The Panasonic G1HD | GH-1 Video Mode : A Real Video Mode

[RaviSun3D]

Oh! kholi,
Read my last post, see if that makes sense to you!

[Kholi]

It does. But I seriously MUST have something set wrong if the Clips only reading 9mbps and not the 17. that's nearly half.

[ChipG]

Does it record any meta data, camera settings etc to the SD card files?

[Ian-T]

Is it somehow dependent on motion? Meaning do you think if there were motion in the video it would compress it more maybe? Just a stupid thought.

[Peter J. DeCrescenzo]

It does. But I seriously MUST have something set wrong if the Clips only reading 9mbps and not the 17. that's nearly half.

If you can stand it, do another "FHD" test, but this time with the GH1 aimed at a scene with continuous movement. A torture test might be aiming it at a TV that's displaying something, anything moving. Or a scene with grass/trees/surf blowing in a breeze, etc.

Does recording constant motion hugely affect the GH1's maximum continuous record times?

[hunter richards]

Just got mine! I tried the live composite out put and it does spit out a live image through the a/v cable.

The only issue is 1. You have to have the LCD flipped on, 2. It stops spiiting out a live image once you press record. So its a no go for having a directors monitor.

Maybe kholi can try the test with the hdmi again? You open the LCD, press display, and then hold down the Trash button for 10 seconds about- the screen flashes for a second and then you get a live image. *** note -- this only works if you have a memory card installed in the camera ***

[henrooo]

@Kholi

Save Yourself some time....

"The camera can record AVCHD movie in SD memory cards up to their full capacities.
However, the camera can record Motion JPEG movie up to 2 GB in SD memory cards. The camera shows the time
it can save (remaining time to record) computed from 2GB space in recording Motion JPEG movie even though
your memory card capacity exceeds 2 GB."

http://avc-cs.panasonic.co.jp/faq/1033/app/servlet/qadoc?QID=002074

What Class is your SD card?

...because it "is strongly recommended to use SD memory cards whose card classes are larger than Class 6 for movie recording. For
Motion JPEG movie recording with the quality HD, WVGA or VGA fast type SD memory cards labeled as at least 10 MB/S
is recommended."

http://avc-cs.panasonic.co.jp/faq/1033/app/servlet/qadoc?QID=002072-1

[Kholi]

Just tried that Composite thing as well. Does work But cuts out afterward like Hunter said.

Will try the HDMI in one second.

[Barry_Green]

Kholi, I'm using Nero to play the files back; you can tell it to display additional data such as bitrate and frame rate. On the 0040.mts file, it drops as low as 6 megabits in places.

Try some full motion shots in FHD and SH mode (shoot basically the same thing) and try playing them back in Nero, or, if you don't have nero, shoot 'em on over and I'll try 'em.

[Kholi]

I'll take it outside right now and get some footage then send it to you. brb

[henrooo]

Someone posted this link yesterday - just for reference sake, visit http://avc-cs.panasonic.co.jp/faq/1033/app/servlet/qasearch

a lot of the questions people are asking can be found there.

[ChipG]

Someone posted this link yesterday - just for reference sake, visit http://avc-cs.panasonic.co.jp/faq/1033/app/servlet/qasearch

a lot of the questions people are asking can be found there.

It pulls up a panny page that says: The specified URL is incorrect.

[LizaWitz]

If you want your footage to look like a film camera shot it, you want to use 1/120 shutter on 60fps that's intended to play back at 24fps. That's the speed that will match the exposure (and motion blur) that a film camera would.

I think the point of confusion on this issue is that the phrase "look like a film camera shot it" means a film camera running at 60fps, with a 180 shutter and thus a 1/120th second recording time.

The other method, I think, was an attempt to run at 60fps, and then have it play back at 24fps with the motion blur as if it had been shoot at 24 fps (and all of reality was slower.)

Or put another way, a high speed film camera cuts down on motion blur because the shutter moves faster (while still being 180 degrees).


I don't know just yet if there's a recording time limit, I'll have to let it run for a while to see. Coming soon.

I saw on one of the Panasonic spec sheets, once, that the "max recording time" was 120 minutes-- this was a claim of the batteries performance, rather than a built in limit to the camera. I believe that if you use the battery adapter and run the camera from wall current that it will record as long as you have card capacity.



I recently purchased a Kingston 8GB SDHC Class 6 memory card from Amazon.com to use when we test Hunter's GH1 soon:
I won't know for sure until we try it if this card is appropriate for use with the GH1, especially its full-HD 1080p24 AVCHD recording mode.

17Mbps is 2.125 MBps. Class 6 means the minimum sustained transfer rate the card claims to be capable of is 6 MBps so you should only be using 1/3 of the peak bandwidth of the card.

A Class 4 card should be more than adequate, but given that there isn't really a price premium for Class 6 I don't think there's any reason not to use them.


How is this possible?Anyone know what's going on? Theories?

I believe what we're seeing with the lower bitrates is the effect of variable bitrates (the "VBR" in the specs). If the camera's sitting there recording a static scene, it should take significantly less data to record each frame, and in fact probably most of the data will be the periodic complete keyframes rather than interframe deltas.

So, "17Mbps" is probably a guide, and in actual use might range between 15 and 25Mbps depending on what is needed by the scene in question-- and what's been going on previously.

The camera probably has a fairly large buffer -- probably 48MB going by the burst shooting mode specs-- which means it can probably hold around 10 or more frames in memory at a time for analysis... and to some extent allocate the bandwidth to the frames that need it the most.

Might be worth shooting 2 30 second clips, one with the camera facing a blank wall or simple static scene, and the other outside panning the camera around constantly... and then look at the file sizes and see if they are different. I would be surprised if they are nearly the same. If they are then the compression is targeting a constant bitrate, but if not then its letting the differences between the frames determine how much of its bitrate it uses to store them.

[Peter J. DeCrescenzo]

Just got mine! I tried the live composite out put and it does spit out a live image through the a/v cable.

The only issue is 1. You have to have the LCD flipped on, 2. It stops spiiting out a live image once you press record. So its a no go for having a directors monitor.

Maybe kholi can try the test with the hdmi again? You open the LCD, press display, and then hold down the Trash button for 10 seconds about- the screen flashes for a second and then you get a live image.

That's great news, Hunter.

Just curious: Does the "LVF/LCD" button have any affect on live composite video out when recording?

[henrooo]

It pulls up a panny page that says: The specified URL is incorrect.


http://panasonic.jp/support/global/cs/dsc/index.html

here we go....click on the FAQ--->GH1 links. has a lot of info on the GH1

[squig]

mine is on charge now...be shooting with it later...

LOVE the red colour. I asked if I could get red..little mic is cool too...

the geezer has a RED ONE!

quite a small looking appendage in those hands

[squig]

This camera sounds cool.

Question... does it have the capability to shoot pretty girls?

only the black one

[hunter richards]

Peter- The live feed only happens when you have the LCD on, if the EVF is on it wont work- and as soon as you hit record the life feed stops.

[RaviSun3D]

Kholi, I'm using Nero to play the files back; you can tell it to display additional data such as bitrate and frame rate. On the 0040.mts file, it drops as low as 6 megabits in places.
Try using KM Player... (http://cdn.pandora.tv/KMP/Download/beta/The_KMPlayer_1434.exe)

This may not play the video Perfectly but will show you all the essential video info.

Hope it will help you....

General :
Complete name : 00024.MTS
Format : BDAV
Format/Info : BluRay Video
File size : 18.1 MiB
Duration : 9s 974ms
Overall bit rate : 15.2 Mbps
Maximum Overall bit rate : 18.0 Mbps

Video :
Format : AVC
Format/Info : Advanced Video Codec
Format profile : High@L4.0
Format settings, CABAC : No
Format settings, ReFrames : 2 frames
Width : 1920 pixels
Height : 1080 pixels
Display aspect ratio : 16/9
Frame rate : 29.970 fps
Standard : NTSC
Colorimetry : 4:2:0
Scan type : Interlaced
Scan order : Top Field First

Audio :
Format : AC-3
Format/Info : Audio Coding 3
Duration : 9s 974ms
Bit rate mode : Constant
Bit rate : 192 Kbps
Channel(s) : 2 channels
Channel positions : L R
Sampling rate : 48.0 KHz

[squig]

the D90 captures between 7-25Mbps in motion so 9Mbps doesn't sound strange for a far more efficient intraframe codec

[MatzeB]

have you seen that one?:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=56LvcSM-JHM
second half is night. Looks like the first 5d clips from Peking.
You can download a HDV (?) Version - if his server can handle it.

[Ian-T]

This was posted in another thread. Also, it's not HDV.

[Car3o]

I'm just a tiny bit upset you cant use an external monitor for directing.

[Finster]

Regarding Philip Bloom's red GH-1 on page 24 of this thread ...

Does it come with a microphone, or is that something you have to order separately?

I was going to order the Zoom H4n, but maybe I should wait until Kholi, Hunter, and Philip report back on sound quality???

Then again, all my mics are XLR.

[Car3o]

Order a Zoom H4n and use the line out and feed it into the camera.

[Kholi]

I'm getting a Zoom H4N as well

[Ian-T]

So just to be clear...there is only composite out and not component? Kholi did you get to try the test Hunter suggested with HDMI?

[Finster]

Order a Zoom H4n and use the line out and feed it into the camera.

Good thinking! You are a smart man.

[squig]

have you seen that one?:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=56LvcSM-JHM
second half is night. Looks like the first 5d clips from Peking.
You can download a HDV (?) Version - if his server can handle it.

reminds me of the noodle bar in bladerunner.....very cool, can't wait to shoot a film with this thing

[squig]

I'm getting a Zoom H4N as well

me 3 sold my H4

[upshot]

On the microphone subject... You all might want to be aware that panasonic uses a 4-pole 2.5mm plug for the shutter/mic input...
http://pinouts.ru/connectors/minijack4pin.gif
I'm going to guess that the 1 and 2 position are the audio channels since I've tested it for the external trigger and it uses the 3 and 4 pole for that... 4 is probably the ground.

[Peter J. DeCrescenzo]

I'm just a tiny bit upset you cant use an external monitor for directing.

