7D has manual control 1080p 24/25/30p and 720p 50/60p

[DallasZhen]

7D has manual control 1080p 24/25/30p and 720p 50/60p

WOWWW!!!

[joe 1008]

If so, I bet on a firmware update for the 5D, soon...

[Rhys Day]

source?

[DallasZhen]

I have a friend is a Chinese IT website editor, he/she told me 7D has good video via HDMI and 24p in 1080p 60p in 720p. I don't know what exactly good means, hopefully is better than 5d mark 2's.

what interested me is, he/she said there is another DSLR model in the line. I don't really care if it is 1D 4 or something, because I feel 5d2 is just still in my price figure.

[Rhys Day]

you don't know the sex of your friend?

[Jordan_S]

you don't know the sex of your friend?

It's more genteel to say gender. Hermaphrodite is my guess...

[DallasZhen]

there is he, I was try to hind his identity.

but another few hours , things will become very clear whatever the figure is right or not.

[DallasZhen]

forgot the audio, there is mic phone plug in and sample is 48KHz.

[noelsphoto]

Any word on autofocus during videorecording?
Also pricing?

[DallasZhen]

there will be better af in video.

7d.jpg (http://www.dvxuser.com/V6/attachment.php?attachmentid=12465&stc=1&d=1251720216)

[squig]

any idea when they will actually be in stores?

[Richard Wilis]

Hey guy's.

The source of this rumour (google translated): http://translate.google.com.au/translate?hl=en&sl=zh-CN&tl=en&u=http://www.mobile01.com/topicdetail.php%3Ff%3D244%26t%3D1211890

Scroll down to the paragraph about "LCD screen and the fuselage Introduction"

"Video camera functionality in the full HD (1920 × 1080) can choose to 30/25/24 frames per second frame rate, HD (1280 × 720), as well as standard definition (640 × 480) can select a more fluid per 60 / 50 of the frame rate. Video recording mode can use an external microphone. Not only can experience immersive sound effects (sampling frequency: 48KHz), and because the microphone can be away from the camera, so the camera movements recorded voice will not be able to get a clear recording. In addition, the video shoot, can have use the manual mode, make full use of the image sensors of digital SLR camera features a large, greatly expanded its depth of field control, image expression.
EOS 7D house equipped with a video camera editing features, even in the shooting scene, surrounded by no computer, you can also right before and after the cut scene editing, you can also enjoy the slideshow of all 5-second video playback. Compatible devices because the connection can use HDMI terminals, so be able to enjoy to enjoy high-definition brings the fun. "

Awesome news, if this rumour turns out to be true! :)

[squig]

thx richard

If these specs are for real this thing will put the GH1 to shame and there might finally be an almost flawless DSLR.

[mhood]

It seems Canon was listening, huh? My fingers are crossed...

[Stephen Mick]

Oh no. My GH1 might be put to shame by another camera? Really?

I guess I'll just have to reassure it and tell it that it still shoots full 1080p/24, and has full manual controls, and that the picture looks beautiful. I hope my GH1 can get over this "shame."

[Richard Wilis]

The mentioned Wireless File Transmitter (optional accessory) is pretty interesting too. If it allows us to directly offload the CF cards to an external hard drive via USB.

"Wireless File Transmitter WFT-E5C with the battery box and handle the same need to use the camera tripod next hole, fixed at the bottom of the camera to use. Can be wired or wireless LAN (IEEE802.11b / g and a), high-speed communications. In addition, due to have the USB terminal, you can connect a portable hard drive, GPS navigation devices and Bluetooth devices. Moreover, the same battery box and handle the same as BG-E7 holding machine equipped with a vertical shooting buttons and dial used to ensure that BG-E7 with the same operability. The WFT-E5C can be applied to wired or wireless remote shooting and DLNA (Digital Living Network Alliance). In addition, you can have the same browser-enabled mobile devices (cell phones) for wireless transmission of information. Images via mobile devices capable of browsing, wireless remote control and even change the camera settings, and shutter release."

[mcgeedigital]

Oh no. My GH1 might be put to shame by another camera? Really?

I guess I'll just have to reassure it and tell it that it still shoots full 1080p/24, and has full manual controls, and that the picture looks beautiful. I hope my GH1 can get over this "shame."


Lol, snort.

[squig]

Oh no. My GH1 might be put to shame by another camera? Really?

I guess I'll just have to reassure it and tell it that it still shoots full 1080p/24, and has full manual controls, and that the picture looks beautiful. I hope my GH1 can get over this "shame."

Do you really think a 2x crop sensor with a third of the bit-rate is going to compare? It's common knowledge around here that the MKII produces a better picture than the GH1 and the 7D sounds like it might be even better than the MKII.

[Stephen Mick]

Yeah, I guess the footage comparisons I've seen online and the one I did yesterday in the field with both a 5D and a GH1 aren't valid in the face of "common knowledge."

If these specs are true, I'm sure the 7D will be a very nice camera. But if side by side comparisons and tests have shown us anything, it's that bit rate and sensor size are not everything, and that in the right hands, any of these cameras are more than capable.

Don't get me wrong, I'm glad Canon is delivering (if the specs are true). Competition and choice make the market stronger and our options much more attractive.

But my GH1 works just as well today as it did yesterday, and I expect it to do so for quite some time.

[roxics]

This is supposed to be announced today?

[Rakesh Jacob]

LMFAO
Squig stop pissing off GH1 owners.

[editman]

This seams to be very interesting news even thou I have D90 and GH1. Might get 7D also :)

[mhood]

I just might have to get a new sig...

[sblfilms]

Barring any non-sense on Canon's part, this is the camera I've been waiting for. If it has full res uncompressed HDMI output as well, I will literally have no issues at all with it.

[mhood]

I wonder about maximum recording time still, but I'm hiding C notes even as we speak.

[jenningsp]

anyone wanna buy an SGpro or a DVX100????

[KeithAndrews.TV]

Well they added the 25/24p feature a lot of users were requesting, but not being a FF sensor will keep the 5D in the mix for quite a bit longer. I personally do not find the DOF capability from the Rebel T1i all that impressive, so the 7D is not going to be any different.

[FatDaddy]

Glad that Matt at McGee Digital told me about the boards over here. I've been listening to photog sites and they barely talk about video.

My body is sweaty all over w/excitement and I'm not even watching "Police Women of Broward County" :grin:

[mcgeedigital]

my body is sweaty all over w/excitement and i'm not even watching "police women of broward county" :grin:

tmi!

[Michael Olsen]

Any news if it is true 24p, or in a 60i stream ala GH-1?

[plasmasmp]

This will be the almighty DSLR. Only been waiting a year for someone to get it right!

[dcloud]

i doubt itll in a stream... if ever it is in 24p

[Kholi]

No 720/60P. You can choose 30/25/24 in 720. And proper shutters for Pal and Ntsc.

[Lee Wilson]

No 720/60P.

The press release says there is 720/60p.


"In addition, can be realized per second 30/25/24 frames, resolution 1920 × 1080 pixel full HD movie capture, the use of high-definition picture quality (1280 × 720 pixel resolution) and standard-definition (640 × 480 pixel resolution) is able to 60/50 frames per second shooting."

[Kholi]

I said the same thing. It looks like to me that it says 1080 30, 25, and 24 and 720 and 480 @ 60/50? But the guy said it's mis-translated and they mean that all modes will have a selectable shutter that corresponds.

I'd be okay with some 720/60, though. Even if it's just there and I don't use it.

We'll see tomorrow when an actual US Press Release surfaces.

[Orchidthief]

This is tech for you! Always something new and interesting coming out....sigh. Gonna burn holes in my pocket.

[sunburst]

What is the codec / data rate?

Can anyone compare this with the gh-1 codec?

thanks

[sunburst]

I can feel my gh1 preorders getting hot!

Only to --- maybe cancel them? lol

[sunburst]

QUOTE= good video via HDMI

does this mean UNCOMPRESSED output possible?

[Reptorama]

Well this looks like the reason to sell my D90. :-)

Could anybody who is more at home with Canon lenses suggest what primes would be a good purchase together with the body?

What would be the equivalent of a 28mm, 50mm and a 100mm on a 35mm full frame?

[ydgmdlu]

Well this looks like the reason to sell my D90. :-)

Could anybody who is more at home with Canon lenses suggest what primes would be a good purchase together with the body?

What would be the equivalent of a 28mm, 50mm and a 100mm on a 35mm full frame?
Wait a minute... If you already own a D90, then you already know the answer. The 7D's chip will be very close in size. You might even be able to use your existing Nikon lenses on it with the appropriate adapter.

[Dafilman21]

I cannot wait till tomorrow to see the official press release so all the speculation and leaks can either be confirmed or shot to hell! Either way bring on tomorrow!

[dadoboy]

If you can stay up late tonight, they'll probably be having press releases in Asia which is one day ahead I believe.

[manglerBMX]

its rumored heavily to be a 1.6x crop factor, so for a 28mm you'd need a 17.5mm, etc..

[Ramon Boutviseth]

excited :)

[Reptorama]

Wait a minute... If you already own a D90, then you already know the answer. The 7D's chip will be very close in size. You might even be able to use your existing Nikon lenses on it with the appropriate adapter.
Oh sweet! :-) (I didn't know how close the sensor sizes were) Thanks ydgmdlu!

[Kholi]

its rumored heavily to be a 1.6x crop factor, so for a 28mm you'd need a 17.5mm, etc..


