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View Full Version : Image Tweakability on the HMC150?



TheMusician
09-30-2008, 09:43 PM
I have had a chance to play with both the Canon XH-A1 and the Sony EX1. One thing that I liked about both of these cameras was the huge range of image tweaks in their picture profiles - gammas, blacks, highlights, knees, color matrix, saturation, etc. As a result, you had the ability to dial in just about any look that you want. So out of the box, both of these cameras looked fairly flat but you could make them look like anything you wanted.

I am going to be buying a HMC150 as my next cam, and I am curious how "tweakable" the image is on these Panasonics. Do they have all of the color manipulation tools of the Sony and Canon cameras, or do you have to dial it in during post if you want a certain look?

Mike Harvey
09-30-2008, 11:05 PM
There is a lot of tweakibility on my DVX, and the HVX and HPX are supposed to be pretty tweakible. I have a hard time seeing why the HMC would be any different.

Barry_Green
10-01-2008, 07:01 AM
The HMC150 has all the same settings as the HPX500, HVX200, and HPX170. Not as many controls or as wide a range of options as the Canon and Sony. However, the HMC150 has more extreme controls than the Canon at least; you can get way more "popping" color out of the HMC150 than you could out of the Canon. The Canon has a range of -50 to +50, the HMC150 is -7 to +7, but the Canon at +50 is about equivalent to the HMC150 at +0. So the adjustment is finer on the Canon, but you actually have more ability to dial in more extreme looks on the HMC150/HPX170/HVX200/HPX500.

shrigg
10-01-2008, 07:35 AM
The HMC150 has all the same settings as the HPX500, HVX200, and HPX170. Not as many controls or as wide a range of options as the Canon and Sony. However, the HMC150 has more extreme controls than the Canon at least; you can get way more "popping" color out of the HMC150 than you could out of the Canon. The Canon has a range of -50 to +50, the HMC150 is -7 to +7, but the Canon at +50 is about equivalent to the HMC150 at +0. So the adjustment is finer on the Canon, but you actually have more ability to dial in more extreme looks on the HMC150/HPX170/HVX200/HPX500.

Awesome. I'd much rather have it this way with the ability to fine tune in post.

jeff9329
10-02-2008, 09:03 AM
The HMC150 has all the same settings as the HPX500, HVX200, and HPX170. Not as many controls or as wide a range of options as the Canon and Sony. However, the HMC150 has more extreme controls than the Canon at least; you can get way more "popping" color out of the HMC150 than you could out of the Canon. The Canon has a range of -50 to +50, the HMC150 is -7 to +7, but the Canon at +50 is about equivalent to the HMC150 at +0. So the adjustment is finer on the Canon, but you actually have more ability to dial in more extreme looks on the HMC150/HPX170/HVX200/HPX500.

Barry:

Being an A1 and HMC150 user, I totally agree with your assessment. It's also making it a little difficult for me to find settings I like.

Can you give me a good starting point for a scene file setting on the HMC 150 for outdoor daylight use that will provide a saturated and sharp image a little hotter/less contrasty than the factory "Spark" scene file?

I am finding the HMC150 is very sensitive IMO to the white balance setting. On the A1 you could get away with AWB almost all the time, and manually setting it was easy. I don't understand the AWB feature on the HMC150 very well (it automatically chooses between 2 K values? only when in A mode?), but I need to quick.

Barry_Green
10-02-2008, 09:16 AM
My stock scene file for a sharp saturated image is detail +2, v-detail +2, coring +1, chroma level +2, cinelike matrix, and cinelike-V gamma. If that's too contrasty, change to cinelike-D gamma.

For white balance you can either set a manual white balance or toggle between the two presets (3200K or 5600K). Put the switch in "A" or "B" settings and you can set manual white balance by holding in the AWB button. But if the switch is in PRST then pressing the AWB button causes it to toggle between the two presets.

Ed Kishel
10-03-2008, 02:05 PM
so until someone comes out with a 150 DVD, will your training DVDs for the HVX apply towards the 150 in terms of scene file settings (physical and mechanical differences aside)

kurtmo
10-03-2008, 04:24 PM
My stock scene file for a sharp saturated image is detail +2, v-detail +2, coring +1, chroma level +2, cinelike matrix, and cinelike-V gamma. If that's too contrasty, change to cinelike-D gamma.


Tried your setting. I changed the Scene file 6 to add your changes. It also had the Master Pe at -2 and the A.IRIS level set to -9 (defaults for scene file6).

All I can say is Holy Saturation, Green-man!

I'll try to post a link to what I got. I shot at 60p and will slow to 24p to see how that looks for me in Vegas.

Thanks for the settings!

Kurtmo

PaulK
10-03-2008, 06:21 PM
My stock scene file for a sharp saturated image is detail +2, v-detail +2, coring +1, chroma level +2, cinelike matrix, and cinelike-V gamma. If that's too contrasty, change to cinelike-D gamma.

Will the look you get with the above settings look like what the DVX would generate with the same settings, i.e., do the settings adjustments on the HMC150 correspond to the DVX in terms of the image having the same look as a result?

I hope so, so when I upgrade someday, after I'm through cutting my teeth on my DVX, I'll be able to easily transfer over some of my favorite scene file settings :-)

johnnyha
10-03-2008, 07:03 PM
One thing I'm noticing right off is the master ped goes all the way to -100. I've tried -50 and -25 and both settings really started bleeding shadows when underexposed, or even when on auto iris. I was shooting on F6 which is cinelike D. I suspect the HD format is more sensitive than the DVX100 on certain shooting settings and some from the DVX100 will just be overkill on the HMC150. I'm gonna start shooting with the waveform, maybe I could even see realtime results on the waveform as the master ped is changed? Hmm...