lake mead to dry up?

[ugafan]

scrary stuff.

link (http://www.newsweek.com/id/110958)

[HorseFilms]

I have a lake of mead in my basement. It's not going to dry up anytime soon.:beer:

[Blaine]

I have a lake of mead in my basement. It's not going to dry up anytime soon.:beer:That would be a lake of your making, right? :happy:

[HorseFilms]

That would be a lake of your making, right? :happy:

Yes, the lake is man made.:Drogar-Happy(DBG):

[Erik Olson]

Yeah, that Snowy River situation is crazy too. I bet nobody ever thought they'd see that town again.

e

[Zander]

I have a lake of mead in my basement. It's not going to dry up anytime soon.:beer:

And why haven't you invited me over?

[J Michael]

No worries. There is enough water in the swimming pools in Phoenix to fill it back up.

[mcgeedigital]

And for a contrarian view I give you this. (http://aquadoc.typepad.com/waterwired/2008/02/watermeisters-d.html)

Just remember there are always two sides to every story.

[Erik Olson]

You know what they say about people who give something a 50/50 chance? They can never be wrong, therefore they can always afford to disagree with those who put real data out there and make real predictions based on defined and defensible trends.

The article you posted isn't a very compelling retort to the Scripps Institute (http://www.scripps.edu/e_index.html) study. I would liken the article to the Quahog Aerospace School telling JPL that their ideas about rocket propulsion might have a 50/50 shot of being right - according to their anecdotal data.

They [Scripps] have a decades-long legacy in oceanic and freshwater studies and the NYTimes story that spun from it indicates dozens of lakes around the world where this phenomenon is underway.

e

[Evan S]

Well why wouldn't a man-made lake dry up!? it's man-made!

[mcgeedigital]

Sorry, but the study in question has a false premise that doesn't take in ALL of the facts:

It is based on the fact the the current 7 tear drought will continue for the next 13 years. This region has always been in the grips of wet and dry cycles. 1995 was the last year of a drought cycle followed by 3 years of record wet/snwopack years and the lakes were full. Look at the snowpack this winter folks. Sierra over 200% of normal, Rockies 175% normal.

The last drought buster winters filled the lakes to capacity and it will happen again.

"Science" that doesn't take in all of the facts is nothing more than a politically motivated sham.

How much $$$ does the NOAA get from the .gov for its studies?

[ugafan]

This region has always been in the grips of wet and dry cycles. 1995 was the last year of a drought cycle followed by 3 years of record wet/snwopack years and the lakes were full. Look at the snowpack this winter folks. Sierra over 200% of normal, Rockies 175% normal.

The last drought buster winters filled the lakes to capacity and it will happen again.


i hope you are right.

[Erik Olson]

Well, you're starting to talk politics in this thread now and that won't fly, so... I'll turn it back to facts versus policy.

The worldwide climate changes seem to be occuring despite higher than average snowpacks and cyclical patterns like drought, El Niño and so forth. What is the answer then?

In California, Mono Lake has been dwindling for generations and the Salton Sea and Central Valley's Owens Lake is gone. Of course, you can drive across them and continue to deny, deny, deny it. Doesn't change the fact that these fresh and saltwater bodies are no longer viable.

We should all be waking up to the fact that the planet could use a little care and do our part in whatever way we can. My first step in 2008 was the purchase of a 60mpg diesel wagon to replace one of our 15/18mpg 4.0L V8s Land Rovers.

http://www.geosci.unc.edu/faculty/glazner/Images/Weathering/OwensLakePost.jpg
Owen's Lake

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[mcgeedigital]

Well, you're starting to talk politics in this thread now and that won't fly, so... I'll turn it back to facts versus policy.

The worldwide climate changes seem to be occuring despite higher than average snowpacks and cyclical patterns like drought, El Niño and so forth. What is the answer then?

In California, Mono Lake has been dwindling for generations and the Salton Sea and Central Valley's Owens Lake is gone. Of course, you can drive across them and continue to deny, deny, deny it. Doesn't change the fact that these fresh and saltwater bodies are no longer viable.

We should all be waking up to the fact that the planet could use a little care and do our part in whatever way we can. My first step in 2008 was the purchase of a 60mpg diesel wagon to replace one of our 15/18mpg 4.0L V8s Land Rovers.

http://www.geosci.unc.edu/faculty/glazner/Images/Weathering/OwensLakePost.jpg
Owen's Lake

e

Fair enough, my apologies for sidelining the topic....

[Erik Olson]

You make good points. I like researching this type of thing, and you're right on one in particular. You can't believe everything you read.

http://image.dieselpowermag.com/f/diesel-news/volkswagen-to-offer-50-state-diesel-in-2008/6307719+w640+cr1+re0+ar1/2008-vw-jetta-sportwagen.jpg

http://www.vwvortex.com/artman/uploads/jettawagon2.jpg

http://www.egmcartech.com/wp-content/uploads/2006/12/bluetec_logo_on_benz.jpg

Our new baby, on its way from Deutschland.

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[mcgeedigital]

Thats hot!

[Erik Olson]

Yeah, like TDIPorn.

e

[Eastside Parkway]

Frankly I'm surprised this didn't happen a long time ago.

[Simon Höfer]

Hey Erik, good car choice :D

Good to see people changing their mind about cars. It always bothered me, that so many people in the USA and also other countries are driving so wasteful and huge cars.

Climate definately is changing. I can see it with my own eyes. When I was a small kid, we could go sledging so many times during wintertime. But every year snow is getting less and less. This winter, we had snow for only 1 (ONE) day. It lasted for a couple of hours. Figure that!

Edited to add:
I also don't like the trend for driving these huge SUVs. Even here in germany they are growing like mushrooms everywhere. What's the point? Streets are definately not that bad, so you would need a SUV.

[Erik Olson]

Unfortunately, we don't have the diesel choices you do in Europe. When we were in France last summer, imagine our surprise at nearly 60 mpg in the Opel Zafira we'd rented... for six passengers and a full load of gear.

The Mercedes-VW engine in this new car is one of, if not the first, 50-state diesel brought to the North American market.

If we had real choices, I believe that many of us would make them. I, for one, have lobbied for diesel Land Rovers in the USA for about 10 years. The V8 I drive was created for the USA market - based on an old Buick design of all things.

The ROW got the TDI and the mileage that goes with it.

e

[mcgeedigital]

I here you Eric, when I was in Panama on a shoot 2 months a go, we rented a Toyota Hilux diesel truck.

Hot DAMN what I wouldn't do for one of those here....damn EPA import restrictions....

[snowleopard]

Interesting discussion. I've seen changes in climate in my life too. Twenty plus years ago I went hiking way up on Mt. Hood here in Oregon, and many many times since. The glaciers have definitely shrunk in that time frame. I've seen it with my own eyes, and I don't mean annual snow melt differences. I mean true glaciers. It's alarming.

We've converted almost all of our light bulbs in our house to fluorescent. I'm wondering if anyone here has attempted to install any kind of LED lights in their house? This seems like the future for certain.

In Medford (Oregon) the local municipality is putting up large solar panels out of cost efficiency. The panels came down in price, and they estimate even with maintenance, that they will save thousands of dollars per year over having so much hydroelectric and coal fired power. So there are some good signs on the horizon.

[Erik Olson]

We've converted to CFL in every fixture that will take them. Anyone else notice they get nowhere near the hours they're rated? Then, you're stuck with a mercury-laced lump that nobody is recycling yet.

I like them, but they aren't the magic bullet. LEDs have a ways to come before they'll be appropriate for decorating in my home. I don't live in an episode of Miami Vice.

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[JConnors]

We've converted to CFL in every fixture that will take them. Anyone else notice they get nowhere near the hours they're rated? Then, you're stuck with a mercury-laced lump that nobody is recycling yet.


Have you noticed a significant amount in savings?

I can't stand fluorescent lights, I never turn mine on in my office, don't think I could use them in my apartment.

[Erik Olson]

No. We have a pool and the HVAC is all over the map depending on the time of year, so it's really difficult to track anything.

All I know is that we're not getting 10,000 hours out of them. Based on that, I should be able to run one continuously for 416 days. Based on 6 hours a day, 1,666 days. That's 4.56 years of operation per globe.

I've lived in my home for five years and replaced almost every CFL three or four times in the two years we've been using them. We have modern electrical service and cycle-up / cycle-down isn't supposed to affect modern CFLs.

Anyway, the manufacturer's math doesn't seem to tell the true story.

e