Red Rope

[lawriejaffa]

"Tenements... cobblestones, tiny bag... it falls out, shining in the night... dangling... limp... the arm of an infant."

My script is a thriller noir, set in post war (1950s) Scotland, where amidst the bulldozing of tenements and the construction of post modern 'new towns' an ambitous town councillor, beloved by his constituents and celebrating his first born fights for promotion. Only a secret tragedy of darkest magnitude stands in his way...

[lawriejaffa]

(bagged)

[Nektonic]

Wow, this one sounds extremely dramatic and seems to have a lot of depth.

[lawriejaffa]

Thanks man, its pretty dark too, think a little of the film 'M' noir, with a bit of pulp. It won't be everyone's cup of tea.

[Isaac_Brody]

Interesting...looking forward to this one.

[pauly_the_hitman]

Oh you had me at..."the arm of an infant"...
Pauly

[lawriejaffa]

Thanks guys, I think this will probably be among the more disturbed entries, im hoping to develop this one for my Loss Fest Entry too.

Here is a wee poster i threw up borrowing bits and bops out there - gets the feel across!

http://img100.imageshack.us/img100/6245/posterde0.jpg

[Nektonic]

cool poster

[DarkElastic]

Nice mate, look forward to reading it.

[Brandon Rice]

Really looking forward to this one!

[lawriejaffa]

Thanks guys - okay if its alright i just wanted to give you guys some 'cultural' translations for something in the script that you will read (there not plot related) but just to make sense.

Mine is set in immediate post ww2 war scotland, very class based british (almost Victorian in part) so old fashioned, and you will also hear mention of so called 'new towns' these were government funded new towns built because of the housing shortages resulting from ww2 and the decrepit states of many old homes.

There you have it, so hope that explains the period formality of this script, and so you know what the heck the 'new town' is that you read mentioned in the script.

I hope its okay to say that, as somethings 'presumed' to be known in the UK id rather that US /international readers could presume to know a bit (at least conceptually) also.

Im uploading tonight, will answer any questions about it - looking forward to reading others :)

[lawriejaffa]

Viewing now open! I honestly hope you all enjoy the script! Will be posting reviews for other folks too!

[DarkElastic]

I enjoyed it very much mate. Your 50s Britain was well created with nice settings, good dialogue and good characters, added to that the excellent - but monsterous - ending made a very good script. Are you going to make this one for LossFest?

[Redcloak]

Some nice ideas and an ambience I totally bought for the first two thirds. I liked the setting, on the verge of the new. Actually it felt American to me for some reason, that dark suburbia feel (I say that as a Brit).

Maybe it's the length, but I don't feel the motivations of the character strongly enough for the ending. It seems out of context with the more subtle build up. I needed to feel the presence of the child and something being amiss from the start for it to work for me. One of the most original settings for the story out of the lot in my opinion though.

[lawriejaffa]

//Spoiler//
I would agree Redcloak to an extent if i was reading in a psychological perspective from dialogue alone. The clues to 'troubles' are very subtle and have to be because lets face it if theres any hint this guy didnt want his kid - then BANG you've guessed it! So, the scene with Murdoch where he eyes up his bosses promotion (even after just getting one!) Or his half joking remark about being priminister// being in a daze over questions about his wife (subtle uncaring but not grossly so.) Are clues.

Then there are parts that only a director can do that a scriptwriter cannot. For example, the settings and locations becoming darker, more grim as the horrible conclusion occurs, as would a subtle and menacing score (that transcends from one more kindly and pastoral.) Certainly the idealistic beginning can give a hint of suburban bliss (that might be the american context) as we do take onto ourselves the worlds we see ;)

So id have to disagree with making the motivation of the character more obvious i think ive probably nailed it so much as i feel comfortable with? Increasing the prescence of the child - that i could do, though we do have numerous characters mention it (with kindly faces etc) we dont need our lead too really i don't think.

Under direction the early scenes would not be so subtle, but would really be quite jolly oh british dads army esque only to become a kind of dickension hell hole. :) Cheers also DarkElastic im onto your script next!

[krestofre]

Twisted little tale. Interesting use of the setting to really send this story home. Some of the dialog felt very stiff to me, even for the setting.

[lawriejaffa]

Thanks mate much appreciated - yep perhaps part of the dialogue is, however any of the almost victorian like formality with a hint of the theatre is completely intended. There are civic offices in scotland today where folk still talk like that haha

[CallaghanFilms]

Nice, neat piece:beer:

The atmospheric mood never slips, it oozes through the nooks and crannies of every scene.

Overall, a nicely constructed project (just like new town undoubtedly will be).


***SPOILER ALERT***

My biggest qualm is with the ending. It is debatable whether or not it is predictable (I personally fall into the no camp...I say it is not predictable). However, it offers up more questions than answers. Namely, why would he think the child wasn't his because it was retarded? I could see if the child were Chinese or black or "different"...but being born with retardation is genetic (which would have been common knowledge in the 1950's).

Or, was that just how he attempted to justify it to himself? Using that as an excuse, in other words. If that is the case, I think a few (very few) revision lines would better portray that.

