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View Full Version : Eos Utility and remote live view



JoeC
09-22-2009, 07:54 PM
Does anyone have experience with the eos utility? On p131 of the 7d manual, it says I can shoot remotely while viewing the computer screen. Does this mean I can see on my computer the same image that's on the camera's lcd? If so, Does it work in video mode? Basically, I'm looking to use a laptop as a monitoring solution. Will it work that way?

Thanks
Joe

PS sold my dvx100a on ebay - put the money toward the 7d - I haven't been this excited about a camera since, well... since the dvx100.

Eddy Robinson
09-23-2009, 01:29 AM
It sure looks that way from the (EOS utility) manual - same page as the camera on canon's website. It very explicitly says you can do so with the 7d...doing it over USB looks a bit awkward (though there's a way to secure the USB cable into the camera).

Perry Wilson
09-23-2009, 01:54 AM
from what I have seen the camera is completely controllable from a computer u can even auto focus by clicking somewhere on the live view on your computer monitor... also change all of the settings without touching the cam... hopefully it works in video mode... that would make it a great studio cam...

J Davis
09-23-2009, 02:10 AM
Basically, I'm looking to use a laptop as a monitoring solution. Will it work that way?



Great sleuthing Joe ... if this works it will solve a lot of problems for everybody

notharrylume
09-23-2009, 04:42 AM
If this works, and I fear that it either won't in video, or that the controls aren't practically useable, but if it does, it would permit remote follow focus about $4000 cheaper than the alternatives! And that's a pretty big deal.

Boz
09-23-2009, 10:00 AM
Man, it sounds like if this works then a $300 10" netbook would be the perfect companion to the 7D. Small and light enough to be easily mounted, but yet still have full computer functionality.

mhood
09-23-2009, 10:02 AM
...and if they would incorporate a phone and GPS into the netbook, we would be all set!

bwwd
09-23-2009, 10:50 AM
you cant see anything under sunlight on my laptop,so take this into consideration,you would need biiiiiig hood.

mhood
09-23-2009, 10:54 AM
That's when you would break out the HD 3D USB Glasses.

Eddy Robinson
09-23-2009, 10:54 AM
If this works, and I fear that it either won't in video, or that the controls aren't practically useable, but if it does, it would permit remote follow focus about $4000 cheaper than the alternatives! And that's a pretty big deal.

I think you can definitely use it for monitoring, but I'm not so sure about remote FF and the like. Looking at the EOS utility manual (pdf here (http://gdlp01.c-wss.com/gds/6/0300002586/01/eu2.7-w-en.pdf)) it seems almost identical to the 5Dii...maybe someone can do some tests?

Eddy Robinson
09-23-2009, 10:57 AM
you cant see anything under sunlight on my laptop,so take this into consideration,you would need biiiiiig hood.

Use an umbrella. Or direct with a blanket over your head and talk a lot about your 'process' :happy:

Peter J. DeCrescenzo
09-23-2009, 11:00 AM
It'll be interesting to see how/if this works.

If it does display motion video on the computer screen, the video refresh rate might be slow via USB. Could also depend on what size the video is displayed at on the computer screen (e.g.: smaller video image might display faster, vs. full-screen video if possible might refresh slowly).

Even if the video refresh is slow, it could be helpful for focus, and framing too if it displays the full video image. I'd be cautious about using it for color or exposure judgments, unless the software allows display adjustments independent of cam settings.

I believe Hoodman sells hoods for laptops.

notharrylume
09-23-2009, 11:24 AM
Pages 29 and 30 of the EOS Utility Manual seem to say that you can focus remotely, but you can't operate the camera while in Live View mode. So follow focus does not seem possible.

Ian-T
09-23-2009, 12:19 PM
What kind of video stream is it? Is it the compressed H.264? Before and after you hit record?

edbarton
09-23-2009, 01:14 PM
The EOS utility as far as I know is the same program across the range i.e. no differences between 5D EOS Utility and 7d eos utility. With the 5D it works OK but isn't 25fps when you're recording, maybe about 12fps and isn't all that responsive. It's good when you aren't recording though.

J Davis
09-23-2009, 01:47 PM
The EOS utility as far as I know is the same program across the range i.e. no differences between 5D EOS Utility and 7d eos utility. With the 5D it works OK but isn't 25fps when you're recording, maybe about 12fps and isn't all that responsive. It's good when you aren't recording though.


So it's software you download? I thought it might be something that was on a CD in the box.

Eddy Robinson
09-23-2009, 04:07 PM
So it's software you download? I thought it might be something that was on a CD in the box.

Same thing these days, Canon makes it available online and in the box AFAIK. Less work.

