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View Full Version : PATHOMANIA - A film by J. Anthony Gonzales (cinealma)



cinealma
08-23-2007, 12:20 PM
http://www.dvxuser6.com/uploaded/13091/1188939924.jpg



The "Unofficial" Poster

. . .

cinealma
08-23-2007, 12:21 PM
09.04.07

Production has officially begun on my new film, Pathomania. When I say production, I actually mean production AND post-production, as the two will go hand-in-hand over the next 6 - 8 weeks.

This will be a black and white, animated film in the style of pen-and-ink/charcoal drawings. Rotoscoped live footage, animated photographs and drawings, stop-motion works, and anything else I can think of, will be used in the process.

My goal for this film is to complete a "beginning." A beginning of what, that remains to be determined. But if I can get the process of the thing down, well... definitely to be continued.


09.05.07

Spent a few hours last night scanning in a bunch of shit. Some preliminary filter tests cames out pretty fucking rad. This is pretty much going to be produced in After Effects, so I've been brushing up on the basics and messing around with some ideas. The new puppet controls in CS3 are really going to have an impact on this project, I can tell you that!


09.06.07

This morning I spent a little time finalizing the basic story structure. I think I've got the "pathway" down. Just needs a few tweaks to break it free from 'formula."


09.07.07

Nothing really important done today. Scanned a bunch of stuff in, mostly architectural photos and such. I'm working out the "workflow" and the best way to apply filtering (and at least a compromise in the "time" department).


09.08.07

Cleaned up the garage today. I had a bunch of junk piled up area. I killed two birds with one stone with this: I made my wife happy, but most importantly, now my greenscreen doesn't have crap in front of it.


09.09.07

Guess what? Chicken butt. I did not work on Pathomania today. Hung out with my kids, watched the fucking Dodgers lose because Broxton sucks, and then fought off some raccoons in the backyard.


09.10.07

I, uh... uh... um...


09.11.07

My son's 4th birthday today. Yes, he's going to have to live with the stigma of that date for the rest of his life. I tried to get the doctor to keep him in for another day, but due to circumstances, they had to c-section him out of my wife.

BTW - No work done today.


09.12.07

Storyboards, storyboards, storyboards... my mantra today. So far, so good. I'm really trying to be anal about pre-production, planning, tracking, etc. But with a project like this, you kind of have to be.


09.25.07

It's been a while since I last posted anything. Well, that whole "post something everyday" BS went right out the window, didn't it? Anyway, now I know what everybody is talking about when they bitch and complain about rendering time. My apologies to all those whiners I diss'd, as I am truly whining now.

Things are coming along. Slower than I expected, but coming along nevertheless. Stay tuned for more drivel.

Brandon Rice
08-23-2007, 12:21 PM
Whoot! Rockin dude!

Zoidoid
08-23-2007, 01:24 PM
Excellent! You had one of my favorites in the last round!

Also, Pathomania is a nice title. It's much more forboding than, say, Potomania which is "an intense persistent desire to drink alcoholic beverages to excess." Though, in the right context (say, with lots of drunken de-pantsing) it could be fairly terrifying...

cinealma
08-23-2007, 01:34 PM
Whoot! Rockin dude!

Thanks, Brandon!



Excellent! You had one of my favorites in the last round!

Also, Pathomania is a nice title. It's much more forboding than, say, Potomania which is "an intense persistent desire to drink alcoholic beverages to excess." Though, in the right context (say, with lots of drunken de-pantsing) it could be fairly terrifying...

Thanks, Zoidoid. Potomania could have very well been used as a title for this fest, I'll give you that. :happy:

Tom Marshall
08-23-2007, 06:54 PM
Good to see you finally stopped being lazy and finally started a thread for your entry. :D

cinealma
08-23-2007, 07:16 PM
Good to see you finally stopped being lazy and finally started a thread for your entry. :D

Well, some of us have JOBS, you know. :laugh:

Tom Marshall
08-23-2007, 07:24 PM
I thought we agreed that when I quit, we both quit? Wasn't that the deal??

Actually, I'm glad to see that the layoff over there didn't affect you... :)

cinealma
08-23-2007, 07:41 PM
I thought we agreed that when I quit, we both quit? Wasn't that the deal??

Actually, I'm glad to see that the layoff over there didn't affect you... :)

Ha! And you fell for it. I still can't believe it. :evil:

Yes, well, I'm not out of the woods yet, although I have pretty good assurances that my job is safe.

Jack Daniel Stanley
08-26-2007, 04:52 AM
Hey looking forward to this one.

You are a pimp with creepy
:beer:

cinealma
09-04-2007, 03:16 PM
First poster up and day #1 of production diary. I am going to try and keep a daily journal of this thing, if for any reason, then to keep me in check. Six or seven weeks is going to fly by, so my goal is to write something down that is finished each day.


Cheers!

Brandon Rice
09-04-2007, 03:19 PM
Wow John, nice poster!

ilauzirika
09-10-2007, 02:57 AM
looking forward, good luck.
I really like your approach to the way of filming it.

cinealma
09-10-2007, 09:43 AM
Wow John, nice poster!

Thanks, Brandon! Something I threw together. I'll have an official poster once I get some stills put together from the actual film. :happy:



looking forward, good luck.
I really like your approach to the way of filming it.

Eskerrik asko!

Yes, something I've been thinking about for a while. If the workflow is something I can manage (and enjoy), then I'm thinking about something bigger with this project in the future. We'll see.

Tapo! :beer:

Geoff_R
09-10-2007, 01:48 PM
Very slick title and poster, looking good!

DarkMatter
09-26-2007, 05:50 AM
Got an Official poster yet? Not that the unofficial one is bad just wondering.....

cinealma
09-27-2007, 05:38 PM
Got an Official poster yet? Not that the unofficial one is bad just wondering.....

I haven't posted in my thread for a while, so in honor of Mr. "STUNTS"...

No "official" poster yet. Probably not until close to the start of the fest.

Not much too say at this point other than everything seems to be running along smoothly. Things are going to start picking up quickly, though, as the deadline approaches, especially once I start on sound design.


Cheers!

Joops
09-27-2007, 05:40 PM
Cool poster. I like the comic book style of it. Look forward to the completed project.

cinealma
09-27-2007, 05:42 PM
Cool poster. I like the comic book style of it. Look forward to the completed project.

Thanks, Joops. BTW - Your banner kicks ass!

Justin Kuhn
09-28-2007, 10:16 AM
Animation, sir? You're insane. In just the right way.

tmnt
09-28-2007, 10:31 AM
Nice poster John. I liked your spyfest entry so looking forward to this.

cinealma
09-28-2007, 11:04 AM
... You're insane. In just the right way.

That't what I keep trying to tell my wife! :beer:



Nice poster John. I liked your spyfest entry so looking forward to this.


Thank you sir!

Brandon Rice
09-28-2007, 12:01 PM
Any updates on this John?

Glideshot
09-28-2007, 12:06 PM
This is my pick for sleeper hit!

Looking forward to it.

Mike

cinealma
09-28-2007, 11:22 PM
Any updates on this John?

Nothing much new to report other than everything is moving along smoothly. Four weeks to go!



This is my pick for sleeper hit!


No pressure, there! :)

Thanks, Mike. I appreciate the support.

Cheers! :beer:

Brandon Rice
09-28-2007, 11:34 PM
Awesome! :thumbsup:

Weston
09-30-2007, 11:29 AM
Pen and ink style drawing and stop motion...all in black and white? Sounds awesome to me. I like your poster quite a bit too.

Definately looking forward to it.

deedive
10-15-2007, 02:53 AM
sounds great bro! animated! WOW,

cinealma
10-17-2007, 02:18 PM
Pen and ink style drawing and stop motion...all in black and white? Sounds awesome to me. I like your poster quite a bit too.

Definately looking forward to it.


sounds great bro! animated! WOW,


Thanks guys. I appreciate the support. This is definitely something a little "different" for me. Again, another learning experience for a dvxuser fest!

cinealma
10-23-2007, 11:43 AM
UPDATE...

Render, render, render, render...

Wind. Fire. Power outage?! F*ck! Lost the whole day Sunday to do any work (i.e. rendering) because we lost power.

Back on line. Keep on truckin'!


Cheers!

Brandon Rice
10-23-2007, 12:20 PM
Yea John!! Go Go go!

cinealma
10-23-2007, 12:49 PM
Thanks Brandon. How are you guys doing out there? Looks pretty bad on the news.

Brandon Rice
10-23-2007, 01:12 PM
It's nuts man, but thankfully my house and family are all good, thanks for asking!

cinealma
10-23-2007, 03:35 PM
It's nuts man, but thankfully my house and family are all good, thanks for asking!

Good to hear it.

Billy Pilgrim
10-23-2007, 03:51 PM
I can't wait to see your entry. I'm quite intrigued. I really dug your Horror Fest entry. Reminded me of Eraserhead (which is one of my all-time favorite films). Good luck.

Jack Daniel Stanley
10-23-2007, 04:32 PM
Me too. And now that Movie Master is entering I can't wait to see both of your entries. :evil: :grin:

hihihi huhuhu hahaha :cheesy:

Brandon Rice
10-23-2007, 04:37 PM
heeheehee. :)

cinealma
10-23-2007, 07:01 PM
Me too. And now that Movie Master is entering I can't wait to see both of your entries. :evil: :grin:

hihihi huhuhu hahaha :cheesy:


You evil bastard. You're killing me. :zombie_smiley:

Jack Daniel Stanley
10-23-2007, 07:42 PM
You evil bastard. You're killing me. :zombie_smiley:

... softly ... with my words ...

Sorry, it's a tradition. At least one reference per fest :beer: :grin:

cinealma
10-23-2007, 08:35 PM
... softly ... with my words ...

Sorry, it's a tradition. At least one reference per fest :beer: :grin:


Yukka yukka. :beer:

cinealma
10-23-2007, 08:36 PM
I can't wait to see your entry. I'm quite intrigued. I really dug your Horror Fest entry. Reminded me of Eraserhead (which is one of my all-time favorite films). Good luck.

Thank! I hope you enjoy it.

Tom Marshall
10-24-2007, 01:41 AM
I'm sure I'LL enjoy it... :beer:

cinealma
10-25-2007, 12:27 PM
:zombie_smiley::zombie_smiley::zombie_smiley:

Struggling to finish... I hope I make it. I put in an all-nighter and I'm sitting here at my day job totally wasted. I don't know if I can put in another one tonight, but I'll be up until some ungodly hour, I know.

This rendering stuff is total shi*, but once it's done, sometimes it's really fantastically worth the wait.

Anyway, going to try and take a little nap in my car at lunch. I have to figure out how to make the alarm clock work on my cell phone so I don't miss a meeting I have this afternoon.

Blah blah blah. Enough of this. Back to that.


Cheers! :thumbsup:

Brandon Rice
10-25-2007, 12:28 PM
Yeah John!

cinealma
10-26-2007, 08:49 PM
4 hours left. After I get the kids to bed, I'll have about 3 or so. Picture is about 99.9% locked. I have to ADR some dialogue (original files CORRUPT!), which is going to be my own voice (yippee... ugh). I have about a dozen sfx to produce and cut int and I need to slap a quick credits page on the last frame.

AND, I've got to get it compressed (but, after a few of these fests, I'm pretty sure I can nail it in no more than two tries at about 20 minutes each).

So, minus 45 minutes, that'll give me about an hour and a half to try and hack this thing together.

Oh, boy.


TO BE CONTINUED...

Billy Pilgrim
10-26-2007, 08:54 PM
Good luck!

Jack Daniel Stanley
10-26-2007, 09:27 PM
hope you get it in!

Brandon Rice
10-26-2007, 09:28 PM
Same! Work it John!

cinealma
10-27-2007, 01:06 AM
Well, I just finished uploading the motherfucker! I'm going to bed, damn it! For the first time in a week before 3:00am.


Cheers!

Simon Höfer
10-27-2007, 03:17 AM
Congratulations!

Brandon Rice
10-27-2007, 11:32 AM
Well, I just finished uploading the motherpoo pooer! I'm going to bed, damn it! For the first time in a week before 3:00am.


Cheers!

Great work John! Lookin forward to your short :thumbsup:

Gord.T
10-27-2007, 09:14 PM
Looks pretty out there. Really risky. And I'm really happy to see you exploring new & unconventional ideas. Absolutely looking forward to it.

Anyways congrats on trying something new. To me, that alone is a success.
And knowing you, the story is going to be a little unconventional.
I'm hoping it's a weird one.

cinealma
10-27-2007, 11:57 PM
Congratulations!


Great work John! Lookin forward to your short :thumbsup:


Looks pretty out there. Really risky. And I'm really happy to see you exploring new & unconventional ideas. Absolutely looking forward to it.

Anyways congrats on trying something new. To me, that alone is a success.
And knowing you, the story is going to be a little unconventional.
I'm hoping it's a weird one.


Thanks, guys. I appreciate the support. I'm pretty confident that there isn't going to be another film like it in this fest. Now, whether that's a good thing or a bad thing, time will tell. :undecided

I didn't really get a chance to post up any grabs/BTS or other stuff this go around, but this project really took a lot of my spare time. I'll talk about the project more once the fest starts.

Cheers! :beer:

GREYTV
10-29-2007, 07:12 PM
Your concept looks great, doubt there will be another piece just like it. Can't wait to see it!

cinealma
10-30-2007, 11:59 AM
Your concept looks great, doubt there will be another piece just like it. Can't wait to see it!

Thanks! I hope you enjoy it.

mikkowilson
10-30-2007, 09:20 PM
*** SPOILERS FROM THIS POINT ON! ***

WOW that was well done.

That must have taken *ages* to do some of that. I'm really impressed. Especially the bit gooing though the trees looked and sounded really good.

Amazing work.

- Mikko

Michael Anthony Horrigan
10-30-2007, 09:32 PM
This must have taken some serious time and effort to pull off. Kind of reminded me of old Heavy Metal magazine. Very cool and creepy to boot!

Sounded fantastic as well.

Cheers,

Mike

Barry_S
10-30-2007, 09:38 PM
Liked this one a lot; it had a kind of classic 16mm art film animation look. I'd love to hear some of the specifics of your workflow and how you screwed this one together.

Billy Pilgrim
10-30-2007, 10:47 PM
Great work! Loved the whole mood/look/sound of the film. Very well done.

Mark Harris
10-30-2007, 10:58 PM
yeah, the precision in this really shows. Nicely done. I am going to watch it again. I did not totally get the story, so want to go back, but the whole world was well thought out and constructed and creepy as hell.

cinealma
10-30-2007, 11:59 PM
*** SPOILERS FROM THIS POINT ON! ***

WOW that was well done.

That must have taken *ages* to do some of that. I'm really impressed. Especially the bit gooing though the trees looked and sounded really good.

Amazing work.

- Mikko

Thanks, Mikko. It's true. Lots of time spent on this one. Baptized by fire in the rendering world, too, I tell ya!

Glad you liked it.



This must have taken some serious time and effort to pull off. Kind of reminded me of old Heavy Metal magazine. Very cool and creepy to boot!

Sounded fantastic as well.

Cheers,

Mike

Thanks, Mike. I appreciate the comments.



Liked this one a lot; it had a kind of classic 16mm art film animation look. I'd love to hear some of the specifics of your workflow and how you screwed this one together.

Thanks, Barry. I'll put up some BTS and tech stuff soon. But basically everything was "screwed together" in After Effects, rendered out frames, Photoshop batch work, then back into After Effects for final processing. I cut it all together in Vegas.



Great work! Loved the whole mood/look/sound of the film. Very well done.

Glad you liked it, Billy! Thanks.



yeah, the precision in this really shows. Nicely done. I am going to watch it again. I did not totally get the story, so want to go back, but the whole world was well thought out and constructed and creepy as hell.

Thanks a bunch. I definitely wanted to create something you could watch again. Very cool.


Well, I just finished downloading all of the films, so I'll get to watching them tomorrow starting on my lunch break. Time to hit the sack. Adios!

Brandon Rice
10-31-2007, 12:48 AM
WHOA WHOA WHOA John...

this scared the CRAP out of me...

Ok... I didn't get at all what was going on... but the images, combined with the trippy sound made me feel sick and uneasy... yikes...

I almost think this affected me in a bad way... to be honest, I didn't really like it...

I appreciate the work put into it, and it looked really cool.

Gord.T
10-31-2007, 01:39 AM
Wow. This was really good. There was nothing I didn't like about it. Very creative. I got the story first time and I'll also be watching this again many times.

I suspect you're going to get alot of mileage out of this so when the fest is over get pimpin it around. I'd be surprised if you can't get some decent airplay.
Congratulations.

cinealma
10-31-2007, 09:56 AM
WHOA WHOA WHOA John...

this scared the CRAP out of me...

Ok... I didn't get at all what was going on... but the images, combined with the trippy sound made me feel sick and uneasy... yikes...

I almost think this affected me in a bad way... to be honest, I didn't really like it...

I appreciate the work put into it, and it looked really cool.

Wow. That review really brings a tear to my eye. IN A GOOD WAY! :laugh:

No really, I know that this is going to be one of those love it or hate it kind of films. Extremes can be good.



Wow. This was really good. There was nothing I didn't like about it. Very creative. I got the story first time and I'll also be watching this again many times.

I suspect you're going to get alot of mileage out of this so when the fest is over get pimpin it around. I'd be surprised if you can't get some decent airplay.
Congratulations.

Thanks Rap. Glad you dug it. Much more to come for Pathomania. Stay tuned.

wesley
10-31-2007, 11:26 AM
wow this was freaking me out big time. story was pretty simple and i wish it was constructed a little better but still thought it was really cool. i'm saving this one for a second viewing.

cinealma
10-31-2007, 12:58 PM
wow this was freaking me out big time. story was pretty simple and i wish it was constructed a little better but still thought it was really cool. i'm saving this one for a second viewing.

Glad you liked it. I agree that it could have been fleshed out better but with the time I had it was kind of a give and take, especially the last week before the deadline. Rest assured, though, that this is not the last you'll hear of this film and hopefully the story will work itself out in a much more cohesive fashion. :happy:

bosindy
10-31-2007, 04:00 PM
wow, very disturbing yet compelling. I am not as into experimental as some, but this was extremely well done. congrats.

Jim

dvpixl
10-31-2007, 05:40 PM
at it's core, I liked what it was doing. It made me feel like i was reading a moving storybook, one that is illustrated in creepy black and white and makes me cringe to turn the next page.

I always wanted to do something like this as well. But none of it would be live action.

great work!

Charli
10-31-2007, 06:23 PM
John, John, John, John... what a DEMENTED little mind you have and what a solid storyteller you are. You freak me out, but in a good way. You never disappoint. Good job.

deedive
10-31-2007, 08:52 PM
work has kept me from the fest but tomorrow i will break my bonds. Can wait to see this. looks real interesting.

