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PhilaDvXphia
02-01-2008, 12:23 PM
Without mentioning any names, some of the footage that is posted under the EX1 footage section has me wondering if this camera is as good as I thought it was. What puzzles me even more is that people are commenting and acting like some of it actually looks good. Sure, Phillip Bloom's work looks amazing.

My question is this...why don't we see footage of this caliber (Phillip Bloom) from other shooters?? Did you see some of the others that are posting? First of all, that rolling shutter problem is horrible. It looks absolutely terrible. Unacceptable in my mind. The other problem that I see is that the footage isn't crisp and has a very video-ish look to it. If I'm wrong here, please post some of your footage that you feel looks great. I'd love to still buy this camera. To be honest though, the rolling shutter problem is very troublesome to me.

I also wish that others would post some footage that was shot ONLY WITH THE STOCK LENS.

I was completely convinced that I was buying the EX1. I was so excited. Now I'm thinking that I don't want the HVX or the EX1. Right now, I'm leaning toward waiting until April to see what's coming out next.

matthew77
02-01-2008, 12:47 PM
You are wrong.

And I think Phil Bloom will take exception to your comment.

I agree that it would be nice to see less DoF box work. The stock lens is truly amazing.

BTW - the EX1 is a video camera.

philip bloom
02-01-2008, 12:53 PM
Without mentioning any names, some of the footage that is posted under the EX1 footage section has me wondering if this camera is as good as I thought it was. What puzzles me even more is that people are commenting and acting like some of it actually looks good. Sure, Phillip Bloom's work looks amazing - but he gets paid by Sony...He speaks for Sony, whatever...

My question is this...why don't we see footage of this caliber (Phillip Bloom) from other shooters?? Did you see some of the others that are posting? First of all, that rolling shutter problem is horrible. It looks absolutely terrible. Unacceptable in my mind. The other problem that I see is that the footage isn't crisp and has a very video-ish look to it. If I'm wrong here, please post some of your footage that you feel looks great. I'd love to still buy this camera. To be honest though, the rolling shutter problem is very troublesome to me.

I also wish that others would post some footage that was shot ONLY WITH THE STOCK LENS.

I was completely convinced that I was buying the EX1. I was so excited. Now I'm thinking that I don't want the HVX or the EX1. Right now, I'm leaning toward waiting until April to see what's coming out next.

Dude,

Kind of a compliment, but also a statement that is slander. I get paid by Sony? For what, to shoot footage and post it on forums? Yeah, they said if I do it they will give me an F23, F900R, a genesis and a new PSP.

For the past 3 days i HAVE been paid by Sony, to answer questions to punters looking at the EX1. They paid me my daily rate and it was cool, especially meeting other forum members. Other than that Sony have paid me zip, Letus have paid me zip. I buy all my gear full price. I post my footage on my website so i can show what the cameras can do and what I can do. So hopefully I can get more work from it. But to say I even speak for Sony is nonsense. I speak for what I like and what I use. Yes most of my cameras are Sony cameras. But I also own a JVCHD 201 that I used for 10 months with the Brevis. I did loads of work with it and loved it. I have an HV20, if you go on to my web site there is a little test short I shot with it and the letus mini. it craps all over my ex1 with regards to edge to edge sharpness. That is one stunning little camera and that's a Canon. I also used the HVX and Brevis for a doco series (homeless portraits was part of it). Now I have moved on to the EX1. Just because I have had more success from that combo doesn't make me biased or in anyone's pocket. It makes me an advocate of the equipment and there is nothing wrong with that. Give me a Red and I will say thanks very much and probably not touch my Letus or EX1 again. Although if Jim Jannard gave me one (Jim, are you there Jim?) would that compromise my independence?

I was asked by a very nice man who runs a very nice company which makes very nice adaptors to become his sponsored shooter. If he is reading this I would be very grateful if he would reiterate what I am saying here now. I said thanks very much, the offer of free gear for life is a fantastic offer but by doing that I am compromise what makes my word on the forums so valuable. I am independent. I will buy lots of different stuff out there and tell people what I think of it. So I said I will still buy your adaptors and make my money back from the cost of them by using them for paid jobs. He agreed that it made sense. So when you hear from me that I like something you will know that i like it for ALL the right reasons.

I understand that quite a lot of people have bought ex1s based on my footage (many people email me to tell me so), that's great. I am glad it is inspiring people to go out there and create! We are living in an amazing time where tools to create quite awesome footage are available to most people, not just the wealthy broadcasters or production companies.

It's a shame, yesterday a thread was started up accusing me of something very similar. All I am trying to do is share. I would be grateful if the moderators do not delete this thread like the did with the one yesterday. This sort of rubbish needs to be nipped in the bud and if people can read what I have written here hopefully they can stop questioning my motives which are very simple. To share with you guys and TO GET ME LOTS AND LOTS OF NICE WORK!!

Stephen Mick
02-01-2008, 12:58 PM
Yeah, really smart thread here. Without mentioning any names, let me mention some names.

Apologies to Philip on behalf of many. Thanks for posting what you have posted, and keep sharing your thoughts on the EX1, even if they're hard for some of us HVX'ers (like myself) to hear.