I'm with you on that, but remember these 3 lucky fellows have only had their cams for a few hours. There's a remote possibility a yet unknown button press or menu item combination might yet yield live video even during recording. At least we can hope! :happy:

[Kholi]

Philip should be able to tell us once he fires his camera up. if he's willing to go that far into explaining menus and all that. If not, it's all good!

RIght now i'm trying to figure out this bitrate thing.

[squig]

At least you can view pre-record to set up a shot. Kholi how good is the viewfinder? Do you think a hoodloupe/eyepiece over the LCD would be a big improvement?

[MatzeB]

This was posted in another thread. Also, it's not HDV.
it's a 1440x1080 25mbit/s mpeg - isn't that HDV?

[LizaWitz]

QUOTE=Finster;1621896]
Does it come with a microphone, or is that something you have to order separately?
[/QUOTE]

The mic in that picture is an accessory that Panasonic is introducing with this camera, that you buy separately. The look of the mic on the flash shoe is growing on me a little.


On the microphone subject... You all might want to be aware that panasonic uses a 4-pole 2.5mm plug for the shutter/mic input...
http://pinouts.ru/connectors/minijack4pin.gif
I'm going to guess that the 1 and 2 position are the audio channels since I've tested it for the external trigger and it uses the 3 and 4 pole for that... 4 is probably the ground.

If one were to hack an external trigger together, what is the signalling? as I understand it on the G1 there's both a "partial button press" and "full button press" so that you can cause it to focus and then take a picture. How are these two states communicated over the third pole, if the fourth is ground? Do you know?

[squig]

I was just looking at the flower/forest footage and there's no jello with the leica lens. Lots of operator induced camera shake but the tree trunks are rock solid.

D90 for sale

[TrueIndigo]

This is getting addictive, just like the D90 days all over again. Recently I've been ignoring the rest of the site in favour of the new GH1 section, and now I'm ignoring the section in favour of this particular thread, refreshing the page to see the very next comment! God, I must get a life, but what would I do with that life if I wasn't reading this stuff...!

[upshot]

If one were to hack an external trigger together, what is the signalling? as I understand it on the G1 there's both a "partial button press" and "full button press" so that you can cause it to focus and then take a picture. How are these two states communicated over the third pole, if the fourth is ground? Do you know?


It looks for different resistance through the same circuit (poles 3/4):
--2k ohm is trigger (or "full button press")
--5k ohm is focus (or "partial button press")

Again I'm guessing this is why panasonic used the 4 pole... reserving the 1 and 2 pole for the microphone

This is different than most trigger releases that use three poles and completely close the circuit (no resistance) on each pole to trigger 'half' and 'full'.

[RaviSun3D]

This is getting addictive, just like the D90 days all over again. Recently I've been ignoring the rest of the site in favour of the new GH1 section, and now I'm ignoring the section in favour of this particular thread, refreshing the page to see the very next comment! God, I must get a life, but what would I do with that life if I wasn't reading this stuff...!

Well, we are now discussing this at the speed of chating... :furious3:
I haven't seen any such speedy forum before.

[Finster]

Somewhere in this thread someone asked about time-lapse on the GH1. I believe the answer was that you needed a timer remote controller, or something like that?

I was looking at the G1 accessories on B&H. I don't see a timer controller.

Anyone know where I can find one for the GH1?

[LizaWitz]

It looks for different resistance through the same circuit (poles 3/4):
--2k ohm is trigger (or "full button press")
--5k ohm is focus (or "partial button press")

Brilliant! That's a really useful piece of information. Since this is the same remote that the G1 uses (well, the model number on the GH1 accessories page is the same as the model on the G1 accessories page), it looks like you can't trigger video recording with the remote. Though its possible that the GH1 looks at other resistance values and 7k or 10k ohms might be equivalent to the video button being pressed -- if they intend to release an updated remote at some point.

[upshot]

Somewhere in this thread someone asked about time-lapse on the GH1. I believe the answer was that you needed a timer remote controller, or something like that?

I was looking at the G1 accessories on B&H. I don't see a timer controller.

Anyone know where I can find one for the GH1?

ebay. search: "g1 timer"

I've been shooting timelapse with the G1 (http://vimeo.com/3678755) since January :happy:

The news that it will shoot 1080p till the card is full is like music to my ears!! Great for short term and the trigger works for long term.

[Lee Wilson]

Oh god ! It's one of those 'big threads' - I want in !!!

Got my beer.

[LizaWitz]

I was looking at the G1 accessories on B&H. I don't see a timer controller. Anyone know where I can find one for the GH1?

I'm ruminating on a project idea that involves time laps and my plan is to create a computer controlled intervalometer using the remote shutter info that upshot just gave. I need variable timing for my project, so something off the shelf likely won't work.

The camera supports a timer but its not clear yet whether this will allow it to take a constant series of shots-- every 2 seconds or 10 seconds or not. Looking at the specs it implies that it will only take three shots max on the timer.

Quite possibly the 2k resistance value it looks for is actually ("anything less than 2k") and thus an off the shelf intervalometer that closes a circuit at a given rate can be made to work... or if not, just put a 2k resistor in line with the intervalometer.

[Car3o]

Oh god ! It's one of those 'big threads' - I want in !!!

Got my beer.

I was beginning to wonder when you were going to show up....

[upshot]

Quite possibly the 2k resistance value it looks for is actually ("anything less than 2k") and thus an off the shelf intervalometer that closes a circuit at a given rate can be made to work...

No this is not true. It's looking for the 2k signal. I tried to use an 'off the shelf' timer and simply connect the correct poles and it didn't work. I had to put a resistor inline. It was easy enough after a trip to 'da shack' and some soldering.

It's definitely a cheaper route though if you already have a tc-80 clone with a 3 pole 2.5mm... female 3-pole 2.5mm + 2k resistor + male 4-pole = done for under $10

[squig]

This is getting addictive, just like the D90 days all over again. Recently I've been ignoring the rest of the site in favour of the new GH1 section, and now I'm ignoring the section in favour of this particular thread, refreshing the page to see the very next comment! God, I must get a life, but what would I do with that life if I wasn't reading this stuff...!

scanning ebay for lenses

[Peter J. DeCrescenzo]

I'm off to meet Hunter to start playing with, er, I mean testing his GH1. Not sure how far we'll get today, but here goes ...

- Peter
www.peterdv.com (http://www.peterdv.com)

[Finster]

ebay. search: "g1 timer"

I've been shooting timelapse with the G1 (http://vimeo.com/3678755) since January :happy:

The news that it will shoot 1080p till the card is full is like music to my ears!! Great for short term and the trigger works for long term.

Loved the timelapse video! VERY NICE!!!

Thanks for the ebay tip.

[Ian-T]

it's a 1440x1080 25mbit/s mpeg - isn't that HDV?No this is AVCHD 17 Mbps @ 24p (in a 60i wrapper) 1080 and then some.

[ChipG]

ebay. search: "g1 timer"

I've been shooting timelapse with the G1 (http://vimeo.com/3678755) since January :happy:

The news that it will shoot 1080p till the card is full is like music to my ears!! Great for short term and the trigger works for long term.

Noticed your BVI video, I'll be doing the same after hurricane season. I'm go to PM you if thats alright. Nice time lapse BTW.

[Nighthawk]

A big thanks to Kholi on all this. I'm sitting here in a pool of my own saliva wondering why we have no FIRM North American release date yet.
Like every camera there's going to be some negatives but the '+'s seem to be keeping the '-'s high in the air on this see-saw. I planned to shoot an hour long thingy in June but now I just want to shoot yesterday. Hurry!

Did I miss anything on the availability to have a live feed out to a monitor?

[DanDOF]

ebay. search: "g1 timer"

I've been shooting timelapse with the G1 (http://vimeo.com/3678755) since January :happy:

The news that it will shoot 1080p till the card is full is like music to my ears!! Great for short term and the trigger works for long term.

Regarding the lens you used: the Schneider Cinegon 10mm/F1.8

Did you get a lot of vignetting on the G1, for example did you have to crop each still image in that time lapse?

Its not an expensive lens for wide and bright.

[Kholi]

Negatives are gonna show up in the Bitrate. I found it breaking up in high motion when I mounted it to the sunroof, but for moderate motion it's pretty good!

Also, no monitoring when recording aside from the LCD and Viewfinder.

But look, it's a step in the right direction. Some of this stuff sounds like firmware tweaks to me.

[androoow]

dvx user needs a GH1 chatroom thingymajig :D

[Car3o]

I mean, it's not THAT big of a deal that I cant use an external monitor. I'm not necessarily using it for framing/focusing, but I'd rather look at a large enough screen when viewing a scene instead of the lcd on a camera. Ah well. Maybe I'll use one to playback scenes so no money is wasted.

[squig]

I read somewhere that the only noticeable difference between 17Mbps and 24Mbps AVCHD was with fast motion

24Mbps petition!

[Nighthawk]

Kholi, when you have a sec, how bad was it on the car? I have a lot of car mount shots scheduled.

[puredrifting]

No VFRs with this camera, right?

Dan

[DavidNJ]

I read somewhere that the only noticeable difference between 17Mbps and 24Mbps AVCHD was with fast motion

24Mbps petition!


The SDHC cards allow 45-50Mb/s...a much better number. Canon does that on the SX1 ($600) and 5DM2.

[LizaWitz]

Did you get a lot of vignetting on the G1, for example did you have to crop each still image in that time lapse?


Looks like the answer is yes:
http://forum.getdpi.com/forum/showthread.php?p=84846

[Christopher Barry]

No external monitor will be a problem for some jib/crane use.

[Kholi]

Telephoto End + OIS, the codec broke pretty easily to me. But I suspect wide might be better purely because the perceived speed of detail going by is much less slower.

I'll find out shortly here when I walk back outside.

Jello on a Car -- Very acceptable. If you get really bad jutters you CAN see the jello, but it's definitely nowhere near as bad as the D90 or MKii.

By Jutters I mean: I stopped the car and while it was idling you can see the shutter a'rollin'. But when the vehicle moves it's smooth.

[LizaWitz]

The SDHC cards allow 45-50Mb/s...a much better number. Canon does that on the SX1 ($600) and 5DM2.

