HMC-40 test footage

[Skilled]

Thought you mike like to see what I found on vimeo. This is NOT my video.



http://vimeo.com/6145756

[ATL Media Group]

Thanks for the find!

[ATL Media Group]

These things are gonna be sold out fast.

[Everts]

does this version do pal /ntsc ?
Looks good !

[Barry_Green]

If it keeps with the current model history, a European HMC41E might do PAL/NTSC, but probably no other version will.

[BobDiaz]

WOW!!!

I'm impressed with the nighttime footage, the camera did a lot better than I thought it would.


Bob Diaz

[Ed Kishel]

perhaps wow, but its been crunched twice- once from the editors output and then vimeo compresses it. It's hard to make any judgement of any camera's output from web video. I messaged the author and asked them to please provide a raw avchd clip.

[Cranky]

What exactly are you people impressed with? Ok, so it shows no visible noise, but so is my HDR-HC1 at 18dB, downsized to 720p. Night shots are made with MagicCam mode... sorry, with slow shutter. To me, looks as good (or as bad) as any other consumer cam. Here are some vids (not mine!) shot with an HDC-SD1, this is the first-gen Panasonic AVCHD camcorder, 13 Mbit/s:

http://www.vimeo.com/797188
http://www.vimeo.com/609746
http://www.vimeo.com/638514
http://www.vimeo.com/670719 (low, low light, slow shutter)
http://www.vimeo.com/691027
http://www.vimeo.com/1140007

This one is mine: http://www.vimeo.com/5450665

The same chip/lens is used in the HMC70.

I like the manual controls on the HMC40 though, but man, this camera is ugly. Panasonic put it into production with the same Home Depot-style handle bolted with two off-the-shelf screws. Why Panasonic could not make it as slick looking as the FX7? Will wait a bit more, maybe Canon will have a better say in this argument. It should replace the GL-2 with an HD cam, after all.

[vocare]

did anyone does a side by side comparison with HMC 150

[Ed Kishel]

the camera is not that ugly- the HMC70 however, now that's an ugly camera. But to each his own. Panasonics are beautiful inside :)

Cranky, if you are that concerned with asthetics- perhaps you should buy an FX7.

I must defend the handle though- we use AG-DV30s at work and its very sturdy and quite usefull. Assuming it's the same design. And they are not off the shelf screws, they are machined thumbscrews that are spring loaded for ease of use. If you loose one you wont find it at Home Depot.

We put our 30's through hell, including the tape drive and they still work as good as the day we bought them. Great camera. The 40 seems like the HD version of this camera. Only the footage will tell.....

[Cranky]

Cranky, if you are that concerned with asthetics- perhaps you should buy an FX7.
But you do agree, that the FX7 looks much better, don't you? It is a three year old design, Panasonic had plenty of time to copy the best from the others, but it chose to reuse its old stuff. I hope it was this reuse that allowed it to lower the price from $3.2K to $2.2K.


I must defend the handle though- we use AG-DV30s at work and its very sturdy and quite usefull. Assuming it's the same design. And they are not off the shelf screws, they are machined thumbscrews that are spring loaded for ease of use. If you loose one you wont find it at Home Depot.
Ok then, not off the shelf. Are you saying that these screws have no washers from the bottom to keep them from falling out? Still, look at the HM100, it also has a removable handle, and a thumbscrew, but what a difference in aesthetics! Actually, pretty much all JVC products look great, and those who work with them say that they are very ergonomic too.


We put our 30's through hell, including the tape drive and they still work as good as the day we bought them. Great camera. The 40 seems like the HD version of this camera. Only the footage will tell.....
I wish Panasonic used the same 3CCD setup as in the HDC-SD1/AG-HSC1U/AG-HMC70 instead of the high-res jellovision. Ah, well.

[Ed Kishel]

http://reviews.cnet.com/i/bto/20090420/AG-HMC40angle_wMic_610x487.jpg

http://www.broadcastor.fr/boutique/news_images/gy-hm100.jpg

Really? It's that nicer looking? Really? :huh: Well- Panasonics have always been a bit utilitarian in the looks dept...

And for the handle, yes there are small retaining washers that prevent them from coming out.

[Cranky]

> Really? Its that nicer looking? Really?
Absolutely.

Mechanically, the JVC is a better design: loosen one screw, slide out the handle, use the shoe instead of the one on the handle. The Pana is more straighforward, less clever. Does it have a shoe on the body, like the JVC?

[Ed Kishel]

well, the 30 has a cold shoe where the handle locks on so I'm betting the 40 does. Wait a minute- it's 1 in the morning and I'm up yappin about camera bodies! Nitey night cranky :)

[ATL Media Group]

> Really? Its that nicer looking? Really?
Absolutely.