DarkMatter
10-31-2007, 08:56 PM
Man I love your creativity, your sound design was superb, and this flowed silky smooth!:thumbsup:

mrcheapyasui
10-31-2007, 10:13 PM
very strange... i liked it!

cinealma
11-01-2007, 10:37 AM
at it's core, I liked what it was doing. It made me feel like i was reading a moving storybook, one that is illustrated in creepy black and white and makes me cringe to turn the next page.

I always wanted to do something like this as well. But none of it would be live action.

great work!

Thanks for the comments! I'm glad you enjoyed it.



John, John, John, John... what a DEMENTED little mind you have and what a solid storyteller you are. You freak me out, but in a good way. You never disappoint. Good job.

Charli, oh, you know, glad I could share a little of my dementia with you. :laugh:

Thanks for the feedback and watching.



Man I love your creativity, your sound design was superb, and this flowed silky smooth!:thumbsup:

Thank you sir!



very strange... i liked it!

Thanks!

Blaine
11-01-2007, 11:11 AM
Nice use of "animation". Good score, too. Okay, somewhere along the line did this turn into an art film? It felt like a bad trip...

George_Bailey
11-01-2007, 01:10 PM
Holy smokes. This was amazing.

I didn't understand it. But it was amazing.

Thoughts: The look was very interesting. I assume that you got your shots and then used scripting to modify frame by frame. It would be interesting to have your work flow explained in some detail (and sorry if you've already explained earlier in the thread).

Some of the VO was great. Some not so. For example, I didn't buy the old man's voice sitting by the bedside.

Not too sure about the extreme aspect ratio. But image-wise, it was great - just still unsure/confused about the actual story.

Sometimes unique is not good, but this was good. Thanks.

mentatDUKE
11-01-2007, 05:40 PM
John, this project felt very creepy, creative, and ambitious. You definitely conveyed some very disturbing images. I like how you made everything look rotoscoped. The demon interacting with the child was really effective.

I'll remember this one.

cinealma
11-01-2007, 06:39 PM
Nice use of "animation". Good score, too. Okay, somewhere along the line did this turn into an art film? It felt like a bad trip...

Art film? What's an art film? :laugh: "It felt like a bad trip", well for some people, that's what I was going for. :lipsrseal



Holy smokes. This was amazing.

I didn't understand it. But it was amazing.

Thoughts: The look was very interesting. I assume that you got your shots and then used scripting to modify frame by frame. It would be interesting to have your work flow explained in some detail (and sorry if you've already explained earlier in the thread).

Some of the VO was great. Some not so. For example, I didn't buy the old man's voice sitting by the bedside.

Not too sure about the extreme aspect ratio. But image-wise, it was great - just still unsure/confused about the actual story.

Sometimes unique is not good, but this was good. Thanks.

Thanks for the comments. Glad you liked it.

I will post up some BTS and workflow stuff soon. Everything was pieced together in AE and then processed with scripting through Photoshop. Back into AE for final processing. I then cut it together using Vegas.

Yes, the doctor was ADR'd in by myself. Some of my original sound files became corrupt, so I had to throw in my lame voice literally at the last hour. :zombie_smiley:

The 2.40 widescreen was a comp choice on my side. I just really love the widescreen canvas.

Again, thanks for watching!



John, this project felt very creepy, creative, and ambitious. You definitely conveyed some very disturbing images. I like how you made everything look rotoscoped. The demon interacting with the child was really effective.

I'll remember this one.

Very cool. I appreciate the comments. Glad you liked it!

deedive
11-01-2007, 06:42 PM
AMAZING sound work. but that was the case in your Adfest too. So far this is the scariest one I've seen. i will watch again and ask for your influences.

Luis Caffesse
11-02-2007, 09:23 AM
Just downloaded and watched this with NO IDEA what to expect - (hadn't opened this thread until right now).

WOW.
Damn good job.

10am, bright sun in my office...and I'm still creeped out.

Great sound, great visuals...not sure i followed the story, but honestly (with this one) i didn't care. It had a very dreamlike (nightmare like?) quality that I loved -

I'm really impressed.

***********POSSIBLE SPOILERS BELOW****************




My only small gripes (bc I'm pretty sure you'd want to get SOME sort of constructive criticism) would be the ADR on the Old man when he's talking to the boy - just seemed way off and didn't seem to match the scene very well at all. That may have been intentional, but it didn't really work for me and for that moment it took me out of the scene. I was actually very happy as the short went on and I realized it wasn't going to be filled with voiced over dialogue like that.

The other things I could have done without were the titles ("KILL" and "MURDER") -
the whole thing was so surreal and dreamlike, but flashing words up on the screen almost felt like it was 'waking' me back up...forcing me to use the logical and reasoning part of my brain... kind of took me out of the emotional visceral reaction I was having to the images and sound at that point. You had such a great purely emotional and surreal thing going on...why make me stop and read when the words are clearly repeated in the soundtrack (and much creepier to hear than see, I might add)
Does that make sense, or am I getting a bit too out there? (jeez...look who I'm talking to)
:)

But again, overall, great work.
I truly enjoyed this.


I should add that I haven't read this thread at all in order to not color my feedback - so if I've repeated what's already been said - sorry.


*****************************SPOILER?????????????* *********************************

Did he kill his parents?

Ben Sliker
11-02-2007, 09:45 AM
Alright, so this is the first film in a dvxuser fest where I've turned to someone else watching and said "dude ... are you tripping out? ... ok good ... then it's not just me"

Very surreal and creepy, I had trouble sort of disconnecting myself between what looked like it was shot and then animated over and what was completely animated, there was to much difference between the two of them for me. Perhaps eliminating some of the backgrounds in the 'real' footage and replacing it with an animation would go far to sustain the suspension of disbelief.

I really loved the crazy circles animation and the traveling through the trees I thought was really well done as well, these parts captured me the most. Oh ... and the creepy tentacle thing. This must have taken an immense amount of time and patience behind a computer, and I applaud you for that, well done.

cinealma
11-02-2007, 03:33 PM
AMAZING sound work. but that was the case in your Adfest too. So far this is the scariest one I've seen. i will watch again and ask for your influences.

Thanks Dee. I'm glad you appreciate the sound. I work very hard and that aspect of my films. I'm just not a sound mixer. One day I'll get me one of those and my sound design will really explode!

