Should i buy a HVX-200 + M2 or EX-1??

[zagga]

I am contemplating purchasing the HVX Filmmakers' kit at B&H, to be used with an M2 adapter.

I love the look from the HVX. I also love the P2 workflow. However, I've heard DPs talk about the EX1 being 'that much better' especially in terms of low-light response. On the other side, i simply HATE the idea of mpeg compression.


1. Does the Filmmakers kit's contents make sense with the redrock M2?
http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/458859-REG/Panasonic__Panasonic_AGHVX200_3CCD_Filmmakers.html

2. Will this overall setup give me optimum results versus an Ex1 based setup? Or will i beat myself for not buying an ex1?

[David Saraceno]

There are so many posts and threads on this issue here and the EX1 forum.

Might be a good idea just to start there and then come with questions.

[crobs808]

i see the ex1 as a bridge between the hdv cameras and the hvx/hpx cameras, because it can only record up to 35mbps, which puts in inbetween hdv mpbs and hvx mbps. you will get a much better "look" from the hvx200. i would buy the ex1 if i were filming a cooking show or mythbusters or something like that, but if you are cosidering a 35mm adapter, then you arent going to the DV look, you are going for the film look, thus hvx200. who cares what dp's say...they are always going to want the newer technology.

remember, this answer is based 100% on the two choices you layed out. if you could get the ex1 with the m2, then hands down go with the m2, but putting the m2 on the hvx200 puts it way above the ex1 stock in my book.

-connor

[zagga]

There are so many posts and threads on this issue here and the EX1 forum.

Might be a good idea just to start there and then come with questions.

Have these specific questions been asked on the forum? Have you actually read the questions i asked? let me post again:



1. Does the Filmmakers kit's contents make sense with the redrock M2?
http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/458859-REG/Panasonic__Panasonic_AGHVX200_3CCD_Filmmakers.html

2. Will this overall setup give me optimum results versus an Ex1 based setup? Or will i beat myself for not buying an ex1?

I cant seem to find similar questions elsewhere on this forum.

[ecking]

Don't get the filmmaker's kit because of the p2 store. It's a waste of money in today's environment. Build your own "kit," look around see what other people have done and when you've got a list personal to you post it up and then have people judge it.

[crobs808]

why even use p2?

i bought a firestore fs100, 100gb and then bought a $120 250gb harddrive and upgraded my fs100 to 250gb. works flawlessly and i get TON of recording time now

-connor

[wgzn]

connor, you keep saying this. and your enthusiasm is appreciated (im a firestore lover as well) but its very inexperienced and unwise advice. the firestore is great - no argument there. but in my experience. the P2 is MUCH more nimble and foolproof.

wait until you shoot a political rally or live music event - you'll wish to GOD you had a P2 card tucked safely inside your camera ; )

[wgzn]

yeah - DONT buy a pre configured "kit" even the best vendors load them full of high markup or useless crap just to get the money of the uninformed.

and im not sure what youre expecting of an M2. but it does the SAME thing for an ex1 that it does for an hvx...

[zagga]

1. Is there anything in that kit that would conflict with the Redrock M2? For example, will the rocker controller have any use? Will the mattebox or the tiffen filters have any use? If not, what would you recommend?

I am going to look around the forum and see what other people have as suggested above.


why even use p2?

i bought a firestore fs100, 100gb and then bought a $120 250gb harddrive and upgraded my fs100 to 250gb. works flawlessly and i get TONs of recording time now

-connor

Strangely enough, the P2 Store was one thing in the kit that i didnt really feel totally confident about but it appears to suit my workflow better. I tend to prefer the security of solid state P2 technology. Even though it comes with less storage space, I find it more reliable than the Firestore.

I had one instance where a Firestore DROPPED from the DP while on set. We only lost one file, but it was still a loss. Since then, i have always appreciated any workflow where i dont rely on hard drive mechanics attached to a device as mobile as a camera. The other thing is that i would worry about the ruggedness of the 250gb upgrade drive in a mobile scenario. Most hard drives arent designed to withstand being dropped from waist hieght. Since the STOCK Firestore 100gb survived it i would assume that the stock drive is more reliable than the ordinary hard drive.

In comparison to the risks of the FS, the P2 Store allows me to incrementally REMOVE the data to a separate storage area, and limit exposure to data loss in the field. To maintain this security while adding capacity, I would even prefer to increase the P2 store's hard drive size to 160gb for $100. How does this approach sound to you?

[zagga]

I see the Red Rock microMatteBox is an IMPRESSIVE option, but how long would i have to wait to get it? not sure if waiting for a few months is best right now.