1.6x crop from "Full Frame" is perfect for Cinematography. A 17mm isn't even the standard ultra wide in a Cinema Lens kit so that's really no issue. And given how fast and clean the MKii was, this camera being newer, using something like a 17/2.8 or even an 11-16/2.8 Tokina will be just fine.

The 1.6x Crop and 24p are enough to tide me over for a long time if the image is the same quality as the Mkii.

[philip bloom]

yes but not EVERYONE is happy with these new features http://philipbloom.co.uk/2009/08/31/someones-not-happy-about-the-release-of-the-canon-7d/

[Taylor Rudd]

The 1.6x Crop and 24p are enough to tide me over for a long time if the image is the same quality as the Mkii.

Add better rolling shutter management and we have a winner. Super winner, even.

[Kholi]

Add better rolling shutter management and we have a winner. Super winner, even.


I think that it'll be better managed. As long as it's up to snuff with the GH-1 then there's really nothing left to complain about. I'm hoping that the 60p was not a typo myself, just in case.

I was kinda still worried about long runs but being able to own two and just shoot at different angles, overlapping the long takes should be fine.

And of course... having video out during recording... a certain oversight by a certain company that is really unforgivable...

[sunburst]

I As long as it's up to snuff with the GH-1 then there's really nothing left to complain about. ..

what about autofocus? thats a big one for me!

Although codec should be number 1, since I do lots of POST / screen - work.

Would a 7d be here BEFORE gh2 is available?


somebody please HELP me decide!

I can seriously feel my credit card being charged for multiple gh-1s by MIDNIGHT
tonight!

[ProjX v2.0]

Why decide? Get both!

[Adam J McKay]

However small the market may be. It would seem that if Canon made a dedicated video camera with the technology they already clearly have, and sold it for in and around the same price as say an xh-a1...

Oh boy, that would be something.

I for see the 35mm adapter market slowly disappearing in the next 5 years.

But this may be the dslr that turns me to Canon. Why have you failed me Nikon...WHY???

Unless the rumoured d700s has a minimum of manual controls and a better codec im out to Canon.

[Tracey Lee]

yes but not EVERYONE is happy with these new features http://philipbloom.co.uk/2009/08/31/someones-not-happy-about-the-release-of-the-canon-7d/

Thanks you for that video Philip. I was fuming a few moments ago and now I'm laughing. I keep rethinking using a 35mm adapter again. Maybe I'll look up Wayne again.

[ChipG]

There are some laptops coming out this Christmas that have hdmi inputs. Curious to see how this cam will work in the field recording directly via hdmi.

[sunburst]

Why decide? Get both!

ha...ha.....................he...hee.............. ....gugggggleelleee.

ha.....ha.....huh? huh? bwaaaaaaahhhaaaaaaa

[PixelMagic]

There are some laptops coming out this Christmas that have hdmi inputs. Curious to see how this cam will work in the field recording directly via hdmi.

Do you have any links to said laptops? I'd love to see which companies will be releasing these.

[Jim Klatt]

Couldn't you just use the SD card slot and get and hdmi adapter?

[Digigenic]

If so, I bet on a firmware update for the 5D, soon...
That would be nice, and it makes a lot of sense, therefore I don't think it will happen.

[Taylor Rudd]

Couldn't you just use the SD card slot and get and hdmi adapter?

I don't think SD card slots work the same way PCMCIA or Express Card slots do. They aren't for expansion, but simply for use with SD memory cards...right?

[arroway]

I'm going to become that which I hate most if Canon doesn't grant 24p to the 5DMII...

A Scarlet fanboy.

[djkarn105]

I don't think SD card slots work the same way PCMCIA or Express Card slots do. They aren't for expansion, but simply for use with SD memory cards...right?

Yeah, They don't have the bandwidth PCMCIA cards do

[djkarn105]

I for see the 35mm adapter market slowly disappearing in the next 5 years.


Less than that.

[Rakesh Jacob]

I'm going to become that which I hate most if Canon doesn't grant 24p to the 5DMII...

A Scarlet fanboy.

Yeah cause spending ~$7000 for a 2/3" cam instead of ~$1700 for an APS-C DSLR makes the most sense? OK... I guess that's the kinda "logic" that creates fanboys so good luck with that.

[Cranky]

It's more genteel to say gender. Hermaphrodite is my guess...
Gender is social role. Also, it many languages other than English words have gender. "Sex" is a proper word for asking is it a girl or a boy. I am sick and tired seeing "gender" on countless web sites asking for personal info.

[Kholi]

Yeah cause spending ~$7000 for a 2/3" cam instead of ~$1700 for an APS-C DSLR makes the most sense? OK... I guess that's the kinda "logic" that creates fanboys so good luck with that.

Without taking any sides here, don't forget APS-C DSLR that skips lines to achieve a compressed image, recording time limits and possible overheating issues (all but the GH-1 have had them). As well, a limitation of 60p @ 720. At this rate, also, I doubt that a 2/3" Scarlet will cost 7K and I wouldn't be at all surprised if, and when it finally happens, that it comes in at S35 Raw for about three or four grand.

With the Full Frame versions being more expensive.

Although money is a factor, the cost of something that's created to do a specific job doesn't make it invalid.

[Jim Klatt]

I don't think SD card slots work the same way PCMCIA or Express Card slots do. They aren't for expansion, but simply for use with SD memory cards...right?

I misspoke...what about using the express card slot? Many Macbook Pro's have this, as well as the new 17incher...

[Jim Klatt]

You know how people add "in bed" to the end of fortunes, etc? I am going to start adding, "when Scarlet comes out" instead...

[Rakesh Jacob]

Agree with ya Kholi, just that his only reason to become a fanboy of Scarlet was because the 5Dmkii wasnt gonna get 24p....??? But a $1700 cam is so WTF LOL

[Rakesh Jacob]

You know how people add "in bed" to the end of fortunes, etc? I am going to start adding, "when Scarlet comes out" instead...

You know I always add "in your butt" to the end of fortunes, it's awkward but funnier than in bed. Try it next time :huh:

EDIT: Just had Panda Express. My fortune is "Your opportunities are many, in your butt" My wife's fortune is "You are a charmer, in your butt." Does my system work or what? :thumbup:

[Finster]

yes but not EVERYONE is happy with these new features http://philipbloom.co.uk/2009/08/31/someones-not-happy-about-the-release-of-the-canon-7d/

It's been a while since I've laughed that hard. Absolutely hilarious, Philip.

[arroway]

Agree with ya Kholi, just that his only reason to become a fanboy of Scarlet was because the 5Dmkii wasnt gonna get 24p....??? But a $1700 cam is so WTF LOL

Did your cat just die or something?

It was meant in jest.

Relax.

[Pirata]

yes but not EVERYONE is happy with these new features http://philipbloom.co.uk/2009/08/31/someones-not-happy-about-the-release-of-the-canon-7d/

good stuff phil :grin:

[Finster]

what about autofocus? thats a big one for me!

There are rumors, but I didn't read anything about it in the press release.

Someone please correct me if I'm wrong.

[Rakesh Jacob]

Did your cat just die or something?

It was meant in jest.

Relax.

I know, so was mine. My cats are fine btw thank you. :thumbup:
I was gonna edit/add that I was just messing with you to the original post but then Kholi distracted me :( I sorry

[Lee_B]

I'm guessing the 5d mark II isn't going to get a firmware update?

:(

[Digigenic]

There are rumors, but I didn't read anything about it in the press release.

Someone please correct me if I'm wrong.
It appears to be part of a leaked press release from China, which is subject to mistranslations, combined with a rumour that was started in a seperate forum.
I'm thinking about 98% of what's been reported is accurate.
I'm not sure about the video features until the official US Press Release sufaces.

[Digigenic]

I'm guessing the 5d mark II isn't going to get a firmware update?

:(
Since it's something that should happen, I have a feeling it won't happen.
That's the way things work.

[alexdias]

We'll all see it in less than 24 hours.

[youngindiefilms]

... I personally do not find the DOF capability from the Rebel T1i all that impressive, so the 7D is not going to be any different.

Did you get hit buy a bus or something?

[Finster]

It appears to be part of a leaked press release from China, which is subject to mistranslations, combined with a rumour that was started in a seperate forum.
I'm thinking about 98% of what's been reported is accurate.
I'm not sure about the video features until the official US Press Release sufaces.

Ahhh, so that's the Chinese version on Canon Rumors? Will the US Press Release first appear on the Canon USA web site? The guys here (http://nexus404.com/Blog/2009/08/26/canon-eos-7d-dslr-release-date-rumored-for-september-1st-7d-dslr-with-121-megapixel-sensor-1080p-hd-video-and-3-inch-oled-display/) make it sound like it's going to be more than just a posting on a web site.

[roxics]

If this camera is true and does offer 24/25/30p at 1080, what do you think the chances are the next spring we'll see a new digital rebel that also does 1080/24p? As it stands right now they are only 4 frames away.

This camera looks great and it has me in high hopes, but by the time I pay off some bills, get trough the holidays and start saving some coin, a new rebel will probably be announced.

[dcloud]

I personally do not find the DOF capability from the Rebel T1i all that impressive, so the 7D is not going to be any different.

LOL ... gimme a break. DOF doesnt make films.

[John Caballero]

LOL ... gimme a break. DOF doesnt make films.

Exactly.

