PDA

View Full Version : Still thinking about the HMC.. but where are the good clips?



booggerg2
12-30-2008, 07:08 AM
There seems to be a lack of good work done by the HMC on the Vimeo.. The cam has been out for a while now so I assumed there would be some quality work. Nothing on Vimeo.. Should I keep waiting or just pick up a XHA1 for cheap because it is more proven?

manglerBMX
12-30-2008, 07:43 AM
i've been using the A1 for over a year, i hate it compared to the 150.

are you just watching the clips you see on vimeo or are you downloading the source files?

Jack Daniel Stanley
12-30-2008, 07:54 AM
Did you look in the HMC150 clips section here?
I don't recall any super produced narrative work, but there's def. some awesome footage there along with raves about low light performance. etc.

booggerg2
12-30-2008, 08:19 AM
I'm looking at Vimeo.. not bothering with the downloaded clips because the web version do not interest me to begin with.

Jack Daniel Stanley
12-30-2008, 08:36 AM
----
Did you look in the HMC150 clips section here?

booggerg2
12-30-2008, 08:45 AM
----

Sure did, nothing good there either. :( In fact, the HMC vs A1 vs EX3 thread was downright depressing for the HMC's sake.. :(

Hidef1080
12-30-2008, 08:49 AM
I'm looking at Vimeo.. not bothering with the downloaded clips because the web version do not interest me to begin with.


Quality as in content or quality as in image quality?


I like Vimeo a lot but I don't think it's what I'd call HD.
It's far better than You Tube [even You Tube HD] but I viewed some clips in full screen and it's pretty clear that the image quality is less than 720p no matter what camera is being used.

booggerg2
12-30-2008, 08:56 AM
Quality as in content or quality as in image quality?


I like Vimeo a lot but I don't think it's what I'd call HD.
It's far better than You Tube [even You Tube HD] but I viewed some clips in full screen and it's pretty clear that the image quality is less than 720p no matter what camera is being used.

Mostly image quality.. not saying that the vimeo compression level disinterests me, but that the scenes in the HMC clips shows nothing compelling that really highlights the quality (or deficiencies) of the HMC's sensor. A Canon HV30 next to the HMC could have shot the same footage for most of those clips..

Show me some clips of the HMC shooting into sunlight, backlit subjects, highlights and shadows in the same shot. Show me how the HMC handles these tricky situations and how it renders the light bloom.... Does it render them beautifully? or does the clip harshly and look like ugly digital video?

Jack Daniel Stanley
12-30-2008, 09:08 AM
....
Show me some clips of the HMC shooting into sunlight, backlit subjects, highlights and shadows in the same shot. Show me how the HMC handles these tricky situations and how it renders the light bloom.... Does it render them beautifully? or does the clip harshly and look like ugly digital video?
Did you see the church production clips of the crow of thorns back lit with theatrical / rock show lights shining into the camera?

Not sunlight though.

Also - you do know the sensors for the 200a, 170 and HMC 150 are identical? Only difference is recording codec.

Hidef1080
12-30-2008, 09:10 AM
Mostly image quality.. not saying that the vimeo compression level disinterests me, but that the scenes in the HMC clips shows nothing compelling that really highlights the quality (or deficiencies) of the HMC's sensor. A Canon HV30 next to the HMC could have shot the same footage for most of those clips..

Show me some clips of the HMC shooting into sunlight, backlit subjects, highlights and shadows in the same shot. Show me how the HMC handles these tricky situations and how it renders the light bloom.... Does it render them beautifully? or does the clip harshly and look like ugly digital video?

Okay, got ya....

I can only remember one clip linked somewhere on here that had a night shot with car headlights coming towards the camera but nothing close to what you're looking for.
That does seem like a good way to test a camera however.

seven.b
12-30-2008, 10:26 AM
I completely agree with booggerg2. I'm currently shopping around for my first prosumer camera and I can't find any footage that really inspires me or draws me to the camera. I find myself looking in the HVX+HPX sections to see good work with those cameras since you guys swear the quality of the HMC150 is almost identical.

Here is an example of one of those videos for the HV20 back in the day... http://www.vimeo.com/431500

Based on a lot of the footage i've been seeing it almost seems like i'll be buying just another consumer camera if I go with the HMC150...

Stevet
12-30-2008, 10:28 AM
I like Vimeo a lot but I don't think it's what I'd call HD.


True, but all you have to do is signup for ypur own vimeo account and you can access the original video attached at the bottom right of the page.
This is the HD video you upload, before they compress it and throw it into their smaller frame.

jeff9329
12-30-2008, 10:55 AM
There seems to be a lack of good work done by the HMC on the Vimeo.. The cam has been out for a while now so I assumed there would be some quality work. Nothing on Vimeo.. Should I keep waiting or just pick up a XHA1 for cheap because it is more proven?


You need to download some clips and view them locally on a HD monitor. All the web based viewing mediums are not very good at all for seeing the resolution differences in these cameras. They just show who has the best lighting and exposure IMO. You also need to try the raw footage in your NLE.

Quality work? It's the videographer who does the work, the camera is just the tool.

I moved from A1s to the HMC-150s. They are both great cameras. Pick the one most suited to what you are shooting.