Panasonic lives in this fantasy land where you take the card out of the GH1 and pop it into your Viera TV and watch your footage in AVCHD glory. Im in the choir for using MP4 files and whatever bitrate the user wishes to use, but I don't think they can hear us singing!

Update:
Well, hmm, it seems that their TVs don't have SDHC slots so I am not sure why they went with AVCHD.

[Kholi]

No VFRs with this camera, right?

Dan

1080/24, 720/60, 720/30

AVCHD

No actual in camera VFR

[TheRealMe]

No external monitor will be a problem for some jib/crane use.


That also means no Steadicam reference monitor... But you could get away with a Merlin since the camera is so light.

[codeloss]

Post the car footage, Kholi!
You're teasing us too much. You need to give us a little something something.

[Kholi]

I ordered a Hague Mini Stabilizer. Mattias brought it to light in the D90 forum. It's pretty incredible and right up the GH-1's alley.

With that and the articulating LCD at least framing will be good. Still learning this auto focus thing.

[squig]

No external monitor will be a problem for some jib/crane use.

that's where the AF kit lens will come in handy, if you don't mind f/4

[dougspice]

That lack of external monitoring (assuming there's no undiscovered fix for it) is a huge reason why this camera doesn't kill 35mm adapters. Unfortunate.

Still, can't wait to see some of the outstanding footage that's probably about to start cropping up.

[Kholi]

Post the car footage, Kholi!
You're teasing us too much. You need to give us a little something something.

I want to post something but I'm refraining from doing so because it's not ready just yet.

Hunter and Philip have cameras, they can do the posting first. I'm in no rush to show-off anything that isn't worth looking at. I define that as an actual production.

Also, I don't feel like battling anyone on detail nitpicking. I dunno the camera in and out and I have no patience for that.

I'll wait, but I'm happy to answer questions right now.

[MatzeB]

No this is AVCHD 17 Mbps @ 24p (in a 60i wrapper) 1080 and then some.
that's what the camera records. The clip is re-encoded to HDV.Odd i know,
but better as youtube.

[Slice]

Kholi, I really want to know more about the audio jack. Is it usable? Can you post a sound test from an external mic?

[dougspice]

that's where the AF kit lens will come in handy, if you don't mind f/4

How does the lens help with jib shots?

[Kholi]

Kholi, I really want to know more about the audio jack. Is it usable? Can you post a sound test from an external mic?

I actually have no internal mics to test with it. Well let me take that back, I do but I don't have that jack converted.

Philip Bloom has the actual Panasonic Mic, though. I suspect he'll be the one to ask about the audio.

[Boz]

Does anyone think there's a chance Panny will tweak the firmware to optimize AVCHD or any other features before US release? I'm slightly disappointed that we have to deal with 60i wrapper in 1080P mode, and no 24fps @ 720P... minor quibbles really.

[Kholi]

How does the lens help with jib shots?

Auto Focus. It also has facial recognition that works pretty well and the AF is extremely quick.

[TrueIndigo]

squig: "scanning ebay for lenses" -- yeah, I just bought a manual 16mm Sigma prime (though not on ebay). Got to go to bed now, goodnight folks...looking forward to reading a thousand new posts tommorow!

[squig]

I want to post something but I'm refraining from doing so because it's not ready just yet.

Hunter and Philip have cameras, they can do the posting first. I'm in no rush to show-off anything that isn't worth looking at. I define that as an actual production.

Also, I don't feel like battling anyone on detail nitpicking. I dunno the camera in and out and I have no patience for that.

I'll wait, but I'm happy to answer questions right now.

#@*&!

you don't have to reshoot the godfather!

[squig]

How does the lens help with jib shots?

it has the AF tracking feature

[Car3o]

Does anyone think there's a chance Panny will tweak the firmware to optimize AVCHD or any other features before US release? I'm slightly disappointed that we have to deal with 60i wrapper in 1080P mode, and no 24fps @ 720P... minor quibbles really.

Don't quote me, but the HVX does the same thing I heard.

[Slice]

Is auto focus good enough for event work?

[Barry_Green]

Does anyone think there's a chance Panny will tweak the firmware to optimize AVCHD or any other features before US release? I'm slightly disappointed that we have to deal with 60i wrapper in 1080P mode, and no 24fps @ 720P... minor quibbles really.
I lobbied the Panasonic factory guys at NAB to release a version of the GH1 to the broadcast division. That would open up PH mode (720/24p, 1080/24pN, and 24mbps recording). They're listening, but I don't know whether they'll do it.

[Kholi]

I lobbied the Panasonic factory guys at NAB to release a version of the GH1 to the broadcast division. That would open up PH mode (720/24p, 1080/24pN, and 24mbps recording). They're listening, but I don't know whether they'll do it.


Where's Isaac Brody at? ISAAC!? What did I tell you man?

Just scratching the surface. With people like Barry stepping in man. WHOO

[Boz]

Thanks Barry. It's good to know they listen...

One more question to the general community here. If one doesn't have old Canon FD lenses or Nikkor lenses... is there a better way to go on that? More lenses available on one side or the other? Better prices? Advice would be appreciated.

[Kholi]

Is auto focus good enough for event work?

With some practice and taming I definitely think so. You can use AF and MF in conjunction with each other as well, so you're not just stuck with Auto Focus at any time. At least with the kit lens.

[ArthurD]

#@*&!

you don't have to reshoot the godfather!

ahahah .... a new era .... "demo" stars

[squig]

I lobbied the Panasonic factory guys at NAB to release a version of the GH1 to the broadcast division. That would open up PH mode (720/24p, 1080/24pN, and 24mbps recording). They're listening, but I don't know whether they'll do it.

add to that something like the zuiko 14-35mm f/2 with OIS and AF video shooting and foegedaboudit!

[squig]

Thanks Barry. It's good to know they listen...

One more question to the general community here. If one doesn't have old Canon FD lenses or Nikkor lenses... is there a better way to go on that? More lenses available on one side or the other? Better prices? Advice would be appreciated.

there are literally tonnes of lenses you can mount to this sucker with the right adapters. check the lens thread. Or google 4/3 adapters. I'm doing my head in trying to choose a 50mm

so I can sack my focus puller?

[Imaginate]

Kholi just wanted to say thanks for blogging this process out, its much appreciated from those of us who are planning shoots in June and beyond where this camera potentially could be used.

from the Matrix - 'I got to tell you, I'm fairly excited to see what you're capable of, if Morpheus is right and all... I'm not supposed to talk about this, but if you are... a very exciting time. We got a lot to do. We got to get to it....'

[ydgmdlu]

Kholi, forgive me for my ignorance, but can you tell use what the 2x crop of the GH1 does? What happens to the FOV or DOF when using Nikon lenses for example?
The crop factor simply crops the image, so you can easily do a test yourself to simulate the effect. If you have a Nikon APS-C DSLR, the crop factor is 1.5x, which is not too different from MFT's 2.0x. Canon's APS-C DSLRs have a crop factor of 1.6x. Take a picture, then crop it slightly on all sides. The crop factor really only affects the perspective; the change in FOV and DOF are merely side effects.

[Zak Forsman]

KHOLI!!!!!!1111111ONEONEONE

i'm playing catch-up, reading your posts. sounds very promising.

if you want to do some night-time tests under the blue light where I shot "Model/Photographer", let me know.... it's the rooftop patio of my office. I can try to get an actor or two to drop by to be on camera as well. let me know.

[Kholi]

KHOLI!!!!!!1111111ONEONEONE

i'm playing catch-up, reading your posts. sounds very promising.

if you want to do some night-time tests under the blue light where I shot "Model/Photographer", let me know.... it's the rooftop patio of my office. I can try to get an actor or two to drop by to be on camera as well. let me know.

Bet on it. Let me get my Contax Adapter in (supposed to be this week) so we can compare the kit lens versus a 1.4 etc out there. But you're DEFINITELY on.

[Kholi]

Kholi just wanted to say thanks for blogging this process out, its much appreciated from those of us who are planning shoots in June and beyond where this camera potentially could be used.

from the Matrix - 'I got to tell you, I'm fairly excited to see what you're capable of, if Morpheus is right and all... I'm not supposed to talk about this, but if you are... a very exciting time. We got a lot to do. We got to get to it....'

No problem, it's fun! And about to get much more so. Meeting with the Stunt Coordinator tomorrow. >=D


--------------

Can someone help me out with Cinema Tools? I can't get this damned thing to pull down properly! Still interlaced!

[holyzoo]

Can someone help me out with Cinema Tools? I can't get this damned thing to pull down properly! Still interlaced!

Have you tried using JES deinterlacer?

http://www.apple.com/downloads/macosx/video/jesdeinterlacer.html

http://www.holyzoo.com/content/dslr/JES-1.jpg

[squig]

from hunter-

24p FCP workflow:

1. In FCP, Log and Transfer
(AVCHD-> ProRes 422)

2. In the Clip window in FCP:
Highlight all clips and go to Export-> Using Compressor

3. In Compressor:

Pick Format as Prores 422 HQ

Go to Video-> Frame rate-> Custom, Enter 23.976

Turn on frame controls-> Deinterlace settings-> Reverse Telecine

Set your output folder and click submit (this renders pretty fast and Compressor automatically finds the pulldown cadence and removes it)

4.Now import the new folder with new clips into FCP and you have 1080/24p

Thats the best I can think of for now anyways!

is there another way?

[Kholi]

Hunter's solution works perfectly.

[henrooo]

Why not just import it into imovie? works no problem. then you cn move it to fcp

[squig]

Why not just import it into imovie? works no problem. then you cn move it to fcp

I couldn't get it to open in imovie 8

[puredrifting]

I don't know Kholi. Your comments about the codec being fairly easy to break is flashing me back to my first experience with HDV and the Z1. I wonder if the G1HD/GH1 (which is it?) ends up taking it's place next to the 5D MKII as a cool toy that is useful in a few situations but that's about it?

No external monitoring during shooting means not really useful on jib or dolly. Easily breakable 17MBps AVCHD codec isn't really exciting. Slow lenses available now with a 2x crop with Nikon or other 35mm lenses are great for telephoto shots but for wide angle with a large aperture, doesn't sound like a lot of affordable glass is available. Audio at this point is an unknown but I don't think it will be very impressive.

Seems like a cool toy that some will used by broke filmmakers because they cannot afford RED/EX1/HPX type cameras with an adapter. I am sure that there will be some impressive stuff shot with it but operationally, it sounds like nothing more than a step in the right direction, just like the 5D MKII was. But it doesn't sound so far as if either are a complete tool.

Dan

[StMad]

Re jib work - AF might help keep your subject in focus but framing will be impractical from that little screen (esp for pro work). This cam seems to be a must have anyway, but it'll be interesting to see if an "unlocked" version follows. But that'd have to kill their video cam sales.

[philip bloom]

no idea how codec is going to stand up but just shot my first footage and it's a lovely camera to use and from the stuff that is coming in it is looking very nice indeed.

[Car3o]

You can still use the an external monitor for framing and focusing but from the sound of things it's not longer useful once you hit record....that's not incredibly harsh, just disappointing.

[LizaWitz]

I couldn't get it to open in imovie 8

With SDHC card mounted on your desktop (out of the camera) open iMovie and choose the camera import button. For me, with the card copy posted the other day, it brought up the import window automatically. It will want to turn it into half resolution ProRes, though.

[henrooo]

I couldn't get it to open in imovie 8


In imovie '09 there is native support

I simple placed Barry's sample footage onto an SD card and connected it to my mac, imovie gave the option to import the footage @1080 or 960(something like that).

I'm not sure how if its that same in imovie '08 though.

[henrooo]

no idea how codec is going to stand up but just shot my first footage and it's a lovely camera to use and from the stuff that is coming in it is looking very nice indeed.


So when are we going to see your footage Phil?

[LizaWitz]

Also, if anyone has Roxio Toast already, as I understand it (eg: someone on a forum said this once) you can use it to seperate out MPEG4 video from and AVCHD file without re-encoding. It will re-encode the audio to AAC, but just pull the H.264 out as is. Theoreticlaly the resulting MP4 file should be easily editable by FCP or iMoive. I don't have toast or an AVCHD camera so I haven't tried this for sure.

I found a video on youtube of someone who seems to say you can do this (Though he's doing a conversion in the example.)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G-dYpe35r24

And from their site, is a tutorial that confirms at least some support for AVCHD (though doesn't confirm the conversion-without-re-encoding feature)
http://img.roxio.com/enu/flash/toast10/toast10-convert.html

[squig]

ahh k thx. I was trying to open a file from my HD

[squig]

kholi have a close look at the source clip in fcp and compare it to the 24p/reverse telecine file and see if there is any new artifacts in the dark area's

[Rakesh Jacob]

PEOPLE PEOPLE PEOPLE!!!!
How easily you twist in the wind....
"this camera is awesome..."
"OMG look what it can do..."
"car mount and such...."
"what? footage? clips?"
"um... nah, can't do that"

This guy doesn't have a GH1, as a matter of fact this isn't even Kholi!
I've done a bit of investigating: Kholi was last spotted in New Zealand working on the Legend of Zelda "fake" trailer. ONLY!!! It was the "REAL" thing! Kholi has been in New Zealand for the past 12 months working with Peter Jackson and Ridley Scott (yes THAT PETER JACKSON, but oddly enough, NOT that Ridley Scott)
So who is this conniving coercive contravening counterfeit cinematographer?
None other than Richard Longwood, the infamous social networking terrorist hacker! After being banned from Myspace and Facebook, Mr. Longwood created an account on Twitter and hacked blogs, news websites and web portals to plant fake stories of how great Twitter was, how life changing and immensely popular it was with the famous, the beautiful and the rich. When Twitter actually became popular despite its clear uberlamenificence (that's what the cool kids say, Google it) an internal company review revealed the scam and Mr. Longwood's ISP was written on a secret post-it note. This post-it note sits in the CTO's office at Twitter where a special task force sits and vigilantly denies accounts being set up by Mr. Longwood. Apparently Mr. Longwood knows how to hack into DVXUser databases but isn't quite sure how to mask his ISP address, weird I know. Also Twitter is really lame and I can totally see how they wouldn't understand about auto rejecting ISPs.
Moral:
DVXUser + a Japanese GH1 = the new Twitter

[LizaWitz]

you had me at uberlamenificence

[philip bloom]

NEWSFLASH!!!

My footage is coming in as 25p...Must be different for UK market...

[squig]

you had me at uberlamenificence

I'm gonna have to google it

[squig]

NEWSFLASH!!!

My footage is coming in as 25p...Must be different for UK market...

my understanding is it's switchable 24p and 25p for all territories?

[Car3o]

i think he means no pulldown for 25p

[squig]

panasonic UK website specs have NTSC and PAL listed http://www.panasonic.co.uk:80/html/en_GB/Products/LUMIX+Digital+Cameras/G+Micro+System/DMC-GH1/Specification/2146697/index.html?trackInfo=true

[squig]

shoot at 50i and you get 25p

[philip bloom]

manual says it is 17mbps 60i (sensor output is 24p). Weird. FCP is saying it's 25p

[Rakesh Jacob]

you had me at uberlamenificence


You hade me at "17Mbps is 2.125 MBps" :love4:

Gotta love a girl who can divide by 8!

[henrooo]

manual says it is 17mbps 60i (sensor output is 24p). Weird. FCP is saying it's 25p


"AVCHA PAL [Full HD] 1920 x 1080, 50i (sensor output is 25fps)(FHD: 17Mbps)"

...from Panasonic.

[DavidNJ]

manual says it is 17mbps 60i (sensor output is 24p). Weird. FCP is saying it's 25p


The spec says 25p over 50i in PAL or 24p over 60i in NTSC. Does your camera have both? The 25p should have 25% less compression (2:2 pulldown instead of 2:3) resulting in a slightly better image.

[Peter J. DeCrescenzo]

In imovie '09 there is native support

I simple placed Barry's sample footage onto an SD card and connected it to my mac, imovie gave the option to import the footage @1080 or 960(something like that).

I'm not sure how if its that same in imovie '08 though.

iMovie & Final Cut Express transcode AVCHD to the Apple Intermediate Codec on ingest.

Final Cut Pro 6 (FC Studio 2) can transcode AVCHD into ProRes or ProRes HQ (or the AI codec). ProRes & ProRes HQ are more capable codecs compared to the AI codec.

I'm not certain, but I suspect that ingesting AVCHD first into iMovie or FCE, and then importing these files into FCP results in a FCP movie using the AI codec. I'll defer to experienced editors on this latter detail.

- Peter
www.peterdv.com

[philip bloom]

how do we feel about importing via imovie using apple intermediate codec versus prores. FCP log and transfer keeps failing to bring in some clips....

[philip bloom]

my manual says 60i but camera is def recording 50i...cant find an obvious way of changing it in menus...

[dougspice]

squig, kholi, the question I was asking about the lens on a jib isn't answered by autofocus. Do I care if it's in focus if it's not framed right?

Likewise, if you're the sort of director I am that doesn't like to shoot my own stuff, this output issue becomes pretty major. It might be useful as a B or C camera, but I do like to see what is being shot.

I'm inclined to agree with Dan here: this camera will be terrific in certain applications, but not all that many. But then again I never really expected it to be the second coming. Should be cool to play with for experiments, small shoots, maybe documentary stuff.

[squig]

The spec says 25p over 50i in PAL or 24p over 60i in NTSC. Does your camera have both? The 25p should have 25% less compression (2:2 pulldown instead of 2:3) resulting in a slightly better image.

I'm confused, didn't liza say something to the contrary?

[squig]

how do we feel about importing via imovie using apple intermediate codec versus prores. FCP log and transfer keeps failing to bring in some clips....

I'd stick with proresHQ. you wanna squeeze as much out of those 17Mbps as possible

[squig]

my manual says 60i but camera is def recording 50i...cant find an obvious way of changing it in menus...

and it's in bloody english!

[Kholi]

Don't shoot car material. The avchd really falls apart in this scenario. At least wide footage, left to right. I'm gonna try it with the tokina 11 on the 11 end to see how it fairs.

The compression doesn't actually break too much easier though. It takes something high motion to crack it. Like Anders Ex1 and leaves test.

I still can't figure out this aliasom thing by it pops up at the weirdest times.

[squig]

squig, kholi, the question I was asking about the lens on a jib isn't answered by autofocus. Do I care if it's in focus if it's not framed right?

Likewise, if you're the sort of director I am that doesn't like to shoot my own stuff, this output issue becomes pretty major. It might be useful as a B or C camera, but I do like to see what is being shot.

I'm inclined to agree with Dan here: this camera will be terrific in certain applications, but not all that many. But then again I never really expected it to be the second coming. Should be cool to play with for experiments, small shoots, maybe documentary stuff.

for the money you save on a red one you could hire a cherry picker.

but seriously you can rehearse your shot before you record through the composite out

[Peter J. DeCrescenzo]

I don't know Kholi. Your comments about the codec being fairly easy to break is flashing me back to my first experience with HDV and the Z1. I wonder if the G1HD/GH1 (which is it?) ends up taking it's place next to the 5D MKII as a cool toy that is useful in a few situations but that's about it?

No external monitoring during shooting means not really useful on jib or dolly. Easily breakable 17MBps AVCHD codec isn't really exciting. Slow lenses available now with a 2x crop with Nikon or other 35mm lenses are great for telephoto shots but for wide angle with a large aperture, doesn't sound like a lot of affordable glass is available. Audio at this point is an unknown but I don't think it will be very impressive.

Seems like a cool toy that some will use because they cannot afford RED/EX1/HPX type cameras with an adapter. I am sure that there will be some impressive stuff shot with it but operationally, it sounds like nothing more than a step in the right direction, just like the 5D MKII was. But it doesn't sound so far as if either are a complete tool.

Dan

Well, I'm back from an all-too-brief visit to the mountaintop, and as usual Dan has pretty much divined the tea leaves from afar. :happy:

By that I mean he's possibly "got it" just about right.

Unfortunately, I only got to stand in the same room (in fact a very nice small studio in SW Portland) with Hunter's shiny new GH1 for about an hour.

