Will Panasonic release an upgrade to the HVX200?

[vivsavage]

I want to stick with P2, but the HVX200 itself is a bit lacking in certain areas for my needs (noise levels, low light). Does anyone know if Panasonic plans to release something like an Hvx250? It seems right now that the P2 cameras they're releasing are over my budget, and the units I can afford are not P2. I like the Hvx200 but I'd hope to see an upgrade. Otherwise I may need to switch to another camera like the Sony EX1 to get the image quality I'm looking for.

[n8ture]

I wouldn't think Panasonic would release something like a HVX2250 or HVX200a until they see the reaction to Sony's EX1.

I think it's a game that all manufactures play. When one comes out with something they see what works and what doesn't and try to address it or put their own spin on it.

I'm sure they have a long term roadmap but I think it would be foolish to commit to something until they see how the Sony goes over and what people like about it and what they don't.

If they start losing market share you can believe they'll address it.

[William_Robinette]

http://www.dvxuser.com/V6/showthread.php?t=58546

And many more. If the HVX doesn't offer what you need professionally then you need to buy another camera. If this is just gear lust then calm down, you already have a beautiful piece of equipment.

[4mat]

The HVX has stunning image quality you just have to use it right. If your filming wedding videos in some dark dingy hall somewhere then perhaps its not the cam for you.

[vivsavage]

http://www.dvxuser.com/V6/showthread.php?t=58546

And many more. If the HVX doesn't offer what you need professionally then you need to buy another camera. If this is just gear lust then calm down, you already have a beautiful piece of equipment.
I truly love the camera but I am bothered by the low light imaging and the image noise. I want to stick with p2, but there are other cameras in its price range that produce cleaner images (Canon XH-A1, etc). I'm basically looking for a reason to stick with the camera format. I need to know whether Panny will come out with something in the HVX's price range that uses P2. I don't want to stay with it if I'll never be able to upgrade my HVX200.

[David Jimerson]

Add more light. You'll find that the noise decreases rapidly the more light you have.

[William_Robinette]

The question is, what are you filming?

[vivsavage]

Add more light. You'll find that the noise decreases rapidly the more light you have.
It's hard to add light at a wedding ceremony or some of the draft animal events I tape.

[David Jimerson]

Well, it's generally the event, and especially wedding, videographers who bump up most against the HVX's particular limitations.

The question is, can you live with them? Can you find a way to work effectively in spite of them? Are they so onerous that they outweigh the advantages of the camera?

If not, then it might be that the HVX is not the right camera for your purposes. No camera is everything to everyone.

[William_Robinette]

Not saying it cannot be done, and done well, but it sounds like a case of you picking up a hammer when you needed a screwdriver.

[vivsavage]

The bottom line is this: I want to stick with solid state media. I don't want to go back to using tape. I want to know that Panasonic will add future P2 cameras that will fit within my budget (sub-$7000), whether its a HVX250 or something else... as long as it uses P2. If the HVX200 is the only camera in this class they will ever release, I'm up the creek without a paddle. If not, then I'm happy to stay with the HVX200 for a couple more years. But I don't want to invest more $$$ in P2 cards if I'm going to drop the format because Panny doesn't release something that suits my needs. I wish Jan could give me a nod in the right direction...

[puredrifting]

I LOVE my HVX-200 and I love P2. That said, if I mostly shot low-light events, I would use an HDV camera. You don't need to do greenscreen or compositing so the lack of 4:2:2 colorspace won't slow you down and frankly, until you can afford 3-4 32 or 64GB P2 cards, HDV tape is a lot easier to deal with. I seriously doubt if many of your wedding clients or livestock clients will miss you not shooting P2. Solid state media is awesome but for your needs, I would consider HDV. Much cheaper and camcorders like the XA-H1 make pretty nice pictures. I have shot with the XL-H1 a lot and personally, while it makes great pictures, the viewfinder makes it useless unless you strap a real monitor onto it. Then you are at $10,000.0 plus. If I was there, I would consider the HPX but then you are into serious bucks.