Mechanically, the JVC is a better design: loosen one screw, slide out the handle, use the shoe instead of the one on the handle. The Pana is more straighforward, less clever. Does it have a shoe on the body, like the JVC?

I'm gonna start callin you "cracky".. heh... Yer crackin' me up!

[BobDiaz]

In studying the footage on both my iMAC's screen and my HDTV, it's not easy to be 100% sure because second generation compression artifacts can appear, but overall it looks good. Granted we only see the 720/25p footage, but 720p looks reasonably sharp and the colors look good.

Much of the nighttime footage used the slow shutter, but a few shots didn't do that. In those shots I noticed some odd compression noise, possible image noise. It would be nice to see the source file, as well as know the settings used.

The HMC-40 may do low level light shooting a bit better than I guessed. I still thing an HMC-150 will beat the HMC-40 for low light, but until we get a side by side test, that's only a guess.



Bob Diaz

[mcsmooth]

^ Agreed. Still need to see 1080 files, but I would be shocked if day shots are not significantly sharper than the 150. Color isn't bad, but it doesn't quite have the same look of Panny CCDs... though that could be the scene file. Still, looks like a great camera that should really hold its own in its price range and for certain applications.

Some of those night shots seemed to have a really slow shutter... a missing feature on the 150. Maybe it got back the 1/6th shutter speed from the DVX? It is difficult to tell without the originals, but the night shots without the slow shutter are noticeably noisier. Slow shutter is the number one firmware feature I wish the 150 would get!

[BobDiaz]

(1) I noticed the color didn't have the same Panasonic look, but given that the user could have set the adjustment different or changed it in post, I'm not sure what to think.

(2) In the 1080/30p mode, I'm willing to bet that the camera will be a bit sharper than the HMC-150.

DV Expo is 1 month away and I can't wait to get a look at the camera. Oh well, maybe someone will get the camera before DV Expo and post lots of source files for downloading...

It should be an interesting series of trade off choices between the HMC-40 and the HMC-150.


Bob Diaz

[Cranky]

It would be nice if someone compared the 40, the 150 and the FX7, in particular sensitivity and resolution.

[studio1972]

^ Agreed. Still need to see 1080 files, but I would be shocked if day shots are not significantly sharper than the 150. Color isn't bad, but it doesn't quite have the same look of Panny CCDs... though that could be the scene file. Still, looks like a great camera that should really hold its own in its price range and for certain applications.

Some of those night shots seemed to have a really slow shutter... a missing feature on the 150. Maybe it got back the 1/6th shutter speed from the DVX? It is difficult to tell without the originals, but the night shots without the slow shutter are noticeably noisier. Slow shutter is the number one firmware feature I wish the 150 would get!

It's not just the sensor that makes for a sharp image, the lens also needs to be good. I would guess that the 150 has a better lens.

[goramsey123]

I have no problem with how it looks. I like it. Love the price point. Looks good to me for the low light shots that I will be taking. If this model works for my clients, then it works for me.

[ATL Media Group]

Me 2.. I think it'll make a great 2nd or 3rd cam for the HMC 150

[Cranky]

Check out the low-light footage from the TM300: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MljbsKr7UEI&fmt=22 Nothing artsy, but looks comparable to the night scene from a previously linked HMC41 video.

[mcsmooth]

It's not just the sensor that makes for a sharp image, the lens also needs to be good. I would guess that the 150 has a better lens.
Without a doubt a better lens, however the 150 maxes out its resolution on the sensor before the lens comes in to play. If a full raster chipset doesn't end up being sharper... then what a waste; could have used a lower resolution and gotten a better picture (like the 150 does so well). Guess that wouldn't be a first in marketing strategies!

[BobDiaz]

Rather than generate a new thread, I'm using this thread to point out any new HMC-40 videos on Vimeo (or YouTube).

http://vimeo.com/6317485

This video comes from Panasonic and is a short introduction on the camera with several close-up shots. If you pause the video you can see several menus as well as the controls.

Another video shows the HMC-45 (Japan); however I don't speak the language so there's only a little one can get out of it...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-5HM_Kd9YNw&translated=1


HMC-41 footage:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ijL_vavtIik



Bob Diaz

[Cranky]

Rather than generate a new thread, I'm using this thread to point out any new HMC-40 videos on Vimeo (or YouTube).

http://vimeo.com/6317485

This video comes from Panasonic and is a short introduction on the camera with several close-up shots. If you pause the video you can see several menus as well as the controls.
Marketing fluff. I saw and heard what Steve Golub said about other cameras, and about this camera offline at NAB. He is a salesman, his task is to advertise whichever product Panasonic is currently pushing. Whatever he or any other sales rep says should be disregarded as white noise.

Video clips from the car show was displayed at NAB and Golub said that they were shot with the HMC150, here they are shown as if they were shot with the HMC40. Same with deposition clips, these clips are present on HMC150 promotional DVD. The video does not show which clips were shot with the HMC40, this is just an advertisement. No new information compared to the booklets already available.

