Anyone using Premiere Pro CS4?

[Tcap]

Was thinking of picking this up with student discount for 350. It claims to work with AVCHD, though Adobe is a little late to the scene.


Tonycap

[Thomas Lew]

what? they're the first to the scene if anything lol. Only program that can do avchd natively

[Tcap]

what? they're the first to the scene if anything lol. Only program that can do avchd natively

I didn't know they were first to the scene with AVCHD native editing. I always thought it was Sony Vegas and Pinnacle.. hehe excuse me for the ignorance.lol

[David Jimerson]

No one's using CS4, because it's not released yet.

But I was a beta tester, and it works very well with HMC150 footage.

[Mike Harvey]

Tcap... CS4 will edit AVCHD natively. However, it doesn't ship until around October 29th, so I wouldn't expect too many people to have a lot of experiance with it yet.

That said, I'm on CS3, and made the jump to it from Pinnacle and haven't regretted it. You will however need a beefy quadcore machine for it to not be sluggish when editing AVCHD I'm told.

*EDIT* Oops... David posted right as I did

[Tcap]

Ahhh, Ok so October 29th it is! Thanks so much. I have a quadcore Q6600 2.4ghz but may upgrade to a quad extreme cpu. I have essentially 4 GPU's with combination of 4 gigs of video ram in the 2 Ati 4870x2's i have in this system. I wonder If i need a better single video card for video editing purposes. My other option is to try a Macpro 8 core. I have a macbook pro 17 with 4 gigs of ram and dual core 2.4ghz that hasnt seen any video editing due to only using it for Protools. Might try final cut on it.

Tonycap

[kurtmo]

I edit on a Dual Core with Sony Vegas. Editing isn't sluggish. Of course, more muscle is always helpful when rendering out.

[GreekStudios]

I've installed Mainconcept HD pro3 and tried editing AVCHD in premiere pro cs3, it will not play in real time and I have an AMD quadcore 2.2ghz

[MadJava]

No one's using CS4, because it's not released yet.

But I was a beta tester, and it works very well with HMC150 footage.


Hi David,

First time poster, and I'm learning alot about the HMC 150 from these threads. Thanks to all who've posted experiences/impressions, pics and screen grabs, and footage from the camera!

I'm also curious about CS4 running AVCHD files, and CS4 being able to export those files so I can burn SD-DVDs. Anyone have experience with that?

I'm still running CS2, as I didn't feel I needed to jump to CS3 for our current workflow. This might change as we buy our first pro HD camera (currently own the HV30, but use it mostly for home movies, vacation, etc.).

Best,

--JA

[David Jimerson]

With a fast, modern machine, I was getting real time from the AVCHD. I haven't tried to burn any DVDs with it, but I don't see why it would appreciably different from making DVDs from other types of footage.

[Mike Harvey]

David and Kurt, what kind of CPUs are/were you guys editing with?

[pgovotsos]

what? they're the first to the scene if anything lol. Only program that can do avchd natively

Wrong. Edius has done native AVCHD for at least 2 major revisions. Unless, of course, that was sarcasm that I missed.

Panagiotis

[pjlefe]

I just installed it this afternoon and am fooling around with AVCHD files that Barry uploaded. I ordered my camera last week but am having second thoughts now.

So far it is very painful. I've had it crash twice and the two files I am using are just a minute or so long. Perhaps I am doing something wrong, I'm still fooling around with it.

[matt s.]

Pjlefe is your computer up to spec?

[pjlefe]

Point me at the spec and I'll let you know.

It's my high end laptop which edits my DVCPRO HD P2 stuff with no problem. If editing avchd takes that much horsepower to edit a 4 second clip then by all means this is not for me.

I have not tried transcoding or converting anything, this is all just using the native avchd files in CS4.

[Mike Harvey]

Point me at the spec and I'll let you know.

CPU? Memory? OS?

[pjlefe]

It's an HP Pavillion DV9700 notebook

CPU=Intel Core2Duo, 2.5ghz
OS=Vista
Memory=4gb

I realize it's not a high end editing station, however it's been more than enough for my HVX200 P2 footage and a lot of my editing takes place in the field where I am working with clips 5 mins or less then encoding them to a web format and uploading them to a website for real-time video broadcasting. I figured since I am dealing with small and short clips it should be good enough. Not sure that was a correct assumption.

Pat

[MitchLewis]

Apple's free iMovie edits AVCHD.

http://www.apple.com/ilife/imovie/

[pjlefe]

It's so bad I just canceled my order for the cam on BH. It's frankly, unbearable.