Favorite Line:
"...Well I suppose it's your future really. Me...I'm old...I'm cobblestone and brick, you're concrete and asphalt."
Good stuff, that:beer:

[lawriejaffa]

Yey thanks man - much appreciate it - its really cute you've quoted favourite lines in your reviews kudos for that.

//Spoilers//

Yep the script isn't about guessing the ending as it were - I want it to be a thought provoking surprise that can then be rationalised watching it backwards and taking the films story (in the context of its period setting also.) So why does it happen? Why does he do it? Well neither does he need justification as in (the baby isn't his ie. making the kid a different race etc.

His motivation is an age old prejudice prevelant up to the 50's stemming from Victorian Britain, against disabled kids and what that says about a man. Our boy is so neurotic that his career succeed that his own prejudice against the kid and fear of his bosses prejudices drives him mad, so much so he wants to ensure his wife can never again bare kids for risk of the same thing happening either.

He is all about the future, but cannot escape the views of the past, and this is ironic, as is his delving to the 'seedy dickension style past' to get his murderer.

I want to show the guy and his idealism and vaunting ambition especially to the future, still falling pray to the social influences of the past. In that sense the film is about HIM and not the baby, despite the horrendous death of the baby making us perhaps overly seek answers to remedy the terrible event in our head.

As we know, backstreet abortions and all manner of horrible things happened for sake of shame and convenience during the period, and still do today.

[GrizzlyGuy]

Nice story, well constructed and paced.

I didn't see the ending coming. Richard earlier said "Bless him, he is a beautiful little thing" about the baby and I took him at his word. With Mike being kind of a hot head ("Just as well sir! Or I’d have torn them down myself!"), I expected him to be the perpetrator at the end. Seemed like he might have been upset with more than just the street lights. The ending was thus a surprising twist for me, well done! :thumbup:

[lawriejaffa]

Cheers mate much appreciated :)

[Mike Manning]

Hey Man, just read your script. Something doesn't really sit right with me, and after reading through your responses to other comments I think I figured it out.

I like the story.. a lot. But I think something like this would be better suited for a feature. The reveal at the end seemingly comes out of no where because it's never really made clear what Richard is capable of, or how far he's willing to go to get what he wants.

Yeah we have the awkward conversations, the half jokes about being Prime Minister, etc. But I think, rather than continuing to develop this as a short, you should expand it into a feature. A feature where we can really see Richard for the tragic character he is. Where we watch him do questionable things to get where he is. I feel like you could chronicle his relationship with his wife, and the birth of their child. And then towards the end of the second act, the baby is born and we understand why a "mongoloid" baby doesn't fit into Richard's goals for the future.

From there you can finish the movie as he becomes increasingly psychotic, contemptuous of his wife, and finally, he hires someone to off the baby and eff up his wife. I would hope that, in the third and act, he would get his comeuppance and lose everything.

Anyway, like I said, I really liked it, but I think it's an idea that would be better developed as a feature.

[lawriejaffa]

Thats interesting Blindbusta cheers for the review.

Yah ;) I know what im doing with this character though! The easy and obvious road would be to paint the guy with enough cracks that it makes sense that his character does what he does. Only problem is its so despicable that i think it would distort the 'facade' of kindness i want to paint for the man. Such is the impact of his crime (and nature) that it would take in terms of fictional expectation, a true and too obvious a villain 'for us to expect him to do it.'

My point, is that a man with the veneer of respectability, can (in a society that demands it - bearing in mind we're talking late 40s Britain... not USA) could go so far as to do this, for his own frigid vanity.

We only see the public self of this man where he's inserted himself in a vision of the future 'the new towns' but it is in the past, in the dark alleys we see his true self. In that way i don't think extending the story - seeing the guy slowly come down to the point he could do such a crime, would work as its a revelation when we learn what he is capable of (what i think we can all be sometimes) the jarring contrast.

It is not the dialogue before that sets it up, he explains his reasons to the killer - the only man he can tell, and of course there stupid, vain and ridiculous. Its the same reason many would have coerced young women into dangerous backstreet abortions to hide 'illigetimate' children... and cover ups of years past too.

Vanity and shame is something that often concerns us men - its quite an ego related thing! Its great blethering about these ideas - its all good and much appreciate your commentary!

[themightyshrub]

I liked this script. The gentle build up at the beginning was lovely, and although it read slightly slowly, I think it would be much better when it's shown visually. I guess some scripts are just better seen than read.

The end came as a shock to me. I agree with what you've said so far about not wanting to make it obvious at all about what this man was capable of, and I think it worked, the ending was shocking and it worked well.

There's only a couple of things I can pull you up on.

1) It could really have done with a setting written into the script. I hadn't read this thread before reading the script, and I was very confused about where/when the piece was set. It makes a lot more sense to me now I've read this thread, but it might have been better to just put "It is Glasgow, 1950" or something along those lines in the first paragraph, just so everybody knows exactly where and when it's happening.

2) Some of your dialogue is quite wooden. The most obvious example I could see is "Mr Anson, the delegation, least that's what they call themselves, is outside". This seems like a very odd way of structuring the sentence. Something like "Mr Anson, the 'delegation' is outside. Least, that's what they're calling themselves" There were a couple of other lines that I think could have been re-written to flow a bit better, but that was the one that stuck out the most.