J Davis
09-23-2009, 06:13 PM
:thumbup:@Eddy

Q: Has anyone used the current EOS utility with the 5D so that their laptop functions as a live monitor?
(as described in post 1)

Perry Wilson
09-23-2009, 06:35 PM
yes please... http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wpLBy4-WXE4 the ultimate in laziness... or if you have no arms... Live view can also be used to do time lapse.. you can set everything including photo time increment and also you can use a external hard drive instead of CF for time lapse

J Davis
10-03-2009, 01:17 PM
Q: Has anyone used the current EOS utility with the 5D so that their laptop functions as a live monitor?
(as described in post 1)



A: I can confirm ... IT WORKS !!!!!

Doing it right now with an intel macbook running osx 10.5.7.
No x5 or x10 zoom in while shooting unfortunately.
This is really going to save my neck on low shots people. I can start / stop the record button from EOS utility and just watch my laptop. (no need to buy the ikan now)

ydgmdlu
10-03-2009, 01:22 PM
A: I can confirm ... IT WORKS !!!!!

Doing it right now with an intel macbook running osx 10.5.7.
No x5 or x10 zoom in while shooting unfortunately.
This is really going to save my neck on low shots people. I can start / stop the record button from EOS utility and just watch my laptop. (no need to buy the ikan now)
WOW. This is the most exciting thing that I've read about the 7D in the last week!

J Davis
10-03-2009, 01:24 PM
WOW. This is the most exciting thing that I've read about the 7D in the last week!

I know this is f*cking awesome. I have a shoot coming up with a slider 4 inches off the floor and I was dreading it. Now its a breeze ... just gonna watch my laptop.
Image fills three quarters of the screen live while shooting !!!

Lucian
10-03-2009, 01:25 PM
how long can a usb tether be?

JoeC
10-03-2009, 01:33 PM
I think the limit to a usb cable is 15 ft I just got one from monoprice. However, there are devices which convert usb to run over ethernet cable - and they can go 150ft or more. I've got such a device on order, I'll post results.

-joe

J Davis
10-03-2009, 01:34 PM
First time I tried it with a usb cable that was 49" (125cm) and monitoring was good
I just switched the cable for the one that comes in the 7D box which is 77" (195cm) and
monitoring was a little jumpy but workable for composition.

This is really nice for pulling focus around as I am using a nikon AIS 35mm f1.4 right now.
Pulling focus all over the place while recording and watching it on my laptop.

Postmaster
10-03-2009, 01:48 PM
Did you say you can pull focus by clicking on the screen while recording?

Frank

J Davis
10-03-2009, 02:06 PM
No, I'm pulling focus around with a manual nikon lens.

I'm monitoring the focus while I do this from my laptop. The image fills three quarters of the screen which is far better than the 3" LCD on the camera
plus I'm not hurting my neck anymore.

Tim Joy
10-03-2009, 02:31 PM
How about lag in the movement?

J Davis
10-03-2009, 02:33 PM
With the 77" cable its is minimal. It might also be different with a different laptop.
On my macbook (2.1ghz) it is a little like watching a vimeo clip stutter but not as bad

On the shorter 49" cable I had no stutter at all

J Davis
10-03-2009, 02:43 PM
Is the LCD on the camera disabled when you're using EOS to monitor?

No the LCD works at the same time


This news is both good and bad.

Good because, well we can use decent netbooks as monitors

Bad because I just spent $600 on a brand new Manhattan LCD monitor, with battery charger and battery plate.

When it comes to run & gun my laptop will not balance on top of my 7D like your monitor will! :)

mhood
10-03-2009, 02:45 PM
This is wonderful! And it will dump the CF card during a break, right? (at least until it overheats).

J Davis
10-03-2009, 02:48 PM
And it will dump the CF card during a break, right?

Yeh ... might be quicker with card reader tho but I'm penny pinching because I think Jimmy Jannardy will drop the bomb regarding release dates soon

Eddy Robinson
10-03-2009, 05:48 PM
Win :-)

Kholi
10-03-2009, 05:56 PM
Yeh ... might be quicker with card reader tho but I'm penny pinching because I think Jimmy Jannardy will drop the bomb regarding release dates soon

If it's any time before the end of October that would be sweet. And if cameras are due out before the end of NEXT October that would be equally sweet.

But, what would be unfukwitably sweeter than that? RAW video from Nikon or Canon. Seeing as how the Video NEF stuff is already being worked on, it's [sadly] more probable that a raw video DSLR will appear before Scarlet or Epic.

Sweet?

Meanwhile, time to try out the Netbook with the Canon Softwares. w00t.

