"Learning to Prey" - a Nelson / Double Decher Productions

[Shawn Philip Nelson]

Shawn Nelson and Teresa Decher Presents

"Learning to Prey"

http://www.nelsonentertainment.com/ltp/LTP_poster_web.jpg

Cast

Jessica: Teresa Decher http://www.imdb.com/name/nm2766850/
Isabel: Victoria Geil http://www.imdb.com/name/nm2769405/
Anna: Chantelle Chriestenson Nelson http://www.imdb.com/name/nm1472229/
Nate: Chase Offerle http://www.imdb.com/name/nm1416531/

Crew
Written & Directed by Shawn Nelson http://www.imdb.com/name/nm2092431/
Produced by Teresa Decher & Shawn Nelson
Associate Produced by Victoria Geil and Chase Offerle
Director of Photography - Patrick LaValley http://www.imdb.com/name/nm2904211/
First Assistant Camera - Sam Garrhttp://www.imdb.com/name/nm0307974/
Fx Makeup by Ravenous Studios
MUA - Amber Arpin
MUA - Kevin O'Dell
FX Design - Christina Kortumhttp://www.imdb.com/name/nm3162701/
3rd AD - Erica Johnson
Grip - Ryan Unger
Grip/Sound Mixer - Joshua Brown http://www.imdb.com/name/nm3571483/
Sound Mixer - Ben Moore
Script Supervisor - Jaqueline White
Production Stills - Ryan Unger & Peter Kim

Score by Herman Witkam http://www.imdb.com/name/nm2079846/

Sound Mixing and Post Sound by Ryan Frias http://www.imdb.com/name/nm3303236/

Liason to the Moose Community - Ken Kupelian http://www.imdb.com/name/nm3074192/

Shot on Red with Build 20 and RPP lens system

[Shawn Philip Nelson]

------

[Shawn Philip Nelson]

Production Log

[Richard J. Johnson]

Welcome back. I'm sure you will do your thing as usual.

[Rodney V. Smith]

Shawneous is back! Sweet!

[ZazaCast]

This is sure to be a good one....welcome back Shawneous. Looking forward to it.

[Michael Anthony Horrigan]

Looking forward to this one.

Good luck! Can't wait to hear what Herman comes up with as well.

Cheers,

Mike

[AmyO]

Awesome! Welcome to the fest! I love all this amazing filmmaking talent up here in the NW. :)

[Shawn Philip Nelson]

Welcome back. I'm sure you will do your thing as usual.

Well that depends, the last two that I did were sweeping artful period pieces, definitely not doing that this time :-)

[Brandon Rice]

Awesome stuff Shawn!

I see you're using Ryan for post sound! Excellent choice :)

[Puckthesane]

Now I lay me down to eat, I prey on people's hearts and spleens. If I die before I wake, it was most likely at the hands of an angry German with a wooden frickin stake!

[Brad S.]

Awesome! With Ryan and Herman aboard, this is going to sound friggin' great!

[teresadecher]

Yeah, Monster Fest! Woo. :)

[~jai~]

NICE title! I'm sure the film will be a good one too! Can't wait!

[Brian Parker]

Welcome back Shawneous. Looking forward to more epic stuff!

[Mike Manning]

Oooo.. here we go. Perhaps i need to get in on MonsterFest! Looking forward to what you guys come up with!

[Ken K]

Assistant to Mr. Nelson - Ken Kupelian
http://www.imdb.com/name/nm3074192/
I look forward to being your codepend... err... I mean "assistant", Mr. Nelson.

[Shawn Philip Nelson]

I've changed username to my real name.

In production news, preprod is going lighting quick and awesome. Rehearsal and wardrobe test tomorrow!

[Shawn Philip Nelson]

GREAT rehearsal tonight, cast is pumped and ready to rock.

[Shawn Philip Nelson]

In other news, we now have 4 makeup artists signed on, all for different purposes. This is a new record for one of my sets :-)

[Ryan E. Walters]

Congrats on putting together another entry. I'm looking forward to seeing your film. Best of luck!

[Tom Marshall]

Shawn, good to hear things are going so well for your project.

[Shawn Philip Nelson]

Thanks Tom! We shoot tomorrow!

[ryanjf]

Have fun tomorrow! Can't wait to see it.

[Joshua Brown]

Oh Man, that shoot rocked! Congrats to everyone! You will all love this!

- J.A. Brown

[Joshua Brown]

Just some production stills from Learning to Prey. (photography by Ryan Unger (http://dimensionsphotography.blogspot.com/))

[Ryan E. Walters]

Looks like a fun shoot- way to redress your house Shawn!

[Shawn Philip Nelson]

Filming is done :-), more to follow. Any requests for screen grabs?

[Rodney V. Smith]

Filming is done :-), more to follow. Any requests for screen grabs?

maye just one:

GRABS? SCREENSHOTS?? GIVE GIVE GIVE!

[Ryan E. Walters]

Filming is done :-), more to follow. Any requests for screen grabs?

Nope, no one wants to see anything- haven't you figured it out yet? We all like being kept in the dark until after the final vote is tallied ... ;)

Yeah, stills / frame and more BTS pics would be great! :)

[Jeff Anderson]

Coiled up rope light as a ring light... f'ing brilliant. How are you powering? May have to borrow this idea...

Shoot looks like fun - looking forward to seeing the end results. Good luck in post!

[Shawn Philip Nelson]

So an interesting thing is that the best shots of this cannot be posted without giving things away.

But instead I can post some still awesome ones, they just aren't the 'money' shots so to speak.

http://www.nelsonentertainment.com/ltp/OTS_Chase_to_Teresa.jpg

[Shawn Philip Nelson]

And I should say this isnt final grade, just a quickie 1st light in Redalert

http://www.nelsonentertainment.com/ltp/party_entrance.jpg

[Shawn Philip Nelson]

http://www.nelsonentertainment.com/ltp/party_cup_insert.jpg

[Shawn Philip Nelson]

http://www.nelsonentertainment.com/ltp/Chantelle_stairs.jpg

http://www.nelsonentertainment.com/ltp/CU_Victoria_party.jpg

[Zak Forsman]

looks beautiful.

[Shawn Philip Nelson]

Thanks Zak! One more today

http://www.nelsonentertainment.com/ltp/Teresa_reverse.jpg

[Mike Manning]

Damn you guys are quick! Looks great!

[ryanjf]

wow. great job! Can't wait to see it!

[Brandon Rice]

This looks very very good!

[Jeff Anderson]

Wow - I love all of the colors - looks fantastic.

[Shawn Philip Nelson]

Coiled up rope light as a ring light... f'ing brilliant. How are you powering? May have to borrow this idea...

Shoot looks like fun - looking forward to seeing the end results. Good luck in post!

Thanks! That was Josh's idea, and a good one. It didnt provide a ton of light, but just enough to make a certain shot (that we cant post yet) really shine. It was powered via a normal edison extension cord that he wrangled from the camera.

[Joshua Brown]

Coiled up rope light as a ring light... f'ing brilliant. How are you powering? May have to borrow this idea...

Shoot looks like fun - looking forward to seeing the end results. Good luck in post!

Hey Jeff, we just plugged it into the wall and let the cable puller handle it. Didn't put out TONS of light, but enough to do the job. The cable was lying around the set anyways so it was nice and handy. There may be other ways to do it more effectively if you don't already have a rope light.

[Joshua Brown]

Oh wow, sorry Shawn, didn't see your post. haha. They are almost identical.

[Ryan E. Walters]

And I should say this isnt final grade, just a quickie 1st light in Redalert

That's what she said ... ;)

Thanks for the frame- looks like a fun shoot- I like the use of color.

[Joshua Brown]

That's what she said ... ;)

Don't know how many of those jokes happened toward the end of the shoot. And for good cause :happy:

[Tom Marshall]

Hey Shawn, beautiful grabs! I like the smoke you've added. Gives it a great ambiance...

[teresadecher]

**Check out more BTS shots taken by the wonderful Peter Kim**

http://www.flickr.com/photos/nihilistbike/sets/72157622051756256/detail/ (http://www.flickr.com/photos/nihilistbike/sets/72157622051756256/detail/)

[Marlon Ladd]

Man, I quit! Just ain't fair. The pics look stellar. Can't wait to see more.

[ryanjf]

Wow. The pictures look freakn' amazing.

[teresadecher]

Here are some potential posters. Would love to hear feedback!

http://i9.photobucket.com/albums/a93/xoxo126/LTPPoster1.jpg

http://i9.photobucket.com/albums/a93/xoxo126/LTPPoster3.jpg

http://i9.photobucket.com/albums/a93/xoxo126/LTPPoster5small.jpg

[Rodney V. Smith]

first one is the best.
second one is pretty, but not effective and the this is kind of cluttered.

[Shawn Philip Nelson]

My favorite is the last, I dont feel it's too cluttered, reminds me of this
http://www.imdb.com/media/rm3161167360/tt0405336

Though I think the text shouldnt be pink faced

[Ryan E. Walters]

My favorite is the last, I dont feel it's too cluttered, reminds me of this
http://www.imdb.com/media/rm3161167360/tt0405336

Though I think the text shouldnt be pink faced

The idea of the third one I like the best, but the compositions of the frames that were chosen for the poster make it feel incomplete / unbalanced to me. If you look at the Southland Tales example the individual frames all contribute to the final design unifying the overall composition. As the third one stands right now each individual frame competes for attention, and the eye has to work hard to read it as a poster. So I'd try and choose different frames that contribute to the whole.

If the posters are done, and cannot be tweaked, then go with #1, as it is the strongest of the three. If you can still tweak them, then I'd continue working on #3- as I think that has a lot of potential, and could be the strongest.

Anyway, just my $0.02 ...

[Maximus]

I agree the third poster has the most potential. I wonder about the retro font choice. Not sure if that's the mood you want. I would suggest checking out dafont.com, where you can type in your title and search fonts by theme, ie. horror, scifi, historical, etc. That'll give you a pretty good idea of how it'll look on your poster.

Also, a tag (teaser) line might be a consideration.

And the credit block at the end is normally arranged in a specific order, ie. the vfx credit would be somewhere in the middle of the block, the director credit would usually be last.

Your grabs look great. Looking forward to seeing your film!

[teresadecher]

Thanks everyone for all the feedback. There will be some new poster options soon.

"If the posters are done, and cannot be tweaked, then go with #1, as it is the strongest of the three. If you can still tweak them, then I'd continue working on #3- as I think that has a lot of potential, and could be the strongest."

They are not totally done, I was just playing around with some ideas from the grabs that Shawn had posted. He's going to send me some more as well.