--SM

matthew77
02-01-2008, 01:05 PM
If I'm wrong here, please post some of your footage that you feel looks great. I'd love to still buy this camera. To be honest though, the rolling shutter problem is very troublesome to me.

I also wish that others would post some footage that was shot ONLY WITH THE STOCK LENS.

I doubt you can even see the rolling shutter issue in normal photography.


I think this looks nice and was shot with the stock lens (by someone other than Phil Bloom):

http://www.8112studios.com/nyc.mov

philip bloom
02-01-2008, 01:14 PM
Also if you go to my website and click on Religion EX1. A lot of that was shot clean on the EX1.

The obsession with rolling shutter is quite odd. I have never had any problems. To be honest I am more likely to have vertical smear issues with ccds than I would rolling shutter issues on cmos.

If you asked me if i would prefer ccd or cmos in my ex1 i would say cmos. That is purely my preference and I am sure for others their priorities lie in different areas.

I keep on planning on doing a short just using the stock lens. But I have gotten so busy recently that I am absolutely knackered. But get the sharpness setting down a few notches, play around with the gamma and some other bits and you will get some cracking footage out of it. Saying that I shot a wedding video for a good friend in Spain last summer using the JVC HD 201 with no adaptor and the picture blew me away. Incredibly filmic, more so than the EX1 clean. Although it was quite a noisy image and rubbish in low light!

Stevet
02-01-2008, 01:15 PM
My question is this...why don't we see footage of this caliber (Phillip Bloom) from other shooters??


Release date two months ago might have a lot to do with it.

Buck Forester
02-01-2008, 01:19 PM
Hey Philip, your work is excellent and it reflects more of you than it does an particular camera. People get caught up in the camera and lose focus of what's really important, creating good images by knowing lighting, composition, pointing the camera at interesting or pretty things, etc. I'm a photographer going into high-def video production. I know it doesn't matter all that much if someone shoots Canon or Nikon or Olympus, it's all about creating desirable images. I'm starting my hd studio from scratch so I have absolutely no preconceived bias over which hd camcorder, or software, or hardware to shoot and edit with. I'm going with an Apple Mac Pro and Final Cut Studio. I still haven't decided on an Aja or Blackmagic capture card. Monitoring I'm going with a JVC monitor. I was all ready to get a Panny HVX200 camera when this Sony EX1 came out. I'm like you... I could care less who makes what, we just want to use tools we feel will best realize our visions. If I shoot with a Canon still camera and if Canon says, "we like your stuff, could we license your images to use in our marketing", that doesn't mean I'm bought-out by Canon and I'm now biased against Nikon. Ha! You create nice footage with the Sony (I saw your site), but you also created nice stuff with other cameras too, like the Canon HV20, and I think you shot some with a Panny HVX200 somewhere along the line. Going high-profile like you're doing, which is very rewarding for guys like me who are making choices on a camera (but realizing it's not the camera in and of itself), you're gonna get high-fives and you're gonna take critical hits. Just know that the vast majority of us do not think you're "bought out" by Sony simply because they approached you after-the-fact and they paid you for your usual consulting services. I'm buying the Sony EX1, not just because of your wonderful footage, but because of my own thorough research looking at camera specs. If Panny comes out with a higher resolution HV200 in the next few days, I may go with them, but as of now it's hands down Sony EX1 for me.

I do have one question though... I noticed every now and then in some of your footage there are blown-out highlites. Sometimes this is an artistic preference, sometimes it's from too much range of light within a scene. I will be creating wilderness adventure footage and nature footage and often using GND filters to help control light. From your experience, do you feel the EX1 handles brights reasonably well? Are some of the blown highlites in your footage exaggerated from the software applications to get that "film" look? Just curious. Thanks again for sharing your work so openly.

Barry_Green
02-01-2008, 01:20 PM
Philip, sorry you're getting hit with this, heaven knows I've had my share. I deleted the last thread, and I'll delete this one too if you want, or if you want your rebuttal to stand then I'll leave it here, up to you.

We don't take kindly to accusations here on the forum, folks.

Secondly, why aren't we seeing that much great footage from the EX1? Perhaps because, as SteveT says, it's only been released a little while ago. And there was a recall on it, which significantly slowed down delivery, so not that many shooters have one. And of those that do, how many shooters are of the caliber of Philip Bloom?

There are probably 40,000 or 50,000 HVXs out there, but how frequently do we see eye-droppingly-gorgeous footage from them? Pretty much every time that Kevin Railsback picks one up, obviously... but when's the last time he took the trouble to post?

The point is: all these tools are capable of stunning results, and the difference is the shooter, not the camera. As more brilliant shooters pick up these cameras, we'll see more brilliant footage from them.

(and then, factor in that of the subset of shooters who are brilliant shooters, how many of them are forum members? And of that subset, how many of those brilliant shooters who are forum members, will go through the trouble of posting footage? And, of that tiny subset of a subset of a subset, how many of THEM want to put up with being called a shill?) Just be glad that people take the time to share their work; that's one of the principal things this forum is about.

philip bloom
02-01-2008, 01:21 PM
I doubt you can even see the rolling shutter issue in normal photography.