There I witnessed Hunter and his colleagues perform stringent scientific tests upon the GH1. Tests which were so gory I will only describe them here in the most general, fleeting terms.

In fact I won't describe the result of the primary scientific test at all; rather I'll leave that to Hunter. After all, it's his camera. :laugh:

Myself I'd need (and very much would like) _much_ more time with the cam so I could shoot some scenario tests with "actors", tripod, lights, mics, etc. There wasn't time for that today. So sad.

However, what little (very little) I got to see was encouraging, but not conclusive.

My current feeling at the moment is that the GH1 is maybe 90%-95% of the way "there" where I want an under-$2K HD camcorder to be. _So_ close, but maybe not close enough for me. I need to think about it a bit more, and see more footage, data, tests.

- Peter
www.peterdv.com

[squig]

Don't shoot car material. The avchd really falls apart in this scenario. At least wide footage, left to right. I'm gonna try it with the tokina 11 on the 11 end to see how it fairs.

The compression doesn't actually break too much easier though. It takes something high motion to crack it. Like Anders Ex1 and leaves test.

I still can't figure out this aliasom thing by it pops up at the weirdest times.

can always hire a hmc/hvx for car shots. the hague should help though. 24Mbps petition!

[Car3o]

blocking a scene still requires a monitor in most cases. i'd much rather be able to monitor everything on something larger than 3.5inches. i want to sit down, analyze and look at my scene rather than hunching over to look at the lcd attached to the camera. that's just preference. if the trade off is a bad ass camera for under $1500.00, well yeah, I'd gladly make the trade. just prefer it. also, another issue I had with the d90, hoping the gh1 will succeed, is the noise you couldn't see on the camera's lcd but rather you could later in post...bugged me.

[Car3o]

Don't shoot car material. The avchd really falls apart in this scenario. At least wide footage, left to right. I'm gonna try it with the tokina 11 on the 11 end to see how it fairs.

what do you mean "falls apart"?

[Car3o]

My current feeling at the moment is that the GH1 is maybe 90%-95% of the way "there" where I want an under-$2K HD camcorder to be. _So_ close, but maybe not close enough for me. I need to think about it a bit more, and see more footage, data, tests.

man, i had no idea there were so many HD cams under 2k that have interchangeable lens, almost academy size sensor, manaul control...psht, i'm living in the stone age.

[squig]

man, i had no idea there were so many HD cams under 2k that have interchangeable lens, almost academy size sensor, manaul control...psht, i'm living in the stone age.

I'm an impoverished perfectionist so 95% is gonna have to do....beats 66.6% from the D90

[Kholi]

Well, I'm back from an all-too-brief visit to the mountaintop, and as usual Dan has pretty much divined the tea leaves from afar. :happy:

By that I mean he's possibly "got it" just about right.

Unfortunately, I only got to stand in the same room (in fact a very nice small studio in SW Portland) with Hunter's shiny new GH1 for about an hour.

There I witnessed Hunter and his colleagues perform stringent scientific tests upon the GH1. Tests which were so gory I will only describe them here in the most general, fleeting terms.

In fact I won't describe the result of the primary scientific test at all; rather I'll leave that to Hunter. After all, it's his camera. :laugh:

Myself I'd need (and very much would like) _much_ more time with the cam so I could shoot some scenario tests with "actors", tripod, lights, mics, etc. There wasn't time for that today. So sad.

However, what little (very little) I got to see was encouraging, but not conclusive.

My current feeling at the moment is that the GH1 is maybe 90%-95% of the way "there" where I want an under-$2K HD camcorder to be. _So_ close, but maybe not close enough for me. I need to think about it a bit more, and see more footage, data, tests.

- Peter
www.peterdv.com (http://www.peterdv.com)

Doug's, Dan's and Peter's summations are about right. The D90 and Mkii are like 65 percent, the GH-1 is like 90 to 95.

For small work, music videos, shorts, and even people doing run n'gun features (Zak Forsman) this'll do just fine.

If you're not doing extraneous actions then it's beautiful. I'll continue to shoot and do what I planned to do this weekend, see what I get out of it when in an actual narrative environment.

But it's definitely worthy of the 1500 Price Tag and more.

[dougspice]

for the money you save on a red one you could hire a cherry picker.

but seriously you can rehearse your shot before you record through the composite out

Yeah, but since I'm working with people and not precision robots, that doesn't do much good for me on the actual takes, does it?

Anyway, there's plenty of cameras in between the GH1 and the RED One that can do these things. I'm certainly not upset about having more choices. It would probably be a bad thing, really, if this camera was "the one". I don't believe in such a thing.

[squig]

doug is the new john

[Peter J. DeCrescenzo]

I lobbied the Panasonic factory guys at NAB to release a version of the GH1 to the broadcast division. That would open up PH mode (720/24p, 1080/24pN, and 24mbps recording). They're listening, but I don't know whether they'll do it.

IMHO, Barry's post above is possibly the single most important post in this entire thread!

If Panasonic were to ...

- Up the AVCHD data rate to something around 25 megabits/sec; e.g.: noticably reduce motion-related compression artifacts;
- Enable full-time live video out. HDMI would be awesome, but I'd settle for composite video (if it's absolutely necessary to keep the cost down), but only if they also increase the AVCHD data rate, too;
- Allow audio auto-gain to be turned off. An external mixer can be used to set the levels;
- Allow 1080/24pN & 720/24p.

... then the GH1 ("GH2"?) would be 100% of what I want a $2K HD camera to be.

To me, the features above would be well worth paying an extra $500 over the GH1's ~$1,500 price, and possibly completely doable using the tech that's mostly already in a GH1.

Heck, if Panasonic could do the above within the next 6 months, I could do without adding 1080/24pN & 720/24p if that made a big difference as far as what is or isn't possible cost-wise.

YMMV.

- Peter
www.peterdv.com

[puredrifting]

Don't get me wrong, I may pick one up to play with and it is cool that things are getting better. This camera does get it almost over the goal line but read this board, we are a demanding bunch of picky SOBs ;-) We want it all and we want it for almost nothing.

I wonder if from a marketing perspective, it makes sense to give it all to us at this kind of price point? If they fixed and added everything here, I couldn't really see much reason to buy a 150 or possibly even a 170 or an EX1. I guess the question is, who will be ballsy enough to break that barrier and really change the paradigm? Don't know if Panasonic will, it seems as if it would be suicide for the lower end pro cameras they sell us. Logically, it should be Nikon or perhaps Canon with the rumored $8k upcoming video camera? It has to be cheap enough that the company sells hundreds of thousands of them but expensive enough so that when they kill off a large majority of their "traditional camera" sales, the profits from the new product make up for that.

Interesting times.

Dan

[Car3o]

IMHO, Barry's post above is possibly the single most important post in this entire thread!

If Panasonic were to ...

- Up the AVCHD data rate to something around 25 megabits/sec; e.g.: noticably reduce motion-related compression artifacts;
- Enable full-time live video out. HDMI would be awesome, but I'd settle for composite video (if it's absolutely necessary to keep the cost down), but only if they also increase the AVCHD data rate, too;
- Allow audio auto-gain to be turned off. An external mixer can be used to set the levels;
- Allow 1080/24pN & 720/24p.

... then the GH1 ("GH2"?) would be 100% of what I want a $2K HD camera to be.

To me, the features above would be well worth paying an extra $500 over the GH1's ~$1,500 price, and possibly completely doable using the tech that's mostly already in a GH1.

Heck, if Panasonic could do the above within the next 6 months, I could do without adding 1080/24pN & 720/24p if that made a big difference as far as what is or isn't possible cost-wise.

YMMV.

- Peter
www.peterdv.com


sure man you can probably pick one of those up on aisle "not gonna happen" located at your local Narnia. i still don't know why this supposed "niche" of indie filmmakers want something for nothing. the demand for these types of cameras already exist, you just need to save the money or get a loan to buy them.

[squig]

I'm sure it could do a lot more than 24Mbps but they might want to save that for a DVX form factor camera with 50-100Mbps which would be a shame because this form factor is ideal.

Doug I have a solution for you, hire a red one for your jib shots. the footage should integrate well with the GH1.

[Car3o]

This camera does get it almost over the goal line but read this board, we are a demanding bunch of picky SOBs ;-) We want it all and we want it for almost nothing.

ding, ding, ding, ding, ding!

[dougspice]

doug is the new john

kennedy? mayer? I've heard that before.

[squig]

aside from the bit-rate so far I'm pretty satisfied. I think any filmmaker who knows their shit should be able to shoot something amazing provided the codec holds up in post.

[SonicStates]

Does anyone want to speculate on what a firmware update might be able to "open up" on this camera if Panasonic were inclined? As opposed to a hardware update.

[Finster]

Don't shoot car material. The avchd really falls apart in this scenario. At least wide footage, left to right.

Duuuuude - show us! Give us the good, the bad and the ugly. We can handle it.

Seriously - I really want to see where it "falls apart." No more footage of pretty flowers!

[Peter J. DeCrescenzo]

sure man you can probably pick one of those up on aisle "not gonna happen" located at your local Narnia. i still don't know why this supposed "niche" of indie filmmakers want something for nothing. the demand for these types of cameras already exist, you just need to save the money or get a loan to buy them.

I hear you, but my point is that the GH1 is _so_ close to busting open a new market.

There's very little Panasonic would need to change to make the GH1 _perfect_ for many, many shooters. Not all shooters or even most shooters, but a whole mess of shooters at least some of the time.

Importantly, making these few changes might not actually obsolete Panasonic's other cams. The GH1 is a completely different "kind" of camera compared to a "traditional" prosumer camcorder.

Panasonic doesn't need to change the GH1's physical form factor or change a single plug, jack, connector, display, or button to add the features I've listed above. All the changes could be internal, possibly "only" involving how its chips are programmed. Maybe.

By not changing the GH1's external "it looks like a DSLR" appearance, that alone allows their marketing dept. to sell their "traditional" camcorders to whoever wants to buy them. Lots & lots of folks want "normal"-looking camcorders for all sorts of reason.

But some of us would very much like to own a cam very much like the GH1, especially if it were just a _little_ less limited.

Like Dan says above, don't get me wrong, I think the GH1 -- as it is -- is a very cool cam, and it begs for someone to yet demonstrate what it can really do.

But with a few "small" tweaks Panasonic could truly bust open up a whole new market _parallel_ (not redundant) to the rest of its product line, and without butting heads with its higher-priced competition.

- Peter
www.peterdv.com

[ryansheffer]

Kholi,

Did you ever try the live composite trick with an HDMI cable. I'm sure you confirmed it didn't work, I just never saw the post.

[Car3o]

If panasonic did adhere to all our demands it would take a huge chunk out of their prosumer lineup. just think, this camera alone is almost equivalent, key word almost, to their hpx/hvx series at a fraction of the cost. heck it 2.5x's less than the Letus Ultimate???? sure it may not look "pro" and would never garnish any interest from those types of shooters, but it's up to par with most of the big boy cam's out there. so yeah, you'd see a huge loss from the camera's that make them a lot of money.

[Car3o]

i'd also like to purchase the RED ONE for $25bux...think if we asked Jannard enough that he'd give in?

[John Caballero]

As long as the footage looks good and workable it is good enough. If some people found the D90 to look excellent, perish the thought, then anything should go. Only one or two pieces I have seen with the D90 looked good enough, including mattias piece. The output from the D90 is atrocious and the workarounds and footage repairing needed is horrendous. The GH1 is looking to beat it by a few miles. And thats a very positive sign.

[Steve Castle]

In regards to Panasonic cannibalizing their higher-end product sales...
What's perhaps impressive is that this isn't really a $1,500 camera. While there is no body-only price, its really a camera that is priced near the D90. The 14-140mm lens, which gives a 28-280mm equivalent is the main contributor to price. It's sold for around $800 separately, and is comparable to Nikon 18-200mmVR in terms of focal distance and price.

Thinking about it another way, a D90+18-200mmVR kit also costs ~$1,500. The G-1 body only is a tad over $500 in Japan, the GH-1 can be considered a mid-tier prosumer camera. In reality, this is camera that we will likely see being sold for $700~900 body-only down the road.

My point being, there is a LOT of room above this. Panasonic needs to put little effort in producing a higher-end u4/3rds camera that they can sell for ~$2k+ body-only that has everything. Moreover, Panasonic is a major supplier of to the Olympus system, supplying everything from sensors to DSP, we may see a "Pro" u4/3rds video system such as what Oly does with the "E-x" series.

We should view the GH-1 as a harbinger, a sign of things to come, a step to establish the u43rds system as a home for video. To convince us that the system and lenses are a good investment. Let's also not forget, that Panasonic has been selling the GH1 to vacationers and amateurs in their marketing campaign in Japan- not to professionals. Panasonic and the u43rds system are just getting started.

[squig]

bloody hell

we have to sit here for at least another month talking about this thing while the 3 stooges go out and shoot and post really nice looking stuff.

that sux arse.

[Peter J. DeCrescenzo]

If panasonic did adhere to all our demands it would take a huge chunk out of their prosumer lineup. just think, this camera alone is almost equivalent, key word almost, to their hpx/hvx series at a fraction of the cost. heck it 2.5x's less than the Letus Ultimate???? sure it may not look "pro" and would never garnish any interest from those types of shooters, but it's up to par with most of the big boy cam's out there. so yeah, you'd see a huge loss from the camera's that make them a lot of money.

The form factor of a GH1 is completely different from all existing (shipping) prosumer camcorders. That fact alone is huge.

Marketing departments _love_ products that look & feel different. It allows them to sell different things to different people for different reasons. Everyone benefits! :happy:

Sometimes you need a cam that has built-in XLR connectors. Sometimes you need a cam that has big built-in audio level knobs. Sometimes you need a cam that can sit on your shoulder. We can already buy (or rent) lots of those, and will continue to do so.

But sometimes you'd like a small cam that doesn't have those things, but instead looks and works kinda like a stealthy DSLR with interchangeable lenses, one that's about as good at shooting video as it is at shooting stills, and one which works sensibly with external audio & video gear.

The GH1 doesn't really seem to be able to shoot video as "competently" as it can shoot stills, and it doesn't interface with external audio & video gear in important ways. That's worse than unfortunate: I think it's a huge missed opportunity.

That being said, in the meantime I'm looking forward to discovering if, for example, the appropriate use of a very subtle lens diffusion filter on a GH1 can tame some of the compression artifacts I've seen so far. Likewise, better use of DOF to limit the amount of in-focus motion in a frame, or by using lighting control & so forth to reduce compression artifacts. That's the GH1 video I haven't seen yet. The best is yet to come.

- Peter
www.peterdv.com (http://www.peterd.com)

[RaviSun3D]

Hey Kholi,

Show us the Footage man. I have been waiting for such a long(3.5mins) period.

Now how much more do you expect me to wait...:angry: Hmmm?

I know you have shot many good things already.
Just put some on the web man.

And yes, shoot..:kali:...more....

[squig]

the japanese menu/girlfriend option is just too tempting provided she isn't into maracca's

[squig]

Kholi is out shooting the GH1 trilogy.....we won't be seeing anything from him for a while.
this is the most anticipated opening since lord of the rings

[squig]

just hope the swines don't get to him first on the treacherous journey to Mordor

[DavidNJ]

my manual says 60i but camera is def recording 50i...cant find an obvious way of changing it in menus...


"File size(Pixels)Motion ImageMotion Jpeg [4:3] QVGA : 320 x 240, 30fps / VGA : 640 x 480, 30fps / Motion Jpeg [16:9] WVGA : 848 x 480, 30fps / Motion Jpeg [HD] 1280 x 720, 30fps / AVCHD NTSC [Full HD] 1920 x 1080, 60i (sensor output is 24fps)(FHD: 17Mbps) / AVCHD NTSC [HD] 1280 x 720, 60p (SH: 17Mbps, H: 13Mbps, L: 9Mbps) / AVCHD PAL [Full HD] 1920 x 1080, 50i (sensor output is 25fps)(FHD: 17Mbps) / AVCHD PAL [HD] 1280 x 720, 50p (SH: 17Mbps, H: 13Mbps, L: 9Mbps)"

http://www.panasonic.co.uk/html/en_GB/Products/LUMIX+Digital+Cameras/G+Micro+System/DMC-GH1/Specification/2146697/index.html?trackInfo=true

[Kholi]

I was actually looking through about 100 casting submissions for our feature.

The process is a headache.

I told ya! I really do NOT want to post random footage of trees and bees, people joggind down the street.

But Peter's request for a talking head or something similar might work in the interim if I can find a subject to shoot before.

[squig]

while we're waiting, anybody got a cross processing technique for color or final cut pro they wanna share?

[dougspice]

If you can give me/Vahe a lesson in operating the camera, and it's genuinely as good as you say it is, we have a nice little talking head piece coming up on Monday. Maybe see some Humvees explode or something as a bonus feature.

[ChipG]

If you have an old pinball machine in the basement take the glass off it and put the camera in it and start playing. It's better than trees...

Edit, wrong quote. Deleted it.

Double edit, I'll shoot myself if I see more trees.

[PappasArts]

I was actually looking through about 100 casting submissions for our feature.

The process is a headache.

I told ya! I really do NOT want to post random footage of trees and bees, people joggind down the street.

But Peter's request for a talking head or something similar might work in the interim if I can find a subject to shoot before.



Dude, Kholi come on your in LA the last time I checked. There's an actor at every corner, every Star Bucks and side walk cafe. Then there's Wannabe actors that are even more concentrated, that would love to sit in front of your camera and read lines from popular scripts of films or your own scripts...





.
Michael Pappas
http://www.pbase.com/Arrfilms
http://www.Myspace.com/PappasArts
http://www.facebook.com/people/Michael-Pappas/573417404
Arrfilms@hotmail.com
http://www.PappasArts.com
CONTACT VIA AOL INSTANT MESSENGER
AT { PAPPASARTS2 }

[John Caballero]

In the meantime the stills look fantastic! Wow! Panasonic is really behind the quality of this little monster. Just amazing.

http://www.flickr.com/photos/audioblog/show/with/3326273474/ (http://www.flickr.com/photos/audioblog/show/with/3326273474/)[/URL]
[URL="http://www.flickr.com/photos/audioblog/show/with/3326273474/"] (http://www.flickr.com/photos/audioblog/show/with/3326273474/)

[dougspice]

In the meantime the stills look fantastic! Wow! Panasonic is really behind the quality of this little monster. Just amazing.

http://www.flickr.com/photos/audioblog/show/with/3326273474/ (http://www.flickr.com/photos/audioblog/show/with/3326273474/)[/URL]
[URL="http://www.flickr.com/photos/audioblog/show/with/3326273474/"] (http://www.flickr.com/photos/audioblog/show/with/3326273474/)

Are those stills pulled from video, or the normal photo mode of the camera? If it's the former, all right. But if it's the latter, I'm not impressed compared to other cameras in its class. I definitely don't see anything amazing or fantastic in these images. Of course I doubt anyone here is buying this camera for the photo mode.

[John Caballero]

Well, if you don't see it is fine. You really have to be at least a good photographer to understand. They are very good indeed. The low light performance is excellent. Common sense alone would say they are not pulled from the video.

Video and stills are looking very promising for such a little camera. I will make my investment back with either one or both. I can't wait.

[dougspice]

I'll let you know if I ever become a good photographer. Meanwhile, I'm seeing images that don't compare favorably to what I can get with my D90 or the EOS 40D. I'm not even sure I'd compare them favorably to my D100. Obviously this camera is a little more compact and probably marketed towards hobbyists and point-and-shooters who are looking for more control.

If you want to tell me what's so impressive about these images, I'm all ears, but it seems to me that someone mostly interested in photography would do a lot better with another camera. But, again, that probably doesn't describe anyone here.

[AdrianF]

There's not been a lot of stills yet from the GH1, seems everybody is more interested in the video mode! These shots show off the GH1 with the new Pany 7-14 pretty well. http://www.flickr.com/photos/yoshinori_kikuchi/3483412502/

This is the lens I'm really interested in, just can't find any footage shot with it yet.