"And the credit block at the end is normally arranged in a specific order, ie. the vfx credit would be somewhere in the middle of the block, the director credit would usually be last."

Yeah, I was wondering about which order I was supposed to put it in haha. And thanks for the suggestion about dafont.com!

[Edgen]

Looking forward to seeing your film shawn! Good luck!
/j

[TMerry]

I still like the second poster the best. The font doesn't seem to fit, but the look on the face, the lighting in the background is all very intriguing.

For me poster three is too much. Sometimes the subtle has the most impact :-)

[Brandon Rice]

third poster :)

[Matty_g]

Looking good shawn!
This stuff is a little forsmanesque.
Can't wait to check it out.

[TMerry]

The Ouija said "P O S T E R 2"

The discussion is over! :Drogar-Love(DBG):

[Shawn Philip Nelson]

Looking good shawn!
This stuff is a little forsmanesque.
Can't wait to check it out.

As in, being visually similar to Zak's stuff? Interesting, never considered that. Though I think Zak's stuff looks awesome, so if that's what you're getting at, cool. Though I havent yet seen Zak make use of a Red :-)

[Tom Marshall]

Hey guys, here's something I worked on a bit. You're welcome to use it if you like...

http://www.dvxuser6.com/uploaded/17011/1251523376.jpg

[Shawn Philip Nelson]

Wow Tom! Thanks! That is definitely in consideration :-)

Here are three more pics. I should caveat this by saying these frames may not make it into the final movie, I'm just scanning the raw footage and finding some interesting frames that dont give away too much (the best stuff is only in the final cut :-)

http://www.nelsonentertainment.com/ltp/Teresa_dress.jpg
http://www.nelsonentertainment.com/ltp/Chantelle_door.jpg
http://www.nelsonentertainment.com/ltp/Victoria_oof.jpg

[Joshua Brown]

Alright, try THIS poster on for size. ( can someone get the actual image into this forum for me? I can't get the actual image address from my iPod. ) also, if the image quality is crap I can repost later, not sure what the iPod does to images upon download.

http://twitpic.com/fw071/full

[Shawn Philip Nelson]

Alright, try THIS poster on for size. ( can someone get the actual image into this forum for me? I can't get the actual image address from my iPod. ) also, if the image quality is crap I can repost later, not sure what the iPod does to images upon download.

http://twitpic.com/fw071/full

Go to advanced post mode and attach it as an attachment, click the little paper clip icon

[Joshua Brown]

Go to advanced post mode and attach it as an attachment, click the little paper clip icon

I just realized that my host has a laptop sitting right next to me. Borrowed it and all is right in the world:

[teresadecher]

Josh,

I love it. I think that should be our poster :)

[Joshua Brown]

Shawn, any news on progress? I'm excited to finally see this on Halloween (if I have internet access in brazil. haha )

-Josh

[lyonfilms]

Love your team. Seriously excited. Rock on buddy.

[Ryan E. Walters]

Josh,

I love it. I think that should be our poster :)

Yep- that's the one. :)

[Joshua Brown]

Yep- that's the one. :)

woohoo! I did something right! Haha, for all you BTS folk.

[Troy Ruff]

nice grabs, i likey

[Shawn Philip Nelson]

Picture lock reached last Thursday!! Deliverables sent to Ryan Frias for sound post work and Herman Witkam for score! I'm VERY excited about all of this. Next up for me is conform and grade, then final assembly

[Michael Anthony Horrigan]

Sounds like you are pretty much finished. Can't wait to check it out.

Cheers,

MAH

[Kevin E. Curry]

You in for teaming up with all the other Portland/Oregon MonsterFest teams to rent out the Hollywood for a showing?

[Nitsuj]

Don't forget your poster.

[teresadecher]

Go team!

"You in for teaming up with all the other Portland/Oregon MonsterFest teams to rent out the Hollywood for a showing?"

We should do it when I'm in town!

[Shawn Philip Nelson]

Go team!

"You in for teaming up with all the other Portland/Oregon MonsterFest teams to rent out the Hollywood for a showing?"

We should do it when I'm in town!


When will that be? :-)

[lyonfilms]

Yeah, for sure - will you be in town in November at all Decher?

[lyonfilms]

Nelson -

We are thinking either late November, or early December. If it ends up the latter, maybe we could make it some crazy early Christmas party type thing? We keep thinking Hollywood for a bunch of shorts and then someplace very close by for party/beers/naughtiness, etc.

[Arturo Sanchez]

Nice... I like the fact that you have lots of girls in it.

[teresadecher]

I'll be in town Nov 23-30 and December 22-Jan 2!

[Shawn Philip Nelson]

Submitted!

[ryanjf]

Great Shawn! I had lots of fun.

[Shawn Philip Nelson]

Great Shawn! I had lots of fun.

Ryan!! Dude, this project would not be what it is without you, my thanks for your craftsmanship and it was great to finally work with you!

[Matt Harris]

awesome lightning on the grabs, looks very professional. and the poster is creepy, i like the scratchy overlay you did, it really works.

[AJ Brooks]

So when do we get to see this "Teresa Decher" titled film you apparently uploaded earlier?

;)

Congrats. Can't wait for this.

[ryanjf]

Ryan!! Dude, this project would not be what it is without you, my thanks for your craftsmanship and it was great to finally work with you!

Herman did a kick ass job!

[Shawn Philip Nelson]

Herman did a kick ass job!


Herman rocks my world. I've come to realize that who I am as an artist is built partly on what he does, how he takes my thoughts and images and floats them on the air, nothing I've done in the last 2 years would be what it is without his hand.

[EditPhish]

I like the way it looked and the story kept me interested, but I didn't think you needed to take as long as you did getting to the climax (pun intended! LOL)

The acting on the new girl seemed a bit stiff and unrealistic, especially her reactions to watching from the doorway.

I had some issues with the sound during the first dialogue scene (it was off), but nothing major. Overall it was enjoyable. There was more I liked about it than disliked. Thumbs up!

[Marlon Ladd]

Hey, Shawn! I really enjoyed your film. You had some great shots and I love the slo-mo stuff. The quality looked great as well. The acting was really good in some spots and okay in others, like the dialogue between the couple for instance. The story was predictable, but that's okay, because it's how you get to where you're going sometimes that's important. Good job, Shawn!

[Ryan E. Walters]

Looking good- I really like the use of color through out the film. And the speed ramping of the slow mo steady cam was great. Congrats!

[Denis Haineault]

As a guy, I found the opening shot very offensive...all 742 times I watched it.

[AJ Brooks]

Great work shawn!

I'm always impressed with the professional and polished feel your films have. Strong production value.

Loved the speed ramping with that opening shot. Fits perfectly into the style and feel of this film.

SPOILER************* I think the films with the "monster" being integral and part of the twist have a strike against them, because we are all expecting it since it's "monsterfest". That said, I still enjoyed the story and the parallels.

Voices not syncing threw me a bit.

I say this with the utmost love and respect for your lead actor and actresses (Victoria, Chantelle, Teresa) but I felt the performances were a bit pushed. Actors weren't really getting there emotionally, notably in the b/f and g/f confrontation scene. Partly because I have seen them in your other films and I know they can deliver.

Again, fabulous work Shawn. You should be proud. And I am proud to have this be a Portland film!

Oh, and that final next victim POV shot... money!

[Chris_Keaton]

This looked and sounded fantastic. Very professional. Sure some of the performances weren't up to par, but overall it worked for me. Good job.

[mobiledeli]

Awesome. Amazing film.

The first shot - a work of art. I found myself completely immersed into this world. Engulfed.

All I have to say is that I highly recommend you remake this movie with a bigger budget. There is something special here.

Getting her first bite. Oh and then that last shot.. When it went to black, shit went down. I wanted to know what was going to happen... and then the last shot came on and it completely added an exclamation point to your film.

Bigger budget, stronger acting.

Now. Perfect.

[Michael Anthony Horrigan]

Camera movement was great! Loved the opening (of course) but especially the camera following the movement. Sounded pretty good, as did the music.

My nitpick would be the male lead and the trainee.

Decher's reactions seemed very heartfelt but I just didn't totally buy into his.
The SFX shot was amazing! Really nicely done there.

The title is wicked. Great choice.

Nice work.

MAH

[Brandon Rice]

Hey Shawn, loved the beginning! Really cool feel :) Felt high budget and interesting... from the moment the guy comes in, the acting seems really off for me... I don't know if that's something you were going for.

And to end my comments... What was the inspiration for this story/short?

Thanks Shawn! :)

[Norm Sanders]

Hey Shawn, fun piece! I DUG the club scene you put together here with the techno music, complete with DJ, lights, fog, etc. Totally sold it.

Everything seemed to blend fairly well until the male lead started speaking ... something was just slightly off to me with the sound, so I'm not sure if it was a mix thing, ADR, or what ... it could have just been me, but something was catching me as different.

Cool to see Chantelle in something with you, and I thought she did a solid job. I could see the vampire bit coming, but that's largely in part to your poster ... kind of tipped your hat with it. :) GREAT FX work on the blood spurting & neck would ... I was hugely impressed!

Oh, and one continuity question, or something I caught. We see her unzipping her top, but then when she pounces down on him to unbutton his, she's zipped all the way to the top. Nit pick, I know.

p.s. The editing & speed ramping as others have mentioned was VERY well executed. Solid camera work by Patrick as well!

[Charli]

I agree that not all the actors were up to par. I did like the camera movement but for half of the short I felt I was watching a music video and not a short film.

[Edgen]

Opening shot.... :)

Cool look and feel of your film. I have to say i enjoyed some of the performances.

If anything, the title may have give the film away and you immediately knew what kind of a film it was by the line, "You could have any boy here.." (or whatever it was..)

Congrats on entering and looking forward to the next round!
/j

[ramsaur]

First off I loved the opening shot! That was really cool the whole normal speed then speed up then go back down was cool. Kind of like 300. The film was too quick for me. The ending should have shown the girl talking to a guy with dialogue or without dialogue, she leads him with her out of frame, cut to black, end IMO. also good job on getting extras.

[Shawn Philip Nelson]

I like the way it looked and the story kept me interested, but I didn't think you needed to take as long as you did getting to the climax (pun intended! LOL)

The acting on the new girl seemed a bit stiff and unrealistic, especially her reactions to watching from the doorway.

I had some issues with the sound during the first dialogue scene (it was off), but nothing major. Overall it was enjoyable. There was more I liked about it than disliked. Thumbs up!

Thanks for the comments. Funny that some think I took too long and others think it's too short. The pacing feels quick to me.

Sound had trouble, i'll talk more about that later.