I think this looks nice and was shot with the stock lens (by someone other than Phil Bloom):

http://www.8112studios.com/nyc.mov

That's cracking footage! I must give him one of my Bravia 50" Plasmas that Sony gave me, he deserves it :-)

PhilaDvXphia
02-01-2008, 01:24 PM
Matthew. No need to get smart or talk down to people: 'BTW - The Ex1 is a video camera.'

It's definitely a compliment Phillip. If it wasn't for what I've seen of your work, I wouldn't even be considering the EX1.

BUT...When you get paid by a company, your credibility is going to get questioned. It's as simple as that. You have to understand that when you see all these people posting their work and nothing looks nearly as good as yours, it makes perfect sense to question things. You'd have to be an idiot not to. And I do realize that some are just more talented than others.

And by the way, I'm not slandering you. Slander is spoken. It would be libel (written). And nothing I wrote came even close to amounting to libel. All I did was make some legitimate observations.

You do a fantastic job with your EX. I'm glad that you're happy with the EX1 and that you aren't in anyone's pocket. Keep up the great work.

But I still would like to see more than just a few people posting great looking footage from this camera before I go out and buy it.

matthew77
02-01-2008, 01:26 PM
Troll.

PhilaDvXphia
02-01-2008, 01:29 PM
Troll?

Very mature.

lawriejaffa
02-01-2008, 01:31 PM
Well, I wouldnt consider anyone hired by Sony or Pannie to be completley impartial - especially when posting a stream of almost promotional style clips that play on the strengths and ignores areas of specific interest (as for example - identified weaknesses.) But don't folk do this for loads of new cams, and IF you were offered mulah to work for panny or sony etc, who wouldn't! I would!

Nobody is completely impartial anyway - important to bear that in mind! The real testimony will be in the quality of the films produced from it - but again is it not the quality of the filmmaker that has by far the greatest effect.

Some will prefer the res, others will prefer the colour space of the hvx, and so on and so on. Its inevitable that the aggressive marketing push and the egos of new buyers (of any cams) will make insane -reassuring and hyped up claims that naturally agitate other cam operators (and not those who rise above it - lol i dont include myself all the time within that enlightened lot!)

Ive seen crap looking stuff on the EX, ive seen crap looking stuff on the HVX, ive seen great films shot on the hvx, ive still to see great films (only because of the time of its release and NOT cos of the cam) from the EX. I don't doubt i will...

So why does this matter?

philip bloom
02-01-2008, 01:32 PM
Cheers Barry, let's leave it. Would like my rebuttal to stand.

I think it could be a useful thread for people to read. Like Buck has just said, just because you are raving about a product or even actually being used by them for promotional purposes doesn't mean a thing.

I will always go with what I think is the best tool for me at that current time. If Panny bring out an HVX300 that is better than the EX1 I will switch straight away!

I am fortunate enough to have had the chance to use most cameras out there and right now I have a favourite and if anybody who was at the forum the past few days and spoke to me will back me up when I say I was brutally honest about the EX1, pointing out it's flaws as well as what I loved about it, and to some people saying honestly I think you will be better off with a different camera. I had to wear a Sony badge but the first thing I said to everyone was I am a freelance DoP hired by Sony as I own and operate an EX1 and they wanted me to be here answer questions.

I wouldn't have take the gig if I didn't believe i what I was saying.

lawriejaffa
02-01-2008, 01:34 PM
Jeez lets just flame it more bloom lol, do you know theres people here that might say 'hey if they release an EX2 with global shutter and 4.2.2 colour space then maybe ill get it till then i'll stick with the hvx200'

These statements only fuel replies and replies and groooan

Buck Forester
02-01-2008, 01:34 PM
My question is this...why don't we see footage of this caliber (Phillip Bloom) from other shooters??

There's a big difference between camera specs and talent, as I'm sure you're aware. You could have some garage band with the best equipment in the world and they might still sound like crap, and give the Eagles some battered acoustic guitars and they will create magic. If you give Greg Brady and Ansel Adams the same high-end camera, are you gonna expect the same results? I've seen some stunning EX1 footage and some crappy footage. I don't judge the camera itself (no matter which camera or manufcaturer) based on just the footage I see posted online (although I do check out as much as I can, it helps). If you're a good videographer, you can make this camera sing (but you could on pretty much any other camera too). If you need high-def specs, the EX1 certainly has the specs. If you need CCD attributes more than CMOS attributes, then that's a whole nuther thing. I'll be shooting wilderness stuff and I want the highest quality in a backpackable camcorder I can get, and the Sony EX1 stands out spec wise as the camcorder of my choice. What I end up doing with it won't be the praise or fault of the camcorder, it will be what I can create. I know I could do well with the HVX200 too, but the specs alone would limit some of my marketing choices. But you have to realize the person behind the camera has much more to do with the results than the camera itself.

philip bloom
02-01-2008, 01:43 PM
Matthew. No need to get smart or talk down to people: 'BTW - The Ex1 is a video camera.'

It's definitely a compliment Phillip. If it wasn't for what I've seen of your work, I wouldn't even be considering the EX1.