J Davis
10-03-2009, 06:53 PM
Meanwhile, time to try out the Netbook with the Canon Softwares. w00t.

now if only someone would hack the EOS utility to give us false color, histos, traffic lights and dancing girls...

ydgmdlu
10-03-2009, 07:44 PM
No the LCD works at the same time
Even better. :)

The EOS Utility sounds like magic sauce!

el presidente
10-04-2009, 01:51 AM
Ive just bought a marshall monitor...I read this n thought @!!^'s,

but then I reckon as the lcd/hdmi still works this would be great to monitor shot on laptop and pull focus in the one to one pixel mode on monitor

cjwolff
10-04-2009, 06:36 AM
Ive just bought a marshall monitor...I read this n thought @!!^'s,

but then I reckon as the lcd/hdmi still works this would be great to monitor shot on laptop and pull focus in the one to one pixel mode on monitor

I think you will find that Marshall helps you compose in camera on a broadcast-quality display versus the limited range of a laptop screen. I wouldn't fret over your purchase at all.

ryansheffer
10-04-2009, 10:28 AM
I just did a test showing that the hdmi remains live and HD while the eos utility is running. You can utilize all functions of the camera as well.

Meaning. Marshall monitor on the camera, director at a laptop. So awesome. Crazily better than what you can do with the 5d in terms of monitors.

It also gives the DP the ability to make changes with the director at his monitor while someone operates. GREAT.

The computer controlled focus pulls are also completely smooth and if you chooses the slowest motor pull you can make a super short pull last for a minute.

shorty15
10-04-2009, 10:54 AM
Wow, this feature sounds like a game changer for DSLR cinematography. I have a couple of questions about this EOS utility.

1. Can anyone take a picture of what the display looks like on a laptop?
2. What is the resolution of the image when the camera is recording?
3. How large is the image on the screen?
4. People have been mentioning the ability to focus remotely, can this be done when the camera is recording? Is this a possible replacement for a follow focus?

ryansheffer
10-04-2009, 11:15 AM
Wow, this feature sounds like a game changer for DSLR cinematography. I have a couple of questions about this EOS utility.

1. Can anyone take a picture of what the display looks like on a laptop?
2. What is the resolution of the image when the camera is recording?
3. How large is the image on the screen?
4. People have been mentioning the ability to focus remotely, can this be done when the camera is recording? Is this a possible replacement for a follow focus?


1. picture attached. Shown filling a 27" 1080p screen
2. Based on the image I would say it is 720x480, but I don't know for sure
3. You can make the image as large or small as you want.
4. Yes. This can be used as a follow focus. Completely. There is no way to make marks but the focus function in liveview is controllable enough to be used for that purpose. I would rather use a follow focus, but those are expensive. I will be using it to execute incredibly slow racks for stuff like macro footage.

shorty15
10-04-2009, 12:33 PM
I know that follow focus works during live view but I just want to be sure that it is not disabled when you press record. Second. How does that focus function work? Do you just click on the portion of the image that you want in focus after you have hit record?

shorty15
10-04-2009, 01:09 PM
I have read the utility manual but it is a little confusing. In the manual, they have you focus your image and then press record but they say nothing about being able to re-focus once you have begun to record. If it is possible, how do you change focus points once the camera is recording? can you achieve a smooth focus pull in the middle of your recording?

If this is possible, it could eliminate the need for a follow focus and an expensive monitor like a marshall. Hell in a very controlled studio or set environment, this could even eliminate the need for the grossly expensive Zfinder.

ryansheffer
10-04-2009, 01:34 PM
Yes. The focus functionality works while recording. There are buttons you press that represent three speeds to move the focus motors at. If you hold one of these down it will do a perfectly smooth rack. The lens I tested this with is the tamron 17-50 2.8.

ydgmdlu
10-04-2009, 01:41 PM
Yes. The focus functionality works while recording. There are buttons you press that represent three speeds to move the focus motors at. If you hold one of these down it will do a perfectly smooth rack. The lens I tested this with is the tamron 17-50 2.8.
Crazy!

If there's one thing that puts the 7D way over the GH1, it's the remote live view... Not to start anything, just sayin'...

J Davis
10-04-2009, 02:39 PM
1. picture attached. Shown filling a 27" 1080p screen
2. Based on the image I would say it is 720x480, but I don't know for sure


If the live view stream is the same as live view hdmi then its 480p which is 853x480.
I have a small screen laptop but from my first impressions eos utility live view seemed higher res than 480p

JoeC
10-04-2009, 03:35 PM
Has anybody tried it with a netbook yet? I'm wondering if the processor can handle it. Also, does anyone plan to attach the laptop to a shoulder rig? I would love to see some pics of that.

I think the ability to remote focus with the eos utility holds a lot of potential for us later on down the road. It probably wouldn't be that hard to decode the usb signals that affect the focusing and write a little app that would give you a more full featured electronic follow focus - something that would let you put multiple focus marks like cue points and be able to jump to them with a key press.