[Digigenic]

Ahhh, so that's the Chinese version on Canon Rumors? Will the US Press Release first appear on the Canon USA web site? The guys here (http://nexus404.com/Blog/2009/08/26/canon-eos-7d-dslr-release-date-rumored-for-september-1st-7d-dslr-with-121-megapixel-sensor-1080p-hd-video-and-3-inch-oled-display/) make it sound like it's going to be more than just a posting on a web site.
Almost every major camera has some sort of a special unveiling, and since this is going to be the first of its kind, it warrants the additional attention.
The rest of the information that particular post you referenced is providing has been ruled out by a majority as innacurate. That was based on early reports, fueled mostly by speculation, what is being reported now is from supposed official leaked documents, which include full photo spreads and information on lenses etc.
Of course, all of the documentation appears, at least when I last looked, to have come from China. And all sorts of stuff can get lost in translation, so aside from some of the more obvious characteristics of the camera, I'll just wait until the official US Press release provides the full video specifications.

[luke stewart]

What a way to knock the wind out of the GH1's sails (sales). Just as GH1's are becoming more available, Canon lays down a killer hand. Ouch.

[dcloud]

with 2 digic 4 processor im assuming it can do proper scaling instead of skipping lines... i could be wrong

[hungrych]

http://www.usa.canon.com/consumer/controller?act=ModelInfoAct&fcategoryid=139&modelid=19356
and first hands on is out http://gizmodo.com/5349829/canon-7d-dslr-first-hands-on-18-megapixels-24fps-full-hd-video-for-1900

[Rodrigo Medina]

It's already on pre-order on amazon.

[ryansheffer]

Preordered.

[ethan cooper]

to quote Blazing Saddles:
"It's twoo, it's twoo, it's twoo"

[Rodrigo Medina]

Wow! That was fast.

[Sumfun]

The press release is also on DP Review, with a hands on preview and sample images. After 30 years of using Nikon, I might have to get myself a Canon.

Note: Max file size is 4GB, or 12 minutes for 1080p.

[fates]

Looks like the amount of jello has been reduced significantly...
http://vimeo.com/6370469?hd=1

[ethan cooper]

Looks like the amount of jello has been reduced significantly...
http://vimeo.com/6370469?hd=1

My guess is that's what the 2nd processor is for.

[mcgeedigital]

ideo specification

The 7D offers HD video capture at 1920 x 1080 pixels (1080P) at 30, 25 or 24 frames per second or 1280 x 720 pixels (720P) at 60 or 50 frames per second. The built-in internal microphone captures monaural audio. There is a socket for a 3.5mm external microphone that allows recording of stereo sound. There is also an option to cut the beginning and end of a movie in one second increments in the camera.
Sizes • 1920x1080: 30/24 fps (NTSC), 25/24 fps (PAL)
• 1280x720 (HD): 60 fps (NTSC), 50 fps (PAL)
• 640x480 (SD): 60 fps (NTSC), 50 fps (PAL)
Audio 44.1kHz Mono (Internal Mic), Linear PCM
Format .MOV MPEG-4 AVC, H.264
File size 5.5 MB/sec (1080P), 5.5 MB/sec (720P), 2.8 MB/sec (VGA)
Max file size per clip 4GB, max duration 29min 59sec,
Running time 12 min for 1080P, 12 min for 720P, 24 min for VGA


http://www.dpreview.com/previews/canoneos7d/page13.asp

[sblfilms]

Well, gulp, I put in my pre-order on Amazon. Bye bye HF100 and SGblade, it has been a great ride!

[morgan_moore]

4 gb =
4000 mb
12 mins =
720 Seconds
5.555555556 MBPer Second

Stacks up from the clip timing

Could this mean stoopid compression ?

S

[sblfilms]

It's ~45mbps h.264. Considering how good some of the stuff we've seen at half that bitrate in h.264 looks, I don't think people will be whining about the compression much on the 7D.

[Sacksnack]

Looks like the amount of jello has been reduced significantly...
http://vimeo.com/6370469?hd=1


I was just going to say that. These clips actually show the camera moving. Looks pretty good to me.

http://web.canon.jp/imaging/eosd/samples/eos7d/

Canon FTW!

[moreg72]

4 gb =
4000 mb
12 mins =
720 Seconds
5.555555556 MBPer Second

Stacks up from the clip timing

Could this mean stoopid compression ?

S

forgive my ignorance,im confused about this also.im trying to figure out if 7D has the same image quality as the 5Dmk2. from the specs below,does it mean that the 7d is less compressed than the 5Dmk2?

5Dmk2: 4.8 MBytes/sec (1080p), 2.2 MBytes/sec (VGA)
Quicktime MOV using H.264 codec, PCM codec for audio

7D: 5.5 MB/sec (1080P), 5.5 MB/sec (720P), 2.8 MB/sec (VGA)
.MOV MPEG-4 AVC, H.264

im not very knowledgeable when it comes to compression and data rates. can anybody give an insight regarding this?any opinion would be greatly appreciated....thanks

[Reptorama]

There is another sample video here courtesy of Popsci.com

http://vimeo.com/6372689?hd=1

[plasmasmp]

wow. those new samples. wow. just wow.

[morgan_moore]

Yeah Im confused
I thought Ex1 = 35mbs
5d2 around 40mbs

forgive the ignorance plaese explain

S

[Otis Grapsas]

Judging by the Line Of Sight clip the shuttering is better than any other CMOS camera I have seen. It doesn't look like it would limit the operator in any way. Everything in the shade looks excellent. The direct sunlight material is dull in color, high in contrast and contains lots of highlight clipping, but this could be operator error.

[Uwe Lansing]

What a day! I think its the "camera of the year" - simply a must have. Can´t wait to hold it in my hands...

btw: please join the 2 big threads here - its exhausting to read both.

[Nik Manning]

Yeah Im confused
I thought Ex1 = 35mbs
5d2 around 40mbs

forgive the ignorance plaese explain

S

I believe it is this

=44 Mbps [Megabit-per-second]
=44000 Kbps [Kilobit-per-second]
=5.5 MB/sec [Megabyte-per-second]
=5500 KB/sec [Kilobyte-per-second]

[John Caballero]

wow. those new samples. wow. just wow.

And WOW and WOW and WOW. They look great so far. Jello? what's jello?

[USLatin]

Did they announce if the audio gain will have a manual mode?

[plasmasmp]

Anyone here wondering about the HDMI out? I've looked through the menus, but I doubt any of those hosehead digicam review sights will even test the HDMI out. I'm hoping for Full HD, and it would be so nice to get around the h.264 compressor.


Did they announce if the audio gain will have a manual mode?
Audio gain is not in the menus. Will probably have to wait for a magic lantern update for that.

[Isaac_Brody]

The Line of Sight clip looks amazing.

[Uwe Lansing]

http://robgalbraith.com/bins/multi_page.asp?cid=7-10042-10239-10240

[sunburst]

anyway to download the passage?

it stutters real bad on my connection

[USLatin]

Audio gain is not in the menus. Will probably have to wait for a magic lantern update for that.

What a shame. I wonder why? To save something for the 8D? So that it doesn't become easy to notice the noise at high gain? They just didn't get around to it?

Like you said the update should be quite the sure thing, but it might take some time. Oh well.

I guess for the price there is no reason to complain! What a steal!

Is there any hope for a less compressed stream to be recorded somehow?

[plasmasmp]

5-10% higher bitrate. I love this camera. Gimme now!

IF the HDMI is uncompressed, which I doubt, yes you can record that to any HDMI capture source which means you could possibly record uncompressed. I'm not going to put a whole lot of hope into that being real. You'd have the equivalent of a mini Viper Filmstream if that was true.

[bill totolo]

For reference from The Passage:

http://cdn.buzznet.com/assets/users16/billtotolo/default/canon-passage-lenses--large-msg-125179371756.jpg

[sunburst]

5-10% higher bitrate. .

you mean over the mk 5d?

[ryansheffer]

Yea. Reports are around 47mbps. Which is even higher when you consider 24p vs. 30p.

[Kegan]

Oh boy...maybe it's time to get back in the camera game. This is mind blowing. To swipe or not to swipe, that is the question.

Kegan

[squig]

LMFAO
Squig stop pissing off GH1 owners.

awww it's my favorite sport.

[cjwolff]

Gender is social role. Also, it many languages other than English words have gender. "Sex" is a proper word for asking is it a girl or a boy. I am sick and tired seeing "gender" on countless web sites asking for personal info.

+1. Cosigned.

[squig]

Yea. Reports are around 47mbps. Which is even higher when you consider 24p vs. 30p.

It's D-Day at long last :grin::beer::thumbup::Drogar-Smoke(DBG)::2vrolijk_08:

:violin: GH1 users

[cjwolff]

It's D-Day at long last :grin::beer::thumbup::Drogar-Smoke(DBG)::2vrolijk_08:

:violin: GH1 users

I'm sure they are vomiting blood, convulsing, and thrashing about on the floor over at reduser as well. :furious3: ( modified, yeah I was right)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Roberto B http://reduser.net/forum/images/style_reduser/buttons/viewpost.gif
the problem with red is that jannard has to have an identical offer first.

the gang is however happy to know the owner of this new company is aware of this thread.. he listens us.. this is the best he can offer to us for the present.

