wow...Letus Extreme and EX1 *FIXED* Sharp as a tac.... [Archive] - DVXuser.com -- The online community for filmmaking

cinemascreen

02-13-2008, 05:20 AM

No more problem with edge to edge sharpness.....

Steve Cahill's blog has an entry (with footage) regarding the Letus extreme and the new glass that shows the EX1 and Letus a perfect combo.....

Looks like the top of the page doesn't load before the movie finishes loading....I almost missed the top picture and description...

http://web.mac.com/stevecahill/Steve_Cahills_Blog/Blog/Entries/2008/2/12_Letus_EX1_Fixed.html

chagchag

02-13-2008, 06:44 AM

WOW! That's nice to know. Getting an EX1 for testing tomorrow, and was worried how it would perform with my LEX

stevec

02-13-2008, 07:20 AM

Qucik test, shot @ 1080 @ 30P , NIce and sharp. would nbe interested in others experience

Regards
Steve

http://web.mac.com/stevecahill

basspig

02-14-2008, 12:29 AM

Steve, you mentioned something about a motor on the Letus. What purpose does it serve? The Letus web site comparing various models talks about a silent motor vibration feature. What is its purpose?

stevec

02-14-2008, 03:16 AM

The motor, know as a vibrator, vibrates the ground glass that the image gets focused on, so that the the grain of the ground glass becomes transparent.
See this: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Depth-of-field_adapter good explanation. also Philip Bloom has a good description of adpaters, as well @ http://web.mac.com/philip.bloom/Shootout/Intro.html

You can see a close-up of the Letus vibrator here: http://web.mac.com/stevecahill/Steve_Cahills_Blog/Blog/Entries/2008/1/6_Letus_Autopsy_1.html

Regards
Steve

socbret

02-16-2008, 10:52 PM

This might be a dumb question but I'll ask it anyway:

Would this fix work with other 35mm adapters such as the M2 or is it only designed to work with the LEX?

philip bloom

02-17-2008, 02:53 AM

it is specific to the letus extreme.

Mediacre

02-17-2008, 12:27 PM

This might be a dumb question but I'll ask it anyway:

Would this fix work with other 35mm adapters such as the M2 or is it only designed to work with the LEX?

My guess is that it could work. The problem with all adapters seem to be the achromatic lens. It's probably either the strength or the fact they are all smaller than the 77mm EX1 lens or maybe both. The Letus is just proving a new achromatic lens. Just like the M2 achromatic lens works on other adapters and so does the Brevis and SGpro achromatic lenses, this"should" work for other adapters too. Of course, there's no way to know without testing. But I don't see why it wouldn't.

philip bloom

02-17-2008, 12:35 PM

Mediacre

02-17-2008, 12:43 PM

it's designed to focus on the exact distance between the achromat and the letus gg. Can't see how it would work with m2 etc unless their distance was identical.

This is a unique achromat. Designed for a specific camera/ adaptor combo.

I tried it out today and got astonishingly sharp edge to edge results.

Well, an achromatic lens normally has a certain distance range it would work. They are normally not that particular. Maybe if you use the M2 flip module it would fall close enough since the Letus is a flipped adapter. Besides, I doubt this is specially designed for the Letus. If they are saying so it's most likely marketing. If they had the resources or could afford a specially designed lens they would have a specially designed relay lens for their Letus XL and HD100 and yet they use a 50mm lens made for 35mm still cameras which yield very poor results.

philip bloom

02-17-2008, 12:55 PM

Steve Shovlar

02-18-2008, 03:37 AM

Well my LEX with EX1 achromat is on the Fedex van for delivery today!

If it arrives early enough I will try and take it out into the garden to a test.

Without going through lots of threads, how far should I zoom into roughly with the EX1 to get the right framing?

Essami

02-18-2008, 05:54 AM

I zoom in at z80 with all my lenses except the canon fd 20mm f2.8 which requires a bit more zooming in.

But Phil mentioned that with the new EX1 kit achromat you dont have to zoom in as much. I have it on order as well and Im very much looking forward to using it.

Phil, how much do you generally zoom in at with the new achromat?

Sami

Mediacre

02-18-2008, 05:14 PM

i really wouldn't compare old Letus with new Letus.

They made the ex1 achromat from scratch, not just for the ex1 but the letus extreme. It corrects the spherical anomalies that the ex1 lens causes. . Not marketing. They old letus xl and hd100 used crappy old minolta lenses for the relay. I had an old Letus FE and was very focal in it's crappiness. The extreme is light years apart. They are making new relays for the xl and hd line that WON't be minolta glass.

Best thing is to PM hien. a nice bloke. I am sure he will answer your questions rather than let us all speculate!!

Yes. But specially now that they have released the flip module to fit 3rd party adapters, the new achromatic would fit right in. Since the flip is most likely the same distance as the Letus, the new achromatic would work and fit like a glove. In a SGPRO, you would basically end up with a spinner letus.

By the way, how many stops does the extreme lose?

socbret

02-18-2008, 08:45 PM

For those M2 users, I have found that the MicroX will include an acromat that solves these issues.

Kholi

02-18-2008, 09:13 PM

Yes. But specially now that they have released the flip module to fit 3rd party adapters, the new achromatic would fit right in. Since the flip is most likely the same distance as the Letus, the new achromatic would work and fit like a glove. In a SGPRO, you would basically end up with a spinner letus.

By the way, how many stops does the extreme lose?

Less than half. But quoted at .5

philip bloom

02-19-2008, 12:22 AM

the only camera the ex1 letus achromat is made for is the letus extreme, will it work with the SGPro. Sure. Will it give it perfect edge sharpness, unlikely. The distance is different to the Letus Extreme. They really have made it specific for the Letus Extreme.

Saying you then have a spinner Letus just because you have a letus flip is silly! it's still an Sgpro for all the plusses and minuses that brings!

best to ask Letus themselves. Either Hien, DeGrey or Aaron Pin about what happens when you use the achromat on other adaptors.

hienle

02-19-2008, 12:53 AM

The fix WILL NOT work with SGPro. You WILL NOT be able to screw the achromat into place.

Mediacre

02-19-2008, 01:17 AM

The fix WILL NOT work with SGPro. You WILL NOT be able to screw the achromat into place.

It may not work on the SGPRO straight. But once you have the letus flip module on the SGPRO, you can then screw the achromat right? The flip has the very same end as it is on the Extreme right? The module also looks to have the very same light path as the extreme, which would make the achromat work too, right?

Kholi

02-19-2008, 01:22 AM

Mediacre

02-19-2008, 02:03 AM

Dude. Hien is the creator of the Extreme and letus Flip.

I mean, it's one thing when I tell you all this same information and you REFUSE TO LISTEN, it's another when you question the creator.

Give it a rest. It won't work. Wait for Wayne to make one.
He said it wouldn't work with the SGPRO because you can't screw it in (which makes me think if you find a way to screw it, it would work) but he said nothing about it not working if you have the letus flip on the SGPRO,( which would give the SGPRO the same back end as the Extreme making the achromat fit.) So I just asked.

hienle

02-19-2008, 02:35 AM

DUDE, he said it wouldn't work with the SGPRO because you can't screw it in (which makes me think if you find a way to screw it, it would work) but he said nothing about it not working if you have the letus flip on the SGPRO,( which would give the SGPRO the same back end as the Extreme making the achromat fit.) So I just asked. Chill!
Extreme doesn't use the Letus Flip. Extreme has it's own, integrated flip. Though the flip portion are identical optically, they are different mechanically. The thread for the achromat holder are different, that's why I said it would not screw in.

philip bloom

02-19-2008, 07:27 AM

Give it a rest. It won't work. Wait for Wayne to make one.

The problem you have is the flip is made for Wayne by Letus, so any fix for it would really need to come from Letus. That would require Wayne to commission the Le Brothers to do it. So I doubt it will come anytime soon!

emotepix

02-20-2008, 12:06 AM

Hien

Slightly off topic but since we're here anyway, is it possible (or advisable) to grind out a little of the achromat holder ring where it fits the Extreme, to allow the EX1 to center the LEx GG image properly?
(i.e. increase the clearance slightly on one side by grinding a larger curve into the mounting ring with a Dremel or similar, to allow for a more eccentric mounting of the ring?)

I'd think it would only be a matter of a millimeter or two more off-center than it can be at the moment, which is around half a millimeter.
Then the set screws would still be able to tighten it and one could then (finally) center the camcorder close to the optical center of the LEx. and therefore use more of the GG image.

What say you?

Steve Shovlar

02-20-2008, 04:14 PM

I have found that I am not aligned properly onto the GG with my EX1. Side to side I am OK, but when zooming in the center of the EX1 lens is between a half and two thirds up the GG on the Letus EX.

Thoughts to solve it?

emotepix

02-20-2008, 04:30 PM

Yeah, Steve, that's the problem I was writing about.
I've posted about this before, mainly on the Letus forums, and I'm waiting to see what works will do before I try alternatives.
The problem with the EX1 and a few other cameras is that their imagers aren't set dead center relative to the axis of their lenses. It isn't mentioned much but it's there.
Letus forum and others have said that it isn't the Letus that has the problem, it's perfectly centered within itself - however, the issue seems to be not whose problem it is or where the blame lies, but how to solve it.
Tell you one thing, though -- it isn't going to go away all by itself.

stevec

02-20-2008, 09:26 PM

Check out my blog about critiical focusl @ http://www.stevecahillphotography.com/blog
see if this helps, you can also see how another user sees what your seeing through the EX1 and lets EX

emotepix

02-20-2008, 09:33 PM

Steve C
Yes, I've seen your site. If the discrepancy were that small I'd not be mentioning it at all. On the FX7 it's way, way off, more like 20-25% vertical frame cropping than the approx 5-8% we're seeing in your lineup.

stevec

02-20-2008, 10:40 PM

The mankers of the adapters do not and can not test all the camera combinations. So the end users, must get the right combo, set-up to get the proper results. We are the beta testers to define the correct cameras, for use with these adapters.

RichardVClark

02-21-2008, 12:22 AM

After seeing The Assassination of Jesse James, Philip Bloom and Stevec's lens baby work, I am defiantly in the market for one.

The LEX fix looks impeccable.

emotepix

02-21-2008, 12:43 AM

Yeah, the bleeding edge of technology, I know. And I do love the images too, don't get me wrong!
See you on the silver screen!

Mediacre

02-21-2008, 04:34 PM

Saying you then have a spinner Letus just because you have a letus flip is silly! it's still an Sgpro for all the plusses and minuses that brings!

No idea what minuses you are talking about. Not sure with the EX1 as I don't have one. But the Sgpro has no real minuses with most cameras I have used it with. Apart from the Letus Extreme, which I don't know, the Sgpro is the sharpest and brightest adapter I have ever used. Also as it is a spinner, I can stop my lens down or use higher shooting speeds which vibrating adapters like the Letus and Brevis normally don't allow.

Extreme doesn't use the Letus Flip. Extreme has it's own, integrated flip. Though the flip portion are identical optically, they are different mechanically. The thread for the achromat holder are different, that's why I said it would not screw in.
So if the problem is only mechanical, it should be easy to solve with a good custom machine job. I hear you Hien. You don't want to say your fix will work with the competition too. It's understandable.

Essami

03-07-2008, 12:46 AM

hi

just got my ex1 kit. im trying to screw in the achromat but where the old achromat screwed in all the way I cant get the ex1 acrhromat to screw in more than a few rounds. It leaves a 3-4mm gap between the letus and the new achromat ring. Is it supposed to be this way? Ive really tried hard and Im afraid to use any tools to turn it further.

Sami

philip bloom

03-07-2008, 04:36 AM

it should be ok. Have you tried it out?

Essami

03-07-2008, 05:05 AM

Im afraid to put in on the EX1 cause it looks like the achromat glass could touch the EX1 lens surface. And if I screw it on like this it could very well break something. Ill attach two pictures here. If you can compare it to your own EX1 kit achromat Id really appreaciate.

I just cant screw it any further no matter how hard I try. It only seems to turn 2 rounds and then it gets stuck. The previous achromat screws in all the way.

philip bloom

03-07-2008, 05:07 AM

mine goes in all the way. what happens when you put the cover over it, how much space is there?

Essami

03-07-2008, 05:26 AM

You mean the LEX achromat cover that screws to the ex1-kit-77mm-thread? It wont go on it because the achromat is on the way. Hmmm... I really cant get my head around if Im doing something wrong but it should be really simple. And I have no problems with the old achromat.

Essami

03-07-2008, 05:38 AM

Oh man! I got some rubber gloves and got it screwed in with real brute force. That is never gonna come off its soooo tight.

thanks for your help!

Sami

stevec

03-07-2008, 05:39 AM

It took me a few tries to get it to seat, (screw all the way in).

DO this. Screw it in until it stops, then unscrew a bit, then screw in again a bit more. keep working it this way until it makes it way all the way in. You will be working the threads and getting it to wear in. You will NOT be able to do it all in one go. If you have ever tapped a screw hole you have to go in a bit than back out a bit, go in a bit back out a bit.

Make sure that when performing this you remove it completly and air blow on the threads to clear any debris that may be getting into the threads as you work it in.

Regards
Steve
BLOG: For the Letus EX http://web.mac.com/stevecahill/Steve_Cahills_Blog/Blog/Blog.html

Essami

03-07-2008, 05:55 AM

Wow, you really can see the sharpness increase A LOT with the ex1 kit! The peaking just fills the whole frame and I cant see anything else but blue, gotta turn that down a bit :)

How much do people usually zoom in with the ex1 kit achromat?

Phil: You mentioned that the focus position is at the edge of the EX1 so it kinda locks in? Did I misunderstand or what did you mean by this? My focus point is a couple of millimeters from the lock focus.

Sami

Essami

03-07-2008, 05:57 AM

DO this. Screw it in until it stops, then unscrew a bit, then screw in again a bit more. keep working it this way until it makes it way all the way in. You will be working the threads and getting it to wear in. You will NOT be able to do it all in one go. If you have ever tapped a screw hole you have to go in a bit than back out a bit, go in a bit back out a bit.

Thanks Steve! This is exactly what I did and now its in. I hope I never have to take it off :)

cckid

03-07-2008, 05:46 PM

Steve,

I just visited your blog - that I really like very much and that I visit on a regular basis - and on your welcome page there's a picture of a redone camera...does this mean you're a proud new owner of a redone too....if my assumption is true when can we expect some comparision shots between two hot contenders: in one corner the redone and in the other letus ex with sony ex1 (they sound made for each other)....I think a lot of people would love to see side by side footage of those two setups...when you get the time please let us know....

stevec

03-08-2008, 04:20 AM

NO RED camera as of yet, this may be the precursor to a Red. If you read the Red online communities for RED they have issues with production, deliveries, and work flow. That said they have a all in one solution camera, rather than a add-on solution we are currently using.

Let's say I would like to be a Red want to be.

See the online communities below for further studies:

http://www.reduser.net/forum/index.php

http://www.redcamcentral.com/

http://www.redrelay.net/

cckid

03-08-2008, 06:44 PM

Steve hi,

yep I've been following the developement of redone for some time now, but to me it seems the red team is working its ass off and fixing the problems quite fiercely...I got myself in line and waiting for one to be delivered mid summer....yet that won't stop me from working on my friend's ex1 occasionaly....