Thanks again for watching. Glad you liked it!



Movies like this make me feel unworthy to be included in the fest. Incredible. Have you ever seen Begotten? Very similar flick. It also made me pee myself.


Thanks for the kind words.

Yes, I actually saw Begotten at the Sunset Lamelle theaters when it had a midnight run, what, 12 years ago? When it was over, most of the people had left. The biggest impact that film has on me was that I said to myself, "Wow! I just paid $7 at a movie theater to watch a piece of art." And it was great. It gave me some hope.

Thanks again for watching.

cinealma
11-02-2007, 03:44 PM
Alright, so this is the first film in a dvxuser fest where I've turned to someone else watching and said "dude ... are you tripping out? ... ok good ... then it's not just me"

Very surreal and creepy, I had trouble sort of disconnecting myself between what looked like it was shot and then animated over and what was completely animated, there was to much difference between the two of them for me. Perhaps eliminating some of the backgrounds in the 'real' footage and replacing it with an animation would go far to sustain the suspension of disbelief.

I really loved the crazy circles animation and the traveling through the trees I thought was really well done as well, these parts captured me the most. Oh ... and the creepy tentacle thing. This must have taken an immense amount of time and patience behind a computer, and I applaud you for that, well done.

Thanks for watching! Yes, I agree. A lot of time was spent "figuring out things". The part from where the boy falls asleep and enters the dream world through the scene where the Malfachi tells him, "will you do muder?", I spent GOBS of time on. And then I looked at the clock and realized I didn't have much time left for the rest of it. Yes, there needs to be a better blend of the "real world" and the "dream world", definitely.

Yes, lots of patience. But worth every frame for me.

Glad you liked it and I appreciate your comments. Thanks! :beer:

cinealma
11-02-2007, 03:56 PM
Just downloaded and watched this with NO IDEA what to expect - (hadn't opened this thread until right now).

WOW.
Damn good job.

10am, bright sun in my office...and I'm still creeped out.

Great sound, great visuals...not sure i followed the story, but honestly (with this one) i didn't care. It had a very dreamlike (nightmare like?) quality that I loved -

I'm really impressed.

***********POSSIBLE SPOILERS BELOW****************




My only small gripes (bc I'm pretty sure you'd want to get SOME sort of constructive criticism) would be the ADR on the Old man when he's talking to the boy - just seemed way off and didn't seem to match the scene very well at all. That may have been intentional, but it didn't really work for me and for that moment it took me out of the scene. I was actually very happy as the short went on and I realized it wasn't going to be filled with voiced over dialogue like that.

The other things I could have done without were the titles ("KILL" and "MURDER") -
the whole thing was so surreal and dreamlike, but flashing words up on the screen almost felt like it was 'waking' me back up...forcing me to use the logical and reasoning part of my brain... kind of took me out of the emotional visceral reaction I was having to the images and sound at that point. You had such a great purely emotional and surreal thing going on...why make me stop and read when the words are clearly repeated in the soundtrack (and much creepier to hear than see, I might add)
Does that make sense, or am I getting a bit too out there? (jeez...look who I'm talking to)
:)

But again, overall, great work.
I truly enjoyed this.


I should add that I haven't read this thread at all in order to not color my feedback - so if I've repeated what's already been said - sorry.


*****************************SPOILER?????????????* *********************************

Did he kill his parents?


Thanks for watching! I really appreciate the detailed comments.

Yes, the ADR on the doctor was lame. Some of my original sound files became corrupt so I actually had to record that and cut it in at like 10:30pm pm the night of the deadline. So, only person availabe was me. So, it is what it isn't. :grin:

I put the "KILL" and "MURDER" titles in because I thought it might add a little something visually to signal we are coming to the end of the film, like a turning point or something, within the five minutes. I realized I didn't need them, but didn't want to have to re-render/re-process. An experiment that didn't quite work.

"Did he kill his parents?"

Good question. Actually, this film is much larger than five minutes. And, cat out of the bag, I'm going to make a feature length project out of the idea.

Basically, the story is that a boy witnesses the brutal, horrible murders of his parents. For some reason, he is spared. He winds up in a mental institution because of it. He's not crazy, just a little "withdrawn" from the world. At the institution, he discovers a world that exists in his dreams. This same world is inhabited by all the other patients in their dreams, kind of like a big online game world (bad example, but kind of the same). This world is ruled by the Malfachi, gruesome, horrible creatures who want to escape the dream world into the real one. There's also other "things" that live there, too.

And that's about all I will say right now. So, uh, no, he didn't kill his parents. :)

Thanks again for watching. Glad you like it! :beer:

sean90291
11-03-2007, 08:22 AM
Very cool. Refreshing to see someone make something that doesn't try to emulate big movie-making. And heck, so few seem to be able to tell an engaging story in their short films, so why not dump the idea of telling a coherent story and make an art film! Good choice. Creepy, interesting, Lynchian moments. Thanks for showing us.

J.R. Hudson
11-03-2007, 11:23 AM
Hated it

Couldn't at all watch it. Not for me. Maybe if the faux-ani was a bit clearer. I don't know; even my 7 year old was like 'What the hell is this?'

cinealma
11-03-2007, 11:57 AM
Very cool. Refreshing to see someone make something that doesn't try to emulate big movie-making. And heck, so few seem to be able to tell an engaging story in their short films, so why not dump the idea of telling a coherent story and make an art film! Good choice. Creepy, interesting, Lynchian moments. Thanks for showing us.

Thanks! Glad you liked it.



Hated it

Couldn't at all watch it. Not for me. Maybe if the faux-ani was a bit clearer. I don't know; even my 7 year old was like 'What the hell is this?'

John, my favorite review. Yours will have an honored place on my wall. :beer:

"Even my 7 year old was like 'What the hell is this?"
That's funny. :laugh:

It wasn't ALL "faux-ani". :crybaby:

Thanks for sticking it out. Did you get through the whole thing or did you walk out of the theater at some point?

J.R. Hudson
11-03-2007, 12:36 PM
I stayed with it and appreciate your character in taking some blows on the project.

I just found it hard to watch and too abstract for my tastes.

Nothing but opinion.

Sorry about assuming it was faux-ani; one thing I can appreciate is that there was orginal art. I'd say it was refreshing to a degree to see you leap with this approach; takes some gusto to go out on a limb like you did.

cinealma
11-03-2007, 12:43 PM
I stayed with it and appreciate your character in taking some blows on the project.

I just found it hard to watch and too abstract for my tastes.

Nothing but opinion.

Sorry about assuming it was faux-ani; one thing I can appreciate is that there was orginal art. I'd say it was refreshing to a degree to see you leap with this approach; takes some gusto to go out on a limb like you did.

Thank you, sir. Good or bad, yours are comments I value highly. A lot of people I showed this to found it hard to watch. One person likened it to a horrible Rorschach Test.

Herman Witkam
11-03-2007, 05:34 PM
I just loved the sound design on this one. :thumbsup:

Tom Marshall
11-03-2007, 05:45 PM
John, I really enjoyed this one, man. I've got a real appreciation for the stuff you do. I wasn't too crazy about The Beginner, but the Writer's block one was fantastic. I felt this one was great as well. I watched it with some buddies and they had Hudson's reaction... You kind of have to be an artist to appreciate something like this. Just like you have to be an actor to appreciate acting or a musician to truly appreciate music...

Maximus
11-03-2007, 09:32 PM
Cool film. Not really into art films, but I can appreciate the time, effort and talent that went into this. Music and sound were very good. Definetely a Begotten/Eraserhead vibe, but I would have preferred live action to rotoscope. You are a real artist.

cinealma
11-04-2007, 06:05 PM
I just loved the sound design on this one. :thumbsup:

Thanks Herman! I work hard on the sound design for my films.



John, I really enjoyed this one, man. I've got a real appreciation for the stuff you do. I wasn't too crazy about The Beginner, but the Writer's block one was fantastic. I felt this one was great as well. I watched it with some buddies and they had Hudson's reaction... You kind of have to be an artist to appreciate something like this. Just like you have to be an actor to appreciate acting or a musician to truly appreciate music...

From one artist to another... :beer::grin:

I have to get you up here so I can shoot and roto you.



Cool film. Not really into art films, but I can appreciate the time, effort and talent that went into this. Music and sound were very good. Definetely a Begotten/Eraserhead vibe, but I would have preferred live action to rotoscope. You are a real artist.

Thanks for the kind comments. I appreciate them. Thanks again for watching!

gabrielflorit
11-04-2007, 07:02 PM
This was good. Very good. Best so far. The intro is brilliant! I love the music. How on earth did you make this? Really clever, and I adore the dream sequence. Reminded me of Spellbound. I think you could have done better with a different filter, it was really hard to make out the images during non-dream sequences. But overall this was phenomenal. Didn't feel like an amateur short. This was the real deal. Congratulations man! I love your style.

I just watched this a second time. Still blown away. This is miles above the competition, in every aspect. What a beauty.

Jack Daniel Stanley
11-05-2007, 12:00 AM
Really liked this.
My favorite of yours and one of the top in the fest.

I always watch your movies early in each fest, enjoy them, appreciate how unique they are, and think I can't really comment on them until I go back and watch again
because there is a lot to think about or absorb in them. Then the fest ends and I have not commented in your thread. So I wanted to tell you how much I liked it at least before that happens again.

I didn't get it, but I didn't feel like I needed to. Like Eraserhead, for which no critic or scholar has ever provided an interpretation of which match's Lynch's own, I felt like you knew what was going on and because your confidence was apparent and the world was so compelling enough that was enough to move through the piece and stay engaged.

Moments that felt less authentic/real/honest than the rest include the Sicilian relative that leave the boy their with some very expository information - it could be played so it felt as natural as the rest of the piece I think. Maybe simpler/realer with the ADR is the way to go?

Another less effective moment is the kill for me and murder speach with the text. I would prefer just the words to the words and the speach, though I think in skimming the thread you prefer just the words. Here's another cooky idea: What if the words for kill and murder are specific to the creature thingy's own language and unintelligible to the human ear ... so we might hear the sentence leading up to kill and then kill is just whatever abstract sound your brilliant tweaked brain comes up with, same for murder, then the KILL and MURDER title cards are needed almost as subtext ...just a thought ... avoids redundancy and fits in the abstract vocabulary of the piece.

Great work. I think you are the most artistic filmmaker we have here. You and Deedive I think - pushing the boundaries.

Thanks for another great entry.

:beer:

Blaine
11-05-2007, 01:39 AM
Okay, John...I was drawn back to this and for the life of me I can't figure out why. When Tom mentioned watching it with a group, I was one of the group. I'm not really into art films. That is by no means a put down on this. I felt I was a bit flippant on my original review so I want to go back, watch it again and perhap give it another review.

I have to say, it's not my style of movie. I still don't particularly like it. That said, I can appreciate the art that went into it. I agree with Jack that it is one of the most original pieces in the fest. You definitely have and audience but it isn't me. That really shouldn't bother you because I think you achieved what you were going for and that wasn't the mainstream audience.

I've seen three of your films now. My favorite of the three is The Beginner which is the most mainstream of the three. You've been consistant in your "color" palette in the three films. You have a voice and I'm sure you'll reach your audience.

cinealma
11-05-2007, 11:59 AM
This was good. Very good. Best so far. The intro is brilliant! I love the music. How on earth did you make this? Really clever, and I adore the dream sequence. Reminded me of Spellbound. I think you could have done better with a different filter, it was really hard to make out the images during non-dream sequences. But overall this was phenomenal. Didn't feel like an amateur short. This was the real deal. Congratulations man! I love your style.

I just watched this a second time. Still blown away. This is miles above the competition, in every aspect. What a beauty.

Thanks for the kind words. I agree that some kinks need to be worked out in the incorporation of live footage. I think the compression kills the lines a bit, as uncompressed everything's a bit cleaner.

Again, thanks for watching. I do appreciate your comments.

cinealma
11-05-2007, 12:12 PM
Really liked this.
My favorite of yours and one of the top in the fest.

I always watch your movies early in each fest, enjoy them, appreciate how unique they are, and think I can't really comment on them until I go back and watch again
because there is a lot to think about or absorb in them. Then the fest ends and I have not commented in your thread. So I wanted to tell you how much I liked it at least before that happens again.

I didn't get it, but I didn't feel like I needed to. Like Eraserhead, for which no critic or scholar has ever provided an interpretation of which match's Lynch's own, I felt like you knew what was going on and because your confidence was apparent and the world was so compelling enough that was enough to move through the piece and stay engaged.

Moments that felt less authentic/real/honest than the rest include the Sicilian relative that leave the boy their with some very expository information - it could be played so it felt as natural as the rest of the piece I think. Maybe simpler/realer with the ADR is the way to go?

Another less effective moment is the kill for me and murder speach with the text. I would prefer just the words to the words and the speach, though I think in skimming the thread you prefer just the words. Here's another cooky idea: What if the words for kill and murder are specific to the creature thingy's own language and unintelligible to the human ear ... so we might hear the sentence leading up to kill and then kill is just whatever abstract sound your brilliant tweaked brain comes up with, same for murder, then the KILL and MURDER title cards are needed almost as subtext ...just a thought ... avoids redundancy and fits in the abstract vocabulary of the piece.

Great work. I think you are the most artistic filmmaker we have here. You and Deedive I think - pushing the boundaries.

Thanks for another great entry.

:beer:

Thanks very much for your comments, Jack. I know a lot of people won't get a lot of the "story", but as long as I can engage them, then I feel that I have succeeded.

The "Sicilian" relative. :laugh::laugh::laugh: I talked about this a bit earlier in the thread where basically, some of my files became corrupt and so I had to do a quick ADR literally at like, 10:30pm on the night of the deadline. That's actually me. Sicilian, huh? Awesome. :cheesy:

Yes, the "kill for me" speech needs more elements to it. I put the words on the screen as more of a way to drive the film to it's conclusion, kind of like some sort of cue or something. And it didn't really work out.

I love the idea of the Malfachi, the "creature thingy", having their own language and using subtitles. :thumbsup:

Anyway, you already know how much I respect you as a filmmaker, and I do appreciate you taking the time to watch and give feedback. Thanks again for the kind words.

Cheers! :beer:

cinealma
11-05-2007, 12:20 PM
Okay, John...I was drawn back to this and for the life of me I can't figure out why. When Tom mentioned watching it with a group, I was one of the group. I'm not really into art films. That is by no means a put down on this. I felt I was a bit flippant on my original review so I want to go back, watch it again and perhap give it another review.

I have to say, it's not my style of movie. I still don't particularly like it. That said, I can appreciate the art that went into it. I agree with Jack that it is one of the most original pieces in the fest. You definitely have and audience but it isn't me. That really shouldn't bother you because I think you achieved what you were going for and that wasn't the mainstream audience.

I've seen three of your films now. My favorite of the three is The Beginner which is the most mainstream of the three. You've been consistant in your "color" palette in the three films. You have a voice and I'm sure you'll reach your audience.

Thanks, Blaine.

"I was drawn back to this and for the life of me I can't figure out why." Yeah, that's that subliminal , mind-fucking hypnosis shit I put in there. Works like a charm! :laugh:

I know that this is the kind of film people are going to like or hate. But I really do prefer the extremes then, say, "a so-so film, it's ok I guess".

As far as mainstream, it's probably most filmmakers's dream (well, most that I know anyway) to be able to one day make big budget mainstream movies and then in between make their little "art" films. I mean, one day I hope to make my big baseball film. So, there you go. :thumbsup:

Anway, thanks again for taking the time to watch and giving some constructive feedback. I do appreciate it.

Darkline
11-05-2007, 03:31 PM
Very interesting John, as with 'cure for writers block' its a hard film to critique because you're working in your own universe.

That's a good thing. I wasn't mad on your last entry which was more straight drama, but this seems to be where you are most comfortable and excel.

I just liked the feel of this piece, it was kind of hypnotic and it must have took a long time to reach fruition.

It's not going to be everyones 'thing' and that's what I like about most of your work. Sometimes I cop out and try to make something with mass appeal, you just do what you love and I think that's very admirable. For me it worked, creepy moments, and some great contrasting sets of images. A unique short that stands out in this festival

You're one of the regulars at these fests and it would really lose some colour if you were not a part of them.

cinealma
11-05-2007, 04:00 PM
Very interesting John, as with 'cure for writers block' its a hard film to critique because you're working in your own universe.

That's a good thing. I wasn't mad on your last entry which was more straight drama, but this seems to be where you are most comfortable and excel.

I just liked the feel of this piece, it was kind of hypnotic and it must have took a long time to reach fruition.

It's not going to be everyones 'thing' and that's what I like about most of your work. Sometimes I cop out and try to make something with mass appeal, you just do what you love and I think that's very admirable. For me it worked, creepy moments, and some great contrasting sets of images. A unique short that stands out in this festival

You're one of the regulars at these fests and it would really lose some colour if you were not a part of them.

Thank you, sir. I appreciate your nice comments.

"...you're working in your own universe."
Yes, my wife tells me that all the time on my projects. :)

You know what, I've actually been a little disappointed you haven't entered any fests since last year's HorrorFest, especially this one. "Halfway" was bloody brilliant. I hope you can shoot something next fest.

Thanks again for watching. :beer:

Jack Daniel Stanley
11-05-2007, 04:27 PM
....You're one of the regulars at these fests and it would really lose some colour if you were not a part of them.

Agreed.

Darkline
11-05-2007, 04:35 PM
Thanks John, suprised you remembered me from that!

you know I've tried, really...lol I wrote a script for Dramafest which I'm only going to get round to shooting in Jan/Feb. I wrote 2 for Hallows Fest, but I'd never get them done in the time that was left. One involved a lot of CG, the other a location I couldn't find in time.

Hopefully they will happen, so I still love these fests as they get me writing; its just my deliverables are 12 months late!

iSTy
11-05-2007, 05:10 PM
What I liked about this was the graphics, reminded me of the A'ha video 'Take on me'

Michael Anthony Horrigan
11-05-2007, 05:15 PM
What I liked about this was the graphics, reminded me of the A'ha video 'Take on me'Does that ever take me back... :laugh:

StefanHaynes
11-05-2007, 06:07 PM
Stunning.

Absolutely stunning.

Brakhage meets Deren meets -- something wholly original.

Best film of the fest, imo, and a cue towards true art.

You've got a gift, man, and it will take you far. Very far.

To you, I tip my hat.

Stefan

Tom Marshall
11-05-2007, 07:01 PM
From one artist to another... :beer::grin:

I have to get you up here so I can shoot and roto you.


Definitely! :beer:

Chris Messineo
11-06-2007, 08:33 AM
While I didn't "get" this film entirely, I really dug the look of it and the fact that you went for it.

It felt incredibly originally and the textures and sound combined for a very creepy experience.