I am going to stick with DVCPROHD for now. Pat

[Hidef1080]

It's an HP Pavillion DV9700 notebook

CPU=Intel Core2Duo, 2.5ghz
OS=Vista
Memory=4gb

I realize it's not a high end editing station, however it's been more than enough for my HVX200 P2 footage and a lot of my editing takes place in the field where I am working with clips 5 mins or less then encoding them to a web format and uploading them to a website for real-time video broadcasting. I figured since I am dealing with small and short clips it should be good enough. Not sure that was a correct assumption.

Pat


Sounds a lot like the boat I'm in – editing on site, “short” clips, Vista, Duo core2 with 4 gigs of ram.


I'm not sure I understood, but are you saying that you have CS4 and you are crashing when you work with native AVCHD on your system?


I'm thinking about my next move right now and I'm wondering if I need to move up to quad core and Vista 64bit... I mean I know this should be better all the way around but if I can squeeze “livable” performance out of my current system then I would hold off on the move to 64bit Vista... If not then I'll just transcode until sometime in March and upgrade my post setup then.

[pjlefe]

The crashing happened when the program would freeze up (it was trying to display motion but was bogged down) and I clicked a couple of other things. You basically need to simply wait for the program to catch up and not click anything else. That is what caused the crash. But that happened all the time and hell, I was just dealing with 10 secs of footage.

CS4 works fine. I edited a 10 minute clip using DVCPROHD, but when editing the (2) 5 second clips that Barry Green provided under AVCHD the system chokes up. I had read about the editing issues but frankly thought they would be exhibited when editing a 30 minute timeline, not one that is 10 seconds.

64 bit Vista may work quite well, CS4 can take advantage of the beefed up ram and threading. But the system I am on is way too inadequate for any real editing. My 2c.

[Hidef1080]

Hey!
Thanks for your 2 cents because that answers a major question I had.

[PJ Sullivan]

Hi - appreciate any advice on my pending purchase of a HMC 150.

I’ve wanted to upgrade for over a year from my SD miniDV consumer JVC to a high-def camcorder to better record my kids’ sports (they are middle-school age.) The HMC150 has the specs I’ve been waiting for -- 60p, 3ccd, good in low light (as basketball courts can be poorly lit), decent zoom (hopefully 13x optical is enough for entire soccer field end-to-end, since ideally I was hoping for a 20x), & affordable (relatively) -- so I’d like to order it today to have it by the weekend.

My workflow is basically record the hour of action at a game, and watch back on TV with the kids at some point (hdmi output is a plus), fast-forwarding thru the slow parts. Additionally I’d like to take the 5 minutes of highlights from each game (so happy to have the 150’s index function) and at season’s end create Blu-ray disk for the other parents. (maybe add some effects like captions and slow motion). The coach has also wondered if I could post any clips to youtube for him. (So in other words, I have no plans to shoot the next Great American documentary, at least not this year.)

I think I’m making a good purchase for my needs based on the other threads (great forums here at DVXuser, by the way) -- although correct me if anyone thinks otherwise. But now after reading this thread I’ve got two concerns that I hope the group can address:

A) Should I need to pay $1300 for a new copy of CS4 standard when its released Nov7 to accomplish my workflow? What other choice would handle my needs for less money? (Something called Vaio Movie Story came loaded on my PC.)

B) I’m crestfallen to think my 9month old PC is undermanned since I bought it to make sports vids with, but from what I’m reading here do I have enough computing power now? (Intel Core2 Duo 2.2Ghz, 2GB RAM 667Mhz, Blu-ray read/write drive, Vista Ultimate.)http://www.amazon.com/Sony-VGC-LT19U-Desktop-Processor-Ultimate/dp/B000W3WM06/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8&s=electronics&qid=1224607160&sr=1-2 (http://www.amazon.com/Sony-VGC-LT19U-Desktop-Processor-Ultimate/dp/B000W3WM06/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8&s=electronics&qid=1224607160&sr=1-2)
Thanks in advance for any advice.

[Ed Kishel]

this is the most affordable solution:

http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/536041-REG/Sony_VP8Q_Vegas_Pro_8_Video.html#features

when you install and then update to 8.0c, you can edit HMC150 files natively. Drag-Drop-Edit. You can then burn a Blu-Ray disc right from the timeline. I installed it just last night and within 5 minutes I was editing the AVCHD files with no transcoding needed.

B&H has some special arrangement with Sony to offer Vegas Pro at this price. Be aware though this version does not include DVD Architect, which you will need for menu driven Blu-Ray discs.

