Re: Camera Operator + DVX100 = $100 a day.

[PurposeDriven]

Wasn't there already a post like this that was removed by Jared? I think you are selling yourself short, and if you don't think so, then you are in the wrong business.

[Zoomforce]

yeah.. there is nothing good about this sort of post.

[ktdmoviemaker]

Wasn't there already a post like this that was removed by Jared? I think you are selling yourself short, and if you don't think so, then you are in the wrong business.


I am a student. I went online at 2-pop. I read a post for the rate of a dp with mini dv that has not been working for at least 5 years. The rates were between $100-$120 a day. I don't understand what the problem is??? I'm not selling myself short. I want to make movies. If I can do that for a living, it will put a smile on my face... I do not understand why my post was taken down. I am offering a legitamate deal.

[Barry_Green]

For corporate work, a good operator should get about $800/day for DVX + operator. Some DP's can command $2500/day or more.

$100/day is astoundingly cheap, and drives down people's expectations about what quality video should cost.

The camera alone commands a rental rate of $175 to $250 per day. Renting it out for any less than that is a) undercutting the market, and b) meaning you're leaving money on the table.

[PurposeDriven]

I wouldn't trust your dp source, 100 is way cheap. Barry is right on the money. If you consider yourself a novice, then let people know that you are still learning and you have a camera. If you have experience, then you should have seen yourself not making as much as fellow camera operators/DPs/camera owners. Start for a couple hundred a day or something. 100 flat is way cheap, I'd hire you to run around the dessert for 10 hours shooting rocks for my amusement for just 100 bucks. ;D

[Beat Takeshi]

Well....it was a good way to get someone to post the rates. I always have to be the optimistic one.

[dpwanab]

For corporate work, a good operator should get about $800/day for DVX + operator. Some DP's can command $2500/day or more.

Where the hell is this the norm?! I need to relocate!!
:o ;D

Seriously though, I do agree that this undercuts the value. But I have friends working in NYC, shooting 35mm for $100-200 a day. And not just rap videos. The sad thing is that most of the time, you can't name your price, and there are so many people hungry for work, that if you turn down that $150/day gig, not only will you lose the meager pay, but there will be a line of people behind you willing to do it for the same cheap price.

I wish I could get people to pay me $800/day, but the simple fact is that I have to compete with really low-balling video guys just to get any work. I recently lost a bid for a small company to do two :30 second spots and two :15 second spots, because I got underbid by another outfit’s offer of $900 dollars total!!! And that's not just for the shoot, that's the spots delivered. It sucks, and it's a perfect example of the 'it's good enough' philosophy I combat EVER DAY. In addition to scrambling non-stop for work, I have to continually educate people on the actual costs/values related to this field, and it's a losing battle. All that seems to happen is I stay unemployed, and can’t even get that $900!

I’m in the process of advertising my services in the local press, since I’m struggling to get this venture underway, just to build a reel. I can’t believe I’m about to do this, but I’m offering to do these ads AT COST, because based on my experience and research, the small businesses that make up the market in my area are totally unwilling to spend any real money on effective, quality advertising. But I’m broke, and it’s about the last card to play. I know I’m not going to be satisfied with the results of these “at-cost” spots, they’re gonna look like poo, cause I don’t have even the limited lighting/grip gear needed to provide satisfactory results. But the market around here doesn’t seem to care, cause I’ve seen some REAL TURDS on the air, so maybe it won’t matter as much. Maybe those union wages are a spoiler, I don’t know, but any money is still better than no money.

[Zoomforce]

I said it once, and I will say it again, thats what Unions for.

for commercials, DPs can make upto 5 grand a day.

Any city a DVX rental is $150 a day alone, so do the math. Hopefully you are worth more than the camera :)

Like Barry said.. this kinda "offer" kills the industry, which is why I removed the offer, as people all of a sudden expect that 100 bucks a day will let them make a 24p production, and when it turns out to look like shit, they will never use video again.

[Zoomforce]

I'd hire you to run around the dessert for 10 hours shooting rocks for my amusement for just 100 bucks. *;D

Jesus.. I almost fell off my chair laughing readiing that one.