What are the alternatives?

[zagga]

connor, you keep saying this. and your enthusiasm is appreciated (im a firestore lover as well) but its very inexperienced and unwise advice. the firestore is great - no argument there. but in my experience. the P2 is MUCH more nimble and foolproof.

wait until you shoot a political rally or live music event - you'll wish to GOD you had a P2 card tucked safely inside your camera ; )


I will have to end up using the FireStore. Is it possible to shoot to P2 and to firestore simultaneously? Perhaps this would provide some amount of backup protection in the event of a firestore failure.

After doing more research, i realize that the P2 Store is a bad choice right now, despite all the wonderful safety features.

1. USB transfer is too SLOW.
2. The device might not be easily upgraded to function fully with larger drives. It may not, for example, be designed to format a larger drive even if it can read or write to it.

[wgzn]

zagga - lets talk a bit about what youre trying to achive... it seems to me that you may be doing what you think youre supposed to do. as opposed to what you need to do.

[Jawad]

HVX when shot on hd is quite decent in low lighting but when shot on mini dv or 480i, its nothing like dvx or other low light cameras.

HVX was mainly designed for the HD fan. It does its justice in that but doesn't do so well in SD side of things. So in my suggestion if you are doing lots of shoots that are live events where you can't lit up stage or subject, stay away from hvx.

[wgzn]

i never have understodd why folks complain thnat the hvx doesnt do SD as well as a dedicated SD camera? a dragster isnt as good at driving to the mall as is a toyota camry either. it wasnt designed to...

but yeah, if you are a live event shooter and cant control light then another camera might be better suited. but ive shot live music venues with an hvx and wasnt horrified by the results.

[zagga]

zagga - lets talk a bit about what youre trying to achive... it seems to me that you may be doing what you think youre supposed to do. as opposed to what you need to do.


HVX when shot on hd is quite decent in low lighting but when shot on mini dv or 480i, its nothing like dvx or other low light cameras.

HVX was mainly designed for the HD fan. It does its justice in that but doesn't do so well in SD side of things. So in my suggestion if you are doing lots of shoots that are live events where you can't lit up stage or subject, stay away from hvx.

I am focusing on Music Videos, with short films as a distinct possibility.


Productions typically last no more than one intense 18-hour day. Ideally, we want to be able to shoot additional b-roll footage on a second day without needing to rent equipment.
We would also want to be able to do green screen work or interviews.
I have already put together a pretty decent audio package, so thats not a problem.
All i need to finalize is the correct camera package (with single mounted microphone) to get the most of the RedRock addons. I also need to consider that for some interviews we may not use the redrock addons at all.
The original budget was the $13k that B&H qouted for their filmmakers kit. This amount is stretching my pocket, but if it will get good results i think it will pay for itself (and repay the credit union).
P2 reliability is important. I need to be able to limit data loss risks by getting the footage away from the camera as soon as practical, with backups.
I would like to know if its possible to record to P2 and firestore simulaneously. That way a laptop+harddrive can be handling P2 transfers, and the firestore will serve as a live backup in the event that the laptop hard drive fails.Any help in putting this package together will be appreciated.

[crobs808]

connor, you keep saying this. and your enthusiasm is appreciated (im a firestore lover as well) but its very inexperienced and unwise advice. the firestore is great - no argument there. but in my experience. the P2 is MUCH more nimble and foolproof.

wait until you shoot a political rally or live music event - you'll wish to GOD you had a P2 card tucked safely inside your camera ; )

not really, lol...i do 3 day shoots, and shoots in concert crowds and all, and after i bought the p-clamp, everything is fine, the p-clamp is a special firewire cable made for fs100 and hvx users, basically holds the firewire in rock solid. never had issues.

-connor

[crobs808]

i never have understodd why folks complain thnat the hvx doesnt do SD as well as a dedicated SD camera? a dragster isnt as good at driving to the mall as is a toyota camry either. it wasnt designed to...

but yeah, if you are a live event shooter and cant control light then another camera might be better suited. but ive shot live music venues with an hvx and wasnt horrified by the results.

well, i still always shoot in HD, even for the clients that order SD, because when i downscale to SD for their final DVD it look SOOO good. also, for weddings i offer a HD DVD for their 1year anniversary for $500...i can edit everything in SD if i want, then go back in a year later, just relink the project files to the original HD files, reexport/burn, done. easy. at least with premiere pro...i think if you use Final Cut you cant do that, you actually have to reedit it, lol...sucks for FCP users.

-connor