BUT...When you get paid by a company, your credibility is going to get questioned. It's as simple as that. You have to understand that when you see all these people posting their work and nothing looks nearly as good as yours, it makes perfect sense to question things. You'd have to be an idiot not to. And I do realize that some are just more talented than others.

And by the way, I'm not slandering you. Slander is spoken. It would be libel (written). And nothing I wrote came even close to amounting to libel. All I did was make some legitimate observations.

You do a fantastic job with your EX. I'm glad that you're happy with the EX1 and that you aren't in anyone's pocket. Keep up the great work.

But I still would like to see more than just a few people posting great looking footage from this camera before I go out and buy it.

Your post basically implied that I am on the payroll of Sony promoting this camera. Using the term "gets paid by Sony" implies that. I have been paid by sony for three whole days!

With regards to the previous comment about me just shooting stuff that ignores the cameras weaknesses, am sorry but I have to disagree. That again implies that this is a conscious decision. Please look at all my other shorts, using the HVX, JVC, DSR 450, F350. This is my style! Simple as that! I like making shorts that are beautiful and like coffee table books on film (video) I enjoy it, it relaxes me and gives me enormous pleasure!

If Sony were to offer me money would I take it? I doubt it very much and if I did I would have to make it VERY clear to everyone on my posts that I am sponsored. I love being on these forums, made lots of friends and it's a great place to learn. But I can't imagine I would get anywhere near the amount of satisfaction as I do now if I was no longer just a independent user.

Jeff Anderson
02-01-2008, 01:48 PM
Buck is spot on - its not the camera at all. I have a funny feeling mr. bloom (and quite a few others here) could take a cheap webcam and make it look good. Put him behind a good camera and guess what it looks even better.

PhilaDVXuser- If you are worrying that much about which camera you use you have other problems. Get the one that works for your budget and workflow and go shoot something.

BobDiaz
02-01-2008, 01:49 PM
Philip Bloom's work has show us how good the image from the EX-1 can be.
This takes work, a good understanding of how to use the technology, AND talent.

While Philip's videos are amazing, there are videos from others I've seen that are demonstrate the technical quality of the EX-1. They may lack the major impact of Phil's videos, but do show a sharp outstanding image with a minimum of noise and good colors.

So the camera is up to the task of producing outstanding images, how the rest turns out depends on who is using it and how they use it.

http://www.pairofhands.net/Ex1%20vs%20HVX%20Shootout.html

http://www.freshdv.com/2007/09/more-xdcam-ex-pre-launch-official-specifications.html


Bob Diaz

lawriejaffa
02-01-2008, 01:49 PM
Well I tell you what we can all agree on gents - that nothing made out here should persnally impune on anyone - and that this topic, while touching some nerves is basically unconstructive and should best be locked...

philip bloom
02-01-2008, 01:49 PM
My question is this...why don't we see footage of this caliber (Phillip Bloom) from other shooters??

There's a big difference between camera specs and talent, as I'm sure you're aware. You could have some garage band with the best equipment in the world and they might still sound like crap, and give the Eagles some battered acoustic guitars and they will create magic. If you give Greg Brady and Ansel Adams the same high-end camera, are you gonna expect the same results? I've seen some stunning EX1 footage and some crappy footage. I don't judge the camera itself (no matter which camera or manufcaturer) based on just the footage I see posted online (although I do check out as much as I can, it helps). If you're a good videographer, you can make this camera sing (but you could on pretty much any other camera too). If you need high-def specs, the EX1 certainly has the specs. If you need CCD attributes more than CMOS attributes, then that's a whole nuther thing. I'll be shooting wilderness stuff and I want the highest quality in a backpackable camcorder I can get, and the Sony EX1 stands out spec wise as the camcorder of my choice. What I end up doing with it won't be the praise or fault of the camcorder, it will be what I can create. I know I could do well with the HVX200 too, but the specs alone would limit some of my marketing choices. But you have to realize the person behind the camera has much more to do with the results than the camera itself.

wise words Buck. I was talking to someone today who runs a company and they had two different shooters in for a project, shooting on f900s. One set of rushes were mind blowing the other looked like it was shot on a dsr 570. A good camera can make a huge difference but not as much as a good shooter can.

philip bloom
02-01-2008, 01:55 PM
One other thing. I am going to go NAB this year and am more than happy to meet and talk to anyone about what I like and dislike about any of my equipment. Am bringing my EX1 and Letus with, after all there will be a lot of cracking stuff for me to film out there and am MORE than happy to go through my set up with anyone who wants me to and give them tips about using 35mm adaptors. These cameras and adaptors have literally changed my life work wise, opening up doors which before now were not just closed but completely off my radar. That is what is great about these forums, it crosses borders and people all over the world get to see your work.

This thread started off basically being incredibly negative, lets turn it around and show people there is great footage out there, lets just be patient. People are only just getting the cameras.

PhilaDvXphia
02-01-2008, 02:18 PM
"this topic, while touching some nerves is basically unconstructive and should best be locked..."

What??? Why??? I didn't mean to insult anyone or cause any problems here. I can't believe how this blew up. The fact that I touched such a nerve makes me question this even more...There's a lot of money to be made by these companies who are selling these cameras. God forbid I question if someone who has BEEN PAID BY SONY might actually be working for Sony...Why should this be deleted? I definitely don't think that what I wrote warranted name calling from a 'Senior Member' either. "Troll."

It's absolutely ridiculous.

The way I see it is this. If you don't want people thinking that you might work for a company, then don't accept pay to speak on behalf of that company. If you don't like people questioning you, then this is one way to avoid it. You should have thought about it before you accepted pay to speak on behalf of that particular product. You can like one product better than another and endorse it. But don't act so offended when people jump to the logical conclusion that there's A CHANCE that you're working with that company or you're 'in it's pocket.' Anyone who wouldn't think that at least for one second is a fool.

You don't work for Sony. Fine. All I said was that I wanted to see more good footage before I buy. AND YES...I questioned whether there's a possibility that you do.

From this reaction, you'd think that I said that I was going to kill someone.

philip bloom
02-01-2008, 02:26 PM
now mate you are getting bloody ridiculous and offending me. i asked Barry not to close this. I have not asked to close it.

You contradict yourself a lot in the last statement. You are making the thread negative and stirring up bad feeling, nobody else is. You know something I can't be bothered with this.

Enjoy it. I am done with this. Life is too short to continue to with this pettiness. I have said enough of this subject. I don't think it makes any difference to you. Good luck and I hope you never work for any commercial client at any stage in your career as you will be in danger, justifiably so apparently of being in the pocket of that client. After all Sony were just my client this week, like Showcase cinemas are next week and Femfresh ladies "down there" freshener are the week after. Look forward to you telling people don't listen to Phil Bloom, he's paid by Femfresh and says the product really works!!

lawriejaffa
02-01-2008, 02:31 PM
Well okay fair do, but philadvxphia we know blooms got some work from sony based on the quality of his promo-reels. I think its fair that the speed and energy with which youve produced your reels bloom could credibly raise an eyebrow over partiality given yourself being hired by Sony.

However, i don't understand philadvxia where your criticism is supposed to lead overall? It's rather not god a point - unless you just wanted to highlight this criticism, or an expression of frustration perhaps at the marketing taking place and why it might all seem so misleading?

You are an apolagist for the crits levelled against the ex bloom, just like for example i would be accused of for being so towards the hvx yep ;) The partiality of my comments would be scrutinised far more if however, i was going on about the superiority of the hvx, making great clips avoiding its weaknesses and getting paid work by panny.

Thats just the way the cookie crumbles bloom, but i dont see the point or cause for anyone to get personal with you, but i think its naive to feign offence over the validity of that scrutiny. I think theres no justifcation though for anyone to come hard on anyone personally though - that is ridiculous.

TheMusician
02-01-2008, 02:35 PM
PhilaDvXphia,

I guess I understand your concerns, but you should really read a lot of posts by a user before you make any conclusions. Philip is an artist, he uses both Brevis and Letus, Sony and Canon and JVC, is very talented, and is clearly in noone's pocket if that is your concern(and truly none of our business). But more importantly adressing your initial question, posting footage is not really an easy thing. Do you have your own high-bandwidth website? Can you post uncompressed footage because that is what most people want? Do you have time to run lots of tests for the curious, color grade them, render them, upload them? I've noticed that you have never posted footage her for the readers here yourself. Why? So far your posts are mostly about Youtube, in which I am sure the EX1 will work just fine. I guess I am just saying that what you are asking for is difficult, time consuming, so if you REALLY have concerns, take some initiative and go check out the camera for yourself. Ask things in a non-accusatory way or a way that doesn't imply dishonesty on an internet forumn and you will get much better answers to your questions.

philip bloom
02-01-2008, 02:37 PM
what's with all this Bloom? My name is Phil or Philip.

As I said I can't be bothered defending my name and reputation. There are people out there who trust me and that's good enough for me, anyone else, tough.

This sort of thing makes me think it is time for me to to take a break from this forum. It seems my speed and energy and quality of my work makes me a valid target for questions about my partiality. It takes all the fun out of it for me!

PhilaDvXphia
02-01-2008, 02:44 PM
I didn't say that you asked to close it. The quote was from lawriejaffa.

We're talking about endorsing camera companies for money. Not working for commercial clients, which is COMPLETELY AND TOTALLY different.

AND you're not the only one who is offended here. I was attacked for insinuating that you might possibly work for a company that paid you to speak on their behalf. Like that's so wrong of me.

Forget this. I'm done too. I've had it with the childish name calling along with the unwarranted attacks that I've encountered ever since I posted this thread.

Buck Forester
02-01-2008, 02:45 PM
I'm guessing that by you making the claim that Philip, who on his own, bought a Sony camera and posted good footage and got a lot of attention because of the results of his skills combined with the camera, and was thereafter contacted by Sony (not "hired" by Sony) to use his usual consulting fees to speak on his experiences using the camera, that is not being bought-out by Sony. The footage speaks for itself.

I'm not one to get into these kinds of discussions, but if you're not liking the footage you're seeing out there, then no worries, don't get the EX1. I'm seeing the footage out there too (I can tell if someone really knows what they're doing or not just by the kind of footage I'm seeing, regardless of camera model) and I like what I'm seeing. You've seen what it can do if you're good (Philip's stuff) and you can see what it looks like if you don't know what you're doing. If you have the time and don't need a different camera asap, simply wait a few months and I'm sure you'll see plenty more stuff online, ranging from crap to amazing.

You got the responses you did because, intended or not, the tone of your post was accusatory. If you simply asked Philip the nature of his relationship with Sony, I would guess he'd be honest and straight up, as he has been. But to dismiss his footage (which you admittedly like) because Sony paid his usual and customary consulting fees to talk about this product has nothing to do with his original choice of the EX1 nor the footage he created using it, nor all the comments he made prior to Sony even contacting him. It's all on his website. And no, I don't know Philip from Adam, I've just seen his website - in case you think he's paying me to make these comments :^D

Stevet
02-01-2008, 02:48 PM
I I've had it with the childish

?????

mjeppsen
02-01-2008, 02:50 PM
Adam Wilt has released his review of a production EX1 (he reviewed a prototype in late 2007). He notes many of the issues others have noted (rolling shutter, etc) and a few more (knee handles highlights oddly, can be avoided though). His findings mirror in most cases what we've been finding at FreshDV, namely that it is a very unique and powerful camera that has a caveats that may or may not affect your particular needs and workflow. Adam also rated the ISO and dynamic range, something we weren't able to test. The six-page review is a very good read, I suggest you check it out here (http://provideocoalition.com/index.php/awilt/story/review_sony_pmw_ex1_1_2_3_cmos_hd_camcorder/) if you are interested at all in the EX1.

philip bloom
02-01-2008, 02:51 PM
We're talking about endorsing camera companies for money. Not working for commercial clients, which is COMPLETELY AND TOTALLY different.
.


I am not endorsing Sony, I am endorsing the EX1. Like I endorse my Honda Accord. Like I endorse Hendricks Gin. Products that I like and recommend to people. The difference being that I was paid for three days to answer questions about the EX1 on the Sony stand as I said I was at pains to point out to everyone that I am not a Sony employee I am a DP hired by Sony for this conference as I am an experienced EX1 user. They needed me as most of the employees there knew just the bare facts about it.

This quote "God forbid I question if someone who has BEEN PAID BY SONY might actually be working for Sony" goes to my statement about working for a commercial client.

Buck, thanks for pointing out that very valid statement. Sony asked me to do this gig about 3 weeks ago. Well after I had shot everything bar South Bank and Dungeness. Your usual fee is heading into your paypal account as we speak...(how do you get invisotext on here?!)

I tried to diffuse things earlier but it made no difference. It was your opening statement that caused the problems. If you had left that out this could have been a constructive thread.

philip bloom
02-01-2008, 02:58 PM
Adam Wilt has released his review of a production EX1 (he reviewed a prototype in late 2007). He notes many of the issues others have noted (rolling shutter, etc) and a few more (knee handles highlights oddly, can be avoided though). His findings mirror in most cases what we've been finding at FreshDV, namely that it is a very unique and powerful camera that has a caveats that may or may not affect your particular needs and workflow. Adam also rated the ISO and dynamic range, something we weren't able to test. The six-page review is a very good read, I suggest you check it out here (http://provideocoalition.com/index.php/awilt/story/review_sony_pmw_ex1_1_2_3_cmos_hd_camcorder/) if you are interested at all in the EX1.

i too recommend this review. I also recommend Matts hour long chat with his colleague and pros and cons.

matthew77
02-01-2008, 03:00 PM
Anyone who has read even a few weeks worth of Phil's posts will see how he has been learning the camera with the rest of us, and that he got one of the first ones, and that he's a quick study, and an excellent shooter.

And, like me, he's partial to the camera that's best for his needs. Everything I've read of Phil's shows his excitement about the camera - not for Sony but for one of its cameras. I understand his desire to educate about it because I have the same desire. It's very strange to attack him for it.

This board has so much brand partiality (aka fanboyism) that it's part of the culture. Not everyone who owns and likes a particular camera has a religious affinity for it.

It would never occur to me to love a particular manufacturer of industrial video equipment over another, and yet everyone here assumes that those of us with genuine excitement over what is a breakthrough production tool have some ulterior reason for raving about the product.

Brand love is a weird quirk on this site. It's far more common to find the love of teaching and knowledge sharing out in the real world than it is to find the love of a particular brand name.

From what I have read from Mr. Bloom, Its clear that he loves what he does and loves to share what he knows.

mjeppsen
02-01-2008, 03:00 PM
... Philip, who on his own, bought a Sony camera and posted good footage and got a lot of attention because of the results of his skills combined with the camera, and was thereafter contacted by Sony (not "hired" by Sony) to use his usual consulting fees to speak on his experiences using the camera, that is not being bought-out by Sony. The footage speaks for itself. In a similar vein, StillMotion (http://stillmotion.ca) was creating visually interesting footage/photos for their clients with the Canon/Brevis combo and Canon DSLRs long before Canon Canada contacted them and ended up sponsoring them (their video footage was used by Canon in a national DSLR commercial). I find it refreshing that companies are realizing outside talent can in some cases deliver more impressive work than they can internally.