3)SPOILER Richard walks into his house and is greeted by a policeman who informs him his wife has been attacked and his baby is missing. Almost immediately after this, his boss rings to say that the whole board has heard about the tragedy and has decided to confirm his promotion. Surely this means that they found out at least half an hour before Richard did? That doesn't make sense to me. I doubt the police would have telephoned his boss to tell him about it before they had told Richard, and there's definitely no way it could have got out into the press that fast, especially in the 50's.

Other than those little points, I really enjoyed the script. Had me guessing right until the end, and the way you built up the character was superb. Well done!

[lawriejaffa]

*ponders* Yep Heather your quite right! (A kind of light bulb flickered above my head reading your comments.) I'm certainly with ya on the visual comment, as a director/producer im not a natural writer and i can presume the reader sees how i would film it etc.

The rest of your comments I will take into account, writing in more of a setting will put the story/character actions and even dialogue into a better context. Some lines are a bit wooden, (that line you mention i had in mind was being said by quite a knarky looking/acting person) and its funny but without apt descriptions character descriptions lines can sound a bit off here or there so ill go over dialogue again. Finally regarding the police knowing - yeah i'll reconsider a bit how that happens - perhaps ill have it so the promotion is still up in the air (a little) and when our hero gets the news he himself calls his boss (in a way using whats happened to push for a sympathy vote but again in a way that doesnt make us guess too much!)

I'm glad you liked the story overall - im thinking of making this one for Lossfest - id love to see yours made for lossfest too!

[seansshack]

Good read. Few formatting issues - (Whispers) - (Pause) etc should be on a line of their own.

Should really describe the time of day in scene headings - i.e ##

EXT. TOWN HOUSE - DAY

AND

EXT. TENEMENT STREET, COBBLES, NIGHT.

Should be

EXT. COBBLED TENEMENT STREET - NIGHT

Think the character dialog needs the most work - read like the same person in parts (didn't hear that distinctive voice(s))

Top class and disturbing ending. Visually it would stay with you if produced and play on your mind later.

In all. Good job and good story.

[lawriejaffa]

Thanks mate cheers and yep i'll make those adjustments in the next draft - i'm always forgetting blooming day/night headers aieee. I'm hoping to produce this for Lossfest and as you describe about the ending that would be the intended effect (goodness knows how bad it would be if i screwed that up though!) lol

[Brandon Rice]

Whoa... first one I've read so far that actually gave me an emotional reaction... in my gut I felt sick at the end... the story is interesting, I think the setup is too long, and maybe can be trimmed. I also think some of the dialog is a little "spot on" for my taste...but that's a subjective thing...

Now, I actually don't like the script... though it's well written and a decent story, it is depressing and makes me feel sick... at least I think that's the reaction you wanted, and you got it.

[lawriejaffa]

Hey there Brandon,

Thanks for the review mate, yep ive had a couple o' comments about tweaking the dialogue and its on the shopping list now.

I mean guys like us, we've seen loads of movies that are good and bad / nice or horrible etc, we're not necessarily shocked by 'shock or shlock hehe' alone.

I wanted the horror at the end to have 'meaning' beyond say the crass gory macabre things you get.

Now not to be presumptious about you but as a man of some faith (I am somewhat myself) the point im trying to make in my story is not that the character is himself redempted (of course he is not, he's does a terrible thing) But that it highlights a point - and in this case its pride and the danger hitherto of.

Pride alone doesn't seem too scary, but its combination with other feelings is what gives that sword its edge. I always wonder with some christian stories told here - take Barn Dance for example, if we did not utilise the classic aritolean ending as (brechte would call it) or basically 'happy' ending - that if the ending we do not desire, makes us more attentive to the threat, to the danger or evil we describe.

In that sense i don't want the script ive written to be percieved as simply horror for horror's sake, but a dark depiction of cruellest vanity.

By adding changes / ideas recommended from the contest im definately going to produce this for Lossfest.

[Noel Evans]

Hey mate. Yes a rather shocking ending, but I love being shocked so worked well for me. On the dialogue, there are a few lines that probably could be tweaked in structure , but personally I liked the rigidity coming from Richard, it gave me the impression throughout something was up with him, and I wasnt at all surprised when the cops showed at which point I was thinking they have come to arrest him, he's done something, but of course had no idea how gruesome the act was.

What I think might work in this just thinking about it and reading your above post, is Murdoch alluding to the weight of what this post carries within the party, and all must be peaches and cream. Have an element of that pressure of appearances. Just a thought.

Initially I was a little unsure on location, so I think you could just structure it

FADE IN:

PLACE NAME 1948

EXT. ETC ETC

Also I when I visualise it, I cant tell that opening shot is a dream. Maybe he could be asleep behind his desk?

Sorry just making all these comments because I saw you wanted to shoot it. Typical of me to throw my opinion out there, so I'll get back on track.

Really liked it.