Alan Bradley
12-30-2008, 11:58 AM
The hv20 got a HUGE boost from Soloman Chase. They were rather lucky in that such a cinematic short like Rainy Day was produced so shortly after the camera's release. Soloman should have gotten something from Canon for his effort!! The HV20, HV30, HF100, etc can all produce very awesome results. For minimal investment. That's fairly obvious. I suppose that the HMC150 has had a noticeable lack of "cinematic" moments since it's release but that only belies it's awesome potential. "Rainy Day" or something similar could easily be achieved with the HMC150, it just hasn't...yet.
You must really view each in person on an HD screen to notice it's differences. The manual controls are the clincher for me. But don't get me wrong. I once viewed some Maui vacation footage on my TV from the HV20 some time back and was completely BLOWN AWAY by what I saw. Very remarkable for the price.
It comes down to how much you are willing to invest financially and in effort. There are many parts to production outside of simple image capture. One could get quite a nice video and audio package for 4 grand.
But don't ever think that the HMC150 just doesn't stack up. I've owned or still own the EX1, HVX200, XH-A1, HV30, DVX100..and the HMC150 is EXCELLENT. They're all great. Just decide what it is you really want to invest.

booggerg2
12-30-2008, 12:26 PM
I'm replacing my SD package consisting of DVX100, GL2(sold) with HD. I've already picked up a couple of HV30s and Letus 35, and it has worked well for my wedding production needs. Now I need to replace my primary cam DVX100 with an HD equivalent..

http://vimeo.com/2318151 I think he used either an EX1 or HVX200 for this video.. why isn't anyone producing something of this caliber with the HMC?

Barry_Green
12-30-2008, 12:31 PM
The simple fact is that the core imagers of the HMC150 produce a noticeably better-looking picture than the core imagers of the HVX200. If you've seen good-looking HVX footage, and you handed that person an HMC150 instead, you'd get better-looking footage.

Note, this applies only to the original HVX, not the HVX200A. The 200A has the same imagers as the HMC150 and will produce footage as good or better than the 150.

But the point is - if you like what you've seen from an HVX, you should love what you see from the HMC150.

As to why you're not seeing it yet; the cameras just came out in October. Very few people have them, and people have been struggling with the editing situation until recently too. When there are enough talented shooters producing quality work with the 150, you'll start seeing jaw-dropping eye-popping footage.

Evro
12-30-2008, 01:47 PM
Here's something we produced earlier this month, shot entirely using two HMC-152 cameras.

http://www.dvxuser.com/V6/showthread.php?p=1508426#post1508426

Justyn
12-30-2008, 05:23 PM
Having shot HVX stuff for 3 years almost.. and 200a, not any 170 yet. This cam is every bit as good as those with plenty more positives than negatives. It just won prosumer camera of the year. It's a sweet choice.


check out some of the footage on the 150 thread.. pretty nice and Evro's stuff should sell ya what things are possible in capable hands.

mikeshu
12-30-2008, 10:24 PM
i've been using the A1 for over a year, i hate it compared to the 150.


Actually I've been struggling with a buying decision between the HMC150 and A1. The A1 has sharper native resolution sensors but the HMC150 has the more efficient codec and cheap solid state medium.

What was it you hated about the A1? I want to hear the good and bad from both sides before choosing either to upgrade from my DVX to the Canon overlords or stick with faithful Panny. Also it has a lot to do with how much work in LA I would get with either. In which case I've also been eyeing the hole-in-your-pocket but popular HVX200A


Thanks!

studio1972
12-31-2008, 03:55 AM
True, but all you have to do is signup for ypur own vimeo account and you can access the original video attached at the bottom right of the page.
This is the HD video you upload, before they compress it and throw it into their smaller frame.

To be fair, most people compress the video quite a lot before uploading it as well, so my HMC151 21mbps clip is compressed to say 3mbps for uploading. So even the clips you download from the site are much lower quality than the original.

studio1972
12-31-2008, 04:13 AM
I'm replacing my SD package consisting of DVX100, GL2(sold) with HD. I've already picked up a couple of HV30s and Letus 35, and it has worked well for my wedding production needs. Now I need to replace my primary cam DVX100 with an HD equivalent..

http://vimeo.com/2318151 I think he used either an EX1 or HVX200 for this video.. why isn't anyone producing something of this caliber with the HMC?

For wedding work I think that the HMC is ideal as it is great in low light (1st dance, dark old churches) and also seems to handle highlights well (dress in sunlight). It also has all the manual controls you need, I cannot think if a better option in this sort of price range. I recently upgraded it from an XM2 btw, which is the PAL version of the GL2. I've only filmed 2 wedding with it so far, but I haven't edited them yet, the footage seems great though.

Is there any risk to the sensor filming into the sun like in that clip btw?

Stuart

Retrospective
12-31-2008, 04:33 AM
Note, this applies only to the original HVX, not the HVX200A. The 200A has the same imagers as the HMC150 and will produce footage as good or better than the 150.

But the point is - if you like what you've seen from an HVX, you should love what you see from the HMC150.

Ok, you've completely nailed it there Barry. Best explanation so far!:thumbup: