Fire Point

[theAlchemist]

Fire Point

Logline: A man on the run jeopardizes his brother's life in search of one last chance.

Second scriptfest for me and second western :)
Still busy writing, but all actions thought out so should make it on time.

[Ezekiel667]

Welcome to the Fest. Can't wait to give it a read.

[TimCollins]

Welcome, love the title.

[conlanforever]

Yep, digging the title. Interested to see what his last one chance is/or is for.

[theAlchemist]

:) good was still doubting about title.

Seems I have to trim some things in the script to keep it at 10 pages.
Luckily I think I can do that mostly with more efficient writing.

[theAlchemist]

First draft done. Finally. Gonna be a long day tomorrow to make the final adjustments to get it in a decent state.

[jamiejay]

sounds good... looking forward to reading your script! :)

jamie

[DarkElastic]

Hi Alc, I have just read your script, thanks for the read.

*Spoilers*

I liked the almost hatred, but brotherly respect between Chris and Sam, especially as Chris had paid for Sam's life in the past (using up all their money), and Sam hated Chris for putting him in this situation again and again. I never really felt anything for the wife though, but I suppose she was a means to an end.
The action gets a little laboured during the shoot out, and a little confusing. It almost begins to judder and moves away from the fluidity you had previously. You don't get into the scene of the wife's death and then Chris', but i feel some rewriting could repair that.
What was the significance of the name? I expected the flames to have more relevance to the story.
I did like the ending, the sacrifice for his brother. It would have been nice if he had killed the Voice before being mowed down.

Overall though it was a good read, thank you. Keep writing.

[NJPage]

Hi there... now I'm a 'newby' too all this (scriptwriting) so I've just been going on impressions rather than technicalities. I enjoyed your story, and to me it felt very much more a story to be told, rather than a script to perform. Maybe the mind got into that mode because of the long descriptive action prose at the begining. Does that make sense? I loved the v. good twist ending.

[lawriejaffa]

Right well this was an interesting little revenge twistish kind of tale that was at times a little hard to follow for me! The thing that confronted me first of all was the huge block of action!

It's probably the most terrifying sight that can behold any director hehe - its like taking one long hard punch to our gut! WHACK!

So I churned my way through that (and it is churning!) and i found the setup to be intriguing - the burning building - the drama, the required resolution (occuring in the midst of this chaos.) There was and could be if not intended - a great gothic quality to this short as well from the initial mood it creates.

Now the length of action lines (and slightly clumsy overlong language describing it) made me skim past the odd sentence and inevitably before you realise it you've just missed an important detail etc!

The relationship of the two brothers - and the wife, and the outcome was intriguing, but i felt a little detached from the emotions of these characters, thus the full consequences of the story did not play out for me.

At its heart though this is a solid story, with a great premise, i think its just a case of cleaning up and reducing the extra language that acts as a barrier to us getting closer!

[krestofre]

I thought your dialogue was pretty strong. That is usually a stumbling block for most writers, but the words the characters were saying rang well to my ears.

I do, however, agree with Lawrie. The blocks of action are a bit difficult. I too was tempted to skip ahead during some of that because of the way it was written. I stopped myself, because it won't be fair to you for me to skip ahead, but the fact that I had the urge means that something needs to be fixed. Length, word economy, etc. All things to think about. You can say the same things with fewer lines and that will help the flow and readability of your script.

Nice betrayal, estranged brothers story.

Keep writing!

[NJPage]

Hi there - gave feedback earlier and just re-read your script. On 2nd read the long action sequences at the beginning and later in the script kind of add rather than detract, if you know what I mean. Just a little pruning here and there would make a big difference. Also, if made into a film, the visual elements you describe could make a good backdrop to the one line dialogues that features a lot in your script. Hope this helps.

[conlanforever]

You've come up with some really good elements in this script. Everything is there as far as plot, characters , dialogue it just got bogged down with some long blocks of action. Nothing some editing couldn't take care of, that first page could easily be half as long and it would help the pace of the story.

I really liked the opening visual of the burning building. I wasn't expecting the wife to get killed, so very good there.

And I always like a good decapitation. I think you have a good story on your hands.

[TimCollins]

So I just finished reading this one and it was enjoyable.

Even though I do agree some of the action was a bit wordy, I like your use of descriptive imagery. It could just be shortened a tad.