As for controls, they are similar to the TM300/HS300, these cameras are available for 3 months already. Go to any consumer electronics store and try for yourself. Touch screen is not very good, worse than Sony's and with smaller virtual buttons. Even with my small fingers I had problems changing settings.


Another video shows the HMC-45 (Japan); however I don't speak the language so there's only a little one can get out of it...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-5HM_Kd9YNw&translated=1


HMC-41 footage:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ijL_vavtIik
http://www.dvxuser.com/V6/showpost.php?p=1727738 (http://www.dvxuser.com/V6/showpost.php?p=1727738&postcount=50)
Funny that you replied to that thread after I posted these links. Did you even click on them?

[BobDiaz]

Cranky, ... Good user name :)

"Marketing fluff" Well I wouldn't expect Panasonic to produce a video that says, our camera sucks pond scum... :2vrolijk_08: However, if someone pauses the video in the different places, you can see some good close up shots of the camera and a few of the menus. For those interested in the camera, it's nice to see it up close and what some of the menus are; so I'm just passing the information along...


"Funny that you replied to that thread after I posted these links. Did you even click on them?" Yes, i did go to the links, but please understand your thread is in DVXUserNews and this is the HMC150/Screen Grabs-Footage thread and I'm on three different video forums. Sorry, but I lost track that it was posted in another thread in this forum. :crybaby:


The camera appears to be shipping in England (HMC-41E) and should be shipping in a week or so in the USA. So, I'm taking bits and pieces of what I can find and sharing it with anyone who's interested. We are very close to getting a whole lot more feedback on the camera and it should be interesting to see how it works out...



Bob Diaz

[tony240sx]

Rather than generate a new thread, I'm using this thread to point out any new HMC-40 videos on Vimeo (or YouTube).

http://vimeo.com/6317485




At around 1.25 at the football game the guy is shooting with an hmc150.

[David Saraceno]

Marketing fluff.

Really?

Who would have guessed?

[Skilled]

Wow...my thread has really taken off. Just got this from panasonic.

- NEW PRODUCTS -
************************************************** **************************
AVCCAM AG-HMC40 series
- A compact camera recorder packed with Image-enhancing technologies
- 3MOS imager with full HD sampling & Pro tuning
************************************************** **************************
- Compact and lightweight at 2.16-pounds (approx.1kg) * with no accessories
- High bit rate of the Pro-Use PH mode
- Optional AG-MYA30G Professional XLR adapter available.
1. Built-in Waveform monitor and PUSH AUTO shooting assist
2. 2.7-inch 16:9 Touch screen LCD display
Just touch the thumbnail for playback / the subject for focusing
3. Shooting support functions
Newly developed "Face detection" and "Dynamic Range Stretcher" which
manages Dark & Clear part in one scene.
4. Bundled the Edius Neo 2 video editing software for Windows (through March 2010)
Edit Full-HD video quickly and make Blu-ray/DVD packages easily
Learn more:
https://eww.pavc.panasonic.co.jp/pro-av/sales_o/02products/products/avccam.html (https://eww.pavc.panasonic.co.jp/pro-av/sales_o/02products/products/avccam.html)

[Ed Kishel]

Rather than generate a new thread, I'm using this thread to point out any new HMC-40 videos on Vimeo (or YouTube).

http://vimeo.com/6317485



2:19- that guy is totaly guilty

[MadHMC150]

Did I miss a password ?

[ATL Media Group]

More HMC40 test footage popin' up now.

HMC40 Youtube test 9-3-09 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wpv0fzuRRu4)

[Cranky]

More HMC40 test footage popin' up now.

HMC40 Youtube test 9-3-09 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wpv0fzuRRu4)
It is fully boxed, both in regular mode and in HD. What frame size did you upload with? Is this straight from the cam, not color corrected?

I saw some jello. This is definitely not a camera one would shoot handheld at full zoom.

The iris has 4 blades, like most consumer cams.

Did you focus manually or used "push for autofocus"? If manually, how easy it is, how helpful focus assist features are? What are they? I assume, center frame magnification and focus bar. No peaking?

Just for comparison sake, these are some flower shots made with the HDC-SD1, which has 3CCD 1/4-inch system (same lens and sensors as on the AG-HSC1 and the AG-HMC70), recorded at 1440x1080i60 @ 13 Mbit/s. No color correction aside of levels: http://www.vimeo.com/5450665

[MadHMC150]

It is fully boxed, both in regular mode and in HD. What frame size did you upload with? Is this straight from the cam, not color corrected?

Why the heck would it be boxed like that? It's scaled down in the time line or they are not using the right export settings.

Honestly, I am not impressed so far with the 40...