-Joe

shorty15
10-04-2009, 06:22 PM
the Canon utility manual shows the program operating on a windows computer but does it work with Mac OSX? the utility manual shows system requirements for PC but not mac. anyone?

shorty15
10-04-2009, 06:28 PM
ignore my last post, i found the eos utility manual for mac

ryansheffer
10-04-2009, 07:22 PM
Hmmm. You asked for a picture and I posted one of me using it in OS X.

shorty15
10-04-2009, 07:40 PM
wow, I cant believe I missed that I was looking at the size of the image but did not bother to look at what OS you were using, no biggie, I answered my own question

visugeek
10-04-2009, 08:03 PM
So now we just need to find dependable wireless USB adapters with a good range, and we are set. : )

ydgmdlu
10-04-2009, 08:27 PM
I was thinking of getting wireless USB adapters to test...

j
10-04-2009, 08:31 PM
This sort of reminds me of the excitement of the massive Edwierdo DIY DOF thread...

MikeWilkinson
10-05-2009, 08:08 AM
What about the WFT-E5A? The wireless file transmitter add-on for this camera? Seems like wireless focus pulling would be an option with it. While not as cheap as a wireless USB set up, at $700 still much more affordable than a traditional WLFF.

When this device comes out (projected release in November) hopefully a few people get them and can run some tests.

ryansheffer
10-05-2009, 10:34 AM
Yea. I was already putting that down on my list of purchases. It is possible that the WFT-E5A plus the on one software dslr remote would create for incredible wireless focus pulling from an iphone.

I haven't found evidence either way as to whether the on one software supports this feature, but I want to hand an AC an iphone to pull focus while we steadicam.

JoeC
10-05-2009, 10:46 AM
From http://www.cameratown.com/news/news.cfm?id=8091 -


The WFT-E5A will also support the WFT server, which enables remote shooting while viewing the Live View image on a computer or handheld terminal, such as a smart phone.

Looks promising.

meauounji
10-05-2009, 05:07 PM
You know what would be TOTALLY awesome? A tablet PC running EOS utility :D

plasmasmp
10-05-2009, 05:31 PM
I'll have video of that soon. I have a UMPC R2H tablet with EOS utility. The 15fps makes it not particularly useful, but it does work.

plasmasmp
10-05-2009, 08:47 PM
It does work, here's an image to show relative size. Works just as well on the UMPC as it does on other machines.
http://img43.imageshack.us/img43/518/1001574m.jpg

meauounji
10-05-2009, 09:13 PM
I notice you're still setting up the utility in that pic. does the program run smoothly on a UMPC like that? It's like the perfect size

plasmasmp
10-05-2009, 09:21 PM
I'll have quick overview video up in a few minutes to show how it runs. Appears to be 15fps refresh rate, but works just like it does on my faster PC.

polr
10-05-2009, 09:55 PM
I seem to get inconsistent frame rates in the viewer.. anywhere from 10 to 24 or more fps running on the latest Mac Pro. Perhaps a freshly booted camera will run faster than after it's been on for a little while?

j
10-05-2009, 11:46 PM
That's so cool that it hurts my head.

plasmasmp
10-05-2009, 11:52 PM
Pulling focus with a tablet UMPC
TcPib7go9d0

Eddy Robinson
10-06-2009, 12:03 AM
http://www.evolinium.com/images/Robs%20pics/Spock%20-win%20in%20this%20sector.jpg

j
10-06-2009, 09:14 AM
With all that breathing, it looked like a remote zoom... :-(

Richard Allen Crook
01-30-2010, 10:36 PM
I'm reviving this thread because I recently noticed the ability to focus (among other things) remotely. I'm surprised this fizzled out in October, lol.

Has anyone tried to beta test this in a real-world scenario? I can see the cable being the main problem...but it's not a big hurdle t. I think the actual "following" part in the truest spirit of the term would be the issue...not being able to follow a subject moving from the camera away, or vice versa.

Ryan Farnes
01-30-2010, 10:58 PM
I've been meaning to use my laptop as a preview monitor through the EOS utility since I initially tried it out. Last few interviews we've done, we're setting up so quickly, I have just used the 7D's lcd.

It seems like a great little tool in a controlled studio type setting, but ultimately, I'm looking to just get a small HDMI monitor.

J Davis
01-30-2010, 11:06 PM
I don't own an external monitor, so on shoots with budgets we rent one. On shoots without a budget I use a mix between on camera LCD (when actors are stationary) and EOS (when things are tricky.)

Best use of EOS live view happens when tha camera is close to the ground and I don't want to be straining my frickin' neck. I had a slider shot with the rail 4 inches off the ground - thank god I had the live view.

Only thing I gotta mention is to have a really stable place to put your laptop. I use a plastic milk crate as the irregular surface helps prevent the laptop from taking a tumble, plus milk crates are light weight and (usually) free.

monochromic
09-22-2010, 06:59 AM
How is the image quality in live view mode? I'm guessing it's not full resolution of course? Any idea of the resolution?