There were a few sentences that I thought could be reworded to flow easier...
One example:

CHRIS
Cut the crap. You want money isn't
it?Now I'm not sure if it is that is just Chris' dialect but that would read easier as:

"You want money don't you?" or "It's money you want isn't it?"

Anyway, small nitpicks aside, I did like the overall premise.

I thought though that the duel between Guy and the drunken Max was sort of just extra fluff and really is of no consequence to the story (perhaps I missed something which is entirely possible because I'm pretty tired. So if I did please correct me).

I did, however, like the fact that Ann and Chris both died which was an unexpected twist. But I didn't like how the brothers started to tussle with each other at the end, that seemed a little far fetched for two guys who had just sustained multiple gunshot wounds. Especially Chris' mortal wound to the torso.

It was also a little confusing to have a character named Guy and refer to the other men as "guy" also.

I especially liked the ending, though. "A concert of gunshots" that's a great way to describe it. Very cool. I always appreciate a story without a happy "walk into the sunset" ending.

All in all, it was a fun piece to read. And despite those few nitpicks it was a solid piece of work. With just a simple revision it would be excellent.

[Blaine]

I started to say something about your grammar and style, then I saw you are from the Netherlands soooooo that's an easy one to overlook.

I thought your opening was strong but found it went downhill from there. Sam seems to be the protagonist here and it would be nice to have some reason to like him or pull for him but I found him to be an thorough ass. His brother Chris should have shot him on sight.

Now, reading, I feel there is a bit of a plot hole here. Sam owes Guy money but Chris paid Guy after Sam left, so why all the drama? It's been paid up so everyone should be square. A second problem is why they choose this exact time to come after Chris and Ann. Sam hasn't been around for a long time...in fact, Chris' wife doesn't even know Sam, so why, all of a sudden do they go after Chris (who has already paid Guy)? It just doesn't feel right.

On the technical front...you need to capitalize the character's name the first time he/she appears in the script. You did that with Sam, but you capitalized Chris when talking about his house, not him. Also, please be consistent with character's names in dialogue. You started Ann as Mrs. Walton, then after she introducer herself, you switched to Ann. Nowhere had you given Chris' last name as Walton so I would have just started out with Ann. Remember, we're reading this, not watching it yet so it's okay to use her name since you're not trying fool the reader about who she is.

I also found your action sections to be somewhat tedious and it was all I could do to keep from skimming them.

You might want to be careful about having someone named Guy (capital G) then refer to others in your script as guy or guys (lowercase g) as it can get confusing.

You might want to use pronouns such as 'he' after you've already mentioned the character's name as long as it doesn't get confusing with other characters. I mention this because of how many times you used the name Chris in close proximity.

I commend you on writing this and getting it out there but it still fell flat for me because of the plot holes I mentioned earlier. Thanks for sharing.

[jamiejay]

i like how you opened with a man's silhouette riding into a town in the glow of a burning building next to the ruins of a church... it was a great visual with which to open up a story. it was my favorite part of the script.

like blaine said, i did not like sam as the protagonist at all... he even threw punches at his dying brother whose wife was just murdered! but i also understand that main characters are not always likable.

the problems with the long action sequences have already been covered, and, some of the phrasing and grammar was incorrect, but that can be overlooked. the use of "guy" was distracting because it was used over and over to describe different people and it was the villain's name as well.

all in all, i think the script has potential... it's an interesting concept. :)

[Chris_Keaton]

I haven't sifted through all of the feedback so I apologize if any of this is duplication. Oh, take a look at my general feedback thread, I'm sure some of that will help.

I like the opening seen with the orange glow. It made me think everything was silent, but if there is a massive fire being put out, we should hear this. I would suggest writing that everything is silent and then the noise hits when he realizes where the glow comes from. Or describe what he is hearing as he rolls into town.

I think you have a core of a good story. The real thing that made me cringe and not give a totally high rating was the terrible plan the brothers had. It was an awful failure. Sure this is probably the most realistic gambit, but this is a western these dudes are suppose to have some sense. :)

Keep writing!

[theAlchemist]

Thanks for the reviews so far :)
Appreciate the feedback.

Recognize some of the points that also came to my mind when I read it last time. Mostly confusing things. Naming Guy Guy was silly :huh: I even named him after I was done with the script so should have been aware of it.


