

[USLatin]

http://www.dvxuser.com/V6/showthread.php?p=1762831#post1762831

Holy shit!