I'm gonna ROCK the adapter world....

[cardmaverick]

I've explored, tested, and pushed the DVX100 Andromeda for the past several months, now I'm kicking it up a notch...

http://www.chrisnuzzaco.com/special_uploads/brevis1.jpg

http://www.chrisnuzzaco.com/special_uploads/brevis2.jpg

Many more fine optics to come:

SGPro Rev.3
M2
Panasonic Anamorphic Adapter
P+S Mini 35
Brevis Extreme

And any other units I can get my hands on.

Finally, a compression free look at what these adapters can really do.....

Special Thanks to McGee Digital Media for providing the adapter http://www.mcgeedigitalmedia.com/

[Kholi]

Where's the footage!? LoL just kidding.

Looking forward to seeing Andromeda+all adapters.

[cardmaverick]

Where's the footage!? LoL just kidding.

Looking forward to seeing Andromeda+all adapters.

I'm working on it :)

My first day using the Brevis was promising, though we found that I need a spacer to set it up properly, so at the moment, I don't have anything worth showing. I'm also going to blow up an HD resolution chart onto silver halide paper at a local printer, and of course, shoot non scientific chart footage.

[Look 1st]

Duct tape on an Andromadized DVX w/ a Brevis...
I love it!

Cant wait to see some footage, your stuff is impressive to watch

[cardmaverick]

Duct tape on an Andromadized DVX w/ a Brevis...
I love it!

Cant wait to see some footage, your stuff is impressive to watch

That would be gaff tape and black wrap actually, but hey, its the same indi spirit right?

:)

[bwest]

Ha...that looks like an ancient German u-boat that sank off the coast of England 55 years ago and was just dicovered by Robert Ballard [Titanic] at the bottum of the north Atlantic... great lighting!

[JasonFox]

What problems was the Brevis giving you that you need a spacer? I ask because I have one and don't use the spacer.

[cardmaverick]

We had some trouble focusing on the ground glass screen and zooming in. I think its because of my magenta/UV filter setup now that I really think it though. Anyhow, we got it working properly, but by that time, it was too late to really do much testing, so in the mean time I'm blowing my res chart graphic up MUCH larger, and on silver halide paper too.

[JasonFox]

Ahhh, I see. Have you considered mounting the whole thing on a Steadicam to make it just that much more complex? Hehe.

[cardmaverick]

Ahhh, I see. Have you considered mounting the whole thing on a Steadicam to make it just that much more complex? Hehe.

Your giving me ideas... :happy:

By the way, special thanks to Matt at McGee Digital Media for letting me use his adapter http://www.mcgeedigitalmedia.com/

Thanks Matt!

[mcgeedigital]

Good to finally meet the Andromeda master Chris!

Reel-Stream should be paying you royalties!

[ifownlee41nite@mac.com]

Many more fine optics to come:

SGPro Rev.3
M2
Panasonic Anamorphic Adapter
P+S Mini 35

And any other units I can get my hands on.

[/url]

Hey Chris,

Let me know. I'll have a brand new Letus Extreme in about another week. Would love to contribute to this amazing thing your doing. I'm near by so just set up the time table.

[cardmaverick]

Hey Chris,

Let me know. I'll have a brand new Letus Extreme in about another week. Would love to contribute to this amazing thing your doing. I'm near by so just set up the time table.

:2vrolijk_08:

The smiley says it all.

[majormorgan]

Are they Andromeda shots coming out of a DVX?

Thanks!

Richard M
The Major

[Look 1st]

Are they Andromeda shots coming out of a DVX?

Thanks!

Richard M
The Major

The Andromeda IS a DVX (slightly modified that is...)

http://www.reel-stream.com/

[cardmaverick]

Ok, it's gonna be little while before I'm testing full force.

In the mean time, I'd like to discuss the most appropriate way to test.

Here's what I'm thinking:

Use the same lights

Use the same chart

Use a big chart (because of varying focal lengths)

Shoot without my magenta filter trick.... I'm still debating this one....

Make sure each setup uses the same camera f/stop and lens f/stop

To compensate for each adapters light loss, I will adjust the brightness of my lighting, and use a white card to make sure each setup has equal exposure in the green channel, the channel you can't modify via white balance, this is very important.

In Post I will:

Break each clip up into an RGB view, as well as individual channel views to test sharpness on a per channel basis.

Possible Ideas:

Shoot all of the tests using my white balance that puts all three chips into equal gain. If someone wants to loan me an 18K HMI and some gels.... :)

So what do you guys think?

[bwest]

Hey Chris... here a template for you, but it sounds like you want to do a better job, but this one sold me:
this is old and outdated now: click---> http://web.mac.com/philip.bloom/Shootout/Intro.html

[ifownlee41nite@mac.com]

I want to see the SGPro & the Extreme side by side.

[William_Robinette]

I would not do the magenta filter trick, because I think you are the only person here who does this Chris. Also, would it be possible for a real world test scene as well, not just test charts?

Thanks for doing this though.

[cardmaverick]

I would not do the magenta filter trick, because I think you are the only person here who does this Chris. Also, would it be possible for a real world test scene as well, not just test charts?

Thanks for doing this though.

I forgot to add this - I'll be shooting with a Linear LUT.

You know, from a strictly technical point of view, the magenta filtering would actually give a clearer view of what the adapters are really doing, because of the decreased noise, which is basically the point of the whole test.

BUT...

I do see what you mean, so far I'm like the only dude really using the magenta filtering technique outside of the Viper Filmstream world, perhaps I'll just run two sets of tests for everything.

As for a test scene, you bet! I'm more excited about shooting a test scene than a res chart :grin:

The only issue with a test scene is arranging for all the adapter owners to converge at the same time and place, thats hard, and its a TON of stuff to cover in one day...

Another thing just hit me, I should probably also shoot some color charts too.

[cardmaverick]

Longitudinal and lateral chromatic aberration.....

I'm gonna have to battle these factors of the DVX stock lens, then battle the adapter and its lens... yikes. I've got some work ahead of me.

I'm looking into post production ways to correct for this when using just the stock lens, but man, having a second lens can make this really hard to avoid, all the more reason to strap a killer lens onto the adapter itself!

[cardmaverick]

Did some more thinking...

I'm gonna have to find some way to keep the DVX zoom constant. This whole chromatic aberration with the DVX stock lens changes at various focal lengths, at least thats what I've observed so far in my limiting studies...

I guess what I'm getting at is this:

For a true equal playing field, I need to keep the DVX100 lens's chromatic aberration consistent during each adapter test, and the best way for me to do that is maintaining the same focal length, and f/stop.

This could be hard to do given all the designs and such.

I've noticed that this issue of chromatic aberration also affects apparent resolution too, which is why I'm diving into each individual channel, and using only the same Nikon Lenses.

[cardmaverick]

Which adapter requires the greatest focal length on the stock lens?

I'll probably operate all the tests at that focal length.

[majormorgan]

The Andromeda IS a DVX (slightly modified that is...)

http://www.reel-stream.com/

Hiya, sorry I meant the two photos posted, are they shots from the Andromeda DVX modded camera looking at another Andromeda modded DVX camera, or just two digital stills camera shots of the set up

thanks!

Richard M

[cardmaverick]

OK,

Just an update, I'm working on the chromatic aberration issues with the stock DVX lens.

[cardmaverick]

Update:

I've been figuring out ways to eliminate the stock DVX Lens's lateral chromatic aberration in post.

As of right now, I'm about 95% sure I have a solid solution.

In a nutshell, the reason I'm doing this is because I want to keep the testing playing field as even as possible. Every lens has its own CA issues. The trick with adapters is that you have two lenses, each with their own CA issues, and when you use them at the same time, you combine the issues.... If I can correct for the DVX lens properly in each adapter test, I will have a far better view of how well they perform, as well as how well the 35mm lenses perform. I've found that the stock DVX lens's lateral CA varies depending on your focal length, and I suspect the f/stop might also play a role in it.

What I'm trying to do is figure out a focal length that will work for all of the adapters screens. Once I figure out what focal length is the "sweet spot" across all of the adapters, I will then shoot a res chart using the stock lens at that focal length, and then create a custom CA correction template for it.

When I post process all of the adapter tests, I will now have a DVX chromatic aberration free view of how they all perform.

What does everyone think of this approach?

[cardmaverick]

Hey Guys,

Here are some screen grabs that show what I'm up to...

This is a res chart shot at 48mm set to f/5.6, threw two magenta filters (60 ccM total) under 3200 Kelvin light.

Before custom lateral chromatic aberration correction:

http://www.chrisnuzzaco.com/special_uploads/no_ca_correct.jpg

After:

http://www.chrisnuzzaco.com/special_uploads/custom_ca_correct.jpg

Look carefully at the edges of the lines to see the effect.

Different focal lengths exhibit varying amounts of lateral CA.

So far, after more testing, it appears that the f/stop does not affect lateral CA (it does affect longitudinal CA), nor does your focus setting, though I'm going to conduct more research on that variable.

So far the custom lateral CA correction templates are working very nicely.

I anticipate this will be the fairest adapter evaluation yet. I haven't seen anyone else correct for the camera lenses CA, which certainly skews the accuracy of those tests.

More updates to come...

[mcgeedigital]

Good stuff Chris, let me know if you want to borrow the Brevis for more tests!

[cardmaverick]

Thanks Matt!

I'm certainly interested in testing the Brevis again.

As you can see, I've switched my CA correction approach from photoshop's lens correction plugin to a far more powerful custom approach in After Effects.

Can you get you give me the lens settings needed to set it up properly with a DVX100? I can make a custom template ahead of time that way...

Thanks!

[penst]

Hey Guys,

Here are some screen grabs that show what I'm up to...

This is a res chart shot at 48mm set to f/5.6, threw two magenta filters (60 ccM total) under 3200 Kelvin light.

Before custom lateral chromatic aberration correction:

http://www.chrisnuzzaco.com/special_uploads/no_ca_correct.jpg

After:

http://www.chrisnuzzaco.com/special_uploads/custom_ca_correct.jpg

Look carefully at the edges of the lines to see the effect.

Different focal lengths exhibit varying amounts of lateral CA.

So far, after more testing, it appears that the f/stop does not affect lateral CA (it does affect longitudinal CA), nor does your focus setting, though I'm going to conduct more research on that variable.

So far the custom lateral CA correction templates are working very nicely.

I anticipate this will be the fairest adapter evaluation yet. I haven't seen anyone else correct for the camera lenses CA, which certainly skews the accuracy of those tests.

More updates to come...

OK I found your thread and see you have posted a couple pics ( in reference to the questions i had for you on the Easom 645 adapter thread ) Now I'm curious if this is only due to compression artifacting? It's hard for me to tell from a jpeg.
Steve

[cardmaverick]

Steve, I'll post some tiff examples soon...

The reason I'm using the Andromeda as a test bed is that it has no compression whatsoever during capture, just raw sensor data, and I only render my files out to 16 bit tiff image sequences (I capture at 10 bit by the way...).

Hope that helps!

[cardmaverick]

Just an update, I finally visited my printer, the silver halide prints I can make there might not be large enough, only 10 by 15 inches..

They do have an ink jet printer though, and it uses a sprayer to print the image, no dots, so its technically continuous tone. In fact, if you had to compare it to a DPI, its on the order of 185 or so DPI, any higher a DPI, and you don't see any difference, so I guess thats how they figured out the DPI equivalent.

They don't offer glossy paper, but an inbetween type of paper called luster, its basically a shiny matte surface.

Any opinions on getting the ink jet blow up? I can print a 3 by 4 foot chart for about $85 USD.... so I wanna make sure I'm spending money on something good enough for the job.

Thanks!

[Dennis Wood]

Chris, kudos on your thorough examination of the stock lens CA. It's the single largest issue for us in testing, and the one commonly ignored in adapter reviews. Rather than attempting to compensate, I'd just baseline with the bare DVX first. In other words, display the warts of the bare DVX lens along with the adapter footage. That's typically what we do in testing so we know what's there to begin with.

[cardmaverick]

Chris, kudos on your thorough examination of the stock lens CA. It's the single largest issue for us in testing, and the one commonly ignored in adapter reviews. Rather than attempting to compensate, I'd just baseline with the bare DVX first. In other words, display the warts of the bare DVX lens along with the adapter footage. That's typically what we do in testing so we know what's there to begin with.

Dennis,

I've been having that request quite a bit, my lateral CA correction is purely a post correction, so yes, I do plan on releasing two sets of results, one that shows each adapter without any stock lens CA correction, and one with it turned on.

:)

I can kill two birds with one stone, its pretty cool really, one set will show how well a particular adapter works with a stock DVX (no CA correction), and the other will be more fare in evaluating just the adapters themselves.

I'll be sure to mention what focal length each adapter requires from the stock lens as well.

Any thoughts on the ink jet 1956 res chart?

Thanks!

[Dennis Wood]

Why did you want to "blow" up the chart? I"m thinking you should use the EIA1956 at the standard size, no?

[cardmaverick]

I'm having a hard time using a home printer size chart with the longer lenses... I can't fill the frame properly and then focus on the chart :(

So I'm looking into blowing it up some... 3 by 4 feet might be a bit too large.

What is the standard size anyways? I need to look into that. So far my photo paper home printed chart has been sufficient for looking at CA, but I wanna make sure I have an optimal print for checking resolution. I also plan to re-check my CA templates using the newer chart.

[cardmaverick]

I just checked my PDF file of the chart... about 10 by 7 inches.. unless that file is wrong, it seems way to small for the longer lenses.

[cardmaverick]

Dennis,

This is the file...

http://www.bealecorner.com/trv900/respat/EIA1956.pdf

Thanks,

[Dennis Wood]

We use this one: http://www.graphics.cornell.edu/~westin/misc/ISO_12233-reschart.pdf which should be sized at 400×240mm (about 15.75 x 8.45). It could be printed on the "cheap" using an 11x17 format printer.

[cardmaverick]

Thanks for the link, I've seen that chart, actually, I have that PDF file.

Is this a better chart than EIA1956? My sensors are actually 4:3, but I see that this chart has marks for various aspect ratios, so maybe it doesn't matter.

Thanks!

[cardmaverick]

Just got my hands on an SGPro! Special thanks to Antar Hanif (SilverWolf) of Baltimore for letting me use his unit. Check out his site, www.antarhanif.com

I'm very impressed with the unit, especially the rock solid construction and super fast set up.

I did use the 60ccM filtering while shooting the charts, which does make a difference in clarity. It's interesting, without it (I shot some non res chart material), you still see the adapter grain, but color grain is more apparent. No doubt in my mind the color grain is from the louder red and blue channels. With the filters on, the image looks like a very nice matte photograph.

I'm dropping the CA correction, upon closer inspection, the ground glass screen seems to introduce a third issue technically. I'll just note the DVX focal length, and re shoot the chart at each adapters required DVX settings. You can still correct the CA, but it appears to be easier just correcting the adapter footage only, instead of applying several templates to one shot.

........always learning!

I'm not prepared to release the charts yet, as there may be an issue with my print. I used a silver halide print. For some reason, the 16:9 box didn't fill my monitor correctly (maybe its a printer resizing issue???). I"m not sure if thats how its supposed to be or not, but I kept the framing consistent anyways. I'll look into this more when I have time.

I'll be shooting a short film next weekend, I might use an adapter on this one.