[Barry_Green]

dpwanab,

The best advice I can tell you is -- forget local ads. I went on a tirade here once upon a time, I don't know where the link is but basically local ads are death. There will always be a long line of cheapies waiting to do it cheaper and cheaper and eventually they'll get to the point where they do the entire ad themselves, for $10/hr, so it'll get down to $100 for an ad. Get off that train now. Besides, you can never compete with the television stations -- because nobody has pressed for an antitrust suit, they have a monopoly on distribution and also on content creation, making it impossible for local producers to compete.

There are some clients who will pay. I worked on a spot for a lawyer, 4-day high-def shoot, budget was nearly six figures. Some of the hotel-casinos here used to budget $30k to $50k for their spots. But all those spots go to ad agencies, so you'll have to go to the agencies to try to get hired. The little local ads never use agencies, so they don't know what something should cost -- all they know is what the TV station tells them, which is something like "sign a 2-month contract with us, and we'll do your spot for free!" How do you compete with that? You can't. The agencies will sell the client on higher costs (because the agency is going to mark up your budget enormously before passing it on to the client anyway).

Oh - wait -- I found the tirade. Check out this thread:
http://www.dvxuser.com/cgi-bin/DVX/YaBB.cgi?board=MesPhotos;action=display;num=107587 1440;start=2#2

[PurposeDriven]

Jared, thanks for the compliment. I was waiting for someone to notice that! :D

[ktdmoviemaker]

I don’t know, but any money is still better than no money. *


My thoughts exactly...

[Elvis]

filmshaker, why did you change your username? 8)

[ktdmoviemaker]

I like this name better. All my posts were automatically updated with "filmshaker" it just sounds cool... *;D I hope it's not a problem. ktdmoviemaker just sounded so oooolllddd... Out with the old and in with the new. Filmshaker is da name. ;D

Have a good weekend

Kris

[PurposeDriven]

"I don’t know, but any money is still better than no money."

It all depends. If someone comes up to me and says, "I need to do a 20 minute corporate video, then I need it to be authored to DvD and I can give you $1500. Now, at this point, you have to think to yourself. How much money I'm making divided by the number of hours it will take to do this. 2.50/hr. Ummm... yeah. At some point, you need to get past the fact that you can get people to pay you for your work, and expect them to pay for your work. Money is money, I don't care if your a free-lance anything, don't settle for less then you are worth. Take a stand, whatever you think you would charge for a good size production, tack on an extra 30-40%.

[dpwanab]

....How much money I'm making divided by the number of hours it will take to do this. 2.50/hr. Ummm... yeah. At some point, you need to get past the fact that you can get people to pay you for your work, and expect them to pay for your work. Money is money, I don't care if your a free-lance anything, don't settle for less then you are worth.

You're profile says your in SoCal, right? *While I agree with the premise of the above, it's idealistic, and not very realistic. *Especially if it's just really slow or you're still establishing yourself. Especially also in my rural Midwestern market, where there's not much work to go around. *If you pass up a gig here because you refuse lower to your price, to get SOMETHING out of it, there won't be multiple other gigs you can pursue like in LA or NYC. *You could be in a position like me, who hasn't worked a day since the middle of January, and all of a sudden, you realize you really need those $1500 bucks! * *
:'(
I can barely even get people to pay for my work here, so getting past that to pay me what it's worth is unrealistic as well!

[PurposeDriven]

I am sorry that there is a lack of business where you live. You say its not realistic, well, it all depends. It doesn't matter where you are, business is business. You have to hussle for your business. You find the biggest city around where you live, and you hussle. If you have to advertise in local papers, online, wherever. You are only limited by your imagination and drive. I understand that when you need money, you need money. There have been times that in a pinch someone got my services way cheap. But, you have to give yourself a limit to how low you will go. Keep hunting, build your client list, and make yourself a professional reel and market yourself.

Or you could move to SoCal. 8)

[Elvis]

I e-mailed this guy last Friday about a shoot. No reply. you guys didn't have him knocked off or something? Gulp! ??? ;D

[Zoomforce]

heh heh... Hired a shooter to shoot the shooter :)

[PurposeDriven]

No, I gave the guy 100 bucks. He's out in Palm Springs shooting huge fans. I'm expecting quality work.