Jeff Anderson
02-01-2008, 03:02 PM
PhilaDvXphia - please stop immediately and look at what you've done. You've caused a valued member of this forum to not want to post here anymore and share his work and knowledge which he enjoys doing. That kinda thing pisses me off. I sincerly hope he doesnt stop posting here because of this.

mcgeedigital
02-01-2008, 03:23 PM
It the artist, not the paint.

Philip is a gifted DP who knows the strengths of his kit and how to use them.

People who are SO enamored with the latest and greatest cameras that they overlook the artistry of composition, exposure and timing have my utter disdain.

PhilaDvXphia, where is some of YOUR work that we can stand in awe of?

mcgeedigital
02-01-2008, 03:23 PM
The only thing that that type of behavior proves is lack of intelligence on the part of the poster.


Pot meet kettle. :violin:

philip bloom
02-01-2008, 03:34 PM
Unfortunately your original post is still in the quotes. Oh well!

I understand your original intention and question, it just was worded very badly and then instead of dropping it you carried on defending your statement.

Yes, there needs to be more good footage posted. In time there will be and if you are still undecided what camera to buy i can only offer you this advice...look at what is important to you. The pros and cons of the two cameras that you are deciding between. Read the reviews like the one linked to above by Matt but most importantly go somewhere and USE one. If it means hiring one for a day then do that, or, just go somewhere where they have one and play with it, ask if you can shoot some footage with the salesmen outside, bring your laptop, dump the footage and see what you think. It's a lot of money, you gotta get it right. I bought blindly and was lucky. But you obviously need reassurance so go do it!

You are in Pennsylvania, not sure of the dealers there but you can always get a train up to B&H or somewhere similar in NYC where they will have them and if a short play isn't enough, as I said hire one for the day and test it in every possible way you can. Then you can be sure it is for you or not.

You wanna know something very revealing. The main guy at Sky HD in London spoke to me yesterday. He is blown away by it. He put it up against a 750 HDCAM and was shocked at how good it was. But he doesn't want to approve it for full HD acquisition. He will end up having to, but the reason he doesn't is it opens up the floodgates for high quality broadcast-able HD contents shot by amateurs. The reality shows, the low quality docs. All hand held wobble vision. He wanted to keep HD beautiful. The z1 25mbs was not good enough and he had an easy excuse to refuse it but the ex1 puts him in a quandary. For me this says it all about the cameras. This really is the cheapest HD camera out there that broadcasters are going to fully accept for 100% acquisition. I agree with him in a way, I had hoped the advent of HD meant a return to quality looking TV, not all the self shot PD 150 stuff we have been seeing. I was hoping for Planet Earth type stuff or docos with soundos. i think the ex1 and whatever Panny bring out next will kill that and it just means we see a lot of badly shot HD stuff on our nice big LCDs.

lawriejaffa
02-01-2008, 03:55 PM
Yep well the HVX already has no problem meeting the requirements of broadcast, the EX no doubt does too, however most folk using them for principle programming will be considered by commissiong editors to have 'not had the budget' for better gear - unless the programme especially demands handheld cameras.

So the concern for that Sky chap regarding loads of rubbish shot hd reality stuff or street docu's etc is a possibility lol. I mean planet earth was shot on the varicam i think? It is a beautifully shot series!

Whenever someone comes on and says 'tell me what to buy?' inevitably we all say what we like about our respective cams, hype it a little, then squabble or it becomes negative etc.

Stevet
02-01-2008, 04:53 PM
Thank you Matt!

As expected by Adam Wilt, that has to be one of the best well put together reviews I've ever read. Adam is one of the best resources in this business, period!
I also enjoyed the podcast.... excellent man!

BobDiaz
02-01-2008, 08:52 PM
One other thing. I am going to go NAB this year and am more than happy to meet and talk to anyone about what I like and dislike about any of my equipment. Am bringing my EX1 and Letus with, after all there will be a lot of cracking stuff for me to film out there and am MORE than happy to go through my set up with anyone who wants me to and give them tips about using 35mm adaptors. These cameras and adaptors have literally changed my life work wise, opening up doors which before now were not just closed but completely off my radar. That is what is great about these forums, it crosses borders and people all over the world get to see your work.

This thread started off basically being incredibly negative, lets turn it around and show people there is great footage out there, lets just be patient. People are only just getting the cameras.

Boy, that's tempting, VERY tempting...

I work as a teacher at El Camino College and this year, like most years, our Spring Break does NOT match the week of NAB. :cry: So, video production is really only a side line with me, BUT I really enjoy it. So, having a chance to watch a real pro in action....

Boy, that's tempting, VERY tempting... I'll have to think about that one....


Sincerely,

Bob Diaz

philip bloom
02-09-2008, 09:12 AM
Thanks Gary.

Morpheus_23
02-09-2008, 10:07 AM
If Sony were to offer me money would I take it? I doubt it very much and if I did I would have to make it VERY clear to everyone on my posts that I am sponsored.

If Sony offered me money, I'd take it. Of course, if anyone offered me money, I'd take it.

No, Seriously though. I respect Phillip's work towards sharing his observations/experience/clips on the forums as I do Barry's and many others. It's been a huge help to me.

Also Phillip, my EX1 should arrive this Monday and, in part, I bought it after seeing your work.

thefilmaddict
02-09-2008, 10:18 AM
We all need to make money and if we can make it doing what we love to do, then do it! I would not attack Bloom. I think that he offers great information on this site. I think that he loves his camera. I also think that he would dump it if something better came out (as would I). Barry in a way makes money off of Panasonic, but none of us would attack him. He is a respected man and very credible. I think that Philip should be treated in the same way.

philip bloom
02-09-2008, 11:02 AM
cheers guys. I will be posting some high shutter speed adaptor free footage this weekend. Looks great, but got awful skew on same whip reframes!

RichardVClark
02-09-2008, 11:25 AM
I am not trying to take this thread to a bad place again, I just don't see how you can drag a guy like Philip Bloom through the mud. He is our EX1 guru or even our EX1 Barry Green. Why not pick his brain? Cut the guy some slack or he will stop posting.

Chris Crocker Voice, "Leave Philip Bloom Alone!" lol

Ricahrd Clark

gac811
02-09-2008, 11:56 AM
This is my first post after reading this forum for months...

Phillip you're awesome, thanks for all the educational and inspirational stuff you have posted in this forum (and others). You deserve to be paid by Sony because you are a big factor in why people are buying the EX (buying mine soon). Of course, if something better came out next week in the same price range, I would get it over the EX in a sec. Don't worry about the guy who started this post...it was good to see everyone come to your support, just wanted to throw in my 2 cents as well.

I live in Los Angeles and am very tempted to make the trip to NAB just to take you up on your offer. I'm directing a low budget film (under 500k) later in the year and the EX will be at least B camera if not the only camera used to shoot.

Draccan
02-11-2008, 02:50 PM
Philip
Great work!
'nuff said

Jim Kinsey
02-11-2008, 06:30 PM
Phillip,

I have been actively shooting the HVX200 for 18 months and love this camera. I will keep it for sure but I can tell you this.. after looking at your reels from various places and your amazing eye for seeing the world in such a away that inspires many including me. I am looking at purchasing several EX1's for my production company. I love good cinematography and the camera is only a tool to help tell a story and you are one gifted DP.

Cheers...

Jim Kinsey
DP SWP Inc.

iconoclast6
02-11-2008, 07:28 PM
just my .02 cents as an editor turned shooter. Phill Bloom's and others whose work and words reflect passion is what led me to actively start shooting, rather than simply complain about the footage I've been asked to edit. As such I've been drawn in in several directions to investigate what components would make up my equipment. I never thought that anyone's choice of equipment and their passion for it, would overwhelm my own judgement or make up for my skill, or lack of it. I have no illusion that equipment, whatever brand, is no substitute for hard work and humility.

Perhaps, PhilaDvXphia's skepticism about how passion is embraced and rewarded is based on not having experienced it yet..or on the level that Phil Bloom has. I guess i understand that emotion, since like Philly there is a great deal of talent here in NYC.

In any event, hang in there PhilaDvXphia. And please Phil, keep on contributing. Passion is not only inspiring, but contagious. I bet even
PhilaDvXphia would agree!!

basspig
02-11-2008, 08:11 PM
There are lots of EX1 clips out there, and plenty of stills, comparing it to known cameras. Here's my contribution to the stills:

www.basspig.com/PMW-EX1.htm (http://www.basspig.com/PMW-EX1.htm)

The picture looks like anything BUT video, to me. It's clear, detailed, and not a hint of aliasing. The picture can be tweaked nine ways to Sunday, and it can be tweaked to look horrible or great, depending on the skill of the person making the picture profile setup.

My above shot compares the best I got out of my V1U, to the best I could get out of the EX1 with only a couple of hours to play with it. I'm sure I can do better once I am more familiar with the controls and can tweak the picture.

And a note to Phillip, it does baffle me as well, what with all the hubbub about 'rolling shutter', when there were so many more gross problems with prior Sony cameras. I see people 'pixel-peeping' looking for slight vignette, or shaking the camera wildly and snapping a frame from the timeline and passing it off as a horrible design flaw. But ironically, everyone (almost everyone) ignored far more gaping flaws in prior Sony cameras. I can't figure the motives of such people, but alas, it gives us something to crow about.

Quigon007
03-04-2008, 11:34 PM
I think Phil has done a great job in convincing that the Letus Extreme 35mm Lens Adaptor along with the Sony Ex1 make a great combo for great quality at an affordable price.

So convincing that I've used his footage from The Trench to convince a producer out west that camcorder and lens combo is what I want to use for my debut feature film in Arizona.

Feel Free to read the script, it's registered with the WGA.

philip bloom
03-04-2008, 11:38 PM
Quigon, thanks. I will read your script. I will be passing through Arizona myself in on Tuesday en route to New Mexico. Love to film there

puredrifting
03-05-2008, 11:41 PM
Philip:

Can you tell us about your doc that you are working on over here? Or are you posting that on your blog?

All the best,

Dan

philip bloom
03-06-2008, 04:35 AM
hey Dan

Am working insane hours on it. Got some wicked frame grabs to post. Will hopefully blog soon!