Messed Up Reds?

[DOSMedia]

Ok so, I have only been shooting with the hvx for 2 and a half months now and the other day was the first time i ever shot someone wearing a bright red color. And when it came out at 100% size just his red sweat shirt is all pixilated looking (see picture below). Thinking back on it today i remembered someone in here saying that they make sure no one they film is wearing red. Why does it do this? Is there any way to fix it? Red for me is a decent color to film, because it doesnt blend in with the mountains, snow or trees (like some other colors do), but i guess its just another color to tell my skiers and riders not to wear.
I watched Barry's first dvd and dont recall anything on there about it either.
So whats the deal?
Heres a pic showing it...
http://img174.imageshack.us/img174/3263/messedupredcolorvx2.jpg


Thank you,
bentley

[gi-jones]

What format were you shooting? DV or DVCPro?

[arrestthisman]

Woah. I shot a whole wall painted red the other day. A close up of the wall too, didn't see ANYTHING like that kind of color blocking.

However, I have seen that on my old GL1. (In frame mode.)

A very uneducated guess, is that somewhere in your workflow, your export is not set to mastering quality. OR, a de-interlacing filter is at work.

I'd go back to your p2 viewer, and check the clip there, at FULL REZ. See if it blocks there.

[DOSMedia]

Im shooting DVC PRo HD in 720 30pn and some shots are overcranked to 48,60, and 36.
Doesnt happen to any other colors and i have actually read something on here about the red colors becoming this way.

Hmm. I dont know how it would be part of the exporting process?

[Jackson Miller]

I have almost started a topic about this SO many times! Please do not dismiss this problem guys. Literally any red object I shoot on my DVX ( I don't have an HVX ) turns out pixelated. I thought there was something wrong with my camera but my friends HVX does the exact same thing. And my friends HV20 has similar problems. There have got to be more of you who have had this problem. Someone has to know what is causing it. Is it a matter of changing scene file settings? Also, I did not notice this until the about 5 months after I owned a DVX because bright red objects aren't that common. Anyone with an HVX or DVX could you please quickly get some test footage of true red objects. Anything that is red will do. I think more of you will see that you have this problem than you expect. Also, the distortion is not visible on the LCD.

[Jackson Miller]

If you want more examples, watch this video ( mine ):

http://blip.tv/file/575553 Try not to focus on the horrible greenscreening. Look at the red tie and the shirt.

here is another example. Watch the red shirt:

http://blip.tv/file/575413

[gi-jones]

Bright colors, and especially red has always been a problem with dv compression (this applies to all dv-cameras). You can test this easily if you try and compress photos or digital animations from AfterFX or similar. You will get the problem even without a camera.

It shouldn't be nearly as bad with DVCPro though. #1: Is that picture (which is now mysteriously gone) a first generation dump or has it been processed in any way?

[Hi-Def Moments]

I've noticed it on mine whenever I have shot to tape. One thing that I noticed that may have caused this was using the cine-like matrix which really causes colors to pop. What I have done to remedy this is back off on the chroma setting by -1. The good thing is that when it is punched out to Beta SP, there was no pixilation at all on the monitor.

[PaPa]

If you want more examples, watch this video ( mine ):

http://blip.tv/file/575553 Try not to focus on the horrible greenscreening. Look at the red tie and the shirt.

here is another example. Watch the red shirt:

http://blip.tv/file/575413

Entity, first of all this is a problem known when shooting in 4:1:1 color space ( never had this problem on PC, but i did on my Mac when it captured the clips as MOV )

So firstly, it is a mixture of the limited color space of the dvx mixed with the mac codecs.

Secondly, this is the hvx section, so unless he posted in the wrong section, he should not be getting this issue with 4:2:2 color space, unless, as stated, there was something wrong in the workflow.

[PaPa]

Ok so, I have only been shooting with the hvx for 2 and a half months now and the other day was the first time i ever shot someone wearing a bright red color. And when it came out at 100% size just his red sweat shirt is all pixilated looking (see picture below). Thinking back on it today i remembered someone in here saying that they make sure no one they film is wearing red. Why does it do this? Is there any way to fix it? Red for me is a decent color to film, because it doesnt blend in with the mountains, snow or trees (like some other colors do), but i guess its just another color to tell my skiers and riders not to wear.
I watched Barry's first dvd and dont recall anything on there about it either.
So whats the deal?
Heres a pic showing it...
http://img174.imageshack.us/img174/3263/messedupredcolorvx2.jpg


Thank you,
bentley

This image was taken from the hvx? Doesn't look like it. Looks like it can barely pass for a dvx? Unless this was HVX footage, then burned to SD mpeg 2 for DVD and then captured? Because you should not be getting this unless the workflow got screwed up.

[DOSMedia]

This image was taken from the hvx? Doesn't look like it. Looks like it can barely pass for a dvx? Unless this was HVX footage, then burned to SD mpeg 2 for DVD and then captured? Because you should not be getting this unless the workflow got screwed up.

Work flow is perfectly fine... the only thing done to the frame grab was that i cropped it a little so it wasnt too big and focused right on him. Shot in 720 and to the P2, came right off the p2 when imported it onto my computer. Nothing wrong with the workflow or anything as far as i know.

[PaPa]

haven't a clue mate, sorry. Editing on a Mac right?

[MDKfilms]

Same here. I get this also, and only with reds. And it doesn't matter if I shoot to P2 or SD, although the SD is worse. I would have to say it is an inherent thing when shooting digital, especially with these lower end cams, probably doesn't show up on a Sony F900. I just try and live with it.

[ProfessorU]

Part of it is definitely chroma subsampling. It could also be the reds clipping. In motion it probably doesn't look that bad, either.

Red is better outside of the NTSC color space, too.

[Nexis]

There's a seemingly endless thread on this:

http://www.dvxuser.com/V6/showthread.php?t=129637

[Jason Ramsey]

Shooting a sold red background wouldn't exhibit these effects. It only happens around the edges of something where red clashes with another color.

It's primarily b/c RED's are a B to things less than 4:4:4 color space. they get like that. It's even worse in 4:2:0 and 4:1:1.

But, if you are going to DVD, by the time you burn a dvd and watch it on a regular sd tv, you won't even notice.

Later,
Jason