Last time I looked, neither Canon nor Nikon has a camera that does what the RED ONE does. (http://reduser.net/forum/showpost.php?p=467293&postcount=26)

Jim
__________________

[Jordan_S]

Gender is social role. Also, it many languages other than English words have gender. "Sex" is a proper word for asking is it a girl or a boy. I am sick and tired seeing "gender" on countless web sites asking for personal info.

My comment, which I proofread prior to posting, says the word gender is more genteel. It makes no other claim. It is for this reason that most people would agree inquiring, "Is it a boy or a girl?" after the birth of a baby is preferable to asking, "So, what is the sex?" :beer:

[Uwe Lansing]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ChkcX9qdgl8&feature=channel

[editman]

Just placed an order for the 7D to complement my D90 and GH1.

[rambooc1]

Clip direct from the camera, jello is bad from simple hand held.
http://s3.amazonaws.com/movies.dpreview.com/canoneos7d/MVI_9579.MOV

Cheers Rambo

[ydgmdlu]

That's not bad jello at all. Especially considering that there's barely any camera movement to use as reference.

Look at the moving camera shots from the samples on Canon's Web site ("The Passage" and "Line of Sight"). I would say that the 7D at least matches the abilities of the GH1 in the rolling shutter department.

[editman]

Jello look as the GH1 in 1920x1080 mode. 1280x720 might have the advantage of less jello just like the GH1. 1920x1080/50p would remedy much of the jello but maybe these cameras can't keep up with that rez and fps.

[hermmermferm]

HDMI out, Aja Ki Pro possibility? Why no word/news on this? Seems like the biggest feature to me..

[xbourque]

HDMI out, Aja Ki Pro possibility? Why no word/news on this? Seems like the biggest feature to me..

Jannard's gonna blow a fuse if this thing has clean, uncompressed, full raster HDMI output.

"But... But.... you can't just upgrade the "brain" and keep the compact flash slot and the LCD screen!! You'll have to get rid of _everything_ to upgrade in a couple years!!!"

-X

[booggerg2]

Jannard's gonna blow a fuse if this thing has clean, uncompressed, full raster HDMI output.

"But... But.... you can't just upgrade the "brain" and keep the compact flash slot and the LCD screen!! You'll have to get rid of _everything_ to upgrade in a couple years!!!"

-X

Hahah That was my point the entire time too... it's hilarious all these fanbois proclaim the advantages of modularity when we're talking about being able to detach a handle from an old camera and put it on a new one.. LOL okay.. I can use my old camera strap on my new one, that makes my Panasonic DVX100 and HMC150 modular cameras!

[xbourque]

Now just wait next year when Canon releases a 7D Mk II with optional battery grip style attachment that includes XLR inputs and an HD-SDI output.

Jannard's gonna swallow his gum for sure.

:grin:

--X

[Rakesh Jacob]

Now just wait next year when Canon releases a 7D Mk II with optional battery grip style attachment that includes XLR inputs and an HD-SDI output.

Jannard's gonna swallow his gum for sure.

:grin:

--X

LMFAO, be nice, the dude revolutionized filmmaking, unfortunately he didn't expect the rest of the world to close in on him so fast, he's not ready to move forward yet... give him time... I think they will release a new announcements soon, real soon, I can feel it.

[hermmermferm]

No doubt he is losing Scarlet customers to these new VDSLRs. I don't think he has to worry about the Red One folks though. I wouldn't count Red out (I know I'm not), Scarlet still has specs that bests these new cameras and if he manages to release it early next year, 7D'ers might be kicking themselves for not waiting.. The 500 lb gorilla in the room is that HDMI port.. IMHO

Right now though, I'm buying a 7D, I know it beats my HVX and Brevis. Anyone want a Brevis? If you want to pity someone, pity the 35mm adapter owners.

[Ian-T]

If you want to pity someone, pity the 35mm adapter owners....and manufacturers.

[Rakesh Jacob]

No doubt he is losing Scarlet customers to these new VDSLRs. I don't think he has to worry about the Red One folks though. I wouldn't count Red out (I know I'm not), Scarlet still has specs that bests these new cameras and if he manages to release it early next year, 7D'ers might be kicking themselves for not waiting.. The 500 lb gorilla in the room is that HDMI port.. IMHO

Right now though, I'm buying a 7D, I know it beats my HVX and Brevis. Anyone want a Brevis? If you want to pity someone, pity the 35mm adapter owners.

Problem with that is, not too many people want a 500lb gorilla :dankk2:
Biggest reasons for me to go the DSLR route is price/performance/size.

[Richard J. Johnson]

Biggest reasons for me to go the DSLR route is price/performance/size.

Amen to that. Now I hate lugging around a 16 pound HVX/LEX rig.:zombie_smiley:

[hermmermferm]

Problem with that is, not too many people want a 500lb gorilla :dankk2:
Biggest reasons for me to go the DSLR route is price/performance/size.

Not too many people want 10 bit ProRes 422? I don't follow..

[Ian-T]

All of this hoopla makes me wonder if this (7D) was the actual cam that they (Canon) recently flew onto the Iron Man set and not some modified 5Dll. That would make more sense.

[Rakesh Jacob]

Not too many people want 10 bit ProRes 422? I don't follow..

Um no as a matter of fact, majority don't, overwhelming majority at that! I'm not trying to be a dick about it btw


All of this hoopla makes me wonder if this (7D) was the actual cam that they (Canon) recently flew onto the Iron Man set and not some modified 5Dll. That would make more sense.

DUDE! You read my mind, I was wondering the same thing

[ryansheffer]

The camera was on the Iron Man set long before the rumor. It was the 5d mark II. And it had 24p.

[jls4]

Jannard's gonna blow a fuse if this thing has clean, uncompressed, full raster HDMI output.

"But... But.... you can't just upgrade the "brain" and keep the compact flash slot and the LCD screen!! You'll have to get rid of _everything_ to upgrade in a couple years!!!"

-X

You are 100% on that. That's what I want to see. Canon 7D HDMI plus Nano Flash = 100Mbps saved on compact flash cards. Add in a 8 inch monitor at 1240x720 and you've got a super camera for less than $7,000. (True Bokeh, real lenses, depth of field, low light performance, accurate colors)

Things we don't know that are important
The HDMI out,
Stairstepping problem solved or at least minimized,
And a custom gamma curve would be nice to bring in some of the heavy highlights

If it has those 3 things and the rolling shutter is at least on par with the ex1, this this camera kills every "Depth of Field-I wanna make a movie rig" for the next 6 to 9 months. And imagine you could have a super rig for less than $7K and $2K starts you out. I love the RED guys but this could be a scarlett killer.

[booggerg2]

Hey guys.. remember this? LOL!

http://www.crunchgear.com/2008/09/09/red-announces-dslr-killer-the-dsmc/

[booggerg2]

Right now though, I'm buying a 7D, I know it beats my HVX and Brevis. Anyone want a Brevis? If you want to pity someone, pity the 35mm adapter owners.

Ha! Sold my Letus Mini as soon as the D90 was announced. The 35 adapter route is definitely a dead-end. I think any 35 adapter manufacture would have known that their product could only exist for a limited amount of time before they become obsolete.


Not too many people want 10 bit ProRes 422? I don't follow..

I could care less for that.. why would I want to weight down my compact run n' gun camera with additional crap to recorder via HDMI?

[Spartacus]

Ha! Sold my Letus Mini as soon as the D90 was announced. The 35 adapter route is definitely a dead-end.

There are enough reasons for many users to favor the formfactor, handling and workflow of let´s say a HVX over any VDSLR.
And for those, adpaters will still be appealing if they want to add the "filmlook" to a selected projects.
For personal/noncommercial projects it might be okay to show up with a VDSLR, but some clients just want to see a "big gun" on their set, period.

One thing I agree: the days of EXPENSIVE adapters are over...
I´d rather custom build a fake RED housing around my 5D, than shell out 2-5K just for an adapter...

Hmmm, maybe I just had my next business idea!:grin:
Black box, cut out holes, put inside 7D body, a nano flash and a HD LCD at the end, print "ULTRA HD DIGITAL CINEMA CAMERA" on the outside, put on rails with mattebox and FF - happy clients! :grin::grin::grin:

[Richard J. Johnson]

One thing I agree: the days of EXPENSIVE adapters are over...
I´d rather custom build a fake RED housing around my 5D, than shell out 2-5K just for an adapter...
Hmmm, maybe I just had my next business idea!:grin:
Black box, cut out holes, put inside 7D body, a nano flash and a HD LCD at the end, print "ULTRA HD DIGITAL CINEMA CAMERA" on the outside, put on rails with mattebox and FF - happy clients!

LMFAO!! brilliant Idea. I'm in.

[Cranky]

Any focus assist features? Color peaking?

[puredrifting]

I predict HDMI output will be hobbled as it is on the 5D MKII although with the two processors, they probably have the horsepower to enable it. I wonder if we will know the answer to this before late this month?

Dan

[Richard J. Johnson]

I predict HDMI output will be hobbled as it is on the 5D MKII although with the two processors, they probably have the horsepower to enable it. I wonder if we will know the answer to this before late this month?

Dan

How is it hobbled on the MKII?

[jls4]

I predict HDMI output will be hobbled as it is on the 5D MKII although with the two processors, they probably have the horsepower to enable it. I wonder if we will know the answer to this before late this month?

Dan


Any focus assist features? Color peaking?

If they get the HDMI out you can always buy a $2K monitor that will have those features. That's why the HDMI out is so important.

[kenbaby]

http://dc.watch.impress.co.jp/docs/news/20090901_312421.html

[corrected]
Direct translation of press conference report
[According to Canon] 24fps and 60fps were made possible not because of dual DIGI4, actually a single DIGI4 can handle 24fps and 60fps. As for EOS Kiss X3 and 5D MkII, they are not sure if these cameras have enough reading speed for the data from the sensor when it comes to 60 fps. Therefore, at this point, they haven't decided to provide different shooting modes such as 24fps and 60fps through a firmware update for those EOS cameras with movie capability.

I honestly don't know about DIGI4 and reading speed. They say a single DIGI4 handles it but at the same time they're not sure if 5D MkII and Kiss X3 have enough reading speed.

This is just what Canon says.

[roxics]

http://dc.watch.impress.co.jp/docs/news/20090901_312421.html

[corrected]
Direct translation of press conference report
[According to Canon] 24fps and 60fps were made possible not because of dual DIGI4, actually a single DIGI4 can handle 24fps and 60fps. As for EOS Kiss X3 and 5D MkII, they are not sure if these cameras have enough reading speed for the data from the sensor when it comes to 60 fps. Therefore, at this point, they haven't decided to provide different shooting modes such as 24fps and 60fps through a firmware update for those EOS cameras with movie capability.

I honestly don't know about DIGI4 and reading speed. They say a single DIGI4 handles it but at the same time they're not sure if 5D MkII and Kiss X3 have enough reading speed.

This is just what Canon says.

So in other words the possibility exists that both the 5DII and Rebel will get 24p. That would be sweet if the rebel got 24/30p at 1080.

[morgan_moore]

Surely 24/25 requires a lower data rate than 30

did anyone see this..

http://i27.tinypic.com/19rq0m.jpg
from
http://www.cinema5d.com/viewtopic.php?f=21&t=4938&st=0&sk=t&sd=a&start=80

??

S

[Cranky]

If they get the HDMI out you can always buy a $2K monitor that will have those features. That's why the HDMI out is so important.
I don't want to buy a $1700 small camera to add a bulky $2000 monitor to it. I would not be buying the 7D for studio work or for professional team work, I am not a pro and I don't have a team. I would be buying it for my own use. Focus assist is a must for shooting HD video. I hope it has it.

[plasmasmp]

I cant believe that pic exists. amazing!

[roxics]

I would not be buying the 7D for studio work or for professional team work, I am not a pro and I don't have a team. I would be buying it for my own use. Focus assist is a must for shooting HD video. I hope it has it.

If I get one, it's to shoot a sci-fi feature film and several shorts with it.

[NorthernFilmMaker]

I don't think this question was asked, maybe it was...But How exactly will putting a Canon EF (FF)lens on the 7D effect the picture? there seems to be a small selection of EF-S lenses as compared to EF lenses... Well at B&H anyways... Can someone shed some light?

[bwwd]

http://i27.tinypic.com/19rq0m.jpg

quite bad photoshop job

It says 50d and viewfinder has too big edges.5D owners should notice fakiness immediately i suppose,i dont have it.

[Barry_Green]

Focus assist is a must for shooting HD video. I hope it has it.
Hey Kholi, you ready for another round?

Phase 1: "OH MY GOSH HAVE YOU SEEN THE SPECS?!?!? THIS IS THE GREATEST THING EVER!"

Phase 2: "Are you frickin' kidding me? No autofocus in HD mode?!?!"

:D Heh. Happens every time, with every new camera release...

[Kholi]

Hey Kholi, you ready for another round?

Phase 1: "OH MY GOSH HAVE YOU SEEN THE SPECS?!?!? THIS IS THE GREATEST THING EVER!"

Phase 2: "Are you frickin' kidding me? No autofocus in HD mode?!?!"

:D Heh. Happens every time, with every new camera release...


Man, I'm sitting here reading the comments and just not saying anything. LoL

EVERY single time. But, it's cool to see the excitement anyway.

[Rakesh Jacob]

Wow it's as if the GH1 threads and copious speculations and rediculous defenses of it's blatant shortcomings never existed LOL

[Barry_Green]

But, it's cool to see the excitement anyway. Looks fantastic though. I love that it's APS-C instead of "full frame", and that it's not whole-hog on the megapixels, meaning that the pixels might be a decent size and hopefully give some 5DM2-style sensitivity. I'd miss the M4/3 lens mount because you can mount *anything* to that, but you can get adapters for pretty much anything to Canon. Baited breath, my friend, and I'm very much looking forward to your report!

[Barry_Green]

Wow it's as if the GH1 threads and copious speculations and rediculous defenses of it's blatant shortcomings never existed LOL
Meaning?

I mean, come on, a GH1 is still half the price of this new Canon ($800 body-only vs. $1700 body-only). And it still shoots fantastic footage. And yes it has shortcomings. As, undoubtedly, the Canon will have. We just don't know what they are yet -- jello? moire? aliasing? no autofocus in HD? Let folks get their hands on it and put it through its paces and you'll undoubtedly see some threads firing up, it happens with every camera.

[Rakesh Jacob]

Just thought it was funny, your jab at the goings on in the 5d forums when the GH1 threads were way over the top compared to this. Just my observation and opinion of course, and I know you are in no way being mean spirited about it but it did get a gut reaction out of me :)

EDIT: I'm dearly waiting on the next gen m4/3 cause I have a crap load of FD lenses which obviously dont wont work on EOS without an opitcal adapter cause of the flange focal distance

[plasmasmp]

I went nuts when the GH1 was announced, but when the 3rd or 4th sample came I realized how awful the 1080 mode was and gave up the faith. Now we truly have the holy grail! Everyone get excited now! This is the best thing ever! At least until the next camera comes out.

Seriously though. For films, this is the best camera under the Red One. It's bitrate is the best under the R1, other than cams that are recorded uncompressed. It has the smallest size and the biggest sensor and is extremely cheap. I'll probably have to post 100 more times in five other forums until I can sleep again.

[Kholi]

Looks fantastic though. I love that it's APS-C instead of "full frame", and that it's not whole-hog on the megapixels, meaning that the pixels might be a decent size and hopefully give some 5DM2-style sensitivity. I'd miss the M4/3 lens mount because you can mount *anything* to that, but you can get adapters for pretty much anything to Canon. Baited breath, my friend, and I'm very much looking forward to your report!


In a way, it's because of that I'm glad that Canon did it. If it had been Nikon, then I think I would be pretty miffed about not being able to adapt much of anything to it. At least between Panasonic and Canon we can expect to be able to have a lot more freedom in the way he personalize our image, which is exactly what a simple choice such as which lens to use does.

As an aside, do you remember the posts on here and XL Cinema when the XH-A1 came out? I remember Shannon Rawls and SEVERAL others getting geared up for a Consumer War when they found out the A1's image was JUST as good for less than half the price.

That's what it looks like over at Cinema5d. And like then, I must say I admire the approach that Canon takes "Technology improves. That's just the way things are."

[Barry_Green]

Just thought it was funny, your jab at the goings on in the 5d forums when the GH1 threads were way over the top compared to this.
Well, yeah, I just think it's funny that the day the press release pops up we see a whole raft of "GH1 for sale" and "5d Mark II for sale" threads... :)

I'm in no way pretending that the GH1 threads didn't exist! Thing has killer potential, and a big ol' flaw. But after the GH1 thing of how the "mud" threads got so unbelievably over the top, it just reaffirmed my belief that the formula is true and it'll continue to be true.

But seriously, do you think the GH1 excitement was as high as the 7D? I think the 7D jazz seems to be the highest since the original Scarlet announcement.

And I have to say, I don't see anything wrong with the 7D right now. It looks perfect. I just am so used to everyone (including me) finding some showstopper or other, that it's going to make for a fun ride over this next month. That's all.

[Barry_Green]

As an aside, do you remember the posts on here and XL Cinema when the XH-A1 came out? I remember Shannon Rawls and SEVERAL others getting geared up for a Consumer War when they found out the A1's image was JUST as good for less than half the price.
Oh yes, that made a lot of folks quite unhappy. And it might happen again, although there's a lot more difference between the 7D and the 5D, I mean, 21 megapixels or whatever, vs. 14, and full-frame instead of APS. But I think that those changes actually make the 7D *more* suitable as a cinema camera.


And like then, I must say I admire the approach that Canon takes "Technology improves. That's just the way things are."
Frankly, that's why I hate it whenever someone trots out the ol' line of: "of course they crippled it, they have a higher line to protect". Probably true 20 years ago, but not anymore. These companies have a very Darwinian approach now -- if the old product can't compete, screw it. Survival of the fittest. The XLH1 can't compete against the XHA1? Screw it. We'll just sell that many more XHA1s, and then introduce a new low-cost XLH1A. HPX3700 can't sell against an HPX300? Screw it, we'll sell that many more HPX300s, and put out a $30,000 rebate on the HPX3700. That really is the way these guys are going. They put out the best they can, at the price point, and let the market decide.

If *anyone* is thinking of any camera as an "investment" that they can't afford to see "lose value", they're doomed. These things are tools to do a job, and to be sold on ebay when the next greatest thing comes along.