For that the price goes up big time:
http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/523079-REG/Sony_VP8DVDPRO1_Vegas_Pro_8_Video.html

Vegas does not need the high PC specs that CS4 will need, which should run on your machine just fine.

[matt s.]

Edweirdo what are your computers specs? Does the editing go smoothly?

Im a Mac user but am looking for a cheaper easier solution for native avchd editing and was thinking CS4 but would consider Vegas and a lesser powerful computer if it works well.

thanks for anymore info.

[PJ Sullivan]

Thats a great answer Edweirdo. I probably want the DVD architect available just in case, but $470 is digestable. I'll download the trial version to make sure.

[Ed Kishel]

Intel Core 2 Quad 9450
Asus P5E3 Mobo
4 GB DDR3
700W PS
Geforce 9600GT 1GB DDR3
1 1TB Sata II Capture Drive
1 500GB Sata II Render Drive
1 500GB Sata II Audio Drive
1 500GB Sata II System Drive
XP SP3

I only spent about 1 hr last night editing, so far pretty smooth. Playback without filters is RT, with filters it drops to about 16 fps, which is average for HD. The real test is a project with several AVCHD timelines w/color correction and using multiple audio tracks.

I bought the Manfrotto Focus controller which set me back $300 so I will be holding off on PPro CS4 upgrade for a bit. Vegas will suit me just fine until then :)

[Ed Kishel]

Thats a great answer Edweirdo. I probably want the DVD architect available just in case, but $470 is digestable. I'll download the trial version to make sure.

good idea, the demo is good for 30 days- plenty of time to put it through its paces with the 150.

[David Jimerson]

I have the same hardware as Edweirdo (but the 9800 GTX card); runs beautifully.

[matt s.]

thanks Edweirdo and David. I was looking at building a similar system.

one question can you export quicktime files out of vegas for use with mac system?

[pjlefe]

Downloading the trial and then downloading the sample clips available on this site is an excellent idea. I wish I had done it as my CS3 worked perfectly and I only upgraded to CS4 to get AVCHD. Now I wish I had saved he upgrade fee.

Good luck - I hope it works out well for everyone. I was completely sold on the 150 until I dropped the clips into a timeline on my laptop. I agree, the specs of the camera are perfect for my needs to, but remote editing is a critical need and it was just not feasible.

[shrigg]

Downloading the trial and then downloading the sample clips available on this site is an excellent idea. I wish I had done it as my CS3 worked perfectly and I only upgraded to CS4 to get AVCHD. Now I wish I had saved he upgrade fee.

Good luck - I hope it works out well for everyone. I was completely sold on the 150 until I dropped the clips into a timeline on my laptop. I agree, the specs of the camera are perfect for my needs to, but remote editing is a critical need and it was just not feasible.

I downloaded the CS4 trial and Premiere crashed my Macbook Pro pretty hard when I dropped my sprinkler a clips into a timeline and tried to play it and scrub around a little. Pretty discouraging... I will do some more testing and report back when I return from this shoot. w

[douchebro]

I am having huge issues with CS4. When compared to using the Main Concept plugin with CS3, CS4 is:
Slower to load
Slower to conform/index clips
Cannot for the life of it playback footage in realtime - 1 frame per 3 seconds
Clips glitch at the beginning and sometimes throughout parts of the clip

CS3 doesn't have any of these problems mentioned above whatsoever. The only reason I want to upgrade to CS4 was for the extra RAM which would've given me a speed boost.... Not a decrease.

This is all off a fresh install of Vista64 with all the latest drivers. My system is a Q9550 o/c stable at 3.4ghz, 4gb Geil Ram, 320 + 500g HDD, 8800gt.

Hopefully this issue is resolved as being able to utilise 4gig+ of ram is a huge bonus for me!

[pjlefe]

That is the exact same issue that I experienced with the AVCHD clips. Maybe it's CS4 that is the problem, but my DVCPROHD stuff runs perfectly. Is this just happening with the AVCHD clips or other formats as well?

[MrFluffy]

I just installed the CS4 master collection and the downloaded clips seem to open and play ok (although not at native speed). This PC is a 3.2Gig PentiumD (2 cores) with 3gb of ram on XP. Drives are not that fast.

So far Premier Pro and After Effects seem to work. Tomorrow I will load it on my main production X64 system with 16GB of ram and 8 cores to see how it goes. I'll coment again after I've had a play with that.

[mgilbert]

I keep checking this thread because I had been looking forward to the 150 and CS4. There is no other info out there yet.... Shrigg, where did you find the trial download...I just keep getting the email form to fill out. I did see this (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OPBILit71Wg) on you tube. Thanks for all the tests and reports so far....