Can I just make a couple of small recommendations :P Try to keep -ing words out of action eg. "Richard, stands overlooking a vista of new modern homes." Richard overlooks etc etc. THis is really nitpicky. And being Australian with a Prime Minister , PRIMINISTER stood out a lot to me. But, small things.

Hope you do shoot it and cant wait to watch it. Im a bit DO'H though, cause when I do watch it visually, I'll already know the end :P

EDIT: Forgot to add, I liked the pacing of this, really worked for me. It felt nice and subtle.

[lawriejaffa]

Hey Noel mate cheers for the review and feedback much appreciate it! Was looking forward to yours too ;)

Yep, its weird because the dialogue does need some adjusting but of course there all very official - very conservative speakers as well. So there meant to be stuffy - but thats just style, the feedback ive got has really helped give me ideas to add more focus on the dialogue to building up the suspense.

So yep your quite right, Murdoch is the ideal device for adding more intensity to the need for Richard to be er perfect as it were - so definately going to add that in.

Quite right with the location titles, dream and other bits too (a bit sloppy on my part!) Yep so i'll get that all fixed up! If i do make it i'll just have to hope folks are too scarred to tell others the ending aieee.

(oh and thanks about the -ings recommendation on action lines) im terrible for that!

[MiataFilmSomething]

What I didn't like about this script - The guy totally got off scott free and didn't get what he deserved.

What I did like about this script - The guy totally got off scott free and didn't get what he deserved....

What a great enjoyment out of the frustration of seeing this guy walk. Oh man, we want to see him get caught so bad. But he's not. Unconventional, and that's what makes it good.

I'll admit, I didn't like this as much at first, but then when I thought about it again, it had a certain spark to it that made me appriciate it. Well done.

[lawriejaffa]

Cheers man glad you liked it, we do see the guy ruined by guilt - in a way i want to get across that he's done that monstrous crime out of percieved (not real) helplesness.

Yep I mean im certainly not just out to make the audience miserable (yeah right eh) but to create a tragedy (our lead is a tragic figure too, as his neurosis of the times he lives in and its values and his career) make him act in the most unspeakable manner.

I like to think of it as a question of dark conscience (why we neaver identify the killer as a character - is he really there at all etc.)

I am by nature a grim idealist, but reading it myself i obviously want the cops to grab him/ for the baby not to have died etc. I think that kind of ending however relieves us of thinking about the crime and our relation to the guys motives. I've acted negatively at times in the pursuit of something (never good) we all do sometimes, and in this case we see it taken to the horrific extreme. In that case and in all cases the consequences are inevitable (to whatever extent) which is why i didn't want to hit the audience with the 'happy ending' aieee

[alex whitmer]

Review for Red Rope

This …

Richard, stands overlooking a vista of new modern homes. It
is the late 1940s, but here we see the future. Bauhaus
concrete constructions and glass towers.

*Not sure how we know it’s the 40s just by looking at this scene. Bauhaus and other period architecture is still around,

Maybe …

DREAM SEQUENCE – 1940s

EXT. HILLTOP – DAY

I’m unsure if the dream is in the 40s, or what. I am sure it will be revealed, but the opening scene has me scratching my head.

Or is this just a ‘vision’? How Richard hoped things will be in the future?

This …

Richard rises to shake their hands.

Richard would likely already be standing to receive guests.

Page 2, This …

Well my cat - she won’t know no
new streets Mr. Anson, she’ll get
lost!

*Is this supposed to be an uneducated speak, or a typo?

This …

‘Margaret’

*Not sure why names are in quotes.

This …

Mike grins. Richard goes into his desk drawer and produces
leaflets.

‘produces’ can be read a few ways, like runs them off a printer? I’d use exact verbs. And on that note, why even have them in a drawer?

Here again …

The couple take the leaflets and depart. Margaret stops at
the door.

*‘Depart’ and ‘stops at the door’ are not in sync. I’d say ‘head for the exit, stop at the door’ or something like that.

This …

Little David! Everyone knows
about him Mr. Anson!

*I’d leave out the name in this one.

And here again …

JULIE
And your wife Mr. Anson? How is
she?

*It doesn’t come off as natural.

Page 3, This

EXT.TOWN HALL
Murdoch and Richard depart the building and drive off.

*Drive off in or on what?

It reads like they just levitate. Maybe …

EXT.TOWN HALL
Murdoch and Richard depart the building, jump into a (?) car, and drive off.

*Up to know I’ve made the assumption this is all DAY.

Page 4, This …

EXT. CAR, DISTANT NEW TOWN.

* I’d put

EXT. HIGHWAY

They drive toward a new town in the distance.

By new town do you mean suburbs, tall buildings, ?

Then add …

EXT. HILLTOP – DAY

From here start your next scene (I am assuming this is the same vista point in the opening dream?).

This …

Me... I’m old...
I’m cobblestone and brick, your
concrete and asphalt.

*Typo, should be ‘you’re concrete … ?

This …

MURDOCH
Well... let me retire first
Richard *chuckles* one promotion
at a time! (pause) You will go
far young man.

*Directions buried in dialogue are often overlooked, or read as dialogue. An actor would need to stop and sort this out.

Try …

MURDOCH
Well... let me retire first, Richard .
(chuckles)
One promotion at a time!
(beat)
You will go far young man.

This …

My biggest pet-peeve …

we see Richard heading up to the door
*Once you use ‘we’, you sucks your reader out of their solo journey through your story and sticks them on tour bus. Don’t use it.


Cont ...

[alex whitmer]

Cont ...

Page 5, This …

RICHARD
Who are?

*I assume this means broken speech. Try …

RICHARD
Who are …

This …

Richard sits, face cupped in his hands. Inspector is
talking.

*This is followed by the Inspector’s dialogue. I think you mean these actions are happening at the same time. In that case, try …

Richard sits with his face cupped in his hands, as …

INSPECTOR
Bla, bla, bla

This …

Richard takes it, revealing his grief stricken face, he
sips gently.

I’d be asking where my wife is.

This …

MURDOCH V.O
Your promotion is confirmed
Richard... the board was informed
of what has happened... it moved
all of us... we pray your son is
returned unharmed.

How did the vote happen so fast, and how did Murdoch know about the missing child?

Page 6, This …

The contrast could not be greater. We are amidst ruinous
tenements and decrepit cobble stone streets. Emerging from
the winding alleys we see Richard staggering out from the
inky blackness, eyes sore, bottle dangling from his hand.

Creeping quietly, Richard avoids the glaring street lamps
as he makes his way into a black alley.

*Couple issues here.

*In contrast to what? Where we just were? Not sure you need to even say that. The visuals will make it clear.

*You have Richard stumble out of the ‘inky blackness’ of an alley, only to ‘make his way’ into an alley.

*Use of ‘we’.

Try ...

Ruinous tenements and decrepit cobbled streets. Richard staggers toward an inky black alley, his eyes sore, a bottle dangling from his hand. He avoids the glaring street lamps.

Richard hesitates, then steps into the alley, sinks into the black.

54 words down to 39 to say the same thing. 15 less words your readers and production crew need to sort through.

No need to go so bare-bone every time, but always keep an economy of words in mind.

This …

There, alone in the darkness, he waits. Just meters away a
match flashes as a cigarette is lit. There, a dark capped
FIGURE, shuffles forward awkwardly, it’s face swathed in
shadow. Richard turns to the figure slowly and expectantly.

You use ‘there’ twice. Feels clumsy.

This …

The figure steps closer to the light,

What light?

Page 7

The big dialogue by Richard comes off as a little expositional. I think the ‘figure’ would have known those things anyways.

Well, pretty heavy ending. Like it a lot.

I think this story would benefit more from Richard and his wife together, instead of with disgruntled clients. That would make this crime far more glaring. Or --maybe better yet a phone call from his wife while in Richard is in the office, he looks at her photo, something to let the audience know the victim. At this point I know nothing of her, and I don’t feel any sense of loss.

I’m going to give it another read.

a

[lawriejaffa]

Masterful criticism there Alex, your definately a good step ahead of me on the actual art of screenwriting! In any case i'll take your comments and get implementing some of that advice.

I think when you regularly produce/direct your own writing its easy to get sloppy as well (im terrible for that!)

All the little points you've made I'll also take into account in my next script as well - im really delighted that you took the time to give such a detailed response - so *lifts hat* kudos to you my fair lady ;)

[preston]

well that's what is so cool about these fests - they're more like workshops where we can give and get feedback from a small group of fellow aspiring screenwriters.
if you have some extra time (yeah right, what is that!? haha), check out some of the reviews from scriptfest II - Alex was very thorough in reviewing the tech/format parts of all the entries...

ps- my review for Red Rope is coming soon... i just keep running out of time! soon, though...

[jamiejay]

i think it's a disturbing concept and one that will get an emotional reaction. it's a great topic.

i can't say i was too shocked though, because i could feel it coming.

i would have loved to see the mom and the baby ahead of time to have an emotional connection to the situation. it would be even more disturbing if he played with the baby, ate breakfast with his wife, and kissed them goodbye that morning knowing what was going to happen to them the whole time. that would be pretty sick and maybe throw off some of the people like me who guess endings.

i agree with some of the previous criticisms about the dialogue and the typos and the scene headings, but i am still learning too, so i can't really say much. i can see you really enjoy writing and it was good to read your work. :)

[lawriejaffa]

Yah couldnt agree more Preston - it is like a workshop and so are the film fests, thats why im really eager to get one in for Lossfest - hopefully this script!

Jamiejay cheers for the feedback - but I just had to add there that in actual fact i don't really enjoy writing! lol i know this will sounds nuts but normally i produce and direct, while i LOVE writing as in imagining stories - i really in terms of actually sitting and writing a script er don't so much like it. I find I'm somewhat anxious and self critical when writing - im not one of those folk that could ever do it to relax! It has the opposite effect on me hrmph.

You could feel the end coming? (well thats good) id love to instill some dread in the matter. The dialogue could do with some adjustment but the style isn't too off i think (for stuffy british folk like me except in the civil service from the 1950s) but certainly it could 'do more'.

Um now I definately would not want to add a scene with the wife and kid etc, and theres a great reason why not too as i think it would become another story.