Good luck,

Dan

[vivsavage]

I LOVE my HVX-200 and I love P2. That said, if I mostly shot low-light events, I would use an HDV camera. You don't need to do greenscreen or compositing so the lack of 4:2:2 colorspace won't slow you down and frankly, until you can afford 3-4 32 or 64GB P2 cards, HDV tape is a lot easier to deal with. I seriously doubt if many of your wedding clients or livestock clients will miss you not shooting P2.
None of my clients are even aware of P2. My issue is that tape-based cameras are on their way out. In 3 or 4 years I'd have a hard time selling an XH-A1 and then I"d have to jump back into solid state again. But the main thing is that there is a lot less worry with P2 than with tape. No clogged heads, snapped tape, temperature issues, etc. SO I desperately want to stay with P2... just need a reason to believe I will be able to afford a future P2 camera.

[puredrifting]

Well, who knows if you will be able to afford one in the future. The DVX-100A only cost about $3,500.00 new. Now an HVX costs $5,200.00 new. It does seem like the day of killer prosumer camera like the DVX was at $3,500.00 are over. The XL-H1 is $9,000.00 and the new Sony models are mostly around $7,000.00 to $10,000.00.

You would seriously worry what a prosumer video camera will be worth in 4 years? An HVX-200 won't even be worth much by 2011, much less an HDV camcorder. Video cameras are essentially disposable unlss you are buying a RED or something like that. If you are buying sub $10,000.00 cameras, you should be able to pay them off with just a few shoots so I guess it is moot point if you do video for a living.

Like I said, the HVX is a dog in low light and the P2 run times and costs are not ideal for weddings and events. If I decided to go into the wedding business, I would buy two XA-H1s and go to town.

Dan

[dvpixl]

Video cameras are essentially disposable unlss you are buying a RED or something like that.
Dan


Use the right tools for the job, basically.

[Barry_Green]

I like the Hvx200 but I'd hope to see an upgrade.
Unquestionably they will release an upgrade. They always have, and always will. The questions are:
a) when?
b) what changes? and
c) what price?

Those are questions nobody knows the answer to yet. However, we do know that they're working on an AVC-HD version of something that looks like a DVX, so this tells me that they're finally addressing the low end. They've been focusing on the high end, totally revamping their 2/3" lineup, and now it looks like they're going to start shaking up the lower range. Being AVC-HD it wouldn't use P2, but it's still solid state -- just cheap off-the-shelf solid state SD cards, instead of more-proprietary options like P2 or SxS.

Next big announcements will probably come around April; the big international shows are pretty much done for now (IBC, Broadcast Asia, Broadcast India, SMPTE Australia, and InterBee). So unless they spring something on us outside of a trade show, I'd expect more info at NAB in April.

[ullanta]

I don't suspect any upgrade to the HVX in roughly the same price range will address low-light issues any time soon...

[journalist]

I also am keen to know what's goming. Have one HVX (plus a couple of little DV-Panas) and like a lot of firestore and P2 to speed up the workflow, but would'nt like to go back to tape (yes we need an extra cam for events), also need telephoto lens quite often. So we are very close to get one 20 x zoom canon XH A1, they have a nice lens plus very competetively priced. Should be able to capture straight to EDIUS , so no tapes needed for editing.

If Barry's info (I think he knows more than he tells!) about new panny AVC HD is right, when that might be worth waiting before second HVX.

And who cares about resalevalue anyway after a few years use.

[Justyn]

I too was thinking about such and it would be cool to have something new as pretty soon I will have had my HVX for 2 years and I want to buy another one, but wouldn't it be cool to get another upgraded cam... Panny would sell tons to those who bought the HVX and want another or to upgrade and again to new people. I personally also think that the Sony cam looks nice but I've been thoroughly unimpressed with their other HD cams as of late...


cheers and will be interesting and then again, what's the news on the Pocket Red cam too?

[reticulan5]

I also hope that Panasonic will continue making more and keep the P2 system going.Having bought a HVX200( Pal version).I would like to see a one world system P2 with switchable 50/60Hz.Our Pal 200 can only shoot up to 50 fps.and no 24 fps.All P2 cameras should be able to shoot 24,25,and 30fps.

Other improvements I,d like to see is a full Raster 1920x1080 chip or a single CMOS.I know Panasonic made larger pixels so the 200 can be most light sensitive,
around 320 asa.
But I would much rather see full high def res with a small 1/3" chip or go to 1/2",like Sony with the ED cam.
A larger higher res flip out LCD from 200k to 500k pixel is a must.You cannot judge on 200k,and you cannot always tape measure or have a large Plasma monitor either.