[douchebro]

Hey mgilbert, here's a link that outlines how to download the trial versions:
http://www.allevery.cn/?p=2636

Good luck!

[mgilbert]

Thanks but I always get the same notification page via email...
(Complete the following fields to be notified by e-mail when Adobe® Creative Suite® 4 trials are available.)

[MrFluffy]

So far Premier Pro and After Effects seem to work. Tomorrow I will load it on my main production X64 system with 16GB of ram and 8 cores to see how it goes. I'll coment again after I've had a play with that.

That works fine. Only one clip seems busted, the others load into the project and I can view them and play then in what looks like real time.

This is an 8 core 2.66GHz XPx64 machine with 16GB of ram (although PP is only a 32bit app . BOOOOOO.). AVCHD is also kind to my SATA drives :)

Is there anyone using a PC who has problems rather than using a MAC?
---
Update:
Both Pr and Ae seem to work fine, but scrubbing backwards by large amounts on 60fps files causes freezes while the drives catch up. 24/30 fps are fine.

I was alarmed when I first played the files through as I saw compression artifacts everywhere, but when I single step the frames there are none, so I guess it doesnt decode the smallest frame changes unless you actually view the frame statically.
Just something to note.

I havent yet tried to create an output file. That comes next :)

[loafstone]

From Dave Helmly at Adobe:

*** NEWS FLASH *** please keep in mind that you can't edit MPEG files with the Trial Versions of our software. There are license fees that apply and we would need to pay the fees every time someone downloaded the trial. This means you can't use the trial version to test edit AVCHD, HDV, MPEG2, H264, MPEG4, XDCAM. **HOWEVER**, you can edit Panasonic DVCPro HD/P2 & DV with the trial version - DKH

And

AVCHD smooth playback totally depends on your systems performance. Most Laptops will work just fine with AVCHD editing but don’t have as smooth a playback as a highend desktop. AVCHD is very processor intensive and takes nearly 95% of your systems performance to decode it(obviously depends on how many cores you have) . There are solutions that will convert your AVCHD for better playback (Cineform.com has always been an excellent choice) , but now you can get started with AVCHD and move to other Adobe plug-in partners if needed.

and


YES – we use all Cores for playback , effects, and rendering for both Mac and Windows.
I highly recommend switching to Vista 64 if you are a Windows user (Mac guys are OK with 10.5.4 or higher) Vista 64 will allow Production Premium CS4 to run using more than 4GB of Ram (XP/Vista32 Limitation). As with most NLEs, there are several programs running at the same time to give you the NLE experience. CS4 now allows each process to take up to 4Gb of RAM. If you have 16GB of RAM, then 4 processes can take up to 4GB each. This is a HUGE advantage over CS3. What are some examples of processes? DynamicLink, AfterServer, Photoshop Server, Adobe Media Encoder, Titler, Playback, Capture, Importer, and many more. I tell most people to count on buying 8GB minium.




Thought you'd might like to know, if you are having probs with AVCHD in the trial version. Also, even though PP CS4 may be 32 bit, the sum of apps still takes advantage of a 64 bit system.

[MrFluffy]

Thought you'd might like to know, if you are having probs with AVCHD in the trial version. Also, even though PP CS4 may be 32 bit, the sum of apps still takes advantage of a 64 bit system.

Its always been true that running a 32bit application on X64 gives the app its maximum (32bit) app space. However, each app is limited to the available space it would see on 32bit and each process shares disk access. It would have been far more useful to have a true 64bit version that could have cached most of the image playback in RAM to give much better performance (ref AE ram perview).

[Catz]

Dave from Adobe thanks for the info. I do kinda wish that if I spend $2500 on CS4 Master that I wouldn't get the recommendation to buy a $125 program from CineForm to make CS4 work better. I think that this is something Adobe should address in an update and provide something to assist the workflow with AVCHD.

I have CS3 and just recieved my HMC150 today. Now I'm not sure if I should upgrade to CS4 or buy something else.

[ewilliams2]

I upgraded to CS4 thinking that my 2 zeon processor admittedly aging win machine would work with avchd...must say at least for me Premiere Pro CS4 is an absolute dog. CS3 continues to work with all forms of video much better than CS4 and never crashes. Have spent quite a bit of time with tech support to no avail. So....if it was my dollars and had it to do over again I would not hitch my wagon to CS4 Premiere at this point in its development. Just my 2 cents, sure others have had better luck, but it has been a very frustrating experience for me.

Gene