I thought though that the duel between Guy and the drunken Max was sort of just extra fluff and really is of no consequence to the story (perhaps I missed something which is entirely possible because I'm pretty tired. So if I did please correct me).
&

Now, reading, I feel there is a bit of a plot hole here. Sam owes Guy money but Chris paid Guy after Sam left, so why all the drama? It's been paid up so everyone should be square. A second problem is why they choose this exact time to come after Chris and Ann. Sam hasn't been around for a long time...in fact, Chris' wife doesn't even know Sam, so why, all of a sudden do they go after Chris (who has already paid Guy)? It just doesn't feel right.
Hmm now you mention this I can see how this point could be / is unclear in the script. Sam isn't running from Guy, but from someone else in another town (the "voice" in the last scene) who is very much like Guy. The debt to Guy is paid. The duel between Max and Guy is supposed to be an example of the things men like Guy and "voice" are capable of. That's how I tried to explain both Sams previous problems and his current problems at the same time. More people who thought Sam needs to pay Guy back?


What was the significance of the name? I expected the flames to have more relevance to the story.
When I was looking for a title the story made me think of the backdraft phenomenon. But I didn't want to name it backdraft because of the existing movie. So I titled it all kinds of related things before settling on Fire Point. I saw an abstract similarity between the fire point, the point where a substance will continue to burn after ignition, and my script. Sam's actions make this story reach a (fire) point where it turns into an unstoppable nightmare for Sam and his brother.

@Sam as protagonist
I like grim westerns and non-hero leads. Started this script with the idea of writing it as a film noir / western. I abandoned that idea, but some things stayed. Some of the visual mood and three characters. Sam and Chris stayed. And I transformed Ann from femme fatale to loving wife. I certainly didn't want Sam to be a likeable person. I'd like the reader to feel the hatred Sam can generate in his brother. Hard lead to write and make the reader feel happy with. It also sounds some of you found him not only unlikeable but also annoying? When I think of unlikeable leads in westerns it's mostly the performance of the actor that makes or breaks it for me. Any advice on making an unlikeable person a good lead is welcome :)


I started to say something about your grammar and style, then I saw you are from the Netherlands soooooo that's an easy one to overlook.
I don't mind remarks on grammar and style, would be good for me :)

Well that's it for now, back to reading some other scripts and taking a couple hours of sleep before the formule 1 starts :D

[MrKilloran]

Its good but kind of wordy, it's been said but trim down on your action. Some good build up and I don't really have much to add that hasn't already been said, especially Sam coming across as unlikeable and annoying... mainly because even anti-heroes have a soft-spot or like-able trait, something he holds onto, some moral point he holds onto that the audience can connect with him. You have a decent story to play with, it just needs some work. nice job.

[Mark C]

Holy cow, these brothers have some issues with each other! This kind of tension does make for a great story and I like how the fire at the beginning plays into the title. It may have been cool to see Chris' wife to play a bigger role in there (maybe having something to do with all of this trouble) and it would allow you to reduce the number of characters you needed to pull the whole thing off. It still works but It might be easier then trying to fully develop more then a few characters within ten pages. At any rate I think there's some really cool conflict in here and I liked the story!

[leepback]

Must admit I had trouble with the account keeping and who owed who what.

I also agree with ChrisK in relation to the brothers plan to get the wife back. Not well thought out. Seems they have more courage than brains (but then you did want them to die so I suppose that's why). This is where you lost me for the most part.

Fairly grim but that's not necessarily a bad thing.

Cheers

[arroway]

this was a difficult read (way too descriptive, way too much passive voice) and i'm not entirely sure i understood all the intricacies of the debts and and who owed what to whom for how long...?

i also didn't understand what that duel had to do with anything other than showing how bad a guy, GUY, is. unless i missed something i think that whole thing could be removed or shortened substantially.

BUT...i love how little dialogue it contains. westerns are notoriously devoid of dialogue. so far, yours has been the best example of this. a lot of the other entries are very dialogue-driven, to a fault, in my opinion. yours wasn't at all and what dialogue it did have was pretty good.

this was my favorite bit of description:

"The middle aged man and woman aren't helping. The woman is
seeking comfort in the man's arms. She's crying. The man
has his arms around her, but he doesn't seem to notice her
very much. He stares at nothing."

although i didn't completely understand the end, i love the mysterious man and i love the last train pulling out reveal the gunmen--really an amazing visual.

and i love the post fade out "concert" of guns going off. very stylish.

high marks from me.