Hey, Shawn! I really enjoyed your film. You had some great shots and I love the slo-mo stuff. The quality looked great as well. The acting was really good in some spots and okay in others, like the dialogue between the couple for instance. The story was predictable, but that's okay, because it's how you get to where you're going sometimes that's important. Good job, Shawn!

Thanks. Was the entire thing predictable, including the last shot or just the overall idea that she was a predator? I thought it was fun to flip conventions, usually its the guys preying on the girls.


Looking good- I really like the use of color through out the film. And the speed ramping of the slow mo steady cam was great. Congrats!

thanks! i'm very proud of that shot.


As a guy, I found the opening shot very offensive...all 742 times I watched it.

hmm, you might be more offended if you were able to carefully study the 10 takes it took to get there :-)


Great work shawn!

I'm always impressed with the professional and polished feel your films have. Strong production value.

Loved the speed ramping with that opening shot. Fits perfectly into the style and feel of this film.

SPOILER************* I think the films with the "monster" being integral and part of the twist have a strike against them, because we are all expecting it since it's "monsterfest". That said, I still enjoyed the story and the parallels.

Voices not syncing threw me a bit.

I say this with the utmost love and respect for your lead actor and actresses (Victoria, Chantelle, Teresa) but I felt the performances were a bit pushed. Actors weren't really getting there emotionally, notably in the b/f and g/f confrontation scene. Partly because I have seen them in your other films and I know they can deliver.

Again, fabulous work Shawn. You should be proud. And I am proud to have this be a Portland film!

Oh, and that final next victim POV shot... money!

Agreed on your comments, get me wasted and i'll talk more :nads:


This looked and sounded fantastic. Very professional. Sure some of the performances weren't up to par, but overall it worked for me. Good job.

thanks! which performances worked and didnt work? specific lines that felt wrong or were good for you?


Awesome. Amazing film.

The first shot - a work of art. I found myself completely immersed into this world. Engulfed.

All I have to say is that I highly recommend you remake this movie with a bigger budget. There is something special here.

Getting her first bite. Oh and then that last shot.. When it went to black, shi* went down. I wanted to know what was going to happen... and then the last shot came on and it completely added an exclamation point to your film.

Bigger budget, stronger acting.

Now. Perfect.

thanks! that was my goal in the opening shot, to bring you into the party. I definitely want a bigger budget and time to develop characters. 6 min is very hard to get into things.


Camera movement was great! Loved the opening (of course) but especially the camera following the movement. Sounded pretty good, as did the music.

My nitpick would be the male lead and the trainee.

Decher's reactions seemed very heartfelt but I just didn't totally buy into his.
The SFX shot was amazing! Really nicely done there.

The title is wicked. Great choice.

Nice work.

MAH

Thanks man, I really enjoyed your piece. Patrick did a great job operating! I only grabbed the camera for the overhead bedroom stuff.

For your nitpicks, did you object to all of the male lead and trainee stuff or certain parts of it?

[Shawn Philip Nelson]

Hey Shawn, fun piece! I DUG the club scene you put together here with the techno music, complete with DJ, lights, fog, etc. Totally sold it.

Everything seemed to blend fairly well until the male lead started speaking ... something was just slightly off to me with the sound, so I'm not sure if it was a mix thing, ADR, or what ... it could have just been me, but something was catching me as different.

Cool to see Chantelle in something with you, and I thought she did a solid job. I could see the vampire bit coming, but that's largely in part to your poster ... kind of tipped your hat with it. :) GREAT FX work on the blood spurting & neck would ... I was hugely impressed!

Oh, and one continuity question, or something I caught. We see her unzipping her top, but then when she pounces down on him to unbutton his, she's zipped all the way to the top. Nit pick, I know.

p.s. The editing & speed ramping as others have mentioned was VERY well executed. Solid camera work by Patrick as well!

Good comments, all have merit, would comment more off-board :-)

The entire piece was done in my house and my living room is not big at all, so Patrick and Sam did an awesome job rigging the party. The baby-plates are still bolted to my ceiling :-)


I agree that not all the actors were up to par. I did like the camera movement but for half of the short I felt I was watching a music video and not a short film.

Interesting. Which acting parts did you enjoy and which didnt work for you? The opening part was supposed to be exciting and immersing, so I guess I dont mind it feeling like a music vid. Though it's weird you comment that, music vids usually cut fast and that is a 1-shot, sort of the opposite of a music vid.


Opening shot.... :)

Cool look and feel of your film. I have to say i enjoyed some of the performances.

If anything, the title may have give the film away and you immediately knew what kind of a film it was by the line, "You could have any boy here.." (or whatever it was..)

Congrats on entering and looking forward to the next round!
/j

Sheesh, the one time I do a title that someone can pronounce. that's it, back to Latin for me! :-) lol, just teasing, sort of, haha

Which performances worked for you?


First off I loved the opening shot! That was really cool the whole normal speed then speed up then go back down was cool. Kind of like 300. The film was too quick for me. The ending should have shown the girl talking to a guy with dialogue or without dialogue, she leads him with her out of frame, cut to black, end IMO. also good job on getting extras.

We shot the ending both ways, her talking to a specific guy and her breaking the 4th wall and I felt this way was more powerful. the extras was a massive battle, getting extras for free that are of a certain age and look is daunting. thanks for commenting and viewing!

[Kholi]

Per your request, Nelson.

This was one of the ones I actually wanted to watch the most, so that I could view what sort of progress you had made. The very first thing is that there's an obvious curve from your last to this latest, in that there's a coherent and cohesive moment to follow. Nothing left up to the viewer to decide, nothing ambiguous, just straight forward narrative which I think is great, it'll help you improve immensely.

Along with that, it's cool that you tackled simple material and nothing that would break your brain. I always have an issue with just doing something simple and commend those who choose to do that and practice versus waiting for the more in-depth project to grow.

I also liked the effort put into creating a party atmosphere in the beginning with what you had available. Making what you had work for you is always a plus in my book. There is something I want to address on that front.

I haven't read the responses to the thread (I always go in virginal, haha) but I assume there've been enough comments on acting. One thing I will say is that the arguement between the female and male seemed very difficult, where the female has little to play against due to her experience, which in turn causes her performance to either drag or seem inappropriate. She actually does have a somewhat believable performance, I think it's simply what she had to work with that detracts from it. Just what I got from it. This is also tied into dialog, as it's on the nose and feels false to the situation. Forced. It's almost uneeded at this point, because she serves no further role in the short and he just gets it in the end. It doesn't help him seem like a bad enough guy to get his neck torn through. Was there a purpose that I missed in the arguement?

I don't have an issue with how things played out afterward. A bit anticlimactic but we establish that the conflict is only in that the other girl needs to Learn To Prey, she does, so be it. Are there other ways that could have been more impactful? Maybe. But this is what it is.

Still, you're improving in all areas and it's great to see. This is, in my opinion, your best effort yet and going forward I think what might be beneficial would be weighing out what's really important in the story. What may seem trivial or filler or distracting. By doing that, which I'm sure you did-- again, don't get me wrong-- you get to build on the elements that are important (learning to prey and preying on said prey) and flesh those out. Pun Intended???

So to close up, I dig the simple approach and the execution on what you had to work with, I did actually feel quite comfortable with the closing shot and sequence and I'm looking forward to seeing how you progress next all around.

=]

[Shawn Philip Nelson]

Hey Kholi, thanks for your thoughts! I really appreciate you taking the time. Your take on the party is very interesting, as I originally wrote it to be a house party. I had assumed this would be evident since the camera pans past a refrigerator, cabinetry, carpeted stairs, etc., all things that are obviously a domestic house. I didnt think anyone would get to the living room and think we were at a club. If I was trying to fake a club, I would have duv'd off the fridge, stairwell, etc.

Good thoughts on bringing better balance to my story, in that aspect the thematic pacing is indeed off, it's starting to feel like 3 movies bridged together.

Fair ding on me on the dialogue in the couple fight, I grew to hate it by the end. I should have ignored the pressure to build up the lines and cut it way down, I may do this for a post-festival cut.

[Kholi]

Hey Kholi, thanks for your thoughts! I really appreciate you taking the time. Your take on the party is very interesting, as I originally wrote it to be a house party. I had assumed this would be evident since the camera pans past a refrigerator, cabinetry, carpeted stairs, etc., all things that are obviously a domestic house. I didnt think anyone would get to the living room and think we were at a club. If I was trying to fake a club, I would have duv'd off the fridge, stairwell, etc.


I'm on my phone but duuuh. That does make sense. I think hat threw me off were the lights and atmosphere. It didn't read house party for me but I'm from the south?? I dunno if our house parties looked like raves.

My bad!

[johnhafner]

I've been to plenty of house parties that look like that, so I wasn't' confused. SUPERB technically. Great lighting and music. The actors performance didn't bother me very much, You can't expect oscar stuff from teenagers who aren't getting paid and I've seen worse in major feature films IMHO. The sound wasn't properly synced up to the dialog, which WAS distracting. the camera work, ramping, lighting, cam moves were all very professional. Did you use a steadycam or similar?

To me the choice of narrative structure was the weakest part of this very well executed entry. This is totally a creative choice, but I think it would have added some more intrigue had you not had both the title and the opening dialog revealing the ending. (Esp in a monsterfest contest). The whole story seemed to me to lend itself to a REVEAL ending, where we think the whole time they are talking about 'first time in the sack' and then SURPRISE they are vampires. Always leave them wanting more, up till the very last frame.'

BUT, plenty of movies are really great even with the ending being obvious. EX. in a romantic comedy where you know the ending (they end up together) Even after guessing the ending off the bat, the visuals and dialog and camera work and shots were more than enough to hold my interest which is a testament.

So great job, this is in my top 5.

[NOBELO]

I like simple effective pieces and I thought this one overall fit that bill pretty well. I think this one did suffer from the acting as it came across as a bit unbelievable to me. It still is definitely in the top 10. Nice job and thanks for sharing it with us.

[Scott F]

Opening shot.... :)



Everyone's saying it, I gotta say it too. The opening shot was so pro. I really like the score as well.

[jasonthewho]

Definitely your best work Shawn. I really enjoyed this one. Very clean, very professional, the story is well told.

I thought all of your actors were fine, with a little bit better dialogue and direction they would have been great.

I couldn't help but think of RPDM with that opening shot. Regardless, it was perfectly executed. I also worry that while the opening moment may be a turn on for the typical DVXuser, it may be a turn off for your wider viewing audience, which would seem to be teenage girls. I think if it didn't last quite so long (put a fast motion section between the lick and the lime), I would be okay with it.

Big strides here, in my opinion. One of my favorites so far.

[Geoff_R]

Totally unexpected :) It's just very different from the prior work I've seen from you. I think the opening shot is fun and interesting in a sense of opening up the world and setting the story tone. But once the girls start talking, it takes me out of it and a lot of it is due to the sound mix here... I think the music should have stayed loud and then the girls should have been talking very loud/almost yelling out to make their voices heard... I have this issue with lots of hollywood films too... where it suddenly gets too quiet and people are just talking in regular voices... it doesn't fit for me.

I thought the opening convo with the first two girls was fine... they came across as young college girls and played it convincingly IMO. The stuff with the guy though really threw me off (at first, it was just a personal thing). If I was at party with my gf or some girl I was seeing and some other random girl pushed me into the wall and tried to assert some dominance on me, she'd likely find herself on the ground and me with a WTF look on my face. I don't care how good she looks. On the flipside... I could maybe see why you went this direction with him being into it since his gf says, "not again"... so maybe the guy is a douche. But then their following conversation felt awkward to me... they just didn't feel like a real couple. Not sure if this was mostly read from a script or improv?

I love the fact that he goes off with the girl... it makes his character even worse (from a jerk perspective) and I'm anxiously awaiting his death :) I like the music here and the girl watching... but I didn't feel much for those high up shots looking down on the girl as blood pours from her mouth (that's totally subjective taste right there though).

I think at the very end, you had a funny opportunity to show what kind of guy the new girl would be approaching. I'd almost like to have seen a cut away to the guys face... it could have been funny (a goofy looking guy) or just another jerk-off type with a smug smile.

Overall, like the concept and how it plays out clean. There aren't any loose ends to tie up and it feels complete. Music is good and fits the theme/story well. And while this is definitely something different and new from you... I personally prefer your prior work, like Aetas and the one you did with the kid finding the box in the field (forgive me for forgetting the name right now). Only because those films were much more visual and forced me to discover your story as a filmmaker myself. Hope that makes sense. Just my personal taste on that one. Thanks for sharing and looking forward to the next one.

[bruceallen]

SPOILER ALERT

& NEWBIE LONG VERBOSE POST ALERT

Shawn

Sweet film! Here are my notes. I'm being tough because you mentioned you want to take it further to other festivals etc. So I'm focusing mostly on what I'd fix if I went that route... no time for compliments ;)

Great job on that opening shot! It was absolutely stunning. Time flowed in a really liquid, nice way around the performances and music. Lots of great touches in the production design and mise-en-scene. Oh happy drunken / E-drenched party days with dark undertones and sexual conflict! Great start!

It bugged me that the rest of the film (especially the next CU of the girl's face at 1:33 "and give up on your first time?") had less color / contrast in it than she did during the open. I think you should keep the hyper-saturated look if that's what you set up in the beginning.

The acting in the outdoor scene is bad and IMHO you probably can't save it in the edit. Rehearse the scene properly and re-shoot for sure! The film's worth it! Maybe shoot a little later in the day too - the sunlight was a little incongruous.

The guy also has a really funny way of walking into the room (in the first shot we see him). You really should re-shoot that too if you can.

The story was predictable but lots of fun. Personally the end would have been more of a payoff for me if either:

OPTION A: there was more psychological complexity to the trainee's response. The stuff of her watching from the closet was cool - but it seemed like you were trying to trick us that the girls weren't vampires? By that point everyone knows they're vampires, so I say go ahead and show that earlier - or at least give us more of a wink towards it. Now explore the conflicted emotions of the girl seeing this kill for the first time and realizing she has to do it too. Maybe get her out of the closet a little earlier? Do they share his blood or not? The more experienced girl pushes her to drink the blood of the guy and she's unsure at first then realizes she likes it? Or there is a territorial thing in that the neophyte wants to drink the guy's blood but the other girl is like "get your own".

OPTION B: Pay off the sexy opening shot at the end - but give us even more than we expected. If you show a super-hot shot in the beginning don't be prudish at the end. Or the audience will feel like you teased us and never delivered the full thing ;) I'd personally vote for a combination of the following:
- at least one girl has sex with the guy (not sure whether he should be dead or alive at that point)
- the two girls make out
- orgasm
- orgiastic screaming
- semi-nudity at least (covering in blood optional)

OPTION C: blood as a drug. The girls as addicts. But based on the rest of the film, I don't think that's your focus?

Then after that have your current ending - with the girl from the next victim's POV asking if he wanted to go somewhere quiet. Bwahaha!

But I'm Euro that way ;)

You can go for option A of course but I really would like more insight into the complexities of the girl's feelings. Is she scared? Does she get off on it? Does it make her hungry? Probably all 3, right? The obvious parallels to having sex for the first time are there, but I'd like to see you explore it more. If that's your theme (plus loss of innocence, plus the vampiric callousness of teen sexual interactions), I'd love to see more on what you personally have to say on this. Put more Shawn into it please!

Anyway, congrats! Look forward to seeing a festival version!

Bruce Allen
www.boacinema.com (http://www.boacinema.com)

[Blaine]

This is the best story you've put together. I thought the look was nice. I like what you did with the grading. My beef were more with the casting and acting on this one. Ms. Geil did a good job as did Teresa. I just didn't think that casting Chase opposite either of them was a good idea. He came off too young for either one. He may very well be in their age bracket but his demeanor and looks said otherwise.

I'm not sure why you had the argument scene in there since it had no payoff...it felt like a device and tacked on.

Of all your entries, this is my favorite. It is by far the most accessible.

Good job.

[ZazaCast]

Nice work on this film! I've always been a fan of your films, but this one worked best for me. As always, the look was spot on. You have a great eye for composition. The opening of this film had me hooked right from the first downbeat. A nice slomo body shot never hurt anyone! The speed ramps made me feel like I was right there pushing through the crowd.

The only thing that hit me a little funny, was the girl's facial expression as she watched through the door. I would think that being a Vamp and seeing & smelling fresh blood, she would have been getting 'Hot', breathing heavy with a crazy, lustfull look in her eyes...you know a ,"I want to get me some of that!" kind of thing.

Well done. This is a great film. :thumbsup:

... and I can pronounce the title too!

[Robbie Comeau]

I saw it coming as soon as they entered the room. Probably cause of the theme, and the line "You don't want to have your first time" or whatever.

Who mixed that song?! So sick.

Nice intro, and nice filming. Acting was weak.

Robbie

[Shawn Philip Nelson]

Everyone's saying it, I gotta say it too. The opening shot was so pro. I really like the score as well.

Thanks! I actually put a lot of effort into choregraphing that opening act, I didnt just get two girls and tell them to go at it :-). Alex and Herman did an awesome job on the music!


Definitely your best work Shawn. I really enjoyed this one. Very clean, very professional, the story is well told.

I thought all of your actors were fine, with a little bit better dialogue and direction they would have been great.

I couldn't help but think of RPDM with that opening shot. Regardless, it was perfectly executed. I also worry that while the opening moment may be a turn on for the typical DVXuser, it may be a turn off for your wider viewing audience, which would seem to be teenage girls. I think if it didn't last quite so long (put a fast motion section between the lick and the lime), I would be okay with it.

Big strides here, in my opinion. One of my favorites so far.

Hey, Mark doesnt own the rights to cranking and ramping :-). I'm not sure who my target audience is. On a feature this is critical, but here I can just do whatever. If I could do this again I'd probably nix or change the couple's article and crank up the bedroom scene, further putting it into the 'guy' demographic :-)


Totally unexpected :) It's just very different from the prior work I've seen from you. I think the opening shot is fun and interesting in a sense of opening up the world and setting the story tone. But once the girls start talking, it takes me out of it and a lot of it is due to the sound mix here... I think the music should have stayed loud and then the girls should have been talking very loud/almost yelling out to make their voices heard... I have this issue with lots of hollywood films too... where it suddenly gets too quiet and people are just talking in regular voices... it doesn't fit for me.

I thought the opening convo with the first two girls was fine... they came across as young college girls and played it convincingly IMO. The stuff with the guy though really threw me off (at first, it was just a personal thing). If I was at party with my gf or some girl I was seeing and some other random girl pushed me into the wall and tried to assert some dominance on me, she'd likely find herself on the ground and me with a WTF look on my face. I don't care how good she looks. On the flipside... I could maybe see why you went this direction with him being into it since his gf says, "not again"... so maybe the guy is a douche. But then their following conversation felt awkward to me... they just didn't feel like a real couple. Not sure if this was mostly read from a script or improv?

I love the fact that he goes off with the girl... it makes his character even worse (from a jerk perspective) and I'm anxiously awaiting his death :) I like the music here and the girl watching... but I didn't feel much for those high up shots looking down on the girl as blood pours from her mouth (that's totally subjective taste right there though).

I think at the very end, you had a funny opportunity to show what kind of guy the new girl would be approaching. I'd almost like to have seen a cut away to the guys face... it could have been funny (a goofy looking guy) or just another jerk-off type with a smug smile.

Overall, like the concept and how it plays out clean. There aren't any loose ends to tie up and it feels complete. Music is good and fits the theme/story well. And while this is definitely something different and new from you... I personally prefer your prior work, like Aetas and the one you did with the kid finding the box in the field (forgive me for forgetting the name right now). Only because those films were much more visual and forced me to discover your story as a filmmaker myself. Hope that makes sense. Just my personal taste on that one. Thanks for sharing and looking forward to the next one.

Hey Geoff, thanks dude! I really appreciate such a thorough review. I appreciate that you like Aetas and Ossian better, as that's ultimately more 'me', but it seems more people like this one better, go figure. It's a continual sore spot with me how poorly received Aetas and Ossian were, hence why I wont do another one like that on here, ever.

Comments on the audio are good, I'll talk more about that later.

On the male lead (Chase), I should have made his character more clear. I thought he did a good job and is getting an unfair wrap on here. I should have made him more aggressive, more douchey and shortened their argument and made it less on-the-nose. Or perhaps more. Anyways, I mixed ingredients on this one too much and should have been more consistent.

[Shawn Philip Nelson]

SPOILER ALERT

& NEWBIE LONG VERBOSE POST ALERT

Shawn

Sweet film! Here are my notes. I'm being tough because you mentioned you want to take it further to other festivals etc. So I'm focusing mostly on what I'd fix if I went that route... no time for compliments ;)

Great job on that opening shot! It was absolutely stunning. Time flowed in a really liquid, nice way around the performances and music. Lots of great touches in the production design and mise-en-scene. Oh happy drunken / E-drenched party days with dark undertones and sexual conflict! Great start!
THanks! Great to see you over here, I enjoy your posts on Reduser. That shot took a lot of work but really paid off I thought.



It bugged me that the rest of the film (especially the next CU of the girl's face at 1:33 "and give up on your first time?") had less color / contrast in it than she did during the open. I think you should keep the hyper-saturated look if that's what you set up in the beginning.
Agreed, contrast went down. (sigh) grading is one of my weaker points.



The acting in the outdoor scene is bad and IMHO you probably can't save it in the edit. Rehearse the scene properly and re-shoot for sure! The film's worth it! Maybe shoot a little later in the day too - the sunlight was a little incongruous.

Outdoor scene? Huh? I'm confused, 100% of this takes place indoors and at night with zero natural light.



The guy also has a really funny way of walking into the room (in the first shot we see him). You really should re-shoot that too if you can.

The story was predictable but lots of fun. Personally the end would have been more of a payoff for me if either:

OPTION A: there was more psychological complexity to the trainee's response. The stuff of her watching from the closet was cool - but it seemed like you were trying to trick us that the girls weren't vampires? By that point everyone knows they're vampires, so I say go ahead and show that earlier - or at least give us more of a wink towards it. Now explore the conflicted emotions of the girl seeing this kill for the first time and realizing she has to do it too. Maybe get her out of the closet a little earlier? Do they share his blood or not? The more experienced girl pushes her to drink the blood of the guy and she's unsure at first then realizes she likes it? Or there is a territorial thing in that the neophyte wants to drink the guy's blood but the other girl is like "get your own".

OPTION B: Pay off the sexy opening shot at the end - but give us even more than we expected. If you show a super-hot shot in the beginning don't be prudish at the end. Or the audience will feel like you teased us and never delivered the full thing ;) I'd personally vote for a combination of the following:
- at least one girl has sex with the guy (not sure whether he should be dead or alive at that point)
- the two girls make out
- orgasm
- orgiastic screaming
- semi-nudity at least (covering in blood optional)

OPTION C: blood as a drug. The girls as addicts. But based on the rest of the film, I don't think that's your focus?

Then after that have your current ending - with the girl from the next victim's POV asking if he wanted to go somewhere quiet. Bwahaha!

But I'm Euro that way ;)

You can go for option A of course but I really would like more insight into the complexities of the girl's feelings. Is she scared? Does she get off on it? Does it make her hungry? Probably all 3, right? The obvious parallels to having sex for the first time are there, but I'd like to see you explore it more. If that's your theme (plus loss of innocence, plus the vampiric callousness of teen sexual interactions), I'd love to see more on what you personally have to say on this. Put more Shawn into it please!

Anyway, congrats! Look forward to seeing a festival version!

Bruce Allen
www.boacinema.com (http://www.boacinema.com)
Thanks! I appreciate the brain storming. Unfortunately I cant reshoot anything, 3 of the 4 actors are now in LA. (Boo LA! You suck! Stop stealing my actors!!)

I should have gone more in the direction of Option B, I soft-peddaled the ending too much, the leads didnt want to go anywhere outside of low PG13 territory so I had to stop there. That can be a hard zone to dance in. Oh well, it's still a progression.

I think I screwed myself out of Option A by the title. It was my original intent to make the vampire thing a twist. Thanks the comments!


This is the best story you've put together. I thought the look was nice. I like what you did with the grading. My beef were more with the casting and acting on this one. Ms. Geil did a good job as did Teresa. I just didn't think that casting Chase opposite either of them was a good idea. He came off too young for either one. He may very well be in their age bracket but his demeanor and looks said otherwise.

I'm not sure why you had the argument scene in there since it had no payoff...it felt like a device and tacked on.

Of all your entries, this is my favorite. It is by far the most accessible.

Good job.

Thanks Blaine!! Chase is indeed in their age range. I agree with you in that visually, whenever I see girls of that age and then see their boyfriends I think 'eh, he looks WAY too young', visually it'd be more interesting to see Victoria with a guy who's about 23-28.

The argument scene was indeed tacked on to provide further demo reel footage. I should have cut it from the finished piece, i'm getting tons of comments to this regard.


Nice work on this film! I've always been a fan of your films, but this one worked best for me. As always, the look was spot on. You have a great eye for composition. The opening of this film had me hooked right from the first downbeat. A nice slomo body shot never hurt anyone! The speed ramps made me feel like I was right there pushing through the crowd.

The only thing that hit me a little funny, was the girl's facial expression as she watched through the door. I would think that being a Vamp and seeing & smelling fresh blood, she would have been getting 'Hot', breathing heavy with a crazy, lustfull look in her eyes...you know a ,"I want to get me some of that!" kind of thing.

Well done. This is a great film. :thumbsup:

... and I can pronounce the title too!

Wow, thanks Zaza! I agree on the direction for Chantelle, she's upset at me for that scene, blaming her bad performance on my shitty direction :-) Fair enough, director is QB, its his fault if the football isnt caught.

As for the title, dont worry, it's a momentary lapse, my next film is called Descensus :-)


I saw it coming as soon as they entered the room. Probably cause of the theme, and the line "You don't want to have your first time" or whatever.

Who mixed that song?! So sick.

Nice intro, and nice filming. Acting was weak.

Robbie

[Kevin E. Curry]

Shawn-

Good piece! I enjoyed it. Some quick thoughts:

- Even though I knew where it was going (though specifically not vampire I figured Victoria was some kind of monster), that didn't ruin for me, in fact it kind of built the tension even more. I was anxious to find out what she was going to do to these guys.

- Victoria and Theresa were great (of course I am biased, having cast them before!) The "newbie" girl was OK, and like others the guy didn't do anything for me. I like your suggestion of making him more douchey, that would have helped. In fact, making him even more of an ass would have made the payoff of him getting his comeuppance for cheating on his girlfriend even better.

- Loved the look and feel, the combo of the music and lighting etc. was great. And, of course, great opening scene to drop the viewer right into the party.

- Others have mentioned, and you acknowledged, the audio issue. Felt like bad ADR at first.

- Looking at the story, I might have gotten to Victoria's big bite a little quicker, bought a few additional seconds, and then given us just a little more of the newbie making her move. I liked that stinger and just wanted a little more. Felt just a tad rushed. (Plus, you did have a little more time left).

- Finally, speaking of that big bite, I really liked both the blood spurt effect and Victoria's vamp teeth.

[hoz]

nice film!!!

havent read the thread before so forgive if i repeat...

open was super! the music and colors and people all moved just the right way. i felt right there at the party, too cool. sort of what i went for in my own flick. you nailed it. congrats.

then the girls show up and speak. and it gets kinda thrown into another movie. at the very least i'm no longer there at the party as a viewer. the girls were good too, but i don't know, the movie lost a lot of its momentum for me. it started as a freight train and then simmered off considerably. i almost wished they didn't speak at all. physical acting here would have been much stronger almost.

the dude victim was ok. he looked overmatched though by his girl. and then also overmatched by the vamps, but that's fine, he is a victim.

the kill scene is cool. although i almost hoped for the girlfriend to walk into the mess. she seemed set up for something much more than just a fight.

anyways! you got the best look and intro!!! it's almost so good it sets the bar too high for what comes next?

congrats.

[killacam]

solid shtuff

edit: whoops, sorry for giving such a brief review- just trying to up my post count so I can actually vote on these lol. I didn't have a problem figuring out it was a house party but maybe because I've seen those before. I liked the ramping and the production value- obviously it looked nice being shot on the red. I only had one problem with the acting, I think when the girl held her hand up to her mouth in shock, it seemed a little forced or fake. but overall great job.

[vurfing]

Awesome movie - i've watched the intro too many times already. I love the jumps from slow to fast, it fits really well with the music.
Lead vampire girl is stunning!
The acting was good but as people have said, the boyfriend/girlfriend thing seems forced, its not really natural and detracts after the intro.

[Rakesh Jacob]

I loved this one a lot, very Twilight meets Melrose or something like that :)
Gotta love hot angsty female vampires

[Shawn Philip Nelson]

I loved this one a lot, very Twilight meets Melrose or something like that :)
Gotta love hot angsty female vampires

haha! this is my favorite review :-)

[Mike Manning]

nice film!!!

havent read the thread before so forgive if i repeat...

open was super! the music and colors and people all moved just the right way. i felt right there at the party, too cool. sort of what i went for in my own flick. you nailed it. congrats.

then the girls show up and speak. and it gets kinda thrown into another movie. at the very least i'm no longer there at the party as a viewer. the girls were good too, but i don't know, the movie lost a lot of its momentum for me. it started as a freight train and then simmered off considerably. i almost wished they didn't speak at all. physical acting here would have been much stronger almost.

the dude victim was ok. he looked overmatched though by his girl. and then also overmatched by the vamps, but that's fine, he is a victim.

the kill scene is cool. although i almost hoped for the girlfriend to walk into the mess. she seemed set up for something much more than just a fight.

anyways! you got the best look and intro!!! it's almost so good it sets the bar too high for what comes next?

congrats.

I think most of what this guy said was pretty on point. The intro shot is top notch, and then once the dialog begins it tanks. A lot of that may simply have to do with the fact that we're led to believe that the music is LOUD with THUMPING BASS, and then the girl's begin talking at a normal voice level.. as if the music suddenly turned down for them... oh wait, it did! You know what I mean? They should be shouting or at least speaking a little louder...

I also think that the boyfriend/girlfriend conflict doesn't help the story. The boyfriend's acting is pretty unconvincing, and while the girlfriend is out of line for not believing him, she's still way to hot for him to outright dump her on the spot over a misunderstanding. And as others have said, that whole episode leaves a false expectation that somehow the girlfriend will return in someway and she doesn't.

But anyway, good job over all. Some solid production value, great makeup effects, and hot girls all around! Here's to the next one!
-M

[Noel Evans]

Hi Shawn. Very nice intro and great track. Started on a really cool journey, then as soon as they speak aka act with some slightly off ADR I was pulled out of it.

I didnt see a great deal here in story other than what a vampire usually goes through when they "FIRST" feed. So on that side I thought it was a bit thin. Was there a little ad lib in the dialogue?

On cinematography, I felt in the club there were times things went a touch too dark, and there were a few cut off heads around that were clearly due to framing being a touch off by the op.

A highly stylised piece which it to be highly commended, which looked and sounded pretty darn cool.

[bosindy]

Nice film. thought the setup suffered from it being in Monsterfest bc the expectation is there is going to be a monster and the misdirection didn't work because of that. I liked the opening sequence a lot and am a sucker for the changes in camera speeds as the camera walks through to set up the environment (reminded me a little of RPDM), I would have liked to see you keep the sensual nature of the piece consistent with that.