A 1080pn at all speeds would be icing on the cake.I for one would definitely buy another one if it had these features.

[cordvision]

Please NO CMOS unless it has a global shutter!!!!!!!!!!

[SPZ]

I believe that Panasonic knows what we want.

The great thing about the HVX is that it has currently gained wide acceptance and publicity- it is a prestigious product that is widely accepted by the professional industry. This is prestige that Panasonic lacked on the beginning of the dvx days. Back then, Sony was the brand to watch out for, and tens of thousands PD 150's and its successor the PD 170's were sold due to Sony's great track record and innovation on the DV format.

Panasonic's Professional brand started building up with the innovative Varicam in the High End camera department, and with the DVX in the prosumer department. However, in the HD arena, the HVX, with Panasonic's proprietary DVCPROHD codec, simply proved to be years ahead to the HDV competition, not only in codec performance, but in workflow for post-production and related investment.

The HVX should be, on par to Sony's Z1, the most sought after Prosumer HD camera on the market. And it has taken a big chunk of the professional division revenue from Sony, forcing them to introduce the new- HVX copycat- Sony EX1. The EX1 was introduced less than a year after sony's other entry in the market, the Sony V-1: a camera that was full of flaws that some say took out the prestige previously gained by them on the DV days.

What Panasonic could do this time was to wait and see what the competition brought to the market, to be able to, then, present something better. This was something they couldn't afford to do before, because they simply didn't have the prestige or market share to do it.

So I'm sure well see a fantastic HVX follow up. To maintain on top, Panasonic needs to do better than Sony, which means no rolling shutter, same low light performance as the competitor, and maintain its strong points that make them market leaders- strong codec (DVCPRO HD and AVC-INTRA, hopefully), P2 workflow for installed userbase (to cement the P2 workflow that the HVX practically kicked off for mass production), cinegamma and superior dinamic range- factors that make the camera so looked after in the TVC and Independent film world- and, of course, portability and handling.

I know I'll certainly be disappointed due to my high expectations on the next model. But disappointment aside, it will most certainly be a camera that will be superior in some ways to current day competitors.

[wgzn]

grrrrrrr -

[alpi69]

just improve the LCD and many will be happy.
also add the framerate hack as regular framerates.
other than that, as a 720p camera there is not much left to wish for IMO.

[SPZ]

grrrrrrr -


Lol :)

[Spartacus]

just improve the LCD and many will be happy.
also add the framerate hack as regular framerates.
other than that, as a 720p camera there is not much left to wish for IMO.
I second a high-res LCD and add a 6pin FW port and focus assist in SD (though the higer res LCD could take care of this...):thumbsup:

[David Saraceno]

I third a high-res LCD and a 6pin FW port with a more recessed location. Also lose the tape portion of the cam to save weight and money.

[Tom Plapper]

I'll take a 2/3" version without a tape deck priced around 10K with lens.

[JHV]

Having gone from a Z1U to the HVX200, I can state that from my perspective, I couldn't go back to a Z1. As for the EX-1, until storage becomes more realistic price wise, I still want tape to back me up.
If I could afford to have 4 32GB cards on tap, then I wouldn't care about tape and never look back. Unfortunately, that's not in the cards (no pun intended) at this point.

A replacement HVX? I'll like a better resolution viewfinder as would everyone else and a good wide angle lens available. Low light means nothing to me as I shoot motorsports, but a little more sensitivity would be nice.

[puredrifting]

Replacement model? I want an integrated spatula, chrome plated sideburns, four bolt manifold and a furshlinger.

Dan

[Filmbuff28]

Replacement model? I want an integrated spatula, chrome plated sideburns, four bolt manifold and a furshlinger.

Dan


Plus a turbo encapulator!

[puredrifting]

Yeah Baby!

Dan

[Jarek Zabczynski]

Plus a turbo encapulator!

Don't forget jetpack mode. :D

[Riceman]

I heard rumors of an Auto-Documentary button, just put the camera on a tripod, press button, and let-er-rip :)

[Barry_Green]

Don't forget jetpack mode. :D
Ooooh, Jester scores an oldie but a goodie. :thumbsup: