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robzoo
08-24-2009, 03:58 PM
I am weighing very heavily on whether or not to pull the trigger and buy this camera but am wondering about the audio quality, and what if any options are there for GOOD audio recording to sync along with the video that gets captured.

Mike@AF
08-24-2009, 04:15 PM
Depends on what you're shooting. If you're shooting short films or other narratives, or anything else where audio is really important, then the audio is going to suck. Invest in an H4N and a good mic(s). I've been very pleased with the quality of my H4N. The only downside is that it's dual system audio so post takes a little longer. But the audio on the H4N is much cleaner than the audio on my old HVX200, so I'm happy and find it to be worth it.

Also, I do all my syncing manually with a trusty old slate or hand clap.

robzoo
08-24-2009, 04:42 PM
So does that connect with the cam at all or it is a separate device that has to be synced in post?

robzoo
08-24-2009, 05:22 PM
Has anyone posted any footage that has actual audio via in cam mic or an external device ? I seem to only be able to find stuff that has music added in post.

Mike@AF
08-24-2009, 05:55 PM
So does that connect with the cam at all or it is a separate device that has to be synced in post?

Completely separate. Needs to be synced in post.

Mike@AF
08-24-2009, 06:02 PM
I know I've seen videos with just cam audio. I've yet to create a Vimeo account of my own so I don't have anything up.

I've shot a few different ways. I always recored cam audio (with built-in mic or cam audio with a MKE400 connected) when I record separately with the H4N (with either a MKH416 connected or 2 Sennheisser G2 wireless lavs connected). I've also tried the H4N with it's built-in mic. Order of preference is...

1. MKH416 connected to H4N
2. G2 lavs connected to H4N (in some cases I'd prefer these over the MKH416)
3. H4N built-in mic
4. MKE400 connected to GH1
5. GH1 built-in mic

Trust me, a mic connected to the H4N is an enormous improvement over the GH1. There's no comparison.

J Davis
08-24-2009, 07:47 PM
Mike is right, cam audio is absolutely horrendous, dual audio is the only serious solution at the moment

H4 audio sync example
http://www.dvxuser.com/V6/showthread.php?t=176768
H4 audio sync slippage
http://www.dvxuser.com/V6/showthread.php?t=175358

ustein
08-24-2009, 10:29 PM
What about the Zoom H2?

Peter J. DeCrescenzo
08-24-2009, 11:52 PM
Has anyone posted any footage that has actual audio via in cam mic or an external device ? I seem to only be able to find stuff that has music added in post.

Audio recorded by GH1 using internal & external mics:
http://www.dvxuser.com/V6/showpost.php?p=1692295&postcount=12
http://www.dvxuser.com/V6/showthread.php?t=177740
http://vimeo.com/groups/gh1/videos/5860184
http://www.dvxuser.com/V6/showpost.php?p=1725241&postcount=9
http://vimeo.com/6257412

The above are real-world examples of GH1 audio recordings. Its sound recording capability, especially when using good external microphone(s) and mic technique (mic placement, wind screen, etc.) can yield serviceable results.

However, one can expect the cam's automatic sound recording level control to produce undesirable results from time to time -- ALC sucks like that.

Unfortunately, the GH1's lack of a headphone jack or live audio line output for monitoring sound while recording means recording program audio into a GH1 is an inevitable disaster waiting to happen.

robzoo
08-25-2009, 10:16 AM
So would it be a good idea to use the on board mic and also to have a portable device and in post layer both audio tracks for better sync and sound, or just kill the on board mic and use just the portable device?

Ben_B
08-25-2009, 10:26 AM
You'll want the audio from the camera to help you sync.

Tim Joy
08-25-2009, 10:38 AM
Be careful, because the camera audio is not always in perfect sync with the image, especially the farther your subject is from the mic.

saaby
08-25-2009, 10:58 AM
So would it be a good idea to use the on board mic and also to have a portable device and in post layer both audio tracks for better sync and sound, or just kill the on board mic and use just the portable device?

I wouldn't kill the on-board Mic. For 1 thing, I don't think you can...and for another thing, it never ever hurts to have backup eh? Compared to HD Video, audio takes up relatively little space.

Everybody's shooting styles differ! So what is a big potential issue for me might not be for everyone.

I thought about the type of work I'll be doing with the Cam, and decided to get the Zoom sooner rather than later. The nail in the coffin for me was the lack of any way to monitor the audio at all during recording. If you have audio problems during production...you're not going to know until it's wayyy too late.

3 (of many) situations that could very easily happen with the GH1:

1 - ALC murders an important moment of audio.
2 - Your mic works itself lose from that tiny, non-locking audio connector.
3 - Using a battery-powered Mic (Whether a wireless lav, or a shotgun), the battery dies and all you get is static.

In situations 2 and 3...you wouldn't realize you had audio problems until post.

Imagine all the audio problems you've caught through your monitor headphones, now imagine that you don't know about any of those problems until you're in post.

(I know you can review clips in the field, but how often do you do that?)




NOW I got so wrapped up in that passionate rant about the lack of monitoring, that I forgot to mention Plural Eyes by Singular Software (http://www.singularsoftware.com/). This plugin for Final Cut Pro (Sorry Premiere, Vegas, etc) will take the audio from the camera and sync it with the audio from your recorder. I have the demo right now (Which is fully functional for 30 days :thumbsup:) and it works pretty slick.

The zoom and the GH1 can apparently get out of sync on long shots -- like 15 minutes or more...but this is, from what I understand, generally easily corrected by setting the audio speed to like 99%.

If you're doing a long interview or something, another option is to simply start a new clip every 10 minutes.


These workarounds all sound like hassles I know, but in reality they're not that bad.

Gweilo66
08-31-2009, 09:32 AM
Anyone try that 3rd party (name?) input box that claims to defeat ALC?