[Rakesh Jacob]

I agree with you, it's gonna be a fun ride, had the GH1 actually been in stock I woud have had 2 by now. I've been tempted several times over the summer to get the 5Dmkii but I realize the first gen vDSLR/HDSLR would be throwaways when the second gens came and I can't justify the price of the 5Dmkii. I could have justified the GH1 prices but the cam never showed back up. And when the 60D/7D rumors got too close to call I had to be patient and BOY AM I FREAKING GLAD I DID!
And on these boards YES the GH1 excitement/hype was greater or treated with more validity, it does have it's own GROUP with SUBGROUPS on the front page, not even the DVX or HVX have that...

[Isaac_Brody]

I agree with you, it's gonna be a fun ride, had the GH1 actually been in stock I woud have had 2 by now. I've been tempted several times over the summer to get the 5Dmkii but I realize the first gen vDSLR/HDSLR would be throwaways when the second gens came and I can't justify the price of the 5Dmkii. I could have justified the GH1 prices but the cam never showed back up. And when the 60D/7D rumors got too close to call I had to be patient and BOY AM I FREAKING GLAD I DID!

You and me both. I ordered a GH1, got stuck on the waitlist and shipped a battery but no camera! Cancelled my order and missed the rounds when the camera was in stock for all of two hours. Late in the summer I just figured why buy when you know something new is coming and Canon delivers. :)

[Barry_Green]

it does have it's own GROUP with SUBGROUPS on the front page, not even the DVX or HVX have that
But today's the FIRST DAY the press release has even come out! Not the camera, but the press announcement!!! We don't make multiple sections for a press release! :D

[Kholi]

You and me both. I ordered a GH1, got stuck on the waitlist and shipped a battery but no camera! Cancelled my order and missed the rounds when the camera was in stock for all of two hours. Late in the summer I just figured why buy when you know something new is coming and Canon delivers. :)


These are the two reasons I never went and got the GH-1's. I swear, every single day I still checked the threads to see who was shipping. And honestly, I was on the brink of ordering every time but ... no video out totally killed it for me.

And for the rest, the waitlist just kind of put them right in Canon's hands if they can afford the extra money for a body and a lens.

As far as the wild ride goes, there are already people complaining about No Auto Focus and Barry is right: it will never end.

I can't find a single reason to complain about what I'm seeing. I knew it was going to have aliasing, I knew it was possibly going to be slower than the MKii and less resolute. The only things thatI didn't expect were 24/25p and 60p, and I'm sure as heck not mad about that.

All I can say is Go Canon, man. And I'm happy I jumped on the pre-order before the rest of the planet awakened to Amazon's "Meet the 7D" email.

[Rakesh Jacob]

But today's the FIRST DAY the press release has even come out! Not the camera, but the press announcement!!! We don't make multiple sections for a press release! :D

LOL I understand but my impression, and this is my impression, nothing imperical, but the GH1 has recieved a lot of special treatment from the rumors till now and I don't think it's a deserving product. The 7D on the other hand kinda seems like it might be Neo to the 5Dmkii's Morpheus and the GH1 kinda feels like the little nerd kid that gets shot up in the brick building and of course R1 is Agent Smith LOL
Thnx for humoring me btw

[Kegan]

Out of curiosity, I haven't been following these VDSLR threads that much lately, so I haven't seen people complain about No Auto Focus...why IS that a problem?

I myself have tried to find issues with this camera and can find none, even though I haven't used one yet - "The Passage" and "Line of Sight" videos blew me away.

I have Canon lenses from my DSLRs and will be more than happy to use them with the 7D. Where did that pre-order page go anyway?

Kegan

[Cranky]

Meaning? I mean, come on, a GH1 is still half the price of this new Canon ($800 body-only vs. $1700 body-only). And it still shoots fantastic footage. And yes it has shortcomings. As, undoubtedly, the Canon will have.
I don't remember Canon having serious issues with codecs. On the other hand, everyone knows about the issues the GH1 has, despite that 17 Mbit/s AVCHD is supposed to be as good as 35 Mbit/s MPEG-2. In all recent products that Canon have released (XH-A1, HV20, HF100, HF-S) the encoding was top-notch, and the XH-A1 is known for its smoothness almost unreal for 25 Mbit/s HDV, whether you shoot a white dress or water of burning flame, the codec holds very well. I have no doublt that the 7D is well worth the difference in price compared to the GH1 (and don't forget the difference in bitrate).

Oops, I am discussing a product that I haven't seen, again.

[Ian-T]

Don't worry Cranky....I agree with everything you've said.

[Barry_Green]

I don't remember Canon having serious issues with codecs.
Canon has traditionally had good codes in their video cameras.


On the other hand, everyone knows about the issues the GH1 has, despite that 17 Mbit/s AVCHD is supposed to be as good as 35 Mbit/s MPEG-2.
Properly implemented, 17mbits of AVCHD *is* as good as 35mbits of MPEG-2. But in the GH1 they didn't implement it all. Which is why I'm in more of a state of Missouri regarding specs nowadays. I am quite optimistic that the 7D will deliver the goods as far as codec performance goes.


I have no doublt that the 7D is well worth the difference in price compared to the GH1 (and don't forget the difference in bitrate).
It's not just bitrate, it's also that (apparently) we won't have to deal with pulldown. That's a huge advantage in and of itself.

As for worth the difference in price, that's up to each user to decide. For some folks an $800 price difference is pennies. For others, it might be the difference between being able to get the product at all, or not.

[hermmermferm]

Just finished pre-ordering from Adorama, first time I've ever bought a camera sight-unseen.. Gotta have faith right?

BTW, Adorama said they'd have stock in 2 weeks!?

[Barry_Green]

Okay, now wait a minute -- what's with this?
http://www.bestbuy.com/site/olspage.jsp?skuId=9491944&st=canon+7d&lp=2&type=product&cp=1&id=1218115078883&AID=10597222&PID=3136093&URL=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.bestbuy.com%2Fsite%2Folspage. jsp%3FskuId%3D9491944%26st%3Dcanon%2B7d%26lp%3D2%2 6type%3Dproduct%26cp%3D1%26id%3D1218115078883&ref=39&loc=01

Body-only, $4,000? What happened to $1700?

[Isaac_Brody]

No pulldown, so frigging sweet. Just ingest and edit. And no 30P to 24P workarounds. I know there are flaws and caveats, but just the relative ease in post workflow has me breathing a sigh of relief.

[Ian-T]

Okay, now wait a minute -- what's with this?
http://www.bestbuy.com/site/olspage.jsp?skuId=9491944&st=canon+7d&lp=2&type=product&cp=1&id=1218115078883&AID=10597222&PID=3136093&URL=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.bestbuy.com%2Fsite%2Folspage. jsp%3FskuId%3D9491944%26st%3Dcanon%2B7d%26lp%3D2%2 6type%3Dproduct%26cp%3D1%26id%3D1218115078883&ref=39&loc=01

Body-only, $4,000? What happened to $1700?Maybe they anticipate the cam's popularity and hope there are some desperate souls out there who want to avoid the GH-1 fiasco.

Seriously....I have no idea.

[Barry_Green]

That's crazy... MSRP is $1699...

[Tracey Lee]

Barry: I saw that too. I am certain that they just made a mistake...but you can never be too sure.

[Isaac_Brody]

Looks like a mistake, other places have it listed properly.

[Pirata]

LOL I understand but my impression, and this is my impression, nothing imperical, but the GH1 has recieved a lot of special treatment from the rumors till now and I don't think it's a deserving product. The 7D on the other hand kinda seems like it might be Neo to the 5Dmkii's Morpheus and the GH1 kinda feels like the little nerd kid that gets shot up in the brick building and of course R1 is Agent Smith LOL
Thnx for humoring me btw

LOL and the D90/D300s is the cat that shows up twice, a deja vu glitch in the system

[Zim]

B&H with a Lens.
I guess I could have Nikon and Canon!!




Canon
EOS 7D SLR Digital Camera with 28-135mm f/3.5-5.6 IS USM Lens

18.0 Megapixels3.0" LCDHD Video RecordingSelectable Video Exposure + Frame RatesDust & Weather Resistant100% ViewfinderSelf Cleaning SensorHigh Sensitivity (ISO 12800)8fps Burst Mode28-135mm f/3.5-5.6 IS USM Lens
Mfr # 3814B010B&H # CAE7D28135
New-coming soon

Add to Wishlist
Price:$1,899.95

[Eugenia Loli-Queru]

I am getting a 7D too. At last, I found the camera of my dreams. ;-)

[Cranky]

It would be fun if $4K will turn out to be the REAL price.

[mhood]

I could sell you my pre-order confirmation number for $2,000.00 if you want... lol

[f64manray]

You do realize how pissed off you people are going to be after you get your 7D's and in November Canon's video division is going to take the 5DII/7D sensor technology and put it in the proper form factor of a cine camera with all the proper audio inputs etc. Just a friendly warning about what's probably very close to release. This VDSLR craze is going to be put to an end very soon. Canon's video division is going to drive a stake through it's heart.

[Zim]

some of us want the video in the DSLR


You do realize how pissed off you people are going to be after you get your 7D's and in November Canon's video division is going to take the 5DII/7D sensor technology and put it in the proper form factor of a cine camera with all the proper audio inputs etc. Just a friendly warning about what's probably very close to release. This VDSLR craze is going to be put to an end very soon. Canon's video division is going to drive a stake through it's heart.

[Zim]

That would be kind of funny!!


It would be fun if $4K will turn out to be the REAL price.

[Cranky]

I could sell you my pre-order confirmation number for $2,000.00 if you want... lol
You will be biting yourself if the price indeed goes up to $4k -- "Prices and specifications subject to change without notice."

I waited long enough, I can wait some more. I would prefer a camcorder in a camcorder body, not in a DSLR body. Meanwhile, I have two consumer cams to shoot with, I don't do it often anyway.

[f64manray]

some of us want the video in the DSLR

Some, but I expect not most. Personally as a photographer, I love the fact that I was able to get the 1DsIII image quality with a Red One thrown in for free with the 5DII at $2,400. ... :-)

[Kholi]

You do realize how pissed off you people are going to be after you get your 7D's and in November Canon's video division is going to take the 5DII/7D sensor technology and put it in the proper form factor of a cine camera with all the proper audio inputs etc. Just a friendly warning about what's probably very close to release. This VDSLR craze is going to be put to an end very soon. Canon's video division is going to drive a stake through it's heart.

Honestly, we ran through this long discussion in another thread and even if they do that, it still won't make it right. You have to wonder how they're going to deal with fitting a naturally 4k image into a 1080 frame without line skipping first.

Second, you must consider how much its going to cost. It will probably be nowhere near the ballpark of what we're paying now, so that's always something to keep in mind.

I don't think anyone would be pissed off. On the contrary, I think the most of us (and maybe even me) would be like "Well... I can get another 7D (or whichever camera is out by then) for the price of this and shoot two cam. Naaah."


Now, if it came in at like 3K, did away with the aliasing, etc etc. Then guess what?

We sell the cameras and get that one. LOL This is how cheap they are, it's like pouring out an old glass of water and refilling the cup.

[Cranky]

You do realize how pissed off you people are going to be after you get your 7D's and in November Canon's video division is going to take the 5DII/7D sensor technology and put it in the proper form factor of a cine camera with all the proper audio inputs etc. Just a friendly warning about what's probably very close to release. This VDSLR craze is going to be put to an end very soon. Canon's video division is going to drive a stake through it's heart.
Exactly. Canon has to stop making the GL-2 someday. But how its successor will look like? Will it be the HF-S in the GL-2 body, or will it be the 7D in the GL-2 body? Or maybe Canon will release two cameras instead of one? Who knows.

[John Caballero]

This is how cheap they are, it's like pouring out an old glass of water and refilling the cup.

You can get more than 15 7Ds for the $30K you would end up spending on a Red One!

BTW: I absolutely love the VDSLR concept. Form factor and all.

[Kholi]

It's true. And you would get many more creative shots out of those fifteen 7Ds than you would with any RED ONE setup. Different animals for different purposes.

[squig]

canon can take an uber expensive cine form factor camera and shove it. All the next generation DSLRs need is less compression, no line skipping and a global shutter.

[hermmermferm]

I doubt I'll be pissed at all about any of the new VDSLRS, IMHO all of these cameras are 'transitional,' I just want a moderately priced, feature packed camera to get me through the next two years before the truly groundbreaking VDSLRs come out. Then I'll really break open my wallet. I think the 7D is the perfect fit for the time being.. I repeat, IMHO.

[John Caballero]

If I can get anything close to the 2 Canon samples out there so far I'll be more than happy before the "truly groundbreaking VDSLR comes out". Whatever that means.

[squig]

Hey Kholi, you ready for another round?

Phase 1: "OH MY GOSH HAVE YOU SEEN THE SPECS?!?!? THIS IS THE GREATEST THING EVER!"

Phase 2: "Are you frickin' kidding me? No autofocus in HD mode?!?!"

:D Heh. Happens every time, with every new camera release...

my second fav sport after poking sticks at GH1 users

btw Barry it's 18mp not 14

I haven't read half the posts yet and I gotta leave for red school, now I'm thinkin "why am I goin to red school?"

[hermmermferm]

If I can get anything close to the 2 Canon samples out there so far I'll be more than happy before the "truly groundbreaking VDSLR comes out". Whatever that means.

Don't get me wrong, I'll be more than happy with the 7D, but there is PLENTY of room for improvement that I'm sure we'll see within the next few years. Off the top of my head: XLR inputs, HD/SDI out, advanced compression algorithms, >12 mins of recording time... This is what I meant by "transitional VDSLRs." As always, IMHO.

[Barry_Green]

I think you're spot-on, hermmermferm. These will be transitional, but then again so's everything. I usually buy Canon still cameras, and I still have my little PowerShot SD500 because it had VGA res video at 640x480. Now, just a few years later we're looking at 1080/24p and 1080/30p and 720/60p in a "still" camera.

So they'll continue to transition, but for TODAY, the GH1 and 7D look pretty darn good.

[tfg]

Barry (or other experts) -- can you give a guestimate in regards to the aliasing? Do you think that the 7D (with a smaller sensor) will produce less aliasing than the 5d?

[Rakesh Jacob]

LOL and the D90/D300s is the cat that shows up twice, a deja vu glitch in the system
LMFAO!!! Exactly, you're brilliant!


I am getting a 7D too. At last, I found the camera of my dreams. ;-)
Me too Eugenia, me too .... *sigh*:Drogar-Love(DBG):

[Barry_Green]

Barry (or other experts) -- can you give a guestimate in regards to the aliasing? Do you think that the 7D (with a smaller sensor) will produce less aliasing than the 5d?
No possible way to know at this time. If I was forced to guess, I'd guess that it would be comparable to the 5D, assuming that they're employing similar technologies in the image processing section. But there's been a year of technological advancement between the 5D and the 7D, so who knows, it might be significantly better. Or the same. Or worse. We won't know until it gets in users' hands.

[John Caballero]

Barry, can h264 be edited on Edius 5? Thanks.

[Otis Grapsas]

...a guestimate in regards to the aliasing? Do you think that the 7D (with a smaller sensor) will produce less aliasing than the 5d?

The sensor size is not important. Every camera has an antialias filter designed for a specific pixel size. Since this is a dSLR, the filter is designed for its native 4.3um pixel because they don't want a serious blur on their full resolution stills. In order to get 1920 horizontal pixels, you need to skip lines/coloumns from what could be a cropped size of 3840*2160 and get a bayer 1920x1080 image with an 1.35x crop factor vs the full sensor width. That image would be small enough for the DSP engine to debayer and process in realtime. The camera specs are 8fps at full res, so it will easily do 30fps on a 1080p bayer subsampling. The antialias filter is not effective when you skip pixels because it's designed for 4.3um pixel size not the effective 8.6um of a 1:2 subsampled output.

There is a way to do it without alias. Read the full frame size and downsample in realtime but that's a very heavy job at this pixelrate for the DSP and the sensor has to support the very fast readout. For 16bit 16:9, it would be 250 to 450mpixels/sec CMOS readout and realtime downsampling depending on width (5184 or 3840 pixels). I don't know if they attempt to do this and how fast their chips are. If they do, it will look wonderful at 1080p. It will also have no horizontal crop factor in video mode.

The pixel area of the 5DII is 6.41*6.41=41.09 sq. um.
The pixel area of the 7D is 4.3*4.3=18.49 sq. um, so it will get 41.09/18.49=2.22 times less light. More than a stop of difference in low light performance probably assuming similar technology.

[eL ProduceR]

Quick questions, will the DOF on the 7D be easier to pull than the 5DM2? I have worked with the 5D and boy, if your talent miss their mark by couple of inches you are screwed... Not owning a GH1 I have read its DOF its more forgiving

[Ian-T]

Quick questions, will the DOF on the 7D be easier to pull than the 5DM2? I have worked with the 5D and boy, if your talent miss their mark by couple of inches you are screwed... Not owning a GH1 I have read its DOF its more forgiving
Since it's a smaller sensor I would assume...yes.

[Kholi]

Okay... so those who are unfamiliar will know...

the 7D is pretty much right on with the Sensor Size of say, the RED. And RED is around S35mm size, the same size frame that nearly everything is shot on that you watch in theaters. Full Frame is not the current acquisition standard in Cinematography.

By acuiring images with 7D's image sensor you will be immediately within range of reproducing the same cinematic characteristics that everyone has been striving toward for so many years. Pulling focus @ Stops of 2.8 will be simple for the practiced focus puller. And even wide open at 1.4 it's not too difficult at all.

DOF, Angle of View, Field of View will be plenty good for this stuff. It's a very happy medium between everything, and works very well.

[eL ProduceR]

Thanks Ian-T, Mr. Hicks. Now I need to do a careful selection of prospective lenses... I know you had experience using the Tokina 11-16 2.8, any thoughts on the 16-50 2.8?

[ydgmdlu]

You know, you can get the Tokina 11-16, 16-50, and 50-135 with the 7D (pre-ordered through TigerDirect using the Bing cashback) for less total than the MSRP of the 5D Mark II kit. Isn't that crazy?

[eL ProduceR]

That's crazy indeed!

TD sells lenses too???...

[ydgmdlu]

I was referring to getting the 7D at TD, not the lenses.

[ydgmdlu]

http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/554035-REG/Tokina_ATX116PRODXC_11_16mm_f_2_8_AT_X_116.html
http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/498661-REG/Tokina_ATX165PRODXC_16_50mm_f_2_8_AT_X_165.html
http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/469653-REG/Tokina_ATXAF535DXC_50_135mm_f_2_8_AT_X_535.html

Total is $1730 for the lenses with free shipping. With the $1446 for the camera, the grand total is $3176.

[aalleexx]

how good are those lenses, f/2.8 ??? how well do you think they would perform?




http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/554035-REG/Tokina_ATX116PRODXC_11_16mm_f_2_8_AT_X_116.html
http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/498661-REG/Tokina_ATX165PRODXC_16_50mm_f_2_8_AT_X_165.html
http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/469653-REG/Tokina_ATXAF535DXC_50_135mm_f_2_8_AT_X_535.html

Total is $1730 for the lenses with free shipping. With the $1446 for the camera, the grand total is $3176.

[eL ProduceR]

Thanks for the links ydgmdlu, I think I'll just stick with the Tokina 16-50 2.8 as an option instead of the stock lens, the rest will be primes

[Barry_Green]

Barry, can h264 be edited on Edius 5? Thanks.
I would think so, but not 100% sure. Point me at a file to download and I'll try it.

[Kholi]

The tokina 11-16/2.8 is famous. It's currently being rehoused by two companies for PL application. That alone is a testament to its power.

[eL ProduceR]

Would you say the same for its other 2.8 brothers? The tokina 16-50/2.8 is the one I'm looking as it covers the most common FOV ranges.

[Rakesh Jacob]

Don't forget the Tamron 17-50 f/2.8 VC that's coming soon. Image Stabilization and Auto Focus to boot!

[jamesmallonuk]

Not to be a Jerk but for a while anytime I tried to discuss future VDSLR's my posts got moved to 'DVX cafe' ie no one read them. I guess my tone could of been better but after being constantly moved it got annoying.

Quote:
Originally Posted by artforme http://www.dvxuser.com/V6/images/buttons/viewpost.gif (http://www.dvxuser.com/V6/showthread.php?p=1632113#post1632113)
I'm all ears. Please share your reasoning.


(quote: I't will be a real camera with real lenses. The Gh1 is a four thirds toy that can't take a half decent wide shot. We will NOT be discussing this camera in one year and anyone who disagrees is a fool or in denial cause they just bought it.

My point is and I will repeat it for the criminally stupid. You guys speculated and discussed to death the GH1 for months. So why can' you allow discussion and yes speculation of upcoming VDLRS's. Sure ask the mods to create a forum for it, but until then let them be discussed and let people speculate and get excited about the new wave of DSLR's of which many I'm sure you will agree will have video capabilities. And just like the GH1 speculation was all over the D90 thread don't be negative about future speculation and developments.)

[eL ProduceR]

Don't forget the Tamron 17-50 f/2.8 VC that's coming soon. Image Stabilization and Auto Focus to boot!

Looks very promising Johnny Cola; it says the vibration compensation for Nikons only... wait, Canon too :)

[John Caballero]

I would think so, but not 100% sure. Point me at a file to download and I'll try it.

Thanks Barry but I don't know where to find a file at the moment. I will wait until I get the camera. Hopefully in less time than I was waiting for the GH1 that never came. Thanks.

[triplej96]

Does anyone know if the 7d has a shutter priority mode for hdr bracketing?

Thanks.

[NoxNoctus]

actually with HDR you'd probably want to use AperturePriority so you're not throwing your plane of focus back and forth and blurring some things

[triplej96]

Yes, that's what i meant aperture prioity. Thanks for the correction it's been a long day!

[Eugenia Loli-Queru]

Updated page here btw now has 4 7D clips right out of the camera: http://www.robgalbraith.com/bins/multi_page.asp?cid=7-10042-10239-10240

[aalleexx]

wow... that concert clip is really noisy
why?


Updated page here btw now has 4 7D clips right out of the camera: http://www.robgalbraith.com/bins/multi_page.asp?cid=7-10042-10239-10240

[rambooc1]

These 6 direct from the Cam clips are good too they show fast pans and high motion in 1080p and 480p @60fps and not just STATIC shots.

Gees the 640 x 480 is super smooth with that high bit rate.

http://www.imaging-resource.com/PRODS/E7D/E7DVIDEO.HTM

[rambooc1]

wow... that concert clip is really noisy
why?

To be fair that concert clip was shot at ISO 3200.

[Barry_Green]

Barry, can h264 be edited on Edius 5? Thanks.
Thanks to those who pointed out the files, I've now tested.

Yes, EDIUS 5 works perfectly, just drag and drop. Has about the same performance as native AVCHD files (not surprisingly, as both are h.264!)

Adobe Premiere Pro CS4.1: worked fine. But not as fast as AVCHD.

Sony Vegas 8.0: worked fine; 720p mode gave me about 11fps, 1080/24p mode about 4fps, but it worked.

Newtek SpeedEdit 1.5.5: worked fine, had pretty fast playback rates too.

And, of course, I'm sure Apple FCP users will be thrilled because the 7D records directly to Quicktime files, presuming that they can also execute a drag 'n' drop workflow.

[Kegan]

Nooo...I thought I had made it yesterday, but Adorama just notified me that my camera is backordered. Definitely not good news.

Kegan

EDIT: Nevermind - complete overreaction. It was just a generic email sent out by the system because the actual item isn't yet in stock. I was given an est. Oct. 9th delivery date. We'll see...could be earlier or later she says.

[Richard J. Johnson]

And, of course, I'm sure Apple FCP users will be thrilled because the 7D records directly to Quicktime files, presuming that they can also execute a drag 'n' drop workflow.

I think I missed something. The 7D records footage as QT files as well. So I can dump just like I do with the HVX with no conversion? forgive my noobness but that would be amazing, barring any loss in image quality.

[PSA1]

To be fair that concert clip was shot at ISO 3200.

So in video equivalent, how much gain in db is that?
Thanks.

[Barry_Green]

I think I missed something. The 7D records footage as QT files as well. So I can dump just like I do with the HVX with no conversion? forgive my noobness but that would be amazing, barring any loss in image quality.
It gives FCP the same functionality as basically every other editor has with tapeless footage. Shoot the footage, plug the card into the computer, and edit. No Log & Transfer step.

[Barry_Green]

So in video equivalent, how much gain in db is that?
Thanks.
Depends on what the native speed of the sensor is. If the sensor is natively around 400, then 3200 ISO would be equivalent to +18dB of gain.

[manglerBMX]

It gives FCP the same functionality as basically every other editor has with tapeless footage. Shoot the footage, plug the card into the computer, and edit. No Log & Transfer step.

for a lot of users we'll be transcoding to a proress codec for better editing flow and color grading strength. but for quick stuff it will be nice to just drag and drop.

[Everts]

Okay... so those who are unfamiliar will know...

the 7D is pretty much right on with the Sensor Size of say, the RED. And RED is around S35mm size, the same size frame that nearly everything is shot on that you watch in theaters. Full Frame is not the current acquisition standard in Cinematography.

By acuiring images with 7D's image sensor you will be immediately within range of reproducing the same cinematic characteristics that everyone has been striving toward for so many years. Pulling focus @ Stops of 2.8 will be simple for the practiced focus puller. And even wide open at 1.4 it's not too difficult at all.

DOF, Angle of View, Field of View will be plenty good for this stuff. It's a very happy medium between everything, and works very well.


So that's what everybody and Barry Green is so happy about !
Kholi/ or any serious videographer how fast can you get your hands on one of these ? I believe your test footage might to the 7d justice . And make me order one just before december :)

[Barry_Green]

Well, the GH1 already accomplished most of that, the sensor size is nearly the same, so therefore you get all that goodness.

The excitement (to me, anyway) about the 7D is: higher bitrate codec, and true native 1080/24p recording so no pulldown, plus NTSC/PAL switchability from the get-go so you get a few more variable frame rates. And the hope that it'll have 5DMkII-caliber sensitivity. If it can pull all that off with GH1-level jello, it'll be a huge winner. If it has 5DMkII jello, then it becomes just another contestant and you at that point have to pick your compromise.

[Kholi]

So that's what everybody and Barry Green is so happy about !
Kholi/ or any serious videographer how fast can you get your hands on one of these ? I believe your test footage might to the 7d justice . And make me order one just before december :)

It's a number of things, no pulldown, 720/60p, MKii-esque image but yeah one thing I am very happy about is the APS-C sized sensor. FF wouldn't be bad if we had an in-camera crop option (Scarlet will be able to window out of Full Frame, so that's cool to have the option) then sure. But otherwise, I just want what I'm used to.

I'm on a pre-order list in Japan as well so one or other, as soon as it's available to ship I should have one.

[Kholi]

Barry beat me to it.

[Ian-T]

LOL..you're doing the Japanese thingy again? Maybe they have a firmware to change the language to English. But it's probably all easy to figure out anyways.

[ChipG]

Kholi can speak Japanese in French

[JamesBenet]

The Bar clip 3200ISO on Galbraith´s site is very noisy but, use an option like Neatvideo and it will look even better than ISO 800 with almost no loss of detail. Try the plugin demo I´m so impressed that I will be using ISO 6400 easily for work. Will surely pick this plug up when I get the cam.

Even got rid of the microblock artifacts.

[xmephestox]

does it have a live hdmi out for monitoring? i've been trying to read through all the long articles, thought it would just be easier to ask here. if so...ki pro anybody?

[Everts]

OK gentleman so this maybe the next best thing , to a "real film camera " .
If so , with the correct lenses, prime, etc and Im total noob on this , how do you think it would stand against SI- 2k camera ,which ofcourse is not a "real film camera" ?
Also take in account that the final output will mostly be 16:9 Standard Def.