Kholi, thanks for taking the time documenting this, looking forward to seeing what you come up with.

Adrian

[SonicStates]

Well...I couldn't wait for Kholi's footage...ended up getting 2 for about 1200 bucks each. So far have been pretty impressed with the unit. Will post when I have anything worth posting...that you haven't seen already...maybe some flowers, trees, birds and a train might be a good start...oh and some leaves...whaddya reckon?

[squig]

his and hers

[squig]

Thank you for taking the time to contact Panasonic with your enquiry.

Panasonic Australia does not have details on the release of a Camera with a Model number DMc-GH1 at this time. We may have further details in the coming months.

Kind Regards,
Gavin.
Panasonic Customer Care


grrrr!

[chameloon]

Sorry for the off topic question in this very interessing post : what does "breaking a codec" can mean?
Thanks.

[SonicStates]

his and hers
a-hahaha...just in case I bust one getting crazy angry at the Japanese menus :happy:...no Dad came with...didn't require too much convincing... that he needed one too.

Panasonic Australia sucks..."we MAY have further information in the coming months" ouch.

[artforme]

Video and stills are looking very promising for such a little camera. I will make my investment back with either one or both. I can't wait.


What type of work is it that you do, is there an online portfolio that you could share?

[squig]

aren't they in business to sell stuff?

It's not like it's some big secret, clearly they know when it is shipping. Gavin you're a lousy liar mate.

"breaking a codec" means driving it too hard (fast action in this case) and introducing visible artifacts

[Uwe Lansing]

...
Seriously - I really want to see where it "falls apart." No more footage of pretty flowers!

Oh yes, please. 43 pages without any single clip :-(. Beside that, did anybody find out a workflow with PP CS4 to get rid of that damned 2:3 pulldown?

[Manoeuvre]

Thank you for taking the time to contact Panasonic with your enquiry.

Panasonic Australia does not have details on the release of a Camera with a Model number DMc-GH1 at this time. We may have further details in the coming months.

Kind Regards,
Gavin.
Panasonic Customer Care


grrrr!

The LUMIX DMC-GH1 and the two new Micro Four Thirds System lenses will be available in Australia in late May. Pricing is as follows:

LUMIX DMC-GH1 (Black) with LUMIX G VARIO HD 14-140mm/F4.0-5.8 ASPH./MEGA O.I.S lens $3,299rrp

LUMIX G VARIO HD 14-140mm/F4.0-5.8 ASPH./MEGA O.I.S lens: $1,999rrp

LUMIX G VARIO 7-14mm/F4.0 ASPH lens: $2,299rrp

Ouch

[Manoeuvre]

http://www.gizmodo.com.au/2009/04/panasonics_video-recording_gh1_camera_priced_and_dated.html#more

[SonicStates]

LUMIX DMC-GH1 (Black) with LUMIX G VARIO HD 14-140mm/F4.0-5.8 ASPH./MEGA O.I.S lens $3,299rrp

LUMIX G VARIO HD 14-140mm/F4.0-5.8 ASPH./MEGA O.I.S lens: $1,999rrp

LUMIX G VARIO 7-14mm/F4.0 ASPH lens: $2,299rrp

Ouch

Surely street price will be kinder than that???? 3299 -> 229,986 yen. Almost double than what I paid for it today...bollocks to that

Squiq...Japanese lessons/Girlie friend???

[androoow]

3,299.00 aud = 1,607.04 gbp ?? = :(

[AdrianF]

3,299.00 aud = 1,607.04 gbp ?? = :(

I saw the UK price as being around £1499, in Germany an online store is saying 1550 euros. Street price will hopefully be a little lower, in the EU we always seem to get stiffed for prices.

There is some info on the individual lens pricing on the Lumix lifestyle site http://www.lumixlifestyle.co.uk/forum/viewtopic.php?f=7&t=67

Adrian

[Toenis]

So audio levels are not lockable/manual?

[squig]

Surely street price will be kinder than that???? 3299 -> 229,986 yen. Almost double than what I paid for it today...bollocks to that

Squiq...Japanese lessons/Girlie friend???

yep, I'm in katoomba, dozens of them walk by my place every day. $3300 that's insane. They're not gonna sell any here at that price. I was expecting it to be $2200 max. I'll just get one from the US or HK.

[PaPa]

no external monitoring? It's like im stuck in a bad dream! Damnit! Guess i'll wait to see what ever happens with the D400 or Scarlet.

[squig]

Surely street price will be kinder than that???? 3299 -> 229,986 yen. Almost double than what I paid for it today...bollocks to that

Squiq...Japanese lessons/Girlie friend???

what did you pay for each of them exactly?

[SonicStates]

what did you pay for each of them exactly?

123,000...(didn't even use the points on my card either...next stop...new lens)

[squig]

$1770 AUD...... incredible. I'll wait and see if I can get an english menu version out of HK for that price. I have to flog my D90 first anyway

[Uwe Lansing]

I saw the UK price as being around £1499, in Germany an online store is saying 1550 euros...

Best price I´ve found here in germany € 1499,-:
http://www.fotokoch.de/31392.shtml?redirect=31392&partnerid=10331
But after 1 or 2 months it will be around 1400,-.

[DavidNJ]

123,000...(didn't even use the points on my card either...next stop...new lens)

Now if only someone would upload some raw footage...with the camera settings.

[SonicStates]

Now if only someone would upload some raw footage...with the camera settings.

point taken - let me get my head around these menus first...

[divide]

Anyone with an english GH1: can you post the english pdf manual online somewhere ? (rapidshare/megaupload). I guess the GH1 comes with a CD which has such manual ?
So far only the japanese one is available on panasonic website, which is not very informative for us... Thanks !

[booggerg2]

$3299!!!!


damn australian currency.. almost thought it was in USD for a second there!

[artforme]

Even if it costs that much in AUD they might have to shrink this back town to one forum category, as they would have out priced their potential buyers. We should all wait and see what pricing will look like internationally before jumping the gun, unless you can read Japanese.

[Toenis]

Wouldn't it have been sweet if continious AF tracking worked in movie mode. Damn, see the sample here (http://panasonic.net/avc/lumix/systemcamera/gms/gh1/ia.html) in the mid page where that girl runs towards camera. It apparently doesn't work in movie mode, damn damn damn....

[Oedipax]

Wouldn't it have been sweet if continious AF tracking worked in movie mode. Damn, see the sample here (http://panasonic.net/avc/lumix/systemcamera/gms/gh1/ia.html) in the mid page where that girl runs towards camera. It apparently doesn't work in movie mode, damn damn damn....

That sample looks cool and all but with the crosshair on the moving target, I keep expecting a missile to blow her to smithereens

[ydgmdlu]

123,000...(didn't even use the points on my card either...next stop...new lens)
Where did you get it?

[Zim]

Has any one tried uploading pictures or video to a computer yet?

Does the camera work with Apple? Final Cut Pro? iMovie? iPhoto?

Is there a software update needed from Apple?

[LizaWitz]

We should all wait and see what pricing will look like internationally before jumping the gun, unless you can read Japanese.

The US version will ship in June and cost less than $1,500.

Panasonic announced this at PMA.

That could mean $1,499, but I'm expecting $1300-$1400 based on the prices in Japan.

[caseyhayward]

While we wait for Kholi's reasearch work I thought this story might be of interest to you:

http://www.nytimes.com/2009/04/27/technology/business-computing/27disk.html?_r=1&hpw (http://www.nytimes.com/2009/04/27/technology/business-computing/27disk.html?_r=1&hpw)

I've been following holographic disc technology since 2001. Bring the damn product to market already!

[LizaWitz]

Has any one tried uploading pictures or video to a computer yet?
Does the camera work with Apple? Final Cut Pro? iMovie? iPhoto?
Is there a software update needed from Apple?

Yes, Barry posted a full copy of his flash card. I put that on a flash card, and was able to open and preview the footage in iMovie. I didn't bother importing it because iMovie has supported AVCHD for quite awhile.

No Final Cut Studio here, I'm waiting on the Snow Leopard version. So, I can't say anything about FCE or FCP compatibility.

But the mac has supported H.264 for many years, and AVCHD is just H.264 in an MPEG-2 transport stream. Assuming they haven't encoded the audio in an unusual way, this camera should work just like any other AVCHD camera with the Mac. (EG: Log and transfer or import to apple intermediate codec.)

[Kholi]

Sonic if you have the time to post up for the masses go ahead! I still want to wait until I've got something more than flowers and such to show. But its real soon.

[Zim]

Thanks.


Yes, Barry posted a full copy of his flash card. I put that on a flash card, and was able to open and preview the footage in iMovie. I didn't bother importing it because iMovie has supported AVCHD for quite awhile.

No Final Cut Studio here, I'm waiting on the Snow Leopard version. So, I can't say anything about FCE or FCP compatibility.

But the mac has supported H.264 for many years, and AVCHD is just H.264 in an MPEG-2 transport stream. Assuming they haven't encoded the audio in an unusual way, this camera should work just like any other AVCHD camera with the Mac. (EG: Log and transfer or import to apple intermediate codec.)

[judo]

Thanks for sharing!
I'm interested in how the camera handles bright light, such as a sun or a practical. Any tests on the subject?

/Hannes

[Zim]

And that will include the lens?



The US version will ship in June and cost less than $1,500.

Panasonic announced this at PMA.

That could mean $1,499, but I'm expecting $1300-$1400 based on the prices in Japan.

[Isaac_Brody]

And that will include the lens?

Yes.

[ydgmdlu]

And that will include the lens?

Panasonic isn't selling the body by itself.

[squig]

Has any one tried uploading pictures or video to a computer yet?

Does the camera work with Apple? Final Cut Pro? iMovie? iPhoto?

Is there a software update needed from Apple?

I posted the AVCHD workflow in the workflow thread- http://www.dvxuser.com/V6/showpost.php?p=1622776&postcount=2

[squig]

Panasonic isn't selling the body by itself.

but they are selling the lens....go figure

[LizaWitz]

Panasonic isn't selling the body by itself.

But I think there are a lot of G1 owners out there who are interested in getting the 14-140mm lens, and thus you could probably sell it relatively quickly on a micro-four-thirds forum.

[squig]

But I think there are a lot of G1 owners out there who are interested in getting the 14-140mm lens, and thus you could probably sell it relatively quickly on a micro-four-thirds forum.

I'm gonna hold onto it, will be handy for stabilized and car mount work.

[LizaWitz]

I'm gonna hold onto it, will be handy for stabilized and car mount work.

Me too. A lot of people pooh-pooh this lens, but I think they're stretching. We've seen perfectly fine night shots made with it already. And looking on the market, I haven't found a comparable zoom that's faster than f3.5-- and this lens being significantly smaller is going to have less ability to get light anyway.

But the great thing is, if you already have a collection of lenses that meet your requirements, then you can just mount them on the camera and sell the kit lens.

[PaPa]

i guess it becomes more of a question of where to find your 12mm-18mm to cover your 24 to 35 wides. And osmething that isn't particularly slow either.

[Boz]

I'm still torn on whether to go with Canon FD or Nikon F lenses. There seems to be no discernible difference in either availability or price.

In other news, I guess Phil Bloom has some footage and will (hopefully) be posting later today. I can't wait!

[LizaWitz]

Check out this footage. It goes back and forth between an f2.8 50-200mm Olympus and the kit lens.

In every case the kit lens looks better to me... seems to be less washed out and have better color.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8t7xHgOHxl8&fmt=22

[Ian-T]

Check out this footage. It goes back and forth between an f2.8 50-200mm Olympus and the kit lens.

In every case the kit lens looks better to me... seems to be less washed out and have better color.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8t7xHgOHxl8&fmt=22 Man....my HV20 doesn't look like that. I love that opening shot...it looks very filmic (aside from the shakey footage of course)..

[AdrianF]

i guess it becomes more of a question of where to find your 12mm-18mm to cover your 24 to 35 wides. And osmething that isn't particularly slow either.

The Olympus 12-60mm + 11-22mm could do the job, never used these lenses, but they're highly rated.


Check out this footage. It goes back and forth between an f2.8 50-200mm Olympus and the kit lens.

The kit lens pulls focus quite tidily at one point where the boat passes the buoy! It certainly does hold up in the bright light light.

Adrian

[PaPa]

Nice, i take it though that neither of those lenses have nikon F mounts?

[Tracey Lee]

Ooh yeah that opening shot...the look I'm after. Got my money set aside...just waiting now.

[Uwe Lansing]

...

In every case the kit lens looks better to me... seems to be less washed out and have better color.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8t7xHgOHxl8&fmt=22

Yes, the best footage I`ve seen so far. But also some flickering + banding recognizable.

[AdrianF]

Nice, i take it though that neither of those lenses have nikon F mounts?
Err no... Four Thirds

[LanceB]

Yeah flickering and banding in almost every post - exactly what I feared since this camera was announced. I own a Canon HF10 which also does 17Mbps max AVCHD and I've always wanted more bandwidth. The newer Canon's now go to 24Mbps which helps a lot.

Will have to see when Philip or any other qualified person starts posting and hopefully they'll use Vimeo and not Youtube see we can tell if it's web compression in all these shots.

[Kholi]

What do you guys mean by flickering?

[LizaWitz]

Nice, i take it though that neither of those lenses have nikon F mounts?

One is the kit lens in MFT mount, the other is a regular Four Thirds lens on an MFT to FT adapter (which panasonic sells).

[holyzoo]

What do you guys mean by flickering?

I see flicker in the end of this clip (saved an excerpt):
http://www.holyzoo.com/content/dslr/GH1_ExposureFlicker.mov

Original from YouTube:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8t7xHgOHxl8&fmt=22

Then there is a banding type of flicker as seen in the beginning of this clip:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f5og20tO52k

I totally disagree that it is "seen in every clip". I have only seen it in a few.

[Isaac_Brody]

I still can't judge whether that flicker is in the original footage. Youtube does nasty things to footage.

[Peter J. DeCrescenzo]

Check out this footage. It goes back and forth between an f2.8 50-200mm Olympus and the kit lens.

In every case the kit lens looks better to me... seems to be less washed out and have better color.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8t7xHgOHxl8&fmt=22

It's also true that, compared to the GH1's kit lens, the Olympus lens is faster, which might be desirable in certain situations.

[holyzoo]

Well bring on the tests guys!

[Uwe Lansing]

I see flicker in the end of this clip (saved an excerpt):
http://www.holyzoo.com/content/dslr/GH1_ExposureFlicker.mov

...


Exactly, banding in the sky as well. But hopefully Isaac is right that the bad compression of YT is the main reason for that fault.

[Kholi]

I'm having aliasing issues in my original footage. =T Dunno what it's from, trying to figure it out.

[Ian-T]

Really? That would be a first among all the others we've seen so far.

[stephenvv]

I'm having aliasing issues in my original footage. =T Dunno what it's from, trying to figure it out.

I've seen people have problems with 5D, EX1 etc. etc. with aliasing. Take a careful look at how codec, display system, output, preview etc. is dealing with pulldown, aspect ratio etc. especially if scaling or pulldown removal is involved.

I have a mondo FTP server would be happy to look at any footage - I'm on Vegas and AE CS3.

[LizaWitz]

Exactly, banding in the sky as well. But hopefully Isaac is right that the bad compression of YT is the main reason for that fault.

IF thats what y'all are talking about by "Banding" its totally just compressor artifacts, and since YouTube is not giving us 17Mbps, its certainly the result of YouTube and the other online streaming formats. You can't take %90 of the data out of an image and look at it and then think that the original image wasn't degraded.

The flickering, is interesting, its like those particular frames are exposed at a higher iso than the immediately preceding and following frames. But the image quality doesn't change-- dunno if its youtube, the camera or something in between.

[squig]

I'm having aliasing issues in my original footage. =T Dunno what it's from, trying to figure it out.

maybe I'll wait for the D400

[Peter J. DeCrescenzo]

I still can't judge whether that flicker is in the original footage. Youtube does nasty things to footage.

I agree.

On the other hand: Compressing to YT & Vimeo seems to add some blur which smoothes-over some of the weaknesses in the GH1's video (well, actually all video).

That's why I'm interested in seeing some GH1 video shot with a (very) light diffusion filter on the lens ... e.g.: possibly trading off a little high-freq. resolution in return for fewer video compression artifacts.

[Peter J. DeCrescenzo]

Kholi, Hunter, Phil & other GH1 users: Have you come to any conclusion as to whether or not the GH1's 720p30 MJPEG mode looks better/worse (in terms of compression artifacts) compared to the 1080p24 AVCHD mode?

e.g.: If it's more pleasant-looking, 720p30 MJPEG might be preferable to 1080p24 AVCHD.

Resolution-chauvinism aside, which flavor of HD does the GH1 seem to record the "cleanest"?

(I wonder if Panasonic's "women in the tropics" GH1 sample videos were shot at 720p30 MJPEG?)

[Kholi]

AVCHD for me. The Pattern in MJPEG footage is just completely unappealing to me.

[ryansheffer]

Hey Kholi,

I'm an editor. I'm curious to know how you ingested your footage that you are getting aliasing. Also - what your timeline settings are and do you get this aliasing in all programs you open the file in.

[ryansheffer]

also - has the footage been reverse telecined or is it still 60i?

[Kholi]

It's in the RAW and after the Inverse.

Dealing with ProRes for conversion. Do you think it might be an issue with ProRes? I really need to get Premiere. Final Cut is old hat.

[ryansheffer]

Care to put up a still of the worst image? Quick question - did you bring the file straight into compressor or simply do an export to compressor from a final cut timeline. Export to compressor causes some headaches. If you did export to compressor it may be a field order issue with the timeline before you exported.

I would love to see a still. Or is there a way you could send me a short raw clip. I would love to work on it for you.

Working from home today. Doing a batch export with plenty of time to spare.

[directorvfx]

For all of the early owners that have purchased the Japanese Version I'm curious if you think that a firmware update will add an English menu system? Is that the hope?

[squig]

It's in the RAW and after the Inverse.

Dealing with ProRes for conversion. Do you think it might be an issue with ProRes? I really need to get Premiere. Final Cut is old hat.

how are you viewing it raw?

[Zack Birlew]

Well, I don't know. The footage looks like it's missing something. Maybe it's just the way its shot or the subject matter but it just feels like video somehow, even if it's just a little bit.

After hearing about the pulldown, my hopes for the GH1 dropped significantly. Granted, if it's the only game in town for a small unsuspecting manual controlled 1080p 24p VDSLR, then I'll have no choice but to go with it. The Leica M thing was a good snare but the camera has to work for me above all else before I plunk any money towards it. Otherwise I can sit and wait for a Scarlet.

[dustwaterwindfire]

this thread is torture. Please- I just need to be put out of my misery. I keep coming here over and over looking and hoping to see evidence one way or the other. Hope or no hope? Please just put something out there for all to see. its got me strung out on dvxuser. anyone that has footage right out of the camera take pity on us. i know others must feel this way. do we need to start a petition for footage.:happy:

[stephenvv]

maybe I'll wait for the D400

I doubt Nikon will develop a sensor with optimized readout for video as the GH1 for the D400. Nikon may be waking up to the possibilities and manual control but they've got little to no video codec, so it may well be just a little more control, 1080p MJPEG and not much more.

Unless Canon and Nikon can really move on a dime, it could take 12-18 months before we see a video centric model from them.

Plus, I'm really starting to like the 4/3 format. I've never liked big cameras even in the film days and I'm hoping that this is just the first body in a series of 4/3 video bodies. So I'm leaning to selling my K10d and HV30 and making the 4/3 committment, even if this is not 100% perfect.

[stephenvv]

It's in the RAW and after the Inverse.

Dealing with ProRes for conversion. Do you think it might be an issue with ProRes? I really need to get Premiere. Final Cut is old hat.

Could be - I just made a Blu-ray of an HV20 ProRes short and even though he swore it was 23.976 progressive, the 24p blu-ray MPEG looked crappy with aliasing and blur.

I would not get too excited yet. I was the 6th person in the US to get a DVX100 and no software had support yet. The first footage I shot with it had "issues" that turned out all to be codec and pulldown related.