[Cranky]

Why the heck would it be boxed like that? It's scaled down in the time line or they are not using the right export settings.
Likely the export settings.


Honestly, I am not impressed so far with the 40...
Don't forget that jello is most visible in 1080p24, and you probably won't be shooting 24p handheld. But I agree, I should have bought the 150 for $3,100 during the NAB days. I don't think we will ever see such a low price on the 150, now when the 40 is out.

[Barry_Green]

Just got notified that mine should be here Monday. We'll see what's what at that time.

[ATL Media Group]

It is fully boxed, both in regular mode and in HD. What frame size did you upload with? Is this straight from the cam, not color corrected?

I saw some jello. This is definitely not a camera one would shoot handheld at full zoom.

The iris has 4 blades, like most consumer cams.

Did you focus manually or used "push for autofocus"? If manually, how easy it is, how helpful focus assist features are? What are they? I assume, center frame magnification and focus bar. No peaking?

Just for comparison sake, these are some flower shots made with the HDC-SD1, which has 3CCD 1/4-inch system (same lens and sensors as on the AG-HSC1 and the AG-HMC70), recorded at 1440x1080i60 @ 13 Mbit/s. No color correction aside of levels: http://www.vimeo.com/5450665

Not my video.

[MadHMC150]

Likely the export settings.
Don't forget that jello is most visible in 1080p24, and you probably won't be shooting 24p handheld. But I agree, I should have bought the 150 for $3,100 during the NAB days. I don't think we will ever see such a low price on the 150, now when the 40 is out.

True, but its not only the 3cmos jello... From that video, especially since it was exported even smaller, there is very little detail in the subjects in focus... like the duck.


Just got notified that mine should be here Monday. We'll see what's what at that time.

Looking forward to your review of the 40... I still am considering the 40 as a 'C' cam. Maybe the T1i will give it a run for the money...

[Cranky]

True, but its not only the 3cmos jello... From that video, especially since it was exported even smaller, there is very little detail in the subjects in focus... like the duck.
Yes, I noticed that too. Either bad focusing, or the image has been softened on export. Compare to this TM300 video (this is the cam that the HMC40 is based on): http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=luQubVABroQ&fmt=22

[MadHMC150]

Yes, I noticed that too. Either bad focusing, or the image has been softened on export. Compare to this TM300 video (this is the cam that the HMC40 is based on): http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=luQubVABroQ&fmt=22

I think there are better video examples to come... here is some sharp footage from a t1i that I purchased (for now) in the place of the 40. http://vimeo.com/6440342

:beer:

[Gary Senda]

I had the opportunity to test the HMC-41 (european model) today. This is a short walkaround

http://www.vimeo.com/6445168

I've shooted without reading a single row of the user's manual.

That's a nice little camera

Gary

[matt s.]

looks pretty good but i feel this cam wont have the same "mojo" as the 150 :)

[Gary Senda]

looks pretty good but i feel this cam wont have the same "mojo" as the 150 :)

You're right: this is a useful camera for people who need a light and fully manual camera, with a decent image.

Anyway the HMC150's image is better, but the HMC40 has more resolution.

[BobDiaz]

looks pretty good but i feel this cam wont have the same "mojo" as the 150 :)

One can increase the color saturation to give the output more of the "Panasonic look". However, it won't ever look exactly like the HMC-150.

All jokes aside, the camera does appear to generate nice images, has lots of user options, and a super low price point. The final word isn't in yet, but to me the initial information seems to point that the HMC-40 provides good performance considering the price.

I just wish there were more videos being posted... :beer:


Bob Diaz

[Gary Senda]

All jokes aside, the camera does appear to generate nice images, has lots of user options, and a super low price point.

Something was wrong with the compression settings so the image are darker and the colour much less brilliant. The original AVCHD is much better.

Now it is time to sleep in Italy, but tomorrow I can try to upload an AVCHD file on a depository

[scsz]

I just wish there were more videos being posted... :beer:
Bob Diaz

I'll be getting one on Tuesday. Any suggestions for test videos?

[BobDiaz]

I'll be getting one on Tuesday. Any suggestions for test videos?

YES, thank you... :dankk2::dankk2::dankk2:

Low light footage at different gain settings and some idea how high the gain can be before the image noise is starting to get bad.

1080p Day time shots at different F-Stop settings. My theory is that F 4.0 --> 5.6 is the sweet point for the camera, higher numbers, F8+ should result in a drop in sharpness. (Same shot with details, just different higher F-Stops)


Bob Diaz

[ATL Media Group]

Be sure to set it on a tripod and shoot the lowlight shots at different gain and shutter settings. Also it might be a good idea to do it indoors so you can control the light from extreme dark to lit artificially to daylight through a window. Be sure to put some high contrast items in the shot.
Set it to different matrix settings and the different gamma modes. Maybe with some adjustments we can get this thing to kinda give that panny mojo.