There was a missed opportunity IMO to have the male character be more seduced by the vamp rather than have it be a reaction to the the argument. The dialogue was a bit awkward during the argument as well and I think it's partially due to the performance of the male character. He doesn't seem present and is not reacting well of Theresa (who I think is a good actress). The argument does set the story up though for a satisfying morality play.

I thought the bedroom scene was well shot, I would have like to see you up the ante a bit sexually to sell it. The POV ending was a nice touch. Good work.

[MOVIE STUNTS]

(SPOILER ALERT)

This was the same story as the werewolf segment of Trick R' Treat with Anna Paquin as the werewolf learning to prey! I don't know if this was your intent but there were too many similarities to not think that you borrowed heavily from it. I'm not accusing you of this, it is just my impression I hope.
That being said, I liked the acting and shots in the party sequence, it was very active and felt like an onscreen party should. Great job!

[Shawn Philip Nelson]

(SPOILER ALERT)

This was the same story as the werewolf segment of Trick R' Treat with Anna Paquin as the werewolf learning to prey! I don't know if this was your intent but there were too many similarities to not think that you borrowed heavily from it. I'm not accusing you of this, it is just my impression I hope.
That being said, I liked the acting and shots in the party sequence, it was very active and felt like an onscreen party should. Great job!

Whoa, seriously? I solely wrote Learning to Prey and I've never seen that flick. Now I'm curious :-). I feel flattered that my idea was already commercialized!

[MOVIE STUNTS]

Whoa, seriously? I solely wrote Learning to Prey and I've never seen that flick. Now I'm curious :-). I feel flattered that my idea was already commercialized!

It was made a few years ago, It's a really fun film, you should check it out!

[Troy Ruff]

I thought this film was good, ( it did remind me of RPDM, but this was still fun. Great camera moves, love the color, and acting was pretty good. Great job.

[alex whitmer]

Nice performances - again. Some recognizable faces.

Maybe a little common as concerns the motivation for the victim to wander away, and from a chick's point of view, he deserved what he got. Maybe too much airtime on the contentious repartee. I wanted more suffering.

Always like your works, Shawn.

a

[Robert Eldon]

Shawn and Teresa,

I loved the opening scenes for this film. Really nice club vibe and energy. The frame rate ramping was a great effect. When we first see the main character, she has a great look, and from the title, we know that she is the 'bad girl', the monster.

So far, so good. At about TC 2:28, when the guy and girl are having the argument, the lighting changes, brighter/warmer, and that took me out of the film. I wasn't sure at that point, where they were, and the argument seemed contrived. I don't know how else you would have presented that though?

The weakest part for me was the acting from the young guy and his motivation. Teresa's acting was good and emotional, but was diminished by the other actor. The actress that played the 'monster', played that character very well.

My favorite shot was probably the push in on the 'monster' girl at about TC 1:03. There was something about the color and softness and camera movement that I really liked.

The title of the film kind of gives away the premise, but I think that's a good thing in this case, because I was looking forward to seeing how the characters would 'learn to prey'.

Very nice piece. Good job! :)

[morbidodyssey]

I loved the way the opening played out, but once the characters started talking, I became less interested. I thought the actors were kind of flat(but very attractive!) and I think some of the conversation may have went on too long. The ending scene with the attack is really well done too. Good cinematography, and some good visual storytelling.

[Shawn Philip Nelson]

I thought this film was good, ( it did remind me of RPDM, but this was still fun. Great camera moves, love the color, and acting was pretty good. Great job.

Sheesh, does RPDM have a claim on frame ramping at a party? :-) Just teasing ya. Now if RPDM had two girls doing a body shot then there'd be more of a reason to suggest I lifted anything. But I really love RPDM, lost to it with Aetas.


Nice performances - again. Some recognizable faces.

Maybe a little common as concerns the motivation for the victim to wander away, and from a chick's point of view, he deserved what he got. Maybe too much airtime on the contentious repartee. I wanted more suffering.

Always like your works, Shawn.

a

Thanks! Yeah i'm still debating what I should have done differently with him.


Shawn and Teresa,

I loved the opening scenes for this film. Really nice club vibe and energy. The frame rate ramping was a great effect. When we first see the main character, she has a great look, and from the title, we know that she is the 'bad girl', the monster.

So far, so good. At about TC 2:28, when the guy and girl are having the argument, the lighting changes, brighter/warmer, and that took me out of the film. I wasn't sure at that point, where they were, and the argument seemed contrived. I don't know how else you would have presented that though?

The weakest part for me was the acting from the young guy and his motivation. Teresa's acting was good and emotional, but was diminished by the other actor. The actress that played the 'monster', played that character very well.

My favorite shot was probably the push in on the 'monster' girl at about TC 1:03. There was something about the color and softness and camera movement that I really liked.

The title of the film kind of gives away the premise, but I think that's a good thing in this case, because I was looking forward to seeing how the characters would 'learn to prey'.

Very nice piece. Good job! :)

Thanks! As per my last comment, I should have adjusted Chase's lines as I now realize what I wrote didnt come across as I intended it to.


I loved the way the opening played out, but once the characters started talking, I became less interested. I thought the actors were kind of flat(but very attractive!) and I think some of the conversation may have went on too long. The ending scene with the attack is really well done too. Good cinematography, and some good visual storytelling.

Thanks! My crew did an awesome job bringing those visuals to life. I agree that my dialogue is my weak point, definitely on the improvement list.

[lawriejaffa]

Righto well the film establishes a great mood for adolescent parties borne from the miasma of American popular culture *blurgh* this is the highschool party of models, of beauties and multi-coloured decadence.

You know my high school disco's were never like that - we had the campest euro pop electro music, and i ended up snogging a girl with one eye and a wooden leg, (she was borrowing my wooden leg.)

So anyway the start is glossy and superficial - it does however lend to the idea of attraction and the physical nature of the adolescent perspective of sexuality (in the softest senses anyway.) The lady for our vamp looks great for the part, there maybe a little stiff on there lines, but not terrible, in terms of performance, the weedy guy is genuinely annoying so is setup to suffer his fate quite deservedly. I understand there's some crit for performance here and there, well really i only found our blonde would be student a little stiff - now and again - particularly from her peekaboo shots.

The saxaphone... come on.... please.

I'm fed up saxaphones in sex scenes... everytime i put on my leapord skin cat suit (made from genuine miows) and Sarah's reclined over a bed of bubble paper - then suddenly.... there's Baker Street emanating from the cupboard!

Then of course our dude is murdered... in the land of softcore sexuality. Its just a bit glossy and soft and wimpy in some regards.

Compare to Lovers - as an examination of the vampire myth and sexuality and our insipid fears, and while Shawn has produced an excellent technical production, its about as brave as my scottish thermal underwear!

So i say kudos for a decent production shot beautifully, and i think acceptably acted - a professional film, just not a very exciting one!

[Shawn Philip Nelson]

Lawrie,
Thank you! I do so enjoy your reviews, even if it's a bit of a British skewering :-).

Come now, you didn't enjoy the bodyshot? :-) As per your review, that sort of party is precisely the sort of thing I wanted, a party of fantasy. For one I had an incredible lighting system rigged into that room. So yes, it's supposed to be the party that everyone wants to go to but never actually exists.

Usually it's the girls getting preyed upon at these parties, so I thought I was flipping convention by making it the beautiful "innocent" that are instead having all the power in every sense. Granted it's not a new statement, thousands of years of tales of sirens and so forth (as your own Rusalka is about), but parties such as this depicted the girls are usually pawns and at the receiving end (quite literally). I was attempting to mislead the audience but my title was ill-chosen in that regard.

Thank you sir!

[lawriejaffa]

Yep just to clarify i was DoP / editor for Rusalka - (Sarah was the boss) You certainly achieved what your telling me there you set out to do. (Yeah the bodyshot was okay!)

Phwoar and theres nothing like a British skewering er... well done mate on the film :)

[Herman Witkam]

The saxaphone... come on.... please.

lol - well...call it retro, like your mustaccio :)

it's SaxOphone btw :D

[Horncastle]

This was a professionally produced piece - great lighting, camera moves, ramping, etc. Apart from a few small acting flaws already mentioned it all works OK, but... it just feels a little bit flat and unsurprising. When it comes down to it, I think I don't really feel this film is "yours" in the same way as Aetas and Ossian - it feels as though you are making what you think you ought to be making rather than really having your heart in it.

What you say here seems to confirm this:

I appreciate that you like Aetas and Ossian better, as that's ultimately more 'me', but it seems more people like this one better, go figure. It's a continual sore spot with me how poorly received Aetas and Ossian were, hence why I wont do another one like that on here, ever.

I scratched my head a little when I read this. I actually went back to look at the threads of both of them: Aetas was a finalist (in my personal top 5 I believe) and both had lots of really good reviews - so I would hardly say they were poorly received. They were both beautiful (and to my mind more personal) films, although Aetas was perhaps rather an epic trying to be a short while Ossian was a "small" film, a single scene really (nothing wrong with that, it worked really well, but it probably put it at a disadvantage in the scoring). And I'm sure your heart was in them both. So I think and hope that sooner or later you will go back to making Aetases and Ossians (and, as an aside, they will probably be all the better for your experience making films like Learning to Prey).

[Sprocketboy]

There is a lot of nice work in this short. DP work, as usual in all your films, is great. The ADR is still noticeable even though you did a damn good job hiding it under the music. Nate's ADR is not working too well and made his performance sub par to the actors around him. The only other thing I will point out that I didn't care much for... is the reaction of the vampire's apprentice in the closet during the attack scene. Its too cute. Overall, the editing is tight and paces nicely throughout. A big thumbs up on the music and sound design work. Your actresses come across confident and convincing. A job well done.

[Shawn Philip Nelson]

Usually I dont comment post-fest but thought this entry is unusual enough for me to warrant it (for whoever cares).

Two things hurt this the most. First, my writing. I really like my overall idea but I failed to properly integrate the argument as well as it needed to be. I'm proud of my actors and thought they suffered because I was trying to make the argument more high key for their demo reel purposes instead of trying harder to make it work for the overall story. Sometimes gumbo soup doesnt work. Incidentally the idea for the whole short is based off of Proverbs 5:3-5.

The second thing that really hurt us was the destruction of all audio. There was a gear mistake day-of wherein the input of audio was set to mic in when it should have been line in, as a result every single line clipped horribly, necessitating a 100% ADR. I tried my best and so did the actors but it just doesnt work and really hurts everything. Some ADR'd better than others (though I wont go further on that). This worsened the melodramatic feel of it.

Im extremely proud of the production quality of the image.

I think I also miscalculated the audience and not making it "bad" enough. All the top 3 end with a sort of sucker-punch "doesnt that suck ass?" sort of ending, I think that's more the ticket. It should have been rated R instead of the tame pg13 that it was.

Well, thus ends that experiment. Cheerio.

Lastly a BIG shoutout to my sound crew of Ryan Frias, Alex Orion and Herman Witkam for saving this piece and getting us into finals.

[Noel Evans]

as a result every single line clipped horribly, necessitating a 100% ADR.

Holey crap! Well Im going to add to my comment - best ADR in a fest ever. Whilst the emotion may have changed from what you intended, this matched beautifully in all except one spot. Really well done.

[Jason Ramsey]

Usually I dont comment post-fest but thought this entry is unusual enough for me to warrant it (for whoever cares).

Two things hurt this the most. First, my writing. I really like my overall idea but I failed to properly integrate the argument as well as it needed to be. I'm proud of my actors and thought they suffered because I was trying to make the argument more high key for their demo reel purposes instead of trying harder to make it work for the overall story. Sometimes gumbo soup doesnt work. Incidentally the idea for the whole short is based off of Proverbs 5:3-5.

The second thing that really hurt us was the destruction of all audio. There was a gear mistake day-of wherein the input of audio was set to mic in when it should have been line in, as a result every single line clipped horribly, necessitating a 100% ADR. I tried my best and so did the actors but it just doesnt work and really hurts everything. Some ADR'd better than others (though I wont go further on that). This worsened the melodramatic feel of it.

I think I also miscalculated the audience and not making it "bad" enough. All the top 3 end with a sort of sucker-punch "doesnt that suck ass?" sort of ending, I think that's more the ticket. It should have been rated R instead of the tame pg13 that it was.

Well, thus ends that experiment. Cheerio.

Lastly a BIG shoutout to my sound crew of Ryan Frias, Alex Orion and Herman Witkam for saving this piece and getting us into finals.

If I may.... I think your biggest problem was in trying to make what you thought was a "winner" (at least that is how it came across to me), rather than just making the film you wanted to make, the way you wanted to make it and letting the chips fall where they may. As a result, I think it may have ended up coming across as less than original. Not trying to sound harsh. Just dont' have the proper words I'm looking for.

It felt a bit to me like perhaps you were trying to pander to what you thought was going to "win the fest" or whatever, and your creative voice may have gotten lost in there. But, regardless of how the results turn out in the end, you really never do know what can or will win. Sure, there are patterns here or there, but I've seen every last one of them shattered at one time or another.

Later,
Jason

[Shawn Philip Nelson]

If I may.... I think your biggest problem was in trying to make what you thought was a "winner" (at least that is how it came across to me), rather than just making the film you wanted to make, the way you wanted to make it and letting the chips fall where they may. As a result, I think it may have ended up coming across as less than original. Not trying to sound harsh. Just dont' have the proper words I'm looking for.

It felt a bit to me like perhaps you were trying to pander to what you thought was going to "win the fest" or whatever, and your creative voice may have gotten lost in there. But, regardless of how the results turn out in the end, you really never do know what can or will win. Sure, there are patterns here or there, but I've seen every last one of them shattered at one time or another.

Later,
Jason

A reasonable accusation, but I would somewhat disagree. My normal stuff is pretty heavily disliked here, so in that regard I was trying something different ( I dont need to get pissed on a third time for the same thing). I was just trying to be do something totally unlike what i've done, deliberate practice of my weak points. I think my writing choice is what sunk me and that my overall premise would still work if treated differently.

I already have something else in the can (and actually was going to submit it since i shot it mid-October but ran out of time for post) that's massively different from this piece or anything else I've gone. I'll keep varying it until I am satisfied.

[Barry_Green]

I was just trying to be do something totally unlike what i've done, deliberate practice of my weak points.
You should. Stretching your boundaries and stepping outside your comfort zone is the way to grow. And, in many ways, that's what DVXFest is all about.


I think my writing choice is what sunk me and that my overall premise would still work if treated differently
I don't really think so, not for this fest. As for my watching, there was no mystery in your original premise at all. A glance at the title, and especially at the poster, gave it away and I knew exactly what to expect.

Had this been entered in LoveFest, or something like that, where there was a good chance at some surprise (and with a different poster that didn't give it away) perhaps it would have worked. But for MonsterFest, I saw the ending coming from a hundred miles away. And that's something that doesn't even reflect on the quality of the picture itself, it's just the combination of this premise, placed within the existing expectations of "MonsterFest". No matter how well-acted or well-shot, it still would have been completely predictable based on the particular requirements of the fest it was entered in, and the clues given in the poster and the title.

Matching or meeting or exceeding an audience's expectations is a tricky thing, but succeeding at doing that is key towards having the audience enjoy your film.

Which is frankly a worry I have for betrayalfest -- because right now, I have to say, if people enter that fest with the idea of "ooh, I'm gonna set up this film and then surprise, at the end, there's a betrayal!" then I think we're going to have a lot of disappointed audience members.

My take, anyway.

[Jack Daniel Stanley]

If I may.... I think your biggest problem was in trying to make what you thought was a "winner" (at least that is how it came across to me), ....
It felt a bit to me like perhaps you were trying to pander to what you thought was going to "win the fest" or whatever, and your creative voice may have gotten lost in there. ...

This has been my biggest struggle as a filmmaker.

It's valid to some degree. I mean filmmaking is communication and definitely the point of it is "how will this be received" "how can I craft this to get such and such effect to server the story."

And it's also typical of young filmmakers, to start by emulating others work that they admire. Not saying necessarily that you are doing this Shawn, just that lots of people do. Including myself to a large degree initially and some still.

When I started on DVXuser with a couple decent placings, I was forever studying the films that won and trying to reverse engineer them. Not to copy them per se, but after Zombie Fest, for example, I thought "my film was OK/did OK but I don't think it's the kind of film that will play as well as the 1st place film did for such a guy forum/genre contest." Mine lacked action and was about family devotion. The winning film had cool cowboys and some good scares. So I said - I want to do something more like that the next time. My next film was much more a "guy" film.

But I think you reach greater successes to kind of take that stuff in and then "chase your own demons" as one writing teacher of mine put it. He said, "writers chase their demons" meaning, there's some kind of thematic wellspring particular to you that gives you juice / makes you interesting. So it's worthwhile to consider how certain kinds of films play and certain kinds of effects and production value, but always go back to yourself.

Now I don't mean to be preaching. This is a struggle for me. I started trying to make films like me, then Sam Balcomb and Jesse Soff, then Macgregor, and now, I just did a web series pilot and Fat Monster was in the back of my head "I have to have THAT kind of production value". I'm also trying to make work more like Zak Forsman now with a certain kind of depth. Every time I write and ending I think of Mark Harris and our ongoing discussiona about what makes a good ending. Maybe one can't help but think like that, but make sure YOU would want to see it YOU are passionate about not just the film but the ideas and themes in the film on the most personal level. I think when you find when you are working on something and you have no choice but to veer away from how so-and-so would have done it, that it feels like it has to be done this other way, then you are on the right path.

Again, not saying you are going through the same thing exactly, but I think a lot of our members go through this "trying to think of a winner" or "what plays on DVXuser", and its still something I struggle with.

One thing that's def. helped - getting away from User and playing real world fests / a mix of straight and genre festivals, and learning more and more that there is no winning formula that goes over everywhere, there's only making the movie you'd want to see, which, ironically I think, is the most sure fire, or as sure fire as any other strategy for making a good one / one that others will be drawn to. IMHO.

[Barry_Green]

Mine lacked action and was about family devotion. The winning film had cool cowboys and some good scares. So I said - I want to do something more like that the next time. My next film was much more a "guy" film.
And yet, Ramsey nearly won LoveFest with probably the most action-less film ever submitted. A locked-down shot of two folks sitting on the back porch. My wife still thinks that's the best film ever on DVXFest, and she still asks me when there's gonna be a feature version of it.

And, that action-less zombie film of yours is what first marked you in my book as a guy to watch.

Point being, you can't ever predict what audiences are actually going to want. There is no "formula" -- if there was, there never would have been an "Ishtar".

I still say "production value" is probably the least important of the values. If I care what's happening to the characters, and it's not some predictable boring cliche rehash retread... then as long as it's in focus and you can hear the dialogue, man, that's just about all you need...

[Jack Daniel Stanley]

And yet, Ramsey nearly won LoveFest with probably the most action-less film ever submitted. A locked-down shot of two folks sitting on the back porch. My wife still thinks that's the best film ever on DVXFest, and she still asks me when there's gonna be a feature version of it.

Because that was 100% heart from Jason. Which was my point, which I know you know, that something that the filmmaker is connected to on a profound level is the surest formula for success.


And, that action-less zombie film of yours is what first marked you in my book as a guy to watch.

Point being, you can't ever predict what audiences are actually going to want. There is no "formula" -- if there was, there never would have been an "Ishtar".

I still say "production value" is probably the least important of the values. If I care what's happening to the characters, and it's not some predictable boring cliche rehash retread... then as long as it's in focus and you can hear the dialogue, man, that's just about all you need...Yes as I go around to the "real world" fests now, production value is getting less and less impressive. If it's used to create original draws-you-in atmosphere and mood or a unique world, then yes it's worth something. 4 years ago the fact that guys like us could make movies like these was really noteworthy. Now there are just tens of thousands of folks out there with JDS/Barry, Fat Monster, Bits and Pieces production value. It's almost as underwhelming as taking off the lens cap now.

[Slimothy]

And yet, Ramsey won LoveFest with probably the most action-less film ever submitted. A locked-down shot of two folks sitting on the back porch. My wife still thinks that's the best film ever on DVXFest, and she still asks me when there's gonna be a feature version of it.

And, that action-less zombie film of yours is what first marked you in my book as a guy to watch.

Point being, you can't ever predict what audiences are actually going to want. There is no "formula" -- if there was, there never would have been an "Ishtar".

I still say "production value" is probably the least important of the values. If I care what's happening to the characters, and it's not some predictable boring cliche rehash retread... then as long as it's in focus and you can hear the dialogue, man, that's just about all you need...

I think a lot of people think of "production value" as what the frame looks like but I think it goes well beyond that. I think it's a combination of lighting, location, acting, editing, color timing etc. Of course visual fx and things like that can help but I look at a film like I F*cking Hate you and to me that still seems like it has great production value. Am I in the minority there? It still looks professional as hell but not because of money spent or anything like that but because everything was well crafted which (IMO) exuded high production values. Not sure if anyone agrees but that's the way I see it.

[Mark Johnson]

Appreciate the candor and public rumination, Jack. There's much worth considering in those observations.

I've often referred to your work in discussions with Tim and Luis where I've talked about your "consistency" as being something we need to emulate. After reading your post and considering your films, I realize that what I have been drawn to is the consistent devotion of effort into your craft -- not consistency in terms of style or content. In truth, your films cover a broad range, but they all exhibit unmistakable attention to detail, planning and preproduction.

I don't think anyone has ever accused you of taking shortcuts and, frankly, at times when we worked on "Rekindled" I thought you were neurotic in your fastidiousness. Nevertheless, I see how that level of investment pays off in your films time after time and its something we need to work harder at attaining.

Shawn, I compliment you on your willingness to be self-critical. One of the best ways to grow comes from being willing to be your own toughest critic. Lord knows we rip ourselves up with every post mortem we do and we have no illusions that "Dispatch" or anything else we've done constitutes high art.

With all respect, I think you do yourself a disservice with the attitude you expressed in your recent post:
My normal stuff is pretty heavily disliked here From what I've observed, you've consistently produced solid work that has been voted among the finalists here so I'm not sure what you are referring to as evidence that your films are heavily disliked.

Moreover, if it's your candid assessment that your completed films have been "better" than the competition then you've achieved the most important result anyway. It doesn't matter where you finish in the voting if you honestly feel that your film was superior to the field and that you achieved what you were after.

[Edgen]

Nelson... I've always dug your films.

I say make the movies you want to make and do the best you can at making them. These festivals are here to help you improve as a filmmaker. Not only the critiques on your own film... but also to learn from all the other critiques across the DVXuser festival.

/j

[Shawn Philip Nelson]

Hey Barry,
Thanks for weighing in here.

You strike at an interesting idea. I knew my entry wouldnt be a surprise or shock to ANYONE in this fest, as it's Monsterfest anyways. I didnt care but clearly the voters did. Why does every entry have to twist? I didnt care that it was predictable, I just wanted to entertain with the ride. I think the DVXUsers highly value twists more than execution.

Ditto to your thoughts on betrayal.


You should. Stretching your boundaries and stepping outside your comfort zone is the way to grow. And, in many ways, that's what DVXFest is all about.


I don't really think so, not for this fest. As for my watching, there was no mystery in your original premise at all. A glance at the title, and especially at the poster, gave it away and I knew exactly what to expect.

Had this been entered in LoveFest, or something like that, where there was a good chance at some surprise (and with a different poster that didn't give it away) perhaps it would have worked. But for MonsterFest, I saw the ending coming from a hundred miles away. And that's something that doesn't even reflect on the quality of the picture itself, it's just the combination of this premise, placed within the existing expectations of "MonsterFest". No matter how well-acted or well-shot, it still would have been completely predictable based on the particular requirements of the fest it was entered in, and the clues given in the poster and the title.

Matching or meeting or exceeding an audience's expectations is a tricky thing, but succeeding at doing that is key towards having the audience enjoy your film.

Which is frankly a worry I have for betrayalfest -- because right now, I have to say, if people enter that fest with the idea of "ooh, I'm gonna set up this film and then surprise, at the end, there's a betrayal!" then I think we're going to have a lot of disappointed audience members.

My take, anyway.

[Shawn Philip Nelson]

This has been my biggest struggle as a filmmaker.

It's valid to some degree. I mean filmmaking is communication and definitely the point of it is "how will this be received" "how can I craft this to get such and such effect to server the story."

And it's also typical of young filmmakers, to start by emulating others work that they admire. Not saying necessarily that you are doing this Shawn, just that lots of people do. Including myself to a large degree initially and some still.

When I started on DVXuser with a couple decent placings, I was forever studying the films that won and trying to reverse engineer them. Not to copy them per se, but after Zombie Fest, for example, I thought "my film was OK/did OK but I don't think it's the kind of film that will play as well as the 1st place film did for such a guy forum/genre contest." Mine lacked action and was about family devotion. The winning film had cool cowboys and some good scares. So I said - I want to do something more like that the next time. My next film was much more a "guy" film.

But I think you reach greater successes to kind of take that stuff in and then "chase your own demons" as one writing teacher of mine put it. He said, "writers chase their demons" meaning, there's some kind of thematic wellspring particular to you that gives you juice / makes you interesting. So it's worthwhile to consider how certain kinds of films play and certain kinds of effects and production value, but always go back to yourself.

Now I don't mean to be preaching. This is a struggle for me. I started trying to make films like me, then Sam Balcomb and Jesse Soff, then Macgregor, and now, I just did a web series pilot and Fat Monster was in the back of my head "I have to have THAT kind of production value". I'm also trying to make work more like Zak Forsman now with a certain kind of depth. Every time I write and ending I think of Mark Harris and our ongoing discussiona about what makes a good ending. Maybe one can't help but think like that, but make sure YOU would want to see it YOU are passionate about not just the film but the ideas and themes in the film on the most personal level. I think when you find when you are working on something and you have no choice but to veer away from how so-and-so would have done it, that it feels like it has to be done this other way, then you are on the right path.

Again, not saying you are going through the same thing exactly, but I think a lot of our members go through this "trying to think of a winner" or "what plays on DVXuser", and its still something I struggle with.

One thing that's def. helped - getting away from User and playing real world fests / a mix of straight and genre festivals, and learning more and more that there is no winning formula that goes over everywhere, there's only making the movie you'd want to see, which, ironically I think, is the most sure fire, or as sure fire as any other strategy for making a good one / one that others will be drawn to. IMHO.

Thanks Jack, those are worthwhile thoughts.

I've stayed away from fests because i've been told by too many people that the big ones wont even watch your entry unless it's been kissed by an insider. I dont have money to throw away for my dvds to sit on a shelf. If there was a list of worthwhile festivals that guaranteed your movie to be screened by at least two people then I'd maybe get back at it.

[Jack Daniel Stanley]

Your movies will seen by someone at major festivals virtually guaranteed, and I can prove it via an email I got from Sundance recently ... read on ...

Now WHO screens your movie at the festival is a different question. Big festivals HAVE to have helpers pre-screen. But the way it works is they rate it as "2nd look" or not. So they're saying basically "this doesn't suck it's worth it for someone besides myself to look at it."

I didn't get juiced in to Slamdance. Was totally just one of the sheep. Same for Philadelphia and Austin Film Fest, and Lone Star International. Same for all the genre festivals I've played.

Here's proof that they want to see your movie.
SUNDANCE - submitted a rough cut of something new to them this year. They don't know anything about the other festivals I've played etc. But I got this email from them.


Jack,

Although we have received your submission to the Sundance Film Festival, the version we currently have is broken or damaged in some way. We must receive a new version in order to keep your film in consideration for the festival.

Please send a corrected copy of the film ASAP directly to my attention at the address below. Include your original Tracking Number on the DVD itself as well as a copy of this email. Thank you very much and we look forward to viewing your submission.


Best,

Landon Zakheim
Coordinator, Programming Department
Sundance Institute
8530 Wilshire Blvd., 3rd Floor
Beverly Hills, CA 90211So here they are with 6 thousand shorts entries and they have a system set up to make sure they all get seen. EVEN if the thing keeping them back is that MY disc is crappy! Pretty cool huh? And tust me. I am just some guy to Sundance. I have no juice there.

If it's a big reputablie festival, they will have a system for handling SOMEONE seeing all the material that comes in and rating it and plugging it in to the system. Whether or not that someone plugs you into the system depends on what they had for breakfast that day, if you do something annoying in your short that the last 50 films they saw also did (like beging your short by having a character wake up to an alarm clock, or having a character stair soul searchingly into a mirror, or having them stair nostalgically at a photo), their personal tastes/issues: Friend at Austin Film Festival to Programmer/Founder of the Marfa Film Festival at Austin FIlm Festival party. FRIEND: (holding up post card) You should come see my friend Jack's shorts they're really good. MARFA PROGRAMMER: Yeah I know I've seen them, but they're DISGUTSING! A Lot of women have issues with that subject matter. I'd submitted to her festival. Once she saw the graphic bloody miscarriage scene in A LITTLE MOUTH TO FEED, that was pretty much end of the story for my films at teh Marfa Film festiva. ... so it's a total crap shoot and you may or may not get in based on 100 things. But the majors will look at your films.

Now it's slightly different for features. Yes at major festivals agents and producers try to lobby their films into the fest - such films may be screened, but usually only out of competition. But for shorts its a much more even playing field. HBO just doesn't make short films written and directed by Kevin Bacon, and if they did, they'd have little incentive to really push for it getting into Sundance (little money incentive that is).

Pick ten major festivals and submit (buy your lottery ticket). Who knows. Ten major festivals shouldn't break your bank. That won't even be the cost of 1 accessory for the RED.

Then start googling things about your short and places you'd like to, or can afford to go. I googled "Horror+Film Festival+Los Angeles", "Horror+Film Festival+New York", "Horror+Film Festival+Texas" for example.

Here's a trick that can save you money AND make you look like an insider. Call them and ask if you can not pay. Just ask. "Hi I'm really struggling financially and I have this film I really believe in but my baby's gotta eat. Is there anyway in the world I could get a reduced or waived entrance fee?" Some of them may say yes! Now here's the cool part. If they say yes you can now send in your envelope / application with "Fee Waived as per 'Joe Sundance'" Or whomever gave you the waiver written on it with a big sharpie. Now there is the possibility that when your envelope comes in, maybe it goes in a different pile, maybe someone higher up picks it up and says "Oh this came in through Joe Sundance. Joe must have invited this person to submit. I'll take a look." Just maybe. Of course it could be a pe-on that waves your fee, or very likely, while it won't be the founder of the festival, it will be a longtime trusted employee that's also a filmmaker that also from time to time asks his friends to submit, and those submissions might get moved up the screening chain a bit.

Finally here's a list of 25 film festivals "worth the submission fee" from Movie Maker Magazine:
http://www.moviemaker.com/festivals/article/25_film_festivals_worth_the_entry_fee_2009_2009071 4/

[bosindy]

I've stayed away from fests because i've been told by too many people that the big ones wont even watch your entry unless it's been kissed by an insider. I dont have money to throw away for my dvds to sit on a shelf. If there was a list of worthwhile festivals that guaranteed your movie to be screened by at least two people then I'd maybe get back at it.



this is not true, having talked to a few programmers this past year, most of the well respected fest have each screener watched by more than one person. It doesn't mean its not extremely competitive to get in given the number of entries of course. Having a connection to the fest can help but many films get into the top fests that are submitted blind.

EDIT< Jack beat me to it with his post and he would know as well as anyone.

[Zak Forsman]

I met Landon Zakheim at the LA Film Festival. He's one of the good guys.