My thinking is that if we saw the wife and kid, and the guy acts nice - then he would appear like a complete psycho for what he does (much like the suburban serial killer almost...) The contrast is one of the main characters conscience and his surroundings. The death of the baby and mutilation of the wife are circumstantial consequences of ones mans failure to embrace humility. In doing what he does he destroys himself - but in seeing what he destroys... blissful scenes - it just becomes too easy... it becomes about them... about what appears to be insanity.

It also takes away the nihilistic aspect that i realyl want to retain. Not to get too freudian (and its presumptious to say) but i think there is motive in wanting to see past scenes, as it helps craft a picture of insanity (that makes our acceptance of the character on our own terms, easier.) But the point is that we don't get that psychological closure, we don't get that full picture, we are confronted with this element of torture and despair, and there is no closure.

[Russell Moore]

I have to admit, I did not see the ending coming and thats why I liked it.
I won't issue the dialogue, format issues in detail. More knowledgable people than I have already done so.

I think you have a good story here. My only issue at the end when he gives his motivation for what he's done. Maybe if he hadn't already received the promotion and then he gets the call (which maybe should come the next day) for the promotion. Even if Murdoch were unsure about his promotion earlier...I still certainly wouldn't have thought he was going to have his baby killed. But I'd have seen the result of it in the end when he gets promoted.

But I like the atmosphere you created it helps heighten the shock of what he does at the end. It made me feel. Creepy good story.

[lawriejaffa]

Yo Conlan thanks for the review mate - glad you liked it, and yep i think you would probably have to be a paranoid neurotic to guess the ending (at least in its full magnitude of horribleness!)

How did you think it was going to end if you didn't see it coming - did you have any alternative endings in mind! :)

Yep good point you make about the promotion - someone else also mentioned perhaps adding more importance to the need for the candidate for promotion being otherwise 'perfect.'

Certainly i tried to put across the idea that nobody has seen the baby yet (and maybe that needs to be more obvious) so that we get a hint of a secret that our lead is keeping. As the point is that if the baby was discovered then our lead thinks it would damage his prospects for future promotions there-after etc.

Of course even in a society where appearances were everything, where girls would have backstreet abortions for the fear of ostracising in society... such a crime as the one this chap commits would have been abhorred by all! It is an utterly selfish act, as is the permanent mutilation of his wife.

Yet the story is about our man - his desperation to be part of a brave future yet futile to escape the prejudices of the past. He is the 'victim' (of course the baby by circumstance) but it is him we see getting destroyed - by himself.

The remenants of the infant corpse is the remenants of his humanity. // forgive the typos in my post!

[jamiejay]

not sure if that would make me a paranoid neurotic... haha... but it wasn't an obvious ending by any means, and i hope you didn't think i was saying that. it's just that i've come to expect a twist, i guess... and it is called red rope, and your tag line did mention a dead baby... so between those things and the fact that the main character seemed to be more interested in his work than in his wife and kid and something odd was definitely going on... you see what i mean...

but it's an interesting and gruesome subject, and, unfortunately, too often a reality.

whether or not you enjoy writing, it seems like you do and that's a good thing. :)

in response to your response about not wanting the wife and baby seen earlier, i see what you're saying. i guess i just wanted to feel more of a sense of loss, like alex said. but not seeing them ahead of time does almost belittle their importance just as the main character seems to belittle their importance in the grand scheme of things. neat.

it definitely poses some interesting questions and stirs up good discussion. :beer:

[lawriejaffa]

Hey there mate! I was only kidding about the paranoid neurotic - though i er didn't even make my jokey remark very clear doh.

I was referring more to how impossible it would be to guess (i think) the particular 'extent' of his crime unless one was as paranoid and neurotic (and perverse) as me probably! I think personally speaking (this is speculative) that if i was reading this script, that i would suspect that we're going to find out something about this 'wife and baby' and with the cops, id probably guess this must have something to do with our lead.

What i hope works with the revelation is less that he is connected, or that he is even the cause - but that it is the 'reason' and his justification - and hopefully in his somewhat theatrical monologue the irony of his er intentions (and of his pillar of society type stuff) despite the nature of his crime.

Not having the wife and baby does belittle their importance as 'characters' but thats fine as in this story they are not really characters (we never see/speak to them anyway) they serve as demonstrations simply of what this man would sacrifice for his own ambition (and in doing so destroying himself.)

And so the point is this (for this particular script of mine)

The emotional reaction I want is repulsion - and to attach that to an element of social commentary (revealed by our leads monologue.) I'm calculating that there is enough 'loss' for the baby based simply on our predisposition to babies anyway (without us needing a scene with it.)

But the readers emotional attachment to two characters - the wife and kid, is not necessary for the scripts social point to be made, so i think trying to develop that takes away from the 'intellectual' objective and goes more towards the emotional/cathartic result. Which i think would lead to melodrama in this case especially given how dramatic the ending is already - and worse may make our character look too much like a psycho in the hollwood suburban sense (one day a perfectly normal husband...) - worse, it could make people think i was just being sadistic in my writing - ie. setting up this perfect family just to destroy them -

Let the world be brutal - no family breakfast scene necessary to make us cry when they die because there not the point as it were.

// Oh a short film with a script WAY BETTER than anything i could consider - that plays with this idea, is called World of Glory - definately definately worth checking out.

[lawriejaffa]

Hey someone rated my thread - thanks - ive no idea how to rate others - but id rate them a 5!

As this is the last day just wanted to thank everyone that took the time to read/review my script - feedback totally appreciated, and as you know i've returned the favour and reviewed everyone elses scripts.

Theres at least half a dozen of them that i would love the honour of producing! Its been great and i wish good luck to all the entries!

[alex whitmer]

I thought Sunday was the last day. I'm screwed if it's today

[lawriejaffa]

Eek sorry Alex my mistake - i think your right it might be Sunday! Sorry - sorry false alarm!

So in my process of figuring out thread ratings i saw the magic stars and went ooh whats this and then... accidentally rated my thread a 3! Booo a crappy 3! Well that will teach me!

[preston]

hey you can adjust the ratings... or at least i can.

[lawriejaffa]

Ah don't sweat it Preston, just a comical way for my films feedback thread to end - in a discussion about my internet stupidity!

Anyway i've reviewed alllll the film scripts - i hope you have too preston if you have time to reply to what are probably the most stupid posts ive made in this thread hehe

[preston]

haha almost... i have one or two left.
i'm a big time-waster.

[Horncastle]

I enjoyed this script very much and have enjoyed reading the thread too - it's been a good and informative discussion. I especially like the idea of Richard being divided between the old and the new and I appreciate the reasoning (and also the difficulty) in not making this a clear cut "good wins out" script. There are some slips in screen writing technique, but these have been covered. I would add two things:

1. The Dream sequence right at the beginning doesn't really hit home. This is a writing problem since it might be fine filmed, but you speak of Richard as though we already know who he is but only introduce him in the following scene. Richard comma right at the beginning and the use of "we" don't help either.

2. Maybe more important if you are going to produce this: Richard's long last paragraph of dialogue at the top of page 7 didn't convince me. It felt like you were trying to explain the ending rather than give us Richard's real dialog. In any case, I question how much a man of Richard's social standing (and in his position) would feel it appropriate or wise to say so much to this "figure" (who was presumably a low-life criminal he'd hired). I understand you want to keep Richard complex - he's done a terrible deed but he's also truly grief-stricken and not quite himself, but wouldn't his rigid upringing and class conciousness mean that he didn't feel he needed to justify himself to this man? The things in that paragraph (upstanding member of the community, freak, mongoloid, prospects, scandal ...) all need to be said or shown, and I understand why you don't want to put them in earlier, but I do think they are too much for that dialog.

Nonetheless, I did very much enjoy this and do think it has a lot of possibilities. I look forward to watching it in Lossfest if you do make it.
Jason

[lawriejaffa]

Hey Jason cheers for the insight there yep you raise good points of course (the real murderer we don't see, but he has a bullet shaped head and a beard! Nooo not that nice Captain of the Mersey Mabel hehe! One of my favs - are you making that!?)

The dream sequence definately needs work, atm its a total wasted opportunity and truth for that is - i kinda whacked it on crudely. In my revised version I will be working on that - keeping it short still but adding more depth.

Though just a bit more colourful than i would do hehe... one of my fab British directors was great at dream sequences, he's not often mentioned on these boards either!

Ken Russell, and heres a dream seqence for his movie the 'Music Lovers' about Tchaikovsky (abandoning/escaping key folk in his life and getting exploited-ish) Maybe just something a little like this to make our guy seem/feel like he's top of the world - before plunging him into reality.
http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=vO31n8sy0r0

Yah the long paragraph of Richard's is pure theatre of course - (no in melodrama as we often confuse with theatrical performance!) But in technique. Its the true story onto itself. On the other hand I don't want it too jar too far from naturalism (i don't mind it veering off quite a bit though as the story does.)

When performed i imagine the monologue delivered with quite, high tempo fury... with disdain towards the killer (As if he is ignorant for asking - but also with a desperation for the hopelessness for the situation.) Its interesting what you say about class, because of coruse we do have Richard as the er ultimate middle class type figure (Murdoch as upperclass) and the killer as well (we can't say working class// but be that metaphorical or more so an underclass.)

However despite the 'power' Richard might have, he can't do whats needed, and in that sense his class as to the power it might give him is irrelevant. In a way he's the killers bitch at the end (which is why the killer also taunts him by showing him the dead baby despite his plea not to see.) That is truly the symbol of Richards powerlessness.

Oh just cos im blethering still, despite his class - his monologue is more to himself (its rhetorical almost) its more a pyschological justification to himself than say an expositional outline to the murderer (and audience) - at least its supposed to be (and er ok it just happens to conveniently answer some points of motive too hehe.)

So, ill experiment with the end speech maybe even pen a couple of versions - definately we don't want to 'see it' - imagine that a dream like montage noooo. We have to keep our poor audience in the dark alley... with some psycho kid murderer, a father sick enough to have an infant strangled and a dead baby. Hopefully if the power of that scene can be realised, then they'll be an energy there that makes the power of the monologues 'revelation' work.

Yeah well i wrote it with Lossfest in mind - we need more british entries!

[Nektonic]

I thought that you had one of the biggest character arcs in the fest. The positive optimistic dream and the winning personality that Richard exudes in the beginning counterpointed with his dark side reveal and the end was very dramatic.

Richard's motivation was selfish, but it made sense for the story. Great job in creating a very two-sided character.

I guess the main thing I would like to see is more suspense being ratched up during Act 2. I wanted to see the police investigate and some misdirection as to who the killer was so that when it is revealed that it is Richard, it is all the more shocking and powerful.

I would like to see some more of Richard's seemingly inevitable wonderful life of wealth and influence so that we can understand more why he would want his deformed child murdered. It seems an awful risk to do something like that if he already has such a successful job and position in his community. Does he really fear that having a deformed child will keep him from rising through the ranks in his profession? Wouldn't the cops think it was him immediately? Of course, as we all know from hearing about these kinds of killings on the news, the saying "truth is sometimes stranger than fiction" might apply in this case.

Maybe they nab someone else who had a prior record, or it ends up that Richard framed someone in the town. The police take this poor soul off to jail and then it could be revealed that Richard and his accomplice were responsible for the murder.

Also, it was a little vague as to whether Richard was an architect or a city planner.

This was well written though. Your writing flowed well and I was able to visualize things easily. Maybe my above demands are too much for a 10 page script, but I think you have the building blocks of something longer if you wanted to expand things.

All in all an interesting, compelling, and darkly enjoyable read with a shocker of an ending. Hats off to you lad.

[lawriejaffa]

Hey there Nektonic - thanks for the review mon amie and jeez you did well reviewing so much on the final day!!! Yep Richard is selfish, he's more the middle class bureacrat (very typical for us brits) than say a wealthy man. Often cases money alone doesnt penetrate the differences either in classicism that exists here too (and everywhere to different extents.)

I definately agree now on the need to build more suspense - so i'll be looking at that for the ol' script revisions!

Yep I can see your confused a wee bit about why he would murder his deformed child - its something a wee bit more 'presumable' in vague understanding - probably for british audiences. (Maybe not but necessarily.)

The idea is that this guy is ashamed of the baby being deformed and believes it will hamper his prospects - it is a prejudice he has rooted in an almost victorian sense of respectability and perfection.

It's the same kind of shame that would lead also to countless backstreet abortions - these exceptions to normal society - the deformed, the illegitimate would be exiled socially, politically in every which way!

The irony here is that society is on the cusp of change - we see it with the new town (and the UK was changing fast in the late 40s, early 50s) but people were pulled between the old and new worlds...

Sadly its not such a case that the truth is stranger than fiction, but that this kind of thing was faaaaaar more common than you probably would like to imagine!!! They drained a pond in the city of London and it was found littered with dozens of baby carcasses from dangerous back street abortions that occured during ww2 (from affairs with service men)

Now... why imperil your life to go through that... the horror of that - for the fear of social ostracising? The same reason some would murder their own borne.

In that sense its probably not to the films purpose that we should find out whether Richard gets caught or not (the presumption is - that he won't be.) On the contrary the cops would also probably think it was ANYONE but him. Not the respectable Richard Anson!

[Nektonic]

Yep I can see your confused a wee bit about why he would murder his deformed child - its something a wee bit more 'presumable' in vague understanding - probably for british audiences. (Maybe not but necessarily.)

The idea is that this guy is ashamed of the baby being deformed and believes it will hamper his prospects - it is a prejudice he has rooted in an almost victorian sense of respectability and perfection.

It's the same kind of shame that would lead also to countless backstreet abortions - these exceptions to normal society - the deformed, the illegitimate would be exiled socially, politically in every which way!

The irony here is that society is on the cusp of change - we see it with the new town (and the UK was changing fast in the late 40s, early 50s) but people were pulled between the old and new worlds...

Sadly its not such a case that the truth is stranger than fiction, but that this kind of thing was faaaaaar more common than you probably would like to imagine!!! They drained a pond in the city of London and it was found littered with dozens of baby carcasses from dangerous back street abortions that occured during ww2 (from affairs with service men)

Wow. I didn't know about the historical basis you were inspired by. That is some dark and scary stuff. Isn't there a film about the whole secret abortion thing during World War II? Vera Drake is the title I think. I haven't seen it yet. I'll have to check it out. Gee, what a great idea for holiday viewing. Maybe I can take it to the family Christmas party? Ok. Not a good idea.

I think this concept is something you might be able to work into your script. Maybe have the guy who killed Richard's baby throw the infant's body into a pond in the center of town. Then FADE TO BLACK. A little silence and a few seconds pass. The audience thinks that the film is over. But where are the end credits? That's when you FADE IN to the same shot, same scene but in the present day and the pond is being drained. The bodies of these murdered and aborted babies are then found. I think that would be a potent ending that would contrast Richard's optimistic dream from the opening scene.

Just a suggestion. You might already have thought of this. Maybe it would be confusing to the audience. They might ask, who and where did all these other babies come from?