Michael Anthony Horrigan
11-06-2007, 10:28 AM
I watched this again and just wanted to add...

This movie really creeped me out! The audio is superb as well.

My only negatives would be the lack of cohesiveness in the story (for me) and some of the voice work (old man).

Really though.... great movie! I'm really looking forward to what you do next.
The work you put into this comes shining through.

Cheers,

Mike

cinealma
11-06-2007, 02:01 PM
What I liked about this was the graphics, reminded me of the A'ha video 'Take on me'

Yeah, but with a negative filter. :laugh:

Thanks for watching!



Stunning.

Absolutely stunning.

Brakhage meets Deren meets -- something wholly original.

Best film of the fest, imo, and a cue towards true art.

You've got a gift, man, and it will take you far. Very far.

To you, I tip my hat.

Stefan

Thanks, Stefan, I appreciate your comments. Wow, Brakhage? Deren? :embarasse:happy: Thank you and thank you.



While I didn't "get" this film entirely, I really dug the look of it and the fact that you went for it.

It felt incredibly originally and the textures and sound combined for a very creepy experience.

Thanks mucho!



I watched this again and just wanted to add...

This movie really creeped me out! The audio is superb as well.

My only negatives would be the lack of cohesiveness in the story (for me) and some of the voice work (old man).

Really though.... great movie! I'm really looking forward to what you do next.
The work you put into this comes shining through.

Cheers,

Mike

Thanks Mike! I appreciate the nice comments.

andoguru
11-07-2007, 07:42 PM
Hey Cinealma,

I'm not a very big fan of experimental films, but this piece was pretty engaging. I like the vibe of it and the audio and sound effects were very good. A lot of nice images. I actually understood a story from this so it puts it above most experimental films I've seen.

The 'sketch' effect over the whole piece sort of reminded me of an Adobe Photoshop/after FX plugin. It seemed a little much to me where it could be turned down a little. It sort of looked like an "Ah-ha" music video...on crack, though. Good job overall.

Did you use all original footage or was there some stock footage from old movies in there? I could have sworn I saw some familiar images? If so, I liked it how you combined stock clips to make a story.

Laters,
Ando

Marlon Ladd
11-08-2007, 03:53 PM
John, this film certainly did have a certain level of creepiness on a whole other level. I can honestly say that I have never seen anything like this before, which means I'm sure to remember it. Honestly, I can't say whether or not I liked it, but as a filmmaker I can certainly respect and appreciate it. Afterall, it wouldn't be any fun if we were all doing the same thing, right?

As far as the story goes, I thought it was very dark. I felt like the pacing of it was good in some parts, but seemed to drag a little bit in a few places, like when the voice (creature, monster) was talking to the kid while he was sleep. That seemed redundant at some point. Also, I did think the sound fit very well with what was happening on screen.

Anyway, I applaud you for stepping out the box and doing something different.

cinealma
11-09-2007, 12:12 PM
Hey Cinealma,

I'm not a very big fan of experimental films, but this piece was pretty engaging. I like the vibe of it and the audio and sound effects were very good. A lot of nice images. I actually understood a story from this so it puts it above most experimental films I've seen.

The 'sketch' effect over the whole piece sort of reminded me of an Adobe Photoshop/after FX plugin. It seemed a little much to me where it could be turned down a little. It sort of looked like an "Ah-ha" music video...on crack, though. Good job overall.

Did you use all original footage or was there some stock footage from old movies in there? I could have sworn I saw some familiar images? If so, I liked it how you combined stock clips to make a story.

Laters,
Ando

Thanks for the comments. In a real general term, this project was patched together from a zillion different things. God forbid anybody see what it looks like before it was "processed", kind of like some Frankenstein collage.

There were a couple of characters in the film that were extracted from a couple of ephemeral public domain films because I liked the way they looked. I futzed with them a bit to make them fit within the world of the film.

Cheers!



John, this film certainly did have a certain level of creepiness on a whole other level. I can honestly say that I have never seen anything like this before, which means I'm sure to remember it. Honestly, I can't say whether or not I liked it, but as a filmmaker I can certainly respect and appreciate it. Afterall, it wouldn't be any fun if we were all doing the same thing, right?

As far as the story goes, I thought it was very dark. I felt like the pacing of it was good in some parts, but seemed to drag a little bit in a few places, like when the voice (creature, monster) was talking to the kid while he was sleep. That seemed redundant at some point. Also, I did think the sound fit very well with what was happening on screen.

Anyway, I applaud you for stepping out the box and doing something different.

Thank you very much for the review.

"I can honestly say that I have never seen anything like this before, which means I'm sure to remember it. "

That statement really means a lot to me and I truly appreciate it. As a filmmaker, or any other kind of artist for that matter, that's probably one of the best comments you could receive, regardless if somebody liked it or hated it.

Thanks again.

Marlon Ladd
11-09-2007, 02:06 PM
You're welcome. Keep up the good work.

Michele Seidman
11-10-2007, 11:05 AM
You have no idea how frustrated I am right now because I don't feel I can comment properly on your project. I have an astigmatism and my eyes actually started to hurt and that frustrated me to no end.

My mom was an artists and seeing the way you put your storyline together with the 'line drawing' was stunning to say the least but it kept hurting my eyes to watch.

If it means anything...I cannot look at those 'geometric' pictures that you stare at and finally see something in. I have stared at so many of them and never see the hidden object, be it boat or horse.

Pardon my lack of real comment and know that I loved what I could focus on.

Jack Daniel Stanley
11-12-2007, 02:37 AM
Hey congrats on the Vision Award.

Much deserved, but you were in my top three. :beer:

cinealma
11-12-2007, 12:03 PM
Hey congrats on the Vision Award.

Much deserved, but you were in my top three. :beer:


Thank you very much, Jack. :beer:

Dmitry Yun
11-12-2007, 02:33 PM
Congrats guys, you really deserved this. :)

StefanHaynes
11-12-2007, 04:32 PM
If I had any say in this, you'd have taken first... and second... and third.

But there may be other options for your film beyond this forum... but I'm sure you're well aware of that already.

Congrats anyway though!

cinealma
11-12-2007, 11:25 PM
Congrats guys, you really deserved this. :)


If I had any say in this, you'd have taken first... and second... and third.

But there may be other options for your film beyond this forum... but I'm sure you're well aware of that already.

Congrats anyway though!

Thanks guys! I appreciate it.