[Cranky]

All jokes aside, the camera does appear to generate nice images, has lots of user options, and a super low price point. The final word isn't in yet, but to me the initial information seems to point that the HMC-40 provides good performance considering the price.
It is a consumer camcorder with better controls than modern consumer camcorders have. But at $2,000 nothing much to complain about.

[BobDiaz]

Here's a link to a PDF resolution chart.

http://www.bealecorner.com/trv900/respat/EIA1956.pdf


You can download it and print it out. I'm guessing that the camera should be reasonably sharp, but as you go beyond F8+, the resolution should drop. This chart should allow you to test that and get a reasonable estimate at what point does the F-Stop go too high and we loose resolution.


It might be fun to try this test at 1080p and 720p.



Bob Diaz

[BobDiaz]

It is a consumer camcorder with better controls than modern consumer camcorders have. But at $2,000 nothing much to complain about.

I got to thinking about your comment that the HMC-40 is a "consumer camera". This is one of those things that is subject to perspective.

Even if it has the exact same image sensor as the TM300; from a standpoint of image quality, we're seeing the better 3 chip consumer cameras looking closer in quality to the professional cameras. Granted, when lighting is poor, a 2/3" camera will win over any 1/4" consumer camera, but overall that also holds true for 2/3" vs. 1/3".

Also, Consumer cameras just don't have the level of control and XLR inputs like the HMC-40 has.

You can call the HMC-40 a "consumer camera" if you like, but to me it's a clear setp above that category. Oh well, what's in a name, a rose by any other name ....


But at $2,000 nothing much to complain about.
That's the part I find the most amazing and interesting about the camera.



Bob Diaz

[BobDiaz]

By the way, the User Guide is now on line!!! :thumbup:

http://catalog2.panasonic.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/ModelDetail?storeId=11201&catalogId=13051&itemId=361001&catGroupId=112502&surfModel=AG-HMC40&displayTab=R


Thank you Panasonic. :dankk2:


Bob Diaz

[Cranky]

Even if it has the exact same image sensor as the TM300; from a standpoint of image quality, we're seeing the better 3 chip consumer cameras looking closer in quality to the professional cameras. Yep. Consumer camcorders now have pretty good sensors, but lack controls.
Also, Consumer cameras just don't have the level of control and XLR inputs like the HMC-40 has. This is what I meant.
You can call the HMC-40 a "consumer camera" if you like, but to me it's a clear setp above that category. Sony calls the HDR-FX7 an "advanced amateur" camcorder. I said that the HMC40 is a consumer camera, because it uses the lens, sensors, touch-sensitive LCD screen, menu organization, etc. from a consumer camcorder instead of using a dedicated design. This is not bad by itself, just a matter of fact. Panasonic could at least use a larger 3.0 or 3.5 inch LCD screen to better compete with the FX7/V1, but it decided to reuse as many components from the consumer "300" family as possible. On another hand, this must have contributed to a lower $2,000 price instead of $3,200 announced earlier.

[Cranky]

By the way, the User Guide is now on line!!! Thank you Panasonic. Not a word about how ND filter works.

[BobDiaz]

I'm still reading through the User Guide...


As for the ND Filter, the only thing said is

Automatic ON/OFF interlock with iris OK, I'll guess that this functions through the iris setting. ???


It looks like the AG-MYA30G XLR Adapter will be worth the $300, without it, adjusting the volume levels through a menu will be a bit of a pain.

When an XLR Microphone Adapter is connected, the camera’s mic
input level is fixed. Adjust the volume on the microphone adapter to
adjust the input level. http://i46.photobucket.com/albums/f103/KQ6WQ/VideoClips/HMC-40_XLR.png


It looks like one can set the maximum for the auto gain setting; +12dB, +24dB, and +34dB (Through a USER Button). There does not appear to be any other choices. It will be interesting to see what the noise level for +12dB and +24dB look like.

Sets the maximum value for camera gain.
CAMERA mode
24 dB: Camera gain can be set to up to 24 dB.
12 dB: Camera gain can be set to up to 12 dB.


As for INTERVAL REC:

Enables frame-by-frame recording at specified intervals to create short
videos of scenes with slow movement over long periods of time. Single
frames are recorded at the specified interval, with 24 frames equaling 1
second of video.
OFF, 1 SECOND, 10 SECONDS, 30 SECONDS, 1 MINUTE, 2 MINUTES
When INTERVAL REC is enabled, the following setting items automatically change as follows.
REC FORMAT: PH 1080/24P, TC MODE: NDF


There appear to be 2 "SCENE1 / SCENE2" files for user selection.


There's a lot more to read, but that's what I've seen so far...


Bob Diaz

[Harald]

Sorry. I used the wrong thread.
Post moved to this place (http://www.dvxuser.com/V6/showthread.php?p=1740049#post1740049).

[ravencr]

I think I've watched every video from this camera I can find and non of it shooting high action video like I shoot, mostly handheld. Does anyone have any decent action footage using this camera handheld?

Chris

[shphotovideo]

I think I've watched every video from this camera I can find and non of it shooting high action video like I shoot, mostly handheld. Does anyone have any decent action footage using this camera handheld?

Chris

Have only done some moving cars http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=88zNdvsDf-o (end of video). I do have some hand held footage from inside a 520HP Lotus, but it was very hard to hold the camera still.

Plan on going to the Edwards Air Force Base show on the 17th so that should be a good test.

[ravencr]

SHP,

I'm wondering if that's the compression of youtube or something, but it looks like either frames are missing or just jerky when panning and/or zooming. Does this show up on your computer before uploading to youtube?

Chris

[ravencr]

Just placed my order on Amazon.com...will plan to post a bunch of video tests...nothing professional, just things I've been wondering about this camera in trying to make a decision. I won't be able to do any of it till after the 12th, though.

Chris

[shphotovideo]

ravencr-Congratutions!

I uploaded the car show clip to my server for download. The panning looks much smother compared to YouTube.

www.speedandmotion.net/downloads/SCS092709.mp4 (http://www.speedandmotion.net/downloads/SCS092709.mp4)

[ravencr]

Thanks for uploading it...I'm downloading it right now.

Chris

[ravencr]

I'm uploading two videos from the HMC40 as we speak. One using custom output settings from Adobe Premier to match the video quality it was shot with and the other using Youtube's present Widescreen HD settings within Adobe Premier. It will be interesting to see if Youtube looks better using 59.94 fps or the default of 24 fps. It's a basic walk around my extremely messy office in really low light. Stay tuned...the user name on youtube is hmc40videos in case you want to subscribe.

Chris

[ravencr]

Here's the first one:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qz_kLRPGH1U

And, the second one:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2LGeh672W3w

Notice any difference?

Chris

[ravencr]

Here's the HMC40 @ PH1080-60i

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k1TvGSxXVac

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c1jm8tYD0ao

[ravencr]

Here's similar shot using the HMC40 @ PH1080-30p.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qbapMABkrFg

[ravencr]

Here's the HMC40 @ PH1080-24p:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qd_Qt2P2tqc

[ravencr]

Here's the HMC40 @ PH720-60p:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LrJHP8xu9aU

[ravencr]

Here's the HMC40 @ PH720-30p:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3WRWAbS2YXk

Here's the HMC40 @ PH720-24p:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mfEbt3QInms

[ravencr]

Here's the HMC40 @ HE1080-60i:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8VyWb0F9CZo

[ravencr]

Here's the HMC40 @ PH720-60p handheld, zooming in, and panning in very low light:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AcOS1gM_z5E

[BobDiaz]

ravencr (http://www.dvxuser.com/V6/member.php?u=53454),

Thank you for posting all the video tests. Please consider posting them on VIMEO, where you can upload the source file and allow others to download the file. VIMEO is free, but you will be limited to 1 HD upload per week.

http://vimeo.com/


MediaFire allows file hosting and is free:

http://www.mediafire.com/?mjibljwm5jr

The YouTube videos are helpful, but don't allow us to see the video in the full resolution and without all the extra compression.


Thanks,

Bob Diaz

[ravencr]

Thanks Bob, so do you mean that vimeo and mediafire don't compress the videos past the H.264 compression I'm using when exporting from Premier Pro? And, if I'm understanding correctly, you're saying YouTube does, right?

Chris

[ravencr]

Here's the HMC40 @ PH720-60p handlheld testing manual shutter speeds from 1/2000 - 1/8 in very low light with 50% slow motion following it...nearly dark.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z7I5KEWRmrE

[ravencr]

Here's the HMC40 @ PH720 60p handheld testing panning, fly bys, manual shutter speed of 1/2000 while overcast and raining. The slow motion clips of all 3 of these clips are uploading now:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G1C7NrD2D8E

[BobDiaz]

Thanks Bob, so do you mean that vimeo and mediafire don't compress the videos past the H.264 compression I'm using when exporting from Premier Pro? And, if I'm understanding correctly, you're saying YouTube does, right?

Chris

With MediaFire whatever you upload to it, that's the file people download (limit 100MB). If you take the source files from the camera, people can download the exact same file.

With VIMEO, it turns out that if you upload the source file from the camera AND are using the free service, the file stays the same for 7 days. After that, they may compress it even more to save on server space. For those who pay for VIMEO+, that doesn't happen.

Now if you have an edited version of the file, the format you edited to stays the same for the 7 days (assuming you are using the free service). Again, with VIMEO+, as long as you pay the extra, that never happens and you get a few extra services.

With YouTube, the file is converted into a different more tightly compressed format.

By the way, as a side note... if you upload the source file from the camera without editing, people can play with it to see what it would look like.


Bob Diaz

[ravencr]

Here's the 3 slow motion clips:

75% - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cEjkZMyVa_s

50 & 25% #1 - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M_x7916_E-M

50 & 25% #2 - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=chRUHPZ4t3s

That's all for now...more testing in the future. :) Overall, given the lack of light, rain, fog, and crappy light in general, I'm pretty impressed so far. Anyone have any comments?

Chris

[ravencr]

With MediaFire whatever you upload to it, that's the file people download (limit 100MB). If you take the source files from the camera, people can download the exact same file.Gotcha...I'll check it out as a way to transfer files to and from clients.


With VIMEO, it turns out that if you upload the source file from the camera AND are using the free service, the file stays the same for 7 days. After that, they may compress it even more to save on server space. For those who pay for VIMEO+, that doesn't happen.

Now if you have an edited version of the file, the format you edited to stays the same for the 7 days (assuming you are using the free service). Again, with VIMEO+, as long as you pay the extra, that never happens and you get a few extra services.

With YouTube, the file is converted into a different more tightly compressed format.

By the way, as a side note... if you upload the source file from the camera without editing, people can play with it to see what it would look like.


Bob DiazGotcha...I'll check out Vimeo in more detail. I didn't realize all that...the main draw to youtube is the conjunction with google now, especially for SEO purposes. I wish Youtube had a paid version similar to Vimeo, because I'd be more apt to do that instead of a paid version of Vimeo. Thanks again for the help Bob.

Chris

[ravencr]

Here's one of them on vimeo: http://vimeo.com/7092176 I can't tell a quality difference...can you guys?

Chris

[ravencr]

Hey guys,

Here's some more footage from today where we finally had some decent, non-rainy weather with no fog. :)

This was shot using the Panasonic HMC40 on 1/2000 shutter speed at PH720/60P, starting at 0db gain and going up to 12db of gain. And, slow motion, as well:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4JQHQZMbRLs

Chris

[ravencr]

Here's a similar video to above with the only difference being that it's using 1/1000 shutter speed:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U9drbNib8Mg

Chris

[ravencr]

I'm also going to upload all the raw, un youtube'd files here available for download. They're not raw .mts files, but full resolution adobe premier outputted files in .mp4 format: http://www.utvreport.com/videos/hmc40tests They're in the process of uploading, so it will be a bit before you can download them...they're big, because I uploaded these at full 21 mbps.

Chris

[ravencr]

Here's the same using 1/500 shutter speed: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wVZJSWpR_xY It's not fully done uploading, but I'm going to bed! :)

Chris

[ravencr]

Here's a few more videos:

This was shot using 1/250 shutter speed, testing from F11 - 0 db open:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Nd8J8Oxp0I0

This was shot in auto mode, but manually adjusting the iris dial, which was weird. I believe the dial corrects/adjusts a lot faster than the display is able to tell you what's going on. It was hard to tell if I was adjusting the gain only or the f-stop, as well.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T5zM7RZUV4w

And, this was shot to try to determine up to what shutter speed I could effectively keep the gain at 0 db. I was flipping between agc and mgc to see if the camera would display the level of gain in manual gain control after running it in auto gain control. I'm still not quite sure, but I think it does.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q-otdIu_L1U

Chris

[ravencr]

Here's another agc vs mgc video using 1/1000 shutter speed instead of the one above at 1/2000 shutter speed.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6B4RiYmJzbs

Chris

[BobDiaz]

ravencr (http://www.dvxuser.com/V6/member.php?u=53454)

Because you are trying all sorts of tests, here's one that should prove to be fun....

When the lighting is reduced (like after sunset or night), try shooting at 1/60, 1/30, 1/15, and 1/8 of a second shutter speeds. I assume that you'll have to adjust gain or the iris to make the exposure the same for each test. It should be something with motion, like a street scene with people and cars going by.

If you also try the 24P setting, try 1/48, 1/24, and 1/12 of a second.


Bob Diaz

[ravencr]

ravencr (http://www.dvxuser.com/V6/member.php?u=53454)

Because you are trying all sorts of tests, here's one that should prove to be fun....

When the lighting is reduced (like after sunset or night), try shooting at 1/60, 1/30, 1/15, and 1/8 of a second shutter speeds. I assume that you'll have to adjust gain or the iris to make the exposure the same for each test. It should be something with motion, like a street scene with people and cars going by.

If you also try the 24P setting, try 1/48, 1/24, and 1/12 of a second.


Bob DiazHere ya go...this was all shot at the time I thought with no gain, but this was actually at 24db gain on auto gain control. Actually, the camera comes preset with the maximum gain of 24db and does it automatically as it sees fit, and you have no idea what it's set at unless you do it manually. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z7I5KEWRmrE

Chris

[ravencr]

Here's the HMC40 just running through the various white balance presets:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lAFwQi0WNgU

Chris

[ravencr]

Here's the correct Chroma level video I meant to post originally: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iNvd1G7KCeg

Chris

[ravencr]

Here's some examples of using the digital zoom: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sYWnhjmTYxA

Chris

[ravencr]

Hey guys,

I just realized to my surprise that all of these low light videos I posted were shot with the gain set at 24db. To me, from the statements I've read, you don't want to go above 12db, so after reading the manual and figuring out how to change it, the rest of my videos were shot with the max at 12db. But, the following videos were shot in full auto, auto gain control, and because of the low light I'm suspecting all at 24db:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qz_kLRPGH1U
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2LGeh672W3w
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k1TvGSxXVac
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qbapMABkrFg
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qd_Qt2P2tqc
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LrJHP8xu9aU
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3WRWAbS2YXk
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mfEbt3QInms
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hoTXk8WFPdY
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ijNA4u7LMaY
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=chRUHPZ4t3s
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M_x7916_E-M
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cEjkZMyVa_s
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G1C7NrD2D8E
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c1jm8tYD0ao
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z7I5KEWRmrE
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AcOS1gM_z5E
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8VyWb0F9CZo

I don't think the above videos look bad at all at 24db, personally. What do you guys think?

Here's the rest of the videos shot with the gain maxed out at 12db, but these aren't all shot in the dark like the above ones. These you'l notice are tests of the gain, shutter speeds, auto gain control vs. manual gain control, digital zoom, white balance, and chroma levels, as well.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4JQHQZMbRLs
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U9drbNib8Mg
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wVZJSWpR_xY
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Nd8J8Oxp0I0
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hRVs6rVE_wg
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T5zM7RZUV4w
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q-otdIu_L1U
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6B4RiYmJzbs
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FmEAqGb6hN4
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lAFwQi0WNgU
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sYWnhjmTYxA
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iNvd1G7KCeg

All of the above videos are being uploaded here: http://www.utvreport.com/videos/hmc40videos for download if you want the uncompressed files to watch on your computer versus YouTube. The dates of 10/12, 10/14, and 10/15 are all shot using 24db gain. And, 10/18 are the ones listed immediately above this text.

All of the videos aren't uploaded to the server yet, but I think all the 10/18 ones are already. The others are uploaded as we speak. You'l also notice that the videos on 10/18 are much larger than the rest. The reason for this is I outputted them from Adobe Premier at full 21mbps, instead of 6 mbps for all the rest. I can't tell much difference...can you guys? I'm not sure it's worth the extra size, download and upload time personally. I've found too that the best way to play these to see issues is at full screen, not the standard YouTube size.

I hope this helps...if anyone has any questions, please don't hesitate to ask. These were things I wanted to know before buying the HMC40, but I couldn't find out there, so I bought it. :)

Chris

[ravencr]

Here's a quick vid shot at 720/60p on my bogen 561B monopod, and full auto, no filters.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OVq78ZEnlf8

Chris

[ravencr]

Here's some testimonial videos I put up on Youtube from my Glamis, CA dune trip.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qyc89IN82pE

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R-aUlOnS7T4

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HkzfX98VHFc

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZULzwt_ZHso

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZTJukeFxu5w

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aPvrXO5Degg

All of this whipped together as one video for the SEMA show that just ended...all rough cuts, very little editing done to make them look more professional. I'm very impressed with the camera, and I've found that my matthews tripod when shooting today is a huge help. I'm shooting out in UT today and the next two days, and using the tripod makes all the difference in the world for quality shots. I played it through component out as 1080i, even though I shot it in 720/60p, and it looked outstanding on the television today. Unbelievable actually. The exposure was spot on, colors at +1 chroma look great. So far, I'm very pleased with the camera.

Chris

[ravencr]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DLV3ABx2jDA

This was shot with the HMC40 in PH720/60P using the Panasonic .7x Wide Angle Lens and no nd filters all shot on a Matthews M25 Tripod. Sound was captured using the rode videomic with dead cat.

Chris

[ravencr]

Here's a video I just completed:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o4utezpM6s8

It was filmed using the HMC40 in PH720/60p with the following setup:

- Panasonic Wide Angle .7x Lens
- No ND Filters
- Rode Videomic with Dead Cat for Sound
- Matthews M25 Tripod
- OIS On
- Slow Motion is 25% of normal speed
- Edited with Adobe Premier CS4 on a Macbook Pro 17"
- Outputted using Mainconcept H.264 Youtube HD preset, but changed the fps to 59.94 from 24 fps.
- +1 Chroma

Any pointers, comments, or suggestions